Five questions that will define UConn-Baylor next season | Page 2 | The Boneyard

Five questions that will define UConn-Baylor next season

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harlemmo said:
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It'll all boil down to who executes and who wants it more.
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Nice that you shared your thoughts, and who's to say what the future brings? I certainly think it's fine for a fan to dream best-case outcomes, or simply have fantasies. So, I'm not going to assert you made a fool of yourself, except for: "Who wants it more."

This cliche really turns my stomach. Can you possibly think that at this level there is any variance in "wanting it"? It's true enough that the "best" team doesn't always win -- as both Baylor and UConn fans can attest.
So, why does that happen? There may be differences in confidence levels, or grittiness and perseverence, or preparedness -- and of course, in karma, luck, or the way the officials call the game -- but no team is going to have an edge on another team because they "want it more." That is a horrible insult to the losers, it seems to me. At least at this level, where everyone takes winning seriously.

Does anyone here in fact believe that phrase is anything other than a tired and ridiculous cliche? I'd enjoy hearing your case.
 
PacoSwede said:
Nice that you shared your thoughts, and who's to say what the future brings? I certainly think it's fine for a fan to dream best-case outcomes, or simply have fantasies. So, I'm not going to assert you made a fool of yourself, except for: "Who wants it more."

This cliche really turns my stomach. Can you possibly think that at this level there is any variance in "wanting it"? It's true enough that the "best" team doesn't always win -- as both Baylor and UConn fans can attest.
So, why does that happen? There may be differences in confidence levels, or grittiness and perseverence, or preparedness -- and of course, in karma, luck, or the way the officials call the game -- but no team is going to have an edge on another team because they "want it more." That is a horrible insult to the losers, it seems to me. At least at this level, where everyone takes winning seriously.

Does anyone here in fact believe that phrase is anything other than a tired and ridiculous cliche? I'd enjoy hearing your case.
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I hate that term. Well stated.
 
PacoSwede said:
"Who wants it more."

This cliche really turns my stomach. Can you possibly think that at this level there is any variance in "wanting it"?

Does anyone here in fact believe that phrase is anything other than a tired and ridiculous cliche? I'd enjoy hearing your case.
Expand ...

Exhibit A:

Maya-Moore-11.jpg
 
doggydaddy said:
Nope, not top 10. 19th I think? You're not comparing Prince to Bird now, are you?
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Of course not. Im not that foolish. Just pointing out that being higher ranked doesn't always mean that a player is better than a lower ranked player. Just using Bird as an example.
 
Yes, some players want it more. There are absolutely different levels of desire and effort just like there are different levels of talent.

DT wants it more than any player I've ever seen.
 
It'll all boil down to who executes and who wants it more. :)[/quote]

Granted that "who wants it more" is an over used cliche, that doesn't mean that even at an elite level of play that this isn't sometimes an important factor in athletics.

I'm sure that we can all remember sporting events at the collegiate and professional level where after a highly favored team has lost, one of the losing coaches or players talks about the team not really wanting it, not really have the fire in the gut that particular day.

Even at our beloved Connecticut where grit and endurance are famously built into every practice, there are games when the team doesn't play with the same determination as it usually does. And we hear that afterward from the team itself.

There's probably a more accurate way to phrase the phenomenon of why some teams don't "rise to the occasion" (to throw out another cliche) than "who wants it more" since obviously, if you asked every player if they wanted to win, they'd say yes. But that doesn't mean that something intrinsic isn't taking place.
 
.-.
Coach Katy Meier (USA U18 coach) just threw a monkey wrench into much of this speculation. After raving about how spectacularly Breanna and Morgan played against Canada, she pointed out that in the second half she had Stewart "playing the 2" and Tuck "playing the 3." [direct quotes]

Maybe she is in cahoots with Geno by helping him to make sure that Kelly and Kaleena and Bria are not getting complacent.

The Bible says "The battle is not always to the strong, nor the race to the swift" (something like that), but Damon Runyon shrewdly added, "...but that's where the smart money goes."

I still like our chances.
 
There is no player in WCBB and maybe the WNBA that can play like Breanna Stewart. The qualities she has and that will be developed under her UConns coaches tootleage with be something WCBB has never seen. To say shes a complete player and can do it all is an understatement. She can do alot more then any other player. Obviously our guests havent heard or seen Breanna in action over the years.

I have told this story many times and I will tell it again. I recieved a phone call from one of my reps who's daughters played AAU BB. They grew up with NYC greats Tina Charles, Dannielle Wilson and Kia Vaughn. When my buddy saw Breanna for the first time in an AAU game in NY he called his buddy Mike Flynn and Mike was in NY within 2 hours and signed her to the Belles. He told me he had just seen the best post player he has ever seen. Better then the 3 NYC greats. I said your kidding he said no. She can do everything . Then he told me she was still in junior high school. He said she can do everything better then anyone he had seen. He emphasised her ball handleing ad passing skills and not like a guard but a point guard. He said she can run the floor like a gazelle and with poise.

