Ernest Jones resigns

[huskymedic]

Wow. Just opened the thread on my phone and saw 26 pages. Lol.

Can someone give me the TL/DR cutdown?

was deemed ineligible...

 

[J187Money]

was deemed ineligible...

He should have checked in with the ref.

 

[Marty Jackson]

to sum up spackler and serrano, everything would be better if everyone were christian. All these nuisances would just go away..

 

[Jimmy Serrano]

to sum up spackler and serrano, everything would be better if everyone were christian. All these nuisances would just go away..

You can keep up the demogouging all you want. I've stated repeatedly that I believe in no God. I pretty much think organized religion in all forms is pretty much a joke.

 

[TRest]

Wow. Just opened the thread on my phone and saw 26 pages. Lol.

Can someone give me the TL/DR cutdown?

No one actually knows why the coach quit.

 

[RedSoloCup]

Wow. Just opened the thread on my phone and saw 26 pages. Lol.

Can someone give me the TL/DR cutdown?

We are in the final stages of proving beyond all doubt that religion is best not discussed as the discussion of it causes division.

 

[temery]

There is always the possibility Jones resigned because he truly believes in the quote that started this controversy.

He appears to be a good man. Better than most. Good luck to him.

 

[Waquoit]

He appears to be a good man. Better than most. Good luck to him.

Better than most? Because he's good with a line?

 

[whaler11]

There is always the possibility Jones resigned because he truly believes in the quote that started this controversy.

He appears to be a good man. Better than most. Good luck to him.

Possibility? That's exactly all that is going on here.

A very religious man didn't want to work at an especially secular institution.

The idea that has sort of bubbled up about Christians being discriminated against... yikes.

From the you can't win files - UConn moves the Maryland game and one guy is still annoyed because they didn't move it far enough.

For all two million posts on conference realignment around here, one might note they moved the game not just to accommodate UConn fans but for Maryland fans as well.

 

[Carl Spackler]

Statement From UConn President Susan Herbst: “At public universities we value everyone in our community, and treat each person with the same degree of respect, regardless of who they are, what their background is, or what their beliefs may be. Every student, including student-athletes, must know they are accepted and welcomed at UConn. Always. Our staff should educate and guide students, to ensure they are well-prepared for life at UConn and beyond. But it should go without saying that our employees cannot appear to endorse or advocate for a particular religion or spiritual philosophy as part of their work at the university, or in their interactions with our students. This applies to work-related activity anywhere on or off campus, including on the football field. Our Athletic Director and Coach Diaco agree wholeheartedly with me, and have made this clear to their staff.”

http://courantblogs.com/uconn-football/uconn-president-susan-herbst-on-respecting-all-religions/

Moving a scheduled football game, to accomodate a particular religions, which gives the "appearance of endorsing" a particular religion is in direct violation of this statement. Not only that, doing that, resulted in the game being put on a less accessible broadcasting platform, and thus did not reach as many people as could have been reached through broadcasting (which I've since become 100% sure about).

That's all I'm saying. I don't really care about what religions are what. If you're going to proclaim it publicly, be consistent.

 

[Excalibur]

That's all I'm saying. I don't really care about what religions are what. If you're going to proclaim it publicly, be consistent.

And what you're saying is wrong. Accommodation is not endorsement.

 

[Carl Spackler]

And what you're saying is wrong. Accommodation is not endorsement.

I completely disagree. There are some similarities and differences between the two situations I discuss. The similarity is that neither circumstance was a violation of the establishment clause. The difference, is in the way the university handled the situations publicly, and the public reactions. I'm talking about Coach Jones' statement in the press, and the request by the university officials to schedule a football game after sunset on Yom Kippur.

One instance has nothing to do with the establishment clause, in that the person had not actually done anything except make a verbal statement. He did not actually interact with players, and he did not actually act in any way advocating a particular religion other than to make a statement, which could have been easily redacted publicly on his own and corrected/monitored behind closed doors.

In formally requesting that the American Conference schedule a UCONN home football game to accomodate a particular religion, the university officials most definitely did act in a way that "appears to endorse" a particular religion - as stated by president Herbst in her public statements about Coach Jones. The esteemed businesslawyer has stated that there is no precedent that such scheduling action is in direct violation of the establishment clause, so in this instance as well, the university did nothing wrong, and there was no violation, just as Coach Jones was not in violation. Coach Jones had the potential to be in violation, and there was no reason to think that it would not be handled by university officials within normal functioning and monitoring.

The difference between the two situations was simple - complaints, and the university public response.

Culturally, there was no reason for a guy like me to complain that the game was moved, at the time, becuase contrary to what the clearly ignorant responses on this thread to me have been, I'm actually quite respectful of other people's religious beliefs. It's good when people can realize humor in life, and my comments about certain religions (both Christianity and Judaism) have been light. The only reason I bring it up now, is to point out inconsistency and perhaps hypocrisy - which is a strong word - but definitely inconsistency.

