Jimmy, you said it best.
Game Cancelled
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Jimmy, you said it best.
This is true. I think the Rent is the state emergency preparedness center or something to that effect. If this had been much worse, and the state had set up in the Stop n Shop parking lot, the criticism would have been severe. So you can't blame the state for planning for the worst. I do, however, think that by yesterday it was pretty clear that this was going to be not much more than a distribution operation that could have been set up at a lot of other places.
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One of the primary purposes of any government is the welfare of its people, not the playing of a football game. Blaming Malloy is pure lunacy. He has a lot more on his plate than a football game (like the safety and welfare of a large part of the state). So people get inconvenienced, and heaven forbid some may have to miss a game. The whining in this situation is pathetic.
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It's not a false choice. If you want to move the operations out of Rentschler Field, then you necessarily lose efficiency in the move. Therefore, in order for the game to go on as scheduled, a sacrifice in relief efforts has to be made. It's a legitimate choice, and one many posters on this board have absolutely felt strongly about.
Furthermore, while nobody in these 8 pages speculated that CT, as a whole, supported this, the general consensus among many fans is that this was an obviously stupid choice to stage the relief efforts here, and I am willing to bet that these football message boards do not make up a very large portion of the overall Connecticut population, and, if we were to ask them, I think we'd find that most people were much more sympathetic to the relief efforts than the die-hards on this message board. So when you call for the head of the Governor, who represents more than just football fans, you aren't looking at the big picture, imo.
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We just had one of the worst statewide natural disasters in a generation. As of now there's still about 360k people in this state without power. The Rent has been a designated Emergency Operations Center for this State for several years. Sorry it's an inconvenience for us, but like people here have been saying, this takes precedence over a college football game or any revenue it might generate. Nobody outside the box of those who follow UConn sports (and there are a LOT in this state alone) would even think this is an issue.
Most likely the game will be rescheduled for Saturday anyway. If that means a few hundred or thousand less people can attend - tough.
Most likely the game will be rescheduled for Saturday anyway. If that means a few hundred or thousand less people can attend - tough.
nelsonmuntz
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360k people without power in late August when it is sunny and beautiful is an inconvenience. Half that number without power for 2 days after a noreaster is a disaster.
The Rent serves absolutely no purpose here. It is a distribution center for MRE's and water, and I have yet to read of a single town in this state that has any pressing need for those supplies. We have heard that they have handled a grand total of 20 trucks. This operation could be held anywhere, including one of 2 empty strip malls and an empty movie theater within 2 miles on the stadium. Or better yet, set up a center close to the people who are actually without power.
If you are going to cover the millions lost here, then you can lecture us. Otherwise, stop with your sanctimony.
You want to do something good for humanity? Clear the whole operation out and send them up to Vermont.
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I have a friend who is a Sargent Major with the guard, he returned to work this morning and he gave me a discription of the events around the Rent this past week. First, the decision to use the Rent as a staging area was made by FEMA (the Rent is CT's emergency ditributon center per FEMA's long standing emergency action plan). The parking areas were used for big and small trucks to come in and out of and move the various supplies around the state for relief. They like the area because of its central location, easy access to highways and large open area for storage, parking, moving trucks around in, etc. They were moving a lot more then just water and MRE's and there were a lot more then just twenty trucks involved. He was one of the guys sleeping on the bunks in the concourse for the last several days, no one is happeir then him and his comrades to finally get out of there. It sounds as if the guard and FEMA are starting to pull out of the Rent so that the game can happen on Saturday (look for a late start time) although some of the parking areas may still be tied up. The field itself was not touched - he said the ground keeper threatened to use a machitee on anyone who stepped foot on it. The only damage was to the polls that are used to raise the nets behind the goal posts when kicks are made, they were bent over by the wind and were still laying on the benches when he left last night.
nelsonmuntz
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The earthquake did not damage the Rent, nor was East Hartford or Hartford badly hit by the hurricane. We also were not hit by an asteroid or a zombie apocalypse, although it is only 10 am on Wednesday, so that could change. Since none of those things have happened in East Hartford, and since most of the people out of power are in the far east of the state, or along the shoreline, a MRE and water distribution center at the Rent seems like a complete waste of resources. I have not heard of any town demanding more MRE's. Have you?