From what we've seen over the past 4+ years Breanna has seperated herself from everybody else. Under UConns coaching staff she will be further developed and playing on UConns team she will be able to shine. The players surrounding her will complement her and Breannas skills will be compared to the very best at every position. Her reactions and anticapation of plays can be compared to the very best who have played the game. Shes not just some big tall girl in the middle who has a pretty good outside shot and can use both hands. She does everything and a little bit more. No there is no one in WCBB that you can compare to Breanna Stewart. NO ONE.
 
Remember she doesn't turn 18 until next week, so " The Best is Yet To Come".
 
I have no doubt that Stewart will be an incredible college player, but given the fact that she has never played against any competition in the US that was not a high school player, we may need to hold off on comparing her to the likes of WNBA players such as Lauren Jackson and DT until we see her perform against WCBB players. I have seen her play, although not in person, and I agree 100% that she is the best high school player in the nation and may very well be top 5 in the nation in WCBB.

I am particularly pleased to see that Alexis Prince is the only US player to be in the top 10 in the following categories. She is demonstrating a tremendous all-around game.
  • Points per game
  • Rebounds per game (leads the US in offensive rebounding)
  • FG percentage
  • Assists
  • Steals (leads the US)
  • 3 point FG percentage
  • 3 point FG made
 
easttexastrash said:
I have no doubt that Stewart will be an incredible player, but given the fact that she has never played against any competition in the US that was not a high school player, we may need to hold off on comparing her to the likes of WNBA players such as Lauren Jackson and DT until we see her perform against WCBB players. I have seen her play, although not in person, and I agree completely 100% that she is the best high school player in the nation and may very be top 5 in the nation in WCBB.

I am particularly pleased to see that Alexis Prince is the only US player to be in the top 10 in the following categories. She is demonstrating a tremendous all-around game.
  • Points per game
  • Rebounds per game (leads the US in offensive rebounding)
  • FG percentage
  • Assists
  • Steals (leads the US)
  • 3 point FG percentage
  • 3 point FG made
Expand ...
If by WE you ean TonyC, you are correct.
 
.-.
Tonyc said:
There is no player in WCBB and maybe the WNBA that can play like Breanna Stewart. The qualities she has and that will be developed under her UConns coaches tootleage with be something WCBB has never seen. To say shes a complete player and can do it all is an understatement. She can do alot more then any other player. Obviously our guests havent heard or seen Breanna in action over the years.

I have told this story many times and I will tell it again. I recieved a phone call from one of my reps who's daughters played AAU BB. They grew up with NYC greats Tina Charles, Dannielle Wilson and Kia Vaughn. When my buddy saw Breanna for the first time in an AAU game in NY he called his buddy Mike Flynn and Mike was in NY within 2 hours and signed her to the Belles. He told me he had just seen the best post player he has ever seen. Better then the 3 NYC greats. I said your kidding he said no. She can do everything . Then he told me she was still in junior high school. He said she can do everything better then anyone he had seen. He emphasised her ball handleing ad passing skills and not like a guard but a point guard. He said she can run the floor like a gazelle and with poise.

From what we've seen over the past 4+ years Breanna has seperated herself from everybody else. Under UConns coaching staff she will be further developed and playing on UConns team she will be able to shine. The players surrounding her will complement her and Breannas skills will be compared to the very best at every position. Her reactions and anticapation of plays can be compared to the very best who have played the game. Shes not just some big tall girl in the middle who has a pretty good outside shot and can use both hands. She does everything and a little bit more. No there is no one in WCBB that you can compare to Breanna Stewart. NO ONE.
Expand ...

Wow! Breanna has yet to play her first game at the college level, and you feel comfortable declaring that she is the Best Ever?

First, she couldn't possible be better than all other players at every position, right?

Second, do you really want to declare that she is better than Sue/Diana/Maya and that lady down-under, so quickly?

Third, do you really believe that she is a better shooter/scorer than Diana?

Lastly, it is an open question as to whether or not she is better at the 4 spot than Morgan.

I just assume that you never meant to compare her to any of the elite PGs!

Oh, I almost forgot the returning AA guard Bria, the shooting guard AA-in waiting KML and the post AA-in waiting Stef. Even before Breanna's name is called for her very first game at the college level you are declaring that she is better than all three of these proven contributors?

Since a place on the Wall has to be earned on the floor, we will have to wait and see how her career at UConn unfolds, right?