But culturally, in CT, there were complaints to what Coach Jones said, and how it was handled in the media, by the university was completely unnecessary, and borderline inappropriate IMO, because of the conflict that is evident in the statement, based on the situation around the Maryland v. UCONN home game scheduling.

I knew that this subject matter would bring out strong responses. No doubt about it - that's why I would have preferred talkign about sweater puppies.

The reality here, is that a good man, Coach Jones, who is just trying to make a living for himself and support his family as a football coach, felt the need to leave a secure job, at a very inopportune time of year for football coaches to change jobs, and left the university, for whatever reasons, and it's hard to imagine that the backlash, and public scrutiny he was put under by his superiors was a big part of it, when he could have simply handled the situation himself publicly.

Everyone makes mistakes, and I think Susan Herbst made a mistake here in handling this situation, and it's not a reach for me, to believe that a good guy has left the football program because of it, contrary to what her public statement says about tolerance.

You learn, live and move on. I swear on what I believe, and I do believe in a power in the universe that is totally beyond our comprehension, that we interact with, and effects us every day in our daily life, that I will not comment on this again.

 

[Marty Jackson]

Statement From UConn President Susan Herbst: “At public universities we value everyone in our community, and treat each person with the same degree of respect, regardless of who they are, what their background is, or what their beliefs may be. Every student, including student-athletes, must know they are accepted and welcomed at UConn. Always. Our staff should educate and guide students, to ensure they are well-prepared for life at UConn and beyond. But it should go without saying that our employees cannot appear to endorse or advocate for a particular religion or spiritual philosophy as part of their work at the university, or in their interactions with our students. This applies to work-related activity anywhere on or off campus, including on the football field. Our Athletic Director and Coach Diaco agree wholeheartedly with me, and have made this clear to their staff.”

http://courantblogs.com/uconn-football/uconn-president-susan-herbst-on-respecting-all-religions/

Moving a scheduled football game, to accomodate a particular religions, which gives the "appearance of endorsing" a particular religion is in direct violation of this statement. Not only that, doing that, resulted in the game being put on a less accessible broadcasting platform, and thus did not reach as many people as could have been reached through broadcasting (which I've since become 100% sure about).

That's all I'm saying. I don't really care about what religions are what. If you're going to proclaim it publicly, be consistent.

the fact that you can't distinguish a coach stating that regardless of religious background, his players will learn that Jesus is in the huddle (essentially intolerance of all other religions), and Uconn pushing back a game to accomodate a group of people on one of their high holidays (essentially a sign of respect) is telling. very telling.

Not even sure why you think these two instances have anything in common. How many times has Ollie invoked the name of his savior in his comments. Has that been an issue? No. Why? Because he's not suggesting that all his players follow Jesus.

But keep digging Carl. And keep throwing in the proverbial, "I don't care about religion" and "the schedule change didn't bother me" comments.

Maybe while you're digging, you can find a clue...

 

[Marty Jackson]

For everyone complaining about how Uconn handled this, go back and listen to KO's introduction. Not 30 seconds in he is thanking his savior.
Never heard anything from the state.

This is an issue only because some thick headed people on this board want to make it an issue.

 

[Jimmy Serrano]

For everyone complaining about how Uconn handled this, go back and listen to KO's introduction. Not 30 seconds in he is thanking his savior.
Never heard anything from the state.

This is an issue only because some thick headed people on this board want to make it an issue.

You keep arguing with him about things he never said. It's the Nelson Strawman move.

 

[FAIRTIDES]

Oy vey....(see what I did there?...) Oh good Lord, the evolution thing. Of all the kookiness that can exist in our society in 2014, that's one of the kookiest.

Thanks for you response. I do appreciate it.
I'm not a lawyer, and don't care to be trained to think like one. I'll continue to think about things they way I please and opine on them as well - thank you very much. ;-)

I do appreciate you putting this thing to task like you did.

This Jones matter, I agree completely, is not an Establishment Clause issue. I understand now, that it is not.

I stand by my opinion that the university handled the situation poorly in public.

When I first read the coach's quote my initial thought was, He didn't really say that. Oh sh't, the communications technology at UCONN is about to be stressed. Not because I advocate either way, but because experience has shown how damaging "hot-button" (pain-in-the-ass) issues have become.

Carl, she had absolutely no choice. As soon as the the "letter" was published, she was in danger of losing control to the whack jobs who lurk at the fringes and take delight in blowing this type of thing out of proportion. From a PR standpoint, UCONN was not in need of another "advocate(s)" war by Press Conference. She handled it perfectly. Without being defensive, she reiterated UCONN's stated policy of being welcoming to all who wish to practice any religion while confirming that no religious beliefs will be forced on anyone. Period! Nuff said.

It seems to have worked out. I've seen nothing on the news or Page 1 of Yahoo. The story's only legs seem to be this "thread." Sometimes, the PR people know what they are talking about.

 

[Jimmy Serrano]

When I first read the coach's quote my initial thought was, He didn't really say that. Oh sh't, the communications technology at UCONN is about to be stressed. Not because I advocate either way, but because experience has shown how damaging "hot-button" (pain-in-the-ass) issues have become.