If you want to set priorities for this disaster, the East Hartford NG unit should pack their stuff up and head north on I91 to Vermont. Staying where they are now, doing what they are doing, is a total waste of time and resources, and will cost the university a lot of money.
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They're here to keep balloon knots from storming The Rent demanding a football game....
junglehusky
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Valid points Nelson... but how were we supposed to know these things IN ADVANCE? There's a reason people say "Hope for the best, prepare for the worst".
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Yeah, you're right. No time for any sanctimony here. Let's tell the NG to move their supply trucks out of the way because they're blocking the tailgaters.
Good to know our citizens have their priorities straight. (Oops, there I go lecturing again.)
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Positive 1 more week to plan for Vanderbilt, but negative is they will have butterflies out, and we don't know who we are yet. Do we an Fordham share an open date?
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No. If the game isn't played this weekend it likely doesn't get played. If they do play this weekend, no harm no foul.
There's something new on the interweb, name-calling and strawmen.
You said we "prepared for a disaster that didn't happen." Now you want to claim that's not what you meant? Fine. If you think the government was "over-prepared" and ready for a Katrina like disaster, then how do you explain only having 100 soldiers at the Rent? Do you think 100 soldiers could have handled the Katrina aftermath?
Why can't you answer a simple question that has been asked? If no power, water, or access to food for 5+/- days is an "inconvenience", then what do you call changing your plans for a football game from Thursday to Saturday?
No, no it's not. Protection from foreign invaders, yes. Welfare, no. Read the constitution, there's nothing in there about welfare.
Samoo
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There's actually this little known part of the constitution called the preamble:
We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defence, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America
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Lighten up. You can't reasonably interpret that use of the word "welfare" to mean the payment of funds to people who are not working. It was clearly meant in a broader manner.
I stand corrected based on that usage. The word "welfare" has taken on a different meaning for me. I was 100% wrong in my post if you think of "general welfare". That's not the type of welfare I was talking about.
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Yeah. I'm a libertarian, so I don't think the government has any role other than to prevent individuals from instituting force or fraud against other individuals' life, liberty, or property. However, the fact is that Rentschler Field is owned by the State of Connecticut, and like any property owner, they have the right to do what they want with the land. Of course, that doesn't mean I approve of the government owning land in the first place. Then again, I don't approve of the government running schools either, which means no public University of Connecticut to begin with. And as for the Constitution, the states have the right to welfare per the 10th Amendment in the Bill of Rights (which says that any powers not specifically mentioned in the Constitution are reserved to the states or the people). I absolutely agree federal welfare programs are unconstitutional (sadly, the courts differ). But while I disagree with state welfare programs (and think they should be done by private agencies, which are far more efficient), they're quite Constitutional.
Edit per the crossed post above me: I am interpreting welfare to mean any program to provide for the social being of the people, whether they are in trouble due to unemployment, disaster, poor financial planning for retirement, or anything else that is not the direct consequence of another person's illegal actions (what I mean by "illegal" is "violating life, liberty, or property" not necessarily what IS illegal). But I'm not going to turn this into a political flame. Just don't make up lies about the Constitution.
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I think this is a super appropriate place to debate the fundamental role of government's place in its citizens' lives.
Gregory-read the post above yours.
I see both sides of this issue. I think they should be able to move this relatively small operations, but don't think the football game is more important. I think the Rent is a great location for these operations, understand why it was chosen first, but don't see why alternative arrangements can't be made with a few days notice for a small operations. We're not talking about thousands of soldiers, just 100. But I am most troubled by the people who minimize the disaster, who keep complaining about money when the game is postponed, not canceled (as of today), who rant and rave about the incredibly traumatizing effect of going to a game on Saturday instead of Thursday, while claiming 300,000+ people without power for 5 or more days is nothing more than an inconvenience.
I see both sides of this issue. I think they should be able to move this relatively small operations, but don't think the football game is more important. I think the Rent is a great location for these operations, understand why it was chosen first, but don't see why alternative arrangements can't be made with a few days notice for a small operations. We're not talking about thousands of soldiers, just 100. But I am most troubled by the people who minimize the disaster, who keep complaining about money when the game is postponed, not canceled (as of today), who rant and rave about the incredibly traumatizing effect of going to a game on Saturday instead of Thursday, while claiming 300,000+ people without power for 5 or more days is nothing more than an inconvenience.
