Gerritt Cole | Page 4 | The Boneyard

Gerritt Cole

This pitching stuff is just as performance altering as steroids were. The only difference is putting something in your body compared to on your body.
Take a look at batting averages and how they plummet as the spin rates get higher. Its in a lot of these articles now.
I give credit for baseball trying to end it and suspect offensive numbers will start to rise significantly in the next 2-3 weeks...between this and the hot weather

I agree on making it stop, it is an advantage. But it's not at all the same as steroids from what I see but who's to know. But for me hitters just aren't that good any more because of their philosophy and that won't change if teams fire people like Chili Davis who actually gets it. I mean there's no doubt if the spin rate numbers are what they're saying the advantage has hurt hitting but not as much as we're seeing. It's because hitters just suck. It's not hurting the Sox good hitters because they have a nice philosophy going to the plate, and more level swing plain, especially with 2 strikes.
 
Last edited:
When I woke up this morning, I would've never thought that I'd be reading about Mr. October's backside today. What a world.

No huh LOL. Let's remember the time ARod flipped the ball out of the first baseman glove too but not the time Dustin Pedroia did LOL. Quite the world huh?
 
Yeah I don't think this is right. Homeruns are down over the past half decade. Velocity is way up. In the 70s guys weren't throwing 90 mph sliders on the black. the percentage of pitchers hitting high 90s is through the roof compared to prior generations.
What?

The MLB almost hit 7,000 HRs in 2019. That’s the most hit in one year of all time. The AL broke its HR record in 2017, 2018, and again in 2019. The steroid era was seeing 3,000 to 5,500 HRs per year. Currently we’re blowing those numbers away, they aren’t down.

Higher pitch speed = higher possible exit velocity.
 
I haven't looked recently but I believe the cutoff is somewhere around a 75-80% success rate for SBs to be positive value
That’s the range I’ve seen at the macro level as well. I wonder what that looks like a click down. Something I’ve noticed a little bit recently is going on an 0-2 or 1-2 count with 2 outs. I feel like the success rate wouldn’t need to be as high to be worth it.
 
.-.
In this case I'm not so sure its jealousy of notoriety instead of just trying to compete at the highest level with their peers. However, Bauer really does not like Cole so it's possible in his case it's out of disdain for Cole.

For the Bonds part I'm not sure... He was in the midst of 7 straight years with an OPS over 1000 and (partly because he was a jerk and west coast bias) all of the notoriety was on Griffey and then McGwire and Sosa, two guys who were not in the same stratosphere talent wise. I can't speak for Bonds, obviously, but I believe the Sosa and McGwire saving baseball narrative pissed him off immensely and he decided to use the same "advantage" to become essentially, a video game player.

For perspective, the only other guys who I found with at least 7 consecutive OPS years over 1000 (and this before Bonds is believed to start juicing) are Ruth, Gehrig, Williams, and Hank Greenberg. Bonds was a surly but he was the best player of the 90s and never really got the pub he deserved.
 
So Gerritt Cole just essentially admitted to cheating. Where is the outrage from all the Yankee fans who crucified the Astros and the Red Sox for stealing signs?? (Which by the way the Yankees were doing too). Same group that love hopping on Manny and Big Papi but are silent about Giambi, Clemens and AFraud. They are all cheating. Some get caught some don’t. Some are more obvious than others. I actually give Cole credit for not blatantly lying like all the rest.
I overstand your concerns....The difference you're drawing is well said but not understood. First, Cole just arrived in NY. I don't think that most Yankee fans have come to fully accept him as a Yankee yet. So, that maybe one reason the outrage has been virtually 'non-existent'. Secondly, it's understandable that people tend to defend their turf even it's as dirty or dirtier than someone else's. Now, getting to the steroids....steroids were in the league at least back to the late '70's, and when Jose Conseco tried to tell everyone no one wanted to hear it. Baseball, the Multi-billion dollar enterprise most certainly didn't want to their cash cow destroyed, so it seems that they went after the messenger instead investigating the people he pointed out and the problem. Now, cheating is cheating....but there are differences in WHY someone cheats. I'm told that Barry Bonds never used any of that stuff, but seeing the kind of media frenzy McGuire and Sosa created and the money they made, it made it easy for him to try to enhance his already solidified Hall of Fame Numbers by trying the stuff. Notice, no one criticizes these two...in fact McGuire is still in the league as a coach. If Baseball was TRULY A SPORT....and NOT ENTERTAINMENT EVERY VIOLATOR would have been banned for life from the league and all of their records (or records from the point of use) would be expunged. Any awards rewarded would be rescinded. All teams wins would be forfeited, including playoffs and World Series.....Now, Roger used it late in his career, as did Big Papi and Manny. A-Rod was fighting it and would have won, but it seems that he made a deal with the league and he was allowed to retire with his money and promises of post retirement jobs. Remember, the person who extracted A-Rod's name from the lists of names said that there were MANY names, but he only made A-Rod's public.
Lastly, Sports as we grew up believing it to be.....is no longer. Today, Sports is BIG BUSINESS and therefore it seems that those in power will do all they can to protect the images of their sport. This may be the reason that the NFL Commissioner said that he could not find any evidence of the New Patriots spying on other teams when it was clear that they had. Then, instead of making all the video tapes available to the media to be scrutinized he said he had them destroyed....well, if there was nothing incriminating on them, why destroy them? Also, notice: He didn't say that there was no incriminating evidence. He said "HE" didn't see any....which could mean that he had his staff only show him the tapes that were clean....or to fast forward past the incriminating parts. We can't infer from what he said that he meant what we think he meant.
 