Carl, she had absolutely no choice. As soon as the the "letter" was published, she was in danger of losing control to the whack jobs who lurk at the fringes and take delight in blowing this type of thing out of proportion. From a PR standpoint, UCONN was not in need of another "advocate(s)" war by Press Conference. She handled it perfectly. Without being defensive, she reiterated UCONN's stated policy of being welcoming to all who wish to practice any religion while confirming that no religious beliefs will be forced on anyone. Period! Nuff said.

It seems to have worked out. I've seen nothing on the news or Page 1 of Yahoo. The story's only legs seem to be this "thread." Sometimes, the PR people know what they are talking about.

I'm going to do something I don't advise anyone at home to ever try. I'm gonna try to speak for Spackler. Because I don't think people are understanding what we're saying. I keep seeing strawman after strawman.

I don't think Carl believes in organized religion. I sure as heck don't, so I have no dog in this fight. But I think the Jesus in the huddle is a hot button topic because people choose to make it a hot button topic. The reason why the MD game move was not a hot button topic is because for the most part nobody made it one. Nobody is going to take on the state university for making accomodations for a minority religion. You will never convince me, that had UConn requested a special start time to accomodate the Christian faith, that there would not be a similar type outrage and letters to the editor at the Courant.

What I think that Carl is saying (and I would agree with him), is the state university should not be in the business of advocating, accomodating, endorsing, or anything else any religion period. Be consistent. That's all.

 

[Marty Jackson]

I'm going to do something I don't advise anyone at home to ever try. I'm gonna try to speak for Spackler. Because I don't think people are understanding what we're saying. I keep seeing strawman after strawman.

I don't think Carl believes in organized religion. I sure as heck don't, so I have no dog in this fight. But I think the Jesus in the huddle is a hot button topic because people choose to make it a hot button topic. The reason why the MD game move was not a hot button topic is because for the most part nobody made it one. Nobody is going to take on the state university for making accomodations for a minority religion. You will never convince me, that had UConn requested a special start time to accomodate the Christian faith, that there would not be a similar type outrage and letters to the editor at the Courant.

What I think that Carl is saying (and I would agree with him), is the state university should not be in the business of advocating, accomodating, endorsing, or anything else any religion period. Be consistent. That's all.

you're in a lifeboat with Carl Spackler... And we're all the crazy ones...

The reason nobody made a big deal about the MD game being moved is possibly..... BECAUSE IT WASN'T A BIG DEAL!!!!!!! It was as you say above, an accomodation... Uconn makes those accomodations all the time. Some are made in advance such that they don't need to be re-scheduled. What you are trying to do is contrast that accomodation by the school with their strong stance against what the coach said... And what he said was that all his players, regardless of their belief system would know Jesus is in the huddle. Suggesting some level of inconsistency by Uconn because of the different positions is just wrong. It is wrong because those instances are not at all the same.

Making up a hypothetical about Uconn accomodating the Christian faith and causing an uproar is just dumb. It won't happen because the schedulers are well aware of when the christian holidays are. So the bowl games originally scheduled for Dec. 25th were rescheduled for Dec. 24 and 26th. And wow, no uproar.

Who would have thought ESPN was not only screwing Uconn, but also pushing a christian agenda by not scheduling bowls on Christmas day.

 

[Jimmy Serrano]

you're in a lifeboat with Carl Spackler... And we're all the crazy ones...

The reason nobody made a big deal about the MD game being moved is possibly..... BECAUSE IT WASN'T A BIG DEAL!!!!!!! It was as you say above, an accomodation... Uconn makes those accomodations all the time. Some are made in advance such that they don't need to be re-scheduled. What you are trying to do is contrast that accomodation by the school with their strong stance against what the coach said... And what he said was that all his players, regardless of their belief system would know Jesus is in the huddle. Suggesting some level of inconsistency by Uconn because of the different positions is just wrong. It is wrong because those instances are not at all the same.

Making up a hypothetical about Uconn accomodating the Christian faith and causing an uproar is just dumb. It won't happen because the schedulers are well aware of when the christian holidays are. So the bowl games originally scheduled for Dec. 25th were rescheduled for Dec. 24 and 26th. And wow, no uproar.

Who would have thought ESPN was not only screwing Uconn, but also pushing a christian agenda by not scheduling bowls on Christmas day.

Why are you so angry about everything? We disagree. .

 

[tiger8mush]

Who would have thought ESPN was not only screwing Uconn, but also pushing a christian agenda by not scheduling bowls on Christmas day.

I believe ESPN runs NBA games on Dec 25 and chooses to make that their moneymaker. I think its about $$$ as to why there are no bowl games on Dec25.

 

[HuskyDogArt]

Woah...

Desmond Conner ‏@desmondconner 3m
Ernest Jones resigns As UConn Football Assistant http://courantblogs.com/uconn-football/ernest-jones-resigns-as-uconn-football-assistant/…

I think just because he is a religious man, him resigning is STUPID. As I said in a political site, if you can't say anything about our savior, who will stand up for your freedom of speech.

 

[HuskyDogArt]

I