Samoo
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But it was exactly the type of welfare he was referencing - and that you argued wasn't in the constitution - the welfare of the people (well being, safety, prosperity). No where did he even hint at payments to the poor (which you appear to believe are unconstitutional).
Well said. It also reads "promote" the general welfare. Not "finance" the general welfare.
What part of "I stand corrected" and "I was 100% wrong" is confusing to you? I misinterpreted his post.
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I don't want to make this a whole Constitutional debate, but it's still unclear whether "provide general welfare" is being applied to the states, the federal government, the people, or some combination. It's also unclear if the Preamble is meant to be considered equally valid to the rest of the Constitution, or if it is just a summary. For instance, even though it states "establish justice" there are specific regulations set out to determine who gets to establish justice how, and when "justice" cannot be established (for instance, I may consider hate speech unjust, but it has to be legal). But that's enough of that.
For the pertinent issue, I don't have access to State Documents, an without filing a request under FOIA, I can't know the full details. (On a side note, perhaps someone should file a FOIA request to determine why it can't be moved from Rentschler. I'm not a CT resident so I can't legally do it). But I'd assume they had more than one possible site. And they could have used one of those. That being said, once they start using one site, it's not so easy to pick up everything and move on a whim. And if on Tuesday UConn says to move, there's no guarantee they'd get the place completely cleared out in time for a 7:30 kickoff Thursday night. That being said, I would like to know what (if anything) is being done, which is why someone should file a FOIA request. And unless there's a reason I'm not aware of, they shouldn't have used it in the first place. But assuming they are making a reasonable effort to satisfy all parties, what's done is done, and I understand where they're coming from.
Sure is amazing what a passionate fan base we've developed. But seriously, think of those who've been really hurt by the storm. Many people lost cars, houses, food, etc, etc, etc. More then a ticket's worth. Let's hope they play on Saturday or Sunday. We do need the game to get an "easy" start on progressing the new team.
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Just a note to those wondering why rentschler was decided as the spot to set up the NG. First, it's one of the more open spots of land that is centrally located in the state, infrequently used, easily accessible 84, 91, 384, route 2, etc., and most importantly here, not close to the shoreline, thus reducing the chances that it will be flooded. While it is somewhat near the river, it's set back roughly two miles from it, so flooding would be more unlikely than a spot on the shoreline. The point of a NG post to distribute supplies to people isn't to locate that spot DIRECTLY where the affected people are, that means the spot itself is affected and could possibly not be usable. Based on the projection of this storm, it would've been a bad idea to use the Yale Bowl, because it was unclear how bad the storm surge would be, 95 could've been flooded, access up and down the coast could've very well been spotty at best, which it was. The lesson everyone in the country learned from Katrina was to plan, plan, plan, and plan some more. And in the case of Irene, by and large, that's what they did, and total disaster was avoided. Part of that plan was designating a place before the storm for the NG to set up a post and distribute supplies to people, a place that will likely not be hit as hard, won't be flooded, has lots of space, isn't frequently used, and has easy access to major roadways to get all over the state. The most logical place that fits all or most of those requirements is rentschler, and not some random non-descript warehouse somewhere. You can't just Monday morning quarterback this whole situation and say "oh, rentschler is nowhere near the devastated towns!" So you're suggesting they plan and decide where to move everyone after the storm has already hit? Great idea, that worked in New Orleans. You plan beforehand and make the most logical decision based on the forecast.
As for the need for all of this, there are still entire towns without power, and areas of the state that are still incredibly flooded, and people can't get out of their homes. Go look at the picture on the Courant's homepage, that's from today. This means the food in their refrigerator is likely no longer safe to eat, who knows if they have running water, phones, cell phone service, or if the grocery store in town is either open or even accessible. This is not a "hand out some bottles of water" operation. At the same time, it's not a major disaster such as Katrina, but it's not just some families who can't watch TV or get on the internet. This mentality that some people have on here that UConn football trumps every last thing in the world is sometimes so offsetting. The drive to make UConn into this southern football school that dominates the lives of everyone in the state, where it comes first before serving the general welfare of people who don't have power, phones, running water, or the ability to get to a grocery store - it's very unsettling. This ideal is not going to happen in Connecticut. UConn and Connecticut is not that kind of place. If you want that, go move to Louisiana. Surely they were all up in arms when their home opener was moved a few days in 2005. Probably was the end of the world since Baton Rouge is nowhere near the coast.