Nice try Red Sox/Astros fans.
Nobody buys your sanctimonious over-reaction. It's not going to distract anyone from what your teams did.
Pitchers have been altering the baseball with foreign substances (or an emery board) since the dawn of time. The Hall of Fame is full of pitchers who did this. Heck, there was probably some pine tar on the rock that David slung at Goliath. It is in no way comparable to taking steroids to the point that your actual head gets bigger or using tv cameras in the outfield to systematically steal signs.

Alex Rodriguez Alex Rodriguez Alex Rodriguez

If you say it 3 times, the stupid goes away.
 
Alex Rodriguez Alex Rodriguez Alex Rodriguez

If you say it 3 times, the stupid goes away.
Yes, A-rod did the 'roids. Yankee fans know this. We don't condone it nor do we give him a pass.
But, that has no bearing on this discussion, just as Big Papi doesn't either. This is about pitchers.
Gaylord Perry is in the Hall of Fame. Barry Bonds isn't.
Say that 3 times.
 


This tweet was from yesterday, so it's not even counting the 18 runs and 7 bombs the Red Sox gave up to the Jays today.

Edit: Whoops, starting pitchers. So that means only 5 runs and 3 bombs against the Jays today in 1.1IP should have counted on this tweet.
 
.-.


This tweet was from yesterday, so it's not even counting the 18 runs and 7 bombs the Red Sox gave up to the Jays today.

Edit: Whoops, starting pitchers. So that means only 5 runs and 3 bombs against the Jays today in 1.1IP should have counted on this tweet.

During the Pirates game today, our play-by-play announcer noted that last week spin rate had dropped, Ks were down and BAs were up.

I honestly don't know what's going on, as the color guy (Bob Walk, former pitcher) kept saying that this has been going on forever and it's simply a distraction from the real problem of focusing on launch angles, which leads to three true outcomes, which is killing the game, in his opinion. Walk gave tons of examples of various substances his peers would use and claimed pretty much everyone used something, even in the 80s/90s.
 
The Sox did just face Houston and Toronto too, but as i said before with pitchers getting weened off this stuff and the temps going up its the perfect storm for a big uptick in offense.
 
The Sox did just face Houston and Toronto too, but as i said before with pitchers getting weened off this stuff and the temps going up its the perfect storm for a big uptick in offense.

You would think but then you have to hit the reality button and look at the Yankee offense. No big uptick expected spin rates or not, they're awful. LOL Wish it was just pitchers "cheating" but it's not. I mean I wish they'd all grab a needle and poke it in their ass, at least they'd be more fun to watch until they all got suspended.
 
You would think but then you have to hit the reality button and look at the Yankee offense. No big uptick expected spin rates or not, they're awful. LOL Wish it was just pitchers "cheating" but it's not. I mean I wish they'd all grab a needle and poke it in their ass, at least they'd be more fun to watch until they all got suspended.
Yankee starters have been bad lately. Gotta wonder if something changed with them.
 
Yankee starters have been bad lately. Gotta wonder if something changed with them.