Peace,

John Fryer
 
easttexastrash said:
I have no doubt that Stewart will be an incredible college player, but given the fact that she has never played against any competition in the US that was not a high school player, we may need to hold off on comparing her to the likes of WNBA players such as Lauren Jackson and DT until we see her perform against WCBB players. I have seen her play, although not in person, and I agree 100% that she is the best high school player in the nation and may very well be top 5 in the nation in WCBB.

I am particularly pleased to see that Alexis Prince is the only US player to be in the top 10 in the following categories. She is demonstrating a tremendous all-around game.
  • Points per game
  • Rebounds per game (leads the US in offensive rebounding)
  • FG percentage
  • Assists
  • Steals (leads the US)
  • 3 point FG percentage
  • 3 point FG made
Expand ...
I am pleased that the Baylor fans think so highly of her game. One thing to keep in mind - per HG, there are at least 10 players ahead of her NOT on team USA. Per BS and ASGR, there are at least 4 players ahead of her not on the team. From what I've seen, she should be very good. But she's not one of the truly elite players in the class. Doesn't mean she won't be terrific for Baylor. And once Griner and Simms leave, she may well be the best player on Baylor's team. It remains to be seen how the recruiting for 2013 and beyond goes...
 
John Fryer said:
Wow! Breanna has yet to play her first game at the college level, and you feel comfortable declaring that she is the Best Ever?

First, she couldn't possible be better than all other players at every position, right?

Second, do you really want to declare that she is better than Sue/Diana/Maya and that lady down-under, so quickly?

Third, do you really believe that she is a better shooter/scorer than Diana?

Lastly, it is an open question as to whether or not she is better at the 4 spot than Morgan.

I just assume that you never meant to compare her to any of the elite PGs!

Oh, I almost forgot the returning AA guard Bria, the shooting guard AA-in waiting KML and the post AA-in waiting Stef. Even before Breanna's name is called for her very first game at the college level you are declaring that she is better than all three of these proven contributors?

Since a place on the Wall has to be earned on the floor, we will have to wait and see how her career at UConn unfolds, right?

Peace,

John Fryer
Expand ...
You are really taking the time to respond to one of Tony's over the top, overly optimistic posts?
 
ericsandiego said:
I am pleased that the Baylor fans think so highly of her game. One thing to keep in mind - per HG, there are at least 10 players ahead of her NOT on team USA. Per BS and ASGR, there are at least 4 players ahead of her not on the team. From what I've seen, she should be very good. But she's not one of the truly elite players in the class. Doesn't mean she won't be terrific for Baylor. And once Griner and Simms leave, she may well be the best player on Baylor's team. It remains to be seen how the recruiting for 2013 and beyond goes...
Expand ...

There are also quite a few who ARE on the team and ranked ahead of her who are not top 10 in all of those categories, most notable Tuck, Stewart and Jefferson.

I say it's more prudent to compare her performance with those who are on the team instead of those who aren't.
 
We will all agree that TonyC is an optimist.

That occasionally causes problems for us skeptics. Like worrying how Massengale and DeShields will play as teammates at UConn.
 
.-.
Tonyc said:
There is no player in WCBB and maybe the WNBA that can play like Breanna Stewart. The qualities she has and that will be developed under her UConns coaches tootleage with be something WCBB has never seen. To say shes a complete player and can do it all is an understatement. She can do alot more then any other player. Obviously our guests havent heard or seen Breanna in action over the years.

I have told this story many times and I will tell it again. I recieved a phone call from one of my reps who's daughters played AAU BB. They grew up with NYC greats Tina Charles, Dannielle Wilson and Kia Vaughn. When my buddy saw Breanna for the first time in an AAU game in NY he called his buddy Mike Flynn and Mike was in NY within 2 hours and signed her to the Belles. He told me he had just seen the best post player he has ever seen. Better then the 3 NYC greats. I said your kidding he said no. She can do everything . Then he told me she was still in junior high school. He said she can do everything better then anyone he had seen. He emphasised her ball handleing ad passing skills and not like a guard but a point guard. He said she can run the floor like a gazelle and with poise.

From what we've seen over the past 4+ years Breanna has seperated herself from everybody else. Under UConns coaching staff she will be further developed and playing on UConns team she will be able to shine. The players surrounding her will complement her and Breannas skills will be compared to the very best at every position. Her reactions and anticapation of plays can be compared to the very best who have played the game. Shes not just some big tall girl in the middle who has a pretty good outside shot and can use both hands. She does everything and a little bit more. No there is no one in WCBB that you can compare to Breanna Stewart. NO ONE.
Expand ...


