Geno's telephone congratulations to Mo'ne Davis dubbed a "violation"[merged thread]

[JS]

Call me crazy, but I can see it a violation that if left unchecked, could easily be abused. With that said, a first "offense" should be little more than a stern warning.

One of the articles did articulate a rationale. It's that without some check, recruiters could bombard a pre-high school kid with calls to their hearts' content as long as they go silent for a couple of years after the kid enters the ninth grade.

Would they? Maybe some would.

Trouble with that is, now you've got all kinds of objective rules on contacts and calls for "prospective student athletes" (ninth grade and up) and a completely subjective test (something along the lines of "Is it plausibly a call with some recruiting angle?") for calls to all other "individuals" from birth.

Taking up your challenge, Tom, if a rival coach made the call in this case I'd still think from everything I read about the call that it's absurd to suggest it was intended to recruit the "individual."

Now, assuming for an impossible moment that the rival coach had the stature of Geno, I'd say "There he goes, playing up that his school is every young player's dream and he's a wonderful person."

So now we're talking reality. Not a recruiting call but a stroke of good PR that might make rival coaches grit their teeth. Viewed differently, the best get an advantage from their reputation as the best. That reputation is earned.

Should such PR matters be the business of the NCAA? No.

But now that the big football conferences are moving toward paying their players and telling the NCAA to stick it, the NCAA has to have something to do to those it can still push around. And what better way to demonstrate some feeble twitching of life than to hit the most prominent coach in the game with a ticky-tack foul?

No, there's virtually no punishment for secondary violations, most of which are deemed inadvertent. And that holds true of multiple offenses. Tennessee WBB, just to pick another team at random, had about 15 known ones last time I looked, several more than UConn. Never any consequences other than live and learn.

Of course we're not talking about doing the exact same thing over and over again each time expecting a different result (one definition of insanity).

So here we are in the far reaches of subjective NCAA nonsense, making a young athlete "sad" (her word) while the whole notion of amateur athletics elsewhere in D-1 moves from something of an illusion to something for the history books.

Getting so it won't even be necessary for North Carolina to offer fake courses to athletes anymore (a real head-scratcher for the NCAA: "Hmmmm, should we begin to make plans to prepare for possibly organizing a potential future investigation? Wouldn't want move too hastily.").

Heck with that. Just pay the players, give them a union, 401(k) and bonuses. Don't waste their time or challenge their intellect with difficult choices among fake courses.

Anyway, we've now saved the college athletics world from good-PR, non-recruiting phone calls.

And the anonymous (of course) rival coach who dropped a dime over this is still a petty-ass who should step forward, claim "credit" and reap the PR results .

 

[temery]

Taking up your challenge, Tom, if a rival coach made the call in this case I'd still think from everything I read about the call that it's absurd to suggest it was intended to recruit the "individual."

You hardly represent the "many" people here who I believe would have unreasonably shredded a rival coach for calling the girl.

 

[Kibitzer]

You hardly represent the "many" people here who I believe would have unreasonably shredded a rival coach for calling the girl.

Horrors! Boneyarders would actually and unreasonably shred a rival coach! I'm shocked!

Actually, the reason so many of us want to identify the complaining coach is so we can congratulate him/her for helping to uphold the NCAA standards of integrity.

Sure.

 

[temery]

Horrors! Boneyarders would actually and unreasonably shred a rival coach! I'm shocked!
View attachment 6795
Actually, the reason so many of us want to identify the complaining coach is so we can congratulate him/her for helping to uphold the NCAA standards of integrity.

Sure.

Don't get me wrong. Whoever complained anonymously should be pulled into the sunlight and baked until done.

S/he's a coward.

 

[Icebear]

You hardly represent the "many" people here who I believe would have unreasonably shredded a rival coach for calling the girl.

Not under similar circumstances. Remember Geno did not call the girl. He called the coverage team. He apparently didn't even know she was going to be in the booth. I would give any coach the benefit of the doubt it that circumstance.

This was not a call to her home, her school, to her. It was a call cleared by UCONN compliance. Once on the air talking with the coverage team and they say, "Wait, she is here do you want to talk to her directly?" What is he supposed to do, be impolite and come off as a pompous jackass saying, "No, I can't talk to her." Sorry that doesn't cut it.

 

[temery]

Not under similar circumstances. Remember Geno did not call the girl. He called the coverage team. He apparently didn't even know she was going to be in the booth. I would give any coach the benefit of the doubt it that circumstance.

This was not a call to her home, her school, to her. It was a call cleared by UCONN compliance. Once on the air talking with the coverage team and they say, "Wait, she is here do you want to talk to her directly?" What is he supposed to do, be impolite and come off as a pompous jackass saying, "No, I can't talk to her." Sorry that doesn't cut it.

That could be true, but I have doubts. Gotta source?

I am not entirely sure it matters.