As for the need for all of this, there are still entire towns without power, and areas of the state that are still incredibly flooded, and people can't get out of their homes. Go look at the picture on the Courant's homepage, that's from today. This means the food in their refrigerator is likely no longer safe to eat, who knows if they have running water, phones, cell phone service, or if the grocery store in town is either open or even accessible. This is not a "hand out some bottles of water" operation. At the same time, it's not a major disaster such as Katrina, but it's not just some families who can't watch TV or get on the internet. This mentality that some people have on here that UConn football trumps every last thing in the world is sometimes so offsetting. The drive to make UConn into this southern football school that dominates the lives of everyone in the state, where it comes first before serving the general welfare of people who don't have power, phones, running water, or the ability to get to a grocery store - it's very unsettling. This ideal is not going to happen in Connecticut. UConn and Connecticut is not that kind of place. If you want that, go move to Louisiana. Surely they were all up in arms when their home opener was moved a few days in 2005. Probably was the end of the world since Baton Rouge is nowhere near the coast.
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As long as the game happens, I'm okay with this. If it is completely canceled then this is an epic fail.
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Agreed. IF/WHEN an announcement comes that the game is going to be played in a reasonable timeframe at the Stadium, then it's all over.
I didn't have any problem when I got the news that the game was cancelled becuase of national guard hurricane relief operations. I thought to myself that it makes sense.
My problems started after that. When I found out that the game was cancelled with apparently no plans or discussion in place about rescheduling. In my book, simply from a political standpoint, you don't just shut down an event with the revenue stream involved around it, the size of a UConn football game on such short notice without some kind of contingency in place already to reschedule. There are too many people's pay checks, organizations entire budgets (i guarantee taht Fordham's athletic budget is very much interested in this game) involved. To the best of what I can determine, the decision to shut down the game was made, with pretty much no thought of getting it played at another time. The game wasn't scheduled to be broadcast on national TV - luckily. Maybe that was a big part of the decision, but I'd bet that a local CT business, the size of ESPN, that would have a big interest in that game being on live TV as expected had it been another scenario - maybe this decision doesn't happen this way.
Next, I find out that the operation involved consists of 100 soldiers occupying the stadium grounds and trucks moving in and out. This is where the question marks really start, and they've been reviewed in depth in the past 24 hours.
Nobody's really asked an important question, so I will.
Where are the rest of 4,900 or so Army guard and Airwing soldiers and what are they doing?
They're clearly not at Rentschler at a centrally located, very suitable staging area for emergency infrastructure support operations state wide.
I didn't have any problem when I got the news that the game was cancelled becuase of national guard hurricane relief operations. I thought to myself that it makes sense.
My problems started after that. When I found out that the game was cancelled with apparently no plans or discussion in place about rescheduling. In my book, simply from a political standpoint, you don't just shut down an event with the revenue stream involved around it, the size of a UConn football game on such short notice without some kind of contingency in place already to reschedule. There are too many people's pay checks, organizations entire budgets (i guarantee taht Fordham's athletic budget is very much interested in this game) involved. To the best of what I can determine, the decision to shut down the game was made, with pretty much no thought of getting it played at another time. The game wasn't scheduled to be broadcast on national TV - luckily. Maybe that was a big part of the decision, but I'd bet that a local CT business, the size of ESPN, that would have a big interest in that game being on live TV as expected had it been another scenario - maybe this decision doesn't happen this way.
Next, I find out that the operation involved consists of 100 soldiers occupying the stadium grounds and trucks moving in and out. This is where the question marks really start, and they've been reviewed in depth in the past 24 hours.
Nobody's really asked an important question, so I will.
Where are the rest of 4,900 or so Army guard and Airwing soldiers and what are they doing?
They're clearly not at Rentschler at a centrally located, very suitable staging area for emergency infrastructure support operations state wide.
UConn4ever
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There probably on leave
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