Was looking promising then the Kluber injury happened, then Severino gets hurt in his rehab start. Its a combination of things I believe the lack off offense has put pressure on the pitching, rotations do tend to go through a rough patch in the summer heat. Taillon and Kluber didnt start for essentially 2 years you would think the Yankees who are so OCD with resting players would have a plan in place to give starters a brief 10 day DL spot just to use at a rest period.
 
Yankee starters have been bad lately. Gotta wonder if something changed with them.
I know you're implying that they're doing poorly because they must have been cheating with sticky substances, but they're just regressing to what's expected instead of pitching well above their FIP. Gerrit Cole looked just fine his last start against one of the best offenses in baseball.

1623730386683.png
 
.-.
Here’s a hot take. Glasnow said that not being able to use sunscreen caused his elbow injury that might need TJS:

 
I know you're implying that they're doing poorly because they must have been cheating with sticky substances, but they're just regressing to what's expected instead of pitching well above their FIP. Gerrit Cole looked just fine his last start against one of the best offenses in baseball.

View attachment 68018
Cole has started 14 games this year....he has double digits strikeouts in 5 of those starts...those all happened in his first 8 starts. .he hasn't hit double digits his last 6 starts. Including only 4 tonight.

I think he is still a great pitcher...but he isn't as unhittable as he was earlier than the year. And it's hard not to conclude it's because he isn't using a foreign substance anymore.
 
Cole has started 14 games this year....he has double digits strikeouts in 5 of those starts...those all happened in his first 8 starts. .he hasn't hit double digits his last 6 starts. Including only 4 tonight.

I think he is still a great pitcher...but he isn't as unhittable as he was earlier than the year. And it's hard not to conclude it's because he isn't using a foreign substance anymore.
The guy hit 102MPH in the 8th inning yesterday. Sticky stuff or not, he's still one of the most talented pitchers in the game. I'll take 8 innings of 2 runs, 4 hits and "only" 4 Ks every outing over the rest of his contract.
 
Did anyone see the Bauer interview from the other day? Guy raised a bunch of great points.



I love him - it's a shame he doesn't get along with Cole because he would be epic with the NY media. Huge troll but he is hilarious and often spot on with his "crazy" takes.
 
The guy hit 102MPH in the 8th inning yesterday. Sticky stuff or not, he's still one of the most talented pitchers in the game. I'll take 8 innings of 2 runs, 4 hits and "only" 4 Ks every outing over the rest of his contract.
Against the Jays in a minor league park, Cole would be the least of my worries on this team.
 
.-.
Did anyone see the Bauer interview from the other day? Guy raised a bunch of great points.



I love him - it's a shame he doesn't get along with Cole because he would be epic with the NY media. Huge troll but he is hilarious and often spot on with his "crazy" takes.


Good speak out, more players should this is gonna be a very ugly offseason, players gotta force Manfred to change his way or force him out.
 
Good speak out, more players should this is gonna be a very ugly offseason, players gotta force Manfred to change his way or force him out.
If there is one thing fans of any team can probably agree on, it's that Manfred is a duck*ing genius.

His solutions to baseball's biggest problems over the past few years - from pace of play issues to cheating (illegal use of technology & sticky stuff) - have been so misguided it's perplexing.
 
The guy hit 102MPH in the 8th inning yesterday. Sticky stuff or not, he's still one of the most talented pitchers in the game. I'll take 8 innings of 2 runs, 4 hits and "only" 4 Ks every outing over the rest of his contract.
Yeah...and that's why I said he is a great pitcher. But he won't be the same dominant pitcher he was in the beginning of the year.

And...that is probably ok. He will still be a top pitcher in the league. Baseball sucks with pitchers dominating the game. Cole and Glasnow raise good points about how they change the rules being important.
 
What ever happened to the rosin bags?

Seemed like for 100 years it was a happy medium. Give the pitchers some relief from slippery, sweaty hands and it was a uniformly used substance.
 
What ever happened to the rosin bags?

Seemed like for 100 years it was a happy medium. Give the pitchers some relief from slippery, sweaty hands and it was a uniformly used substance.
Watch the Bauer video I posted.
 
Watch the Bauer video I posted.

I saw it.

My point was you can get plenty of grip on the ball with rosin. Bauer showed he could suspend it upside down on his palm with a combo of sweat and rosin. So why the need for anything else?
 
.-.

Forum statistics

Threads
168,640
Messages
4,587,376
Members
10,497
Latest member
Orlando Fos


Top Bottom