Goodrich Starting Ahead of Diggins

[doggydaddy]

Feel free to point out where I mentioned anything about fatigue.

You said "Another point is that Skylar had a much more demanding senior season that Goodrich, who flew under the radar and didn't have high expectations, like trying to win a National title, along with the pressures of the media. Sylar pretty much carried ND, while playing a very demanding schedule and expectations to win. She's probably exhausted and is not used to this type of wear and tear on her body due to not having a break."

You didn't use the word fatigue, but are you denying that is what you were saying? Really?

 

[doggydaddy]

Oh please. There were plenty of fools who thought she should have been selected first overall in 2009, ahead of Angel McCoughtry. She's not the second, third, or even fourth best player from that class.

I get it. You don't think much of Montgomery.

Doesn't mean you have to insult fans that did.

And what does a few fans thinking Montgomery should have been drafted 1st have to do with the incredible attention Diggins got from ESPN and the rest of the media?

 

[ChicagoGG]

Kudos to ETT for starting a thread that has kept on going..and going..and going....for 5 days - about Skylar, no less. Wire Chief is right (see Ah, Ah, Ah post). We ARE bored. Will it be October soon?? Will someone get a look at unofficial practice games and give us some news, some hope, some something???

 

[Bestiarius]

Kudos to ETT for starting a thread that has kept on going..and going..and going....for 5 days - about Skylar, no less.

Chaos, panic, disorder. His work here is done.

 

[diggerfoot]

Oh please. There were plenty of fools who thought she should have been selected first overall in 2009, ahead of Angel McCoughtry. She's not the second, third, or even fourth best player from that class.

You were one of the primary people I had in mind regarding "post hoc ergo propter hoc," though some of the people ripping Diggins also were guilty of this. The original thrust of the thread was to undermine the legitimacy of "3 to see" based on the fact that Diggins now has been replaced as a starter by Goodrich. You came up with several reasons in defense of Diggins. They are dubious to various degrees, but the biggest problem with them is only one applies at all to the matter at hand, a defending rationale for why Diggins should be replaced by Goodrich. Even with that dubious assertion I guarantee you weren't thinking before the season started: "Hmm, Diggins has had more to deal with than Goodrich, I predict she'll be replaced by Goodrich as a starter." Your use of that as a defense then, along with all your other defenses, are "post hoc ergo propter hoc" or, in ordinary terms, throwing whatever you can against the wall to see what will stick.

I had to respond to this particular post. TheTruthBelow as a handle by someone who resorts to post hoc reasoning is troublesome enough. Referring to fans as fools detracts immeasurably further. For the record, I never thought Montgomery was as good as McCoughtry. I might even have called an ESPN analyst a fool for billing Montgomery as "the one to see." Yet I would not call a fan that, any more than I would ever call TonyC or stwainfan fools for some of the stuff they come up with. Your pejorative remark reveals an unwarranted disdain compounding your post hoc reasoning that suggests you should avoid fan boards of different followings from yours.

 

[TheTruthBelow]

You said "Another point is that Skylar had a much more demanding senior season that Goodrich, who flew under the radar and didn't have high expectations, like trying to win a National title, along with the pressures of the media. Sylar pretty much carried ND, while playing a very demanding schedule and expectations to win. She's probably exhausted and is not used to this type of wear and tear on her body due to not having a break."

You didn't use the word fatigue, but are you denying that is what you were saying? Really?

Really? I actually did not say any of that. You're attributing someone else's words to me.

 

[Suebird10fan]

Perhaps what I am going to say is unsportsmanlike.
Maybe it's petty
It may run contrary to the way we are supposed to comport ourselves on the boneyard, but...
I am happy that Skylar is performing poorly.
Her attitude, ego and showmanship throughout her career and the way she rubbed ND's win in UConn's face were disturbing.
Her non-playing actions made me dislike her.
I hope she continues down her current path.

And if a Lady Vols fan said the same about DT, exactly how would you differentiate?

 

[TheTruthBelow]

They are dubious to various degrees, but the biggest problem with them is only one applies at all to the matter at hand, a defending rationale for why Diggins should be replaced by Goodrich. Even with that dubious assertion I guarantee you weren't thinking before the season started: "Hmm, Diggins has had more to deal with than Goodrich, I predict she'll be replaced by Goodrich as a starter." Your use of that as a defense then, along with all your other defenses, are "post hoc ergo propter hoc" or, in ordinary terms, throwing whatever you can against the wall to see what will stick.

LOL.

I have not mentioned Goodrich's name a single time in this thread. I have said that I expected Diggins to struggle, that the WNBA is different than it was 11 years ago (which is undeniably true), and that it was too early to judge Diggins so harshly.

 

[Bestiarius]

And if a Lady Vols fan said the same about DT, exactly how would you differentiate?

We wouldn't even know about it since we don't read the Tenn discussion boards. BTW, Gail Goodrich is a much better player than Skylar.