 

[RoyDodger]

Call me crazy, but I can see it a violation that if left unchecked, could easily be abused. With that said, a first "offense" should be little more than a stern warning. A pattern of calling such athletes ... Yeah, that would and should be a problem for any school.

One thing for sure, if it had been the coach of a UConn rival who had made the call, it would have been considered a crime against humanity in the minds of many here.

I can think of a lot of things in our society that should be an "offense" but if they aren't on the books, someone who commits the so-called "offense" can't be prosecuted. Here, unless there is something in the NCAA rules we've all missed, Geno Auriemma did not violate any NCAA written by-laws. Maybe, the NCAA should revise their rules to include such a situation, but that's another story. And I think it's unfair to accuse Boneyarders of being one-sided. Sure, we're sensitive to injustices against our great coach, but I suspect few on this board would have gone overboard had another coach done exactly the same thing and it was made clear that it didn't violate the NCAA written by-laws.

 

[doggydaddy]

That could be true, but I have doubts. Gotta source?

I am not entirely sure it matters.

The source is Geno himself.

"I get contacted by some people with the Little League World Series who say is it OK if she calls you. I said how about I just call and you tell her I said congratulations. I call the office and, 'You know, Coach, she is standing right here.' I said put her on the phone, I want to say congratulations. I say congratulations."

http://m.middletownpress.com/middle...?contentguid=anaA6jNL&detailindex=1&pn=0&ps=3

 

[temery]

The source is Geno himself.

"I get contacted by some people with the Little League World Series who say is it OK if she calls you. I said how about I just call and you tell her I said congratulations. I call the office and, 'You know, Coach, she is standing right here.' I said put her on the phone, I want to say congratulations. I say congratulations."

http://m.middletownpress.com/middle...?contentguid=anaA6jNL&detailindex=1&pn=0&ps=3

He should have said yes, it's ok.

I am not sure it would have prevented the controversy, but it would have been a fraction of what it has become.

 

[UcMiami]

temery - the problem is that something like half the D1 programs in the country run camps for athletes every summer using if not the head coach than some of the assistants and some of their players to staff the camps. These camps happen throughout the summer with I believe no regard to NCAA contact and dead contact periods and with the NCAA finding no problem with them because the kids are all pre-highschool age. All that contact is truly sport specific and a great recruiting edge. And Mo'ne Davis' other activities this summer could also be considered 'violations' - well publicized meetings with WNBA players she admires that would all be classified as 'representatives' of their former college teams - heck, the WNBA just paid for her to travel around and every one of those people she met including Brazile and Richie herself would be classified as representatives of their former colleges and in those cases there was monetary value provided to both Davis and her family. And what about all the twitter shout outs from folks like Staley (another Philly person by the way) and others.
I actually think it would have made sense for the NCAA to go in the exact opposite direction - identifying Davis as an exception to any non-contact rule they want to enforce for pre-highschoolers because of her fame. There are not a whole lot of kids 13 and under that become so famous. Make that a criteria and it might happen once a decade.

 

[temery]

I can think of a lot of things in our society that should be an "offense" but if they aren't on the books, someone who commits the so-called "offense" can't be prosecuted. Here, unless there is something in the NCAA rules we've all missed, Geno Auriemma did not violate any NCAA written by-laws. Maybe, the NCAA should revise their rules to include such a situation, but that's another story. And I think it's unfair to accuse Boneyarders of being one-sided. Sure, we're sensitive to injustices against our great coach, but I suspect few on this board would have gone overboard had another coach done exactly the same thing and it was made clear that it didn't violate the NCAA written by-laws.

'Yarders are as partisan as posters on any site. The fact most sites have a much smaller voice doesn't change this fact.

As to the first part of you post - I didn't say he violated or technically violated any NCAA rule, or should be "prosecuted," but I do believe contacting potential players, regardless of age, is a problem waiting to happen.

 

[UConnChapette]

The biggest thing that sticks in my craw is this: here is the big bad NCAA exercising it's "penalty power" over a seemingly innocuous phone call congratulating a female little league player for her success, who happens to have said that her dream is to play for UConn. This is a child who is 4 years away from high school graduation and three years from signing a letter of intent. Yet, there are issues at other institutions for CURRENT student athletes that constitute fraud in the form of fake classes, students not attending classes yet still passing, etc. and they seemingly cannot get off their duffs to invoke even a slap on the wrist penalty to said institutions.

Seems to me the NCAA has misplaced priorities and seems very quick to penalize some schools yet turn a blind eye to others - yet one of their said missions is to protect all student athletes.

I have to wonder...if UCONN was in one of the P5 conferences would the blind eye have overlooked the phone call? Is the NCAA dragging their feet on the P5 schools transgressions to appease them? The NCAA's power in the P5 is waning as those schools begin to branch away and make their own rules. So they wield their big ruler on the institutions unlucky enough to not be in the P5, yet are still a power player in some sports.