Tonyc simply wants it more.
 
easttexastrash said:
There are also quite a few who ARE on the team and ranked ahead of her who are not top 10 in all of those categories, most notable Tuck, Stewart and Jefferson.

I say it's more prudent to compare her performance with those who are on the team instead of those who aren't.
Expand ...

I ignored your first post on Prince's standing in the overall stats. I figured, let ETT have his fun and be proud of his incoming player. But, to the fact that Prince is in the top 10 in these selected categories as some holy grail of being better than Tuck, Stewart and Jefferson is just a little beyond ridiculous.

Just on the USA team:
  • Points per game - Prince (4), Stewart (2), Tuck (1), Jefferson (7)
  • Rebounds per game - Prince (3), Stewart (1), Tuck (6), Jefferson (5)
  • FG percentage - Prince (6), Stewart (1), Tuck (3), Jefferson (7)
  • Assists - Prince (3), Stewart (6), Tuck (7), Jefferson (2)
  • Steals - Prince (1), Stewart (5), Tuck (6), Jefferson (3)
  • 3 point FG percentage - Prince (3), Stewart (1), Tuck (5), Jefferson (5)
  • 3 point FG made - Prince (3), Stewart (2), Tuck (5), Jefferson (5)
  • Blocked shots - Prince (4), Stewart (1), Tuck (6), Jefferson (4)
  • FT taken - Prince (8), Stewart (1), Tuck (2), Jefferson (4)
  • FT made - Prince (8), Stewart (1), Tuck (2), Jefferson (3)
I added a few categories. Prince got to the line ONE time in 4 games. She also had 6 steals in one game. Great job, but it impacts the average for sure.

Prince was a very complete player, but does that make her better than the 3 you mentioned? Nahhhh....one of them was ranked higher on the team in every category except steals.

Just love numbers...lol.
 
I don't think said she is better than those three, but I did point out that her overall stats demonstrate the she is a complete player.
 
easttexastrash said:
I don't think said she is better than those three, but I did point out that her overall stats demonstrate the she is a complete player.
Expand ...

Hey,I just took your advice and was prudent by comparing to those on the team.
 
doggydaddy said:
I ignored your first post on Prince's standing in the overall stats. I figured, let ETT have his fun and be proud of his incoming player. But, to the fact that Prince is in the top 10 in these selected categories as some holy grail of being better than Tuck, Stewart and Jefferson is just a little beyond ridiculous.

Just on the USA team:
  • Points per game - Prince (4), Stewart (2), Tuck (1), Jefferson (7)
  • Rebounds per game - Prince (3), Stewart (1), Tuck (6), Jefferson (5)
  • FG percentage - Prince (6), Stewart (1), Tuck (3), Jefferson (7)
  • Assists - Prince (3), Stewart (6), Tuck (7), Jefferson (2)
  • Steals - Prince (1), Stewart (5), Tuck (6), Jefferson (3)
  • 3 point FG percentage - Prince (3), Stewart (1), Tuck (5), Jefferson (5)
  • 3 point FG made - Prince (3), Stewart (2), Tuck (5), Jefferson (5)
  • Blocked shots - Prince (4), Stewart (1), Tuck (6), Jefferson (4)
  • FT taken - Prince (8), Stewart (1), Tuck (2), Jefferson (4)
  • FT made - Prince (8), Stewart (1), Tuck (2), Jefferson (3)
I added a few categories. Prince got to the line ONE time in 4 games. She also had 6 steals in one game. Great job, but it impacts the average for sure.

Prince was a very complete player, but does that make her better than the 3 you mentioned? Nahhhh....one of them was ranked higher on the team in every category except steals.

Just love numbers...lol.
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DD, I challenge you go show me where I said that Prince is better than Stewart, Prince and Jefferson. I simply pointed out that her stats showed a great all-around game and that it wasn't quite realistic to discount her stats based on player who are present instead of those who are.
 
.-.
Stewart is clearly the best player coming out of highs school. I clearly stated that opinion. There is absolutely no comparison.
 
vowelguy said:
I still can't believe folks will argue this much over players who have yet to play a single college game.
Expand ...
vowelguy said:
I still can't believe folks will argue this much over players who have yet to play a single college game.
Expand ...

The thing is, I never argued in this thread that Prince is better than anyone else. I simply stated that her stats demonstrate that of a well-rounded basketball player. But some take saying something good about a non-UCONN player as a slam against the UCONN players.
 
easttexastrash said:
The thing is, I never argued in this thread that Prince is better than anyone else. I simply stated that her stats demonstrate that of a well-rounded basketball player. But some take saying something good about a non-UCONN player as a slam against the UCONN players.
Expand ...
Who said you we're slamming UConn players?
 
.-.
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