 

[doggydaddy]

Really? I actually did not say anything of that. You're attributing someone else's words to me.

You are right and I apologize. It was another Tennessee troll.

 

[TheTruthBelow]

I get it. You don't think much of Montgomery.

Doesn't mean you have to insult fans that did.

And what does a few fans thinking Montgomery should have been drafted 1st have to do with the incredible attention Diggins got from ESPN and the rest of the media?

A quick search gives me this NYTimes piece: http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:hjW0J7GadIMJ:thequad.blogs.nytimes.com/2009/04/06/uconns-montgomery-is-worth-the-price-of-admission/ &cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us

...and this final mock draft by WNBA.com, which has Montgomery going first overall: http://www.wnba.com/draft2009/mock_draft_090406.html

...as well as this one from The Seattle Times: http://blog.seattletimes.nwsource.com/storm/2009/04/07/mailbag_my_wnba_mock_draft.html

Sure, just a few fans.

 

[doggydaddy]

It was more than a few fans. A quick search gives me this NYTimes piece: http://webcache.googleusercontent.c...price-of-admission/+&cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us

...and this final mock draft by WNBA.com, which has Montgomery going first overall: http://www.wnba.com/draft2009/mock_draft_090406.html

...sure, just a few fans.

Wow, you found two people that would have taken Mongomery 1st. You make is sound like a travesty.

Has McCoutry been better? Of course.

Your pointing out these two articles and calling them fools for their opinion just proves out what I said.

You don't like Montgomery. And there is no way she got as much attention as Diggins.

 

[TheTruthBelow]

Wow, you found two people that would have taken Mongomery 1st. You make is sound like a travesty.

Has McCoutry been better? Of course.

Your pointing out these two articles and calling them fools for their opinion just proves out what I said.

You don't like Montgomery. And there is no way she got as much attention as Diggins.

I added another one from The Seattle Times, so that's two leading newspapers and the WNBA's official website. Clearly, Renee received no love from the national media, and it was just "a few fans" who thought she should have been the first pick. Where are all these articles pegging Diggins as the first pick?

 

[doggydaddy]

I added another one from The Seattle Times, so that's two leading newspapers and the WNBA's official website. Clearly, Renee received no love from the national media, and it was just "a few fans" who thought she should have been the first pick. Where are all these articles pegging Diggins as the first pick?

Are you seriously trying to say that Montgomery got more attention from the media than Diggins did their senior years?

And the year Montgomery was drafted, there was no Griner or EDD. I know you are not this dumb, so what is your agenda? To trash Montgomery in order to inflate Diggins.

On a Uconn board.

Trolling.

 

[Icebear]

A quick search gives me this NYTimes piece: http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:hjW0J7GadIMJ:thequad.blogs.nytimes.com/2009/04/06/uconns-montgomery-is-worth-the-price-of-admission/ &cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us

...and this final mock draft by WNBA.com, which has Montgomery going first overall: http://www.wnba.com/draft2009/mock_draft_090406.html

...as well as this one from The Seattle Times: http://blog.seattletimes.nwsource.com/storm/2009/04/07/mailbag_my_wnba_mock_draft.html

Sure, just a few fans.

What do those have to do with Boneyard fans. Nothing. In reality it isn't even clear they are fans of Montgomery at all. They are draft articles by the NY Times, Seattle Times and WNBA.com.

 

[FairView]

And if a Lady Vols fan said the same about DT, exactly how would you differentiate?

Two things:
First, DT is one of the best players ever in the WNBA, so a Lady Vols fan wouldn't be able to comment on her poor performance. She has not been the huge disappointment that SD is thus far.
Second, if DT had underperformed, I would be pissed about a Lady Vol fan making a comment like that. So what? I like DT as a great player on my team with moxie and the talent to back it up. Other teams disliked her for the very same reasons. There are some teams and some players that many UConn fans aren't all that fond of. The same goes for every team in every sport. To make believe that we're above all that and sending the love out to every player all the time is disingenuous and ludicrous.

 

[ChicagoGG]

It's going to be another scrappy day in paradise....

 

[meyers7]

Don't care one way or the other about Diggins. Hence, why no comments from me so far. However I did find this......interesting???

Enjoy

1. Why did they feel the need to close caption the people you could understand and not the one you couldn't?
2. I imagine when Diggins was told of this fan driving 600+ miles to see all her home games and wearing green because she played at ND, the first thought through her head was "I gotta beef up my security."

 

[EricLA]

What do those have to do with Boneyard fans. Nothing. In reality it isn't even clear they are fans of Montgomery at all. They are draft articles by the NY Times, Seattle Times and WNBA.com.

You know, Ice, that poster has a history of coming on the board and having insane or ridiculous opinions and calls out BY'ers in the process, then does a fast shuffle in subject matter to change what was actually "meant", then starts in on something else. One of the least enjoyable visitors to our board - always picking quarrels with anyone and everyone... Frankly, I'm surprised the poster hasn't been banned.