 

[temery]

temery - the problem is that something like half the D1 programs in the country run camps for athletes every summer using if not the head coach than some of the assistants and some of their players to staff the camps. These camps happen throughout the summer with I believe no regard to NCAA contact and dead contact periods and with the NCAA finding no problem with them because the kids are all pre-highschool age.

That's not a problem, it's a product of success. Most, if not all coaches have summer camps. Had Geno congratulated Mo'ne Davis at his camp, I doubt anyone would have cared.

 

[UcMiami]

That's not a problem, it's a product of success. Most, if not all coaches have summer camps. Had Geno congratulated Mo'ne Davis at his camp, I doubt anyone would have cared.

But if Mo'ne is classified as a potential student athlete at 13 is the NCAA now saying she can't attend a coaches camp because she is too famous?

 

[OneTrickPony]

I prefer to call them what they really are: bullies. Bet this wouldn't be a violation anywhere else. It feels a lot like getting stopped by the local sheriff in some backwoods South Carolina town and the cop sees you have a Connecticut driver's license and knows it's his chance to screw with a Yankee ("well, well, well loooooky what we have here Cletus!") and do what he wants because there's nothing you can or will do about it. And Muffet says Geno doesn't have class...

So you're a Yankee, eh...

 

[Zorro]

Still and all, there is something deliciously funny about the possible prospect of Geno being required to be schooled on NCAA recruiting rules, probably by some intern. Sort of like maybe Jeff Gordon being required to go to driving safety school for making a u-turn on an empty street.

 

[OneTrickPony]

Oh boy.... now Geno's really in trouble.

Bria HartleyVerified account ‏@Breezyyy14
Happy I got to meet money @Monedavis11 today...such a bright future ahead of you and hopefully we cross paths again pic.twitter.com/0VcTQBFzEL

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The fit is obvious...welcome, "Money"...

 

[Zorro]

That's not a problem, it's a product of success. Most, if not all coaches have summer camps. Had Geno congratulated Mo'ne Davis at his camp, I doubt anyone would have cared.

I'll bet he will, too!

 

[j66kicker]

The fit is obvious...welcome, "Money"...

Has Johnny Manziel copyrighted his "money" move yet?

 

[uconnfan68]

That is why I said "if" - but same holds true for any other school. Then again, that isn't Geno's style...unless it is Syracuse.

That SU game wasn't Geno's doing... he just let his players answer back.

 

[uconnfan68]

It would be awesome if the school could, you know stop cheating, just for a few years. I mean the men just got off probation for God's sake so you'd think *someone* in the Athletic Department could say "yo Geno we don't have a great track record with the NCAA so maybe on these borderline cases we should just err on the side of caution." Sorry, I know most on here just care about the streaks and Ws, but I do actually give a damn about the athletic programs keeping it clean, and a secondary violation is still a violation.

Really? Take a look around. The stuff that UConn has publicly suffered for are routinely overlooked in 90% of the country. Retroactive punishments, double jeopardy punishments? No one else gets that stuff, and it wasn't warranted the first time. A 7th semester senior in good standing should be allowed to leave school if they choose to (for a professional tryout), and not have the school penalized for it. Plenty of no-show classes and falsified grades that SHOULD be the NCAA priority go unreported, or ignored, let alone penalized.

 

[OneTrickPony]

That SU game wasn't Geno's doing... he just let his players answer back.

I don't think with the teams Geno assembles, and the way they train, he needs to tell them to turn it on...all he can do is take them out...the championship against ND looked like a group of women answering a statement made to one of them at an awards ceremony in the most poignant way possible...

 

[uconnfan68]

I don't think with the teams Geno assembles, and the way they train, he needs to tell them to turn it on...all he can do is take them out...the championship against ND looked like a group of women answering a statement made to one of them at an awards ceremony in the most poignant way possible...

The SU game that was referred to was a very chippy game, and our kids were really tired of it. Geno just left his kids in to send a message.

 

[RoyDodger]

I haven't seen it cited, but Jeff Jacobs had an excellent column in The Courant the other day on this subject. Best line is his last: "The NCAA found UConn in violation of bylaw 13.1.3.1. We would submit that the NCAA is in violation of common sense, and the anonymous school hiding under that rock is one green, envious lizard."

 

[RoyDodger]

And another very good article by Dan Wetzel on the subject.

Best lines:

"This is the rabbit hole of sub-bylaws all bureaucracies want to go down, while tsk-tsk'ing that rules are rules. In this case, it was Bylaw 13.1.3.1.

The NCAA doesn't just have too many rules; it has too many people obsessed with those rules who, in turn, keep writing more rules. It has too many coaches and administrators who see everything as a recruiting advantage that needs to be curbed or eliminated. It has too many compliance folks who think nothing is just a nice gesture."