Case in point for this discussion - it was about Diggins, but suddenly it's about BY fans who supposedly thought that Monty should have been the #1 draft pick (which has zero to do with the topic at hand - mainly the hype by ESPN and the WNBA surrounding Diggins). But as proof, a bunch of draft.net articles about Monty apparently projected to go at the top of the draft. Which as you aptly pointed out, has zero to do with BY fans, and even less to do with Digggins' hype... altho i'm not sure what is less than zero...!!

 

[Geno-ista]

Yep. The stats will show the biggest reason ND beat (not dominated, dominated means you stomp the other team by 18+)) UConn.

UConn 1 - 4-15, 2-4(3pt), 5 assist, 7 turnover
UConn 2 - 11-31, 0-5(3pt), 3 assist, 8 turnover
UConn 3 - 5-15, 0-2(3pt), 6 assist, 5 turnover
UConn 4 - 3-15, 0-3(3pt), 8 assist, 6 turnover

Diggins was the one that "stirred the drink"- she would come up with those sneaky steals or front our player who was getting the pass and get the charge call. She broke down our defense off the dribble a lot- and then Notre Dame's great interior passing lead to easy buckets or kick outs for uncontested three's. I personally don't like her. And I don't think she is a super star. But it is not fair to say that she was not a Key cog in the wheel. I also think this year we developed late obviously. We did hand over the earlier three losses-each we were in excellent position to win.
And N Dame was a much better team her Soph and Jr year IMO! She was a really good distributor and facilitator. In the Semi's this year- the body language by SD and Achonwa was so bad even early in the game. It almost looked like they knew they could not win the game. Even when it was close they looked frustrated to death. Anyhoo!

 

[UConnCat]

I know you are not this dumb, so what is your agenda? To trash Montgomery in order to inflate Diggins.

On a Uconn board.

Trolling.

The big picture agenda seems to be criticizing former UConn players. Montgomery is a favorite target, sometimes not even mentioned by name and sometimes apropos of nothing (see last post in this very short thread http://www.the-boneyard.com/threads/sun-up-74-61-on-washington-3-31-left-in-game.20715/#post-279800 which is about Renee though she is not mentioned in the post nor had she been mentioned in the thread.) Asjha was/is also a target, particularly after her selection to the Olympic Team, though strangely no mention of her after she filled her role as 12th player beautifully in Team USA's toughest against Australia).

There are many here who are willing to engage in honest discussion of current and former UConn players, their strengths, weaknesses, successes and struggles. It's very difficult to have that conversation with posters whose primary agenda seems to be to criticize UConn players. That's not engaging in discussion; that's using this board as a dumping ground and it's a turnoff.

 

[Geno-ista]

I bet he was hoping she'd be drafted by Chicago instead of Tulsa

I am in "Shock" - no pun intended, that she has never met, spoken, or taken a picture with this gentleman. He loses his son. Comes out of a deep depression as a result of watching her play the game of basketball. Gets season tickets and drives 600 miles per home game to see her. I would be dumbfounded if most of the young women that come thru Ct, wouldn't go over pre or post game and shake his hand, wish him well, and ask if he would like some pictures taken with him. This tells me more about who and what I think she is than anything. Am I crazy? Would a small gesture like I mention above be too much for one of these athletes after you are made aware of the entire background re this nice man?

 

[Icebear]

You know, Ice, that poster has a history of coming on the board and having insane or ridiculous opinions and calls out BY'ers in the process, then does a fast shuffle in subject matter to change what was actually "meant", then starts in on something else. One of the least enjoyable visitors to our board - always picking quarrels with anyone and everyone... Frankly, I'm surprised the poster hasn't been banned.

Case in point for this discussion - it was about Diggins, but suddenly it's about BY fans who supposedly thought that Monty should have been the #1 draft pick (which has zero to do with the topic at hand - mainly the hype by ESPN and the WNBA surrounding Diggins). But as proof, a bunch of draft.net articles about Monty apparently projected to go at the top of the draft. Which as you aptly pointed out, has zero to do with BY fans, and even less to do with Digggins' hype... altho i'm not sure what is less than zero...!!

-1 to -infiniity

 

[diggerfoot]

LOL.

I have not mentioned Goodrich's name a single time in this thread. I have said that I expected Diggins to struggle, that the WNBA is different than it was 11 years ago (which is undeniably true), and that it was too early to judge Diggins so harshly.

I must apologize for piggybacking on doggydaddy putting words in your mouth. Ironically, as I was willing to charitably acknowledge one of your assertions as actually relating to the attended purpose of the thread, you've just denied that. Therefore I must also acknowledge that you may not be guilty of post hoc reasoning; you are simply a provocateur, i.e., a troll.

 

[Icebear]

Digger, I've never seen a poster rub you wrong like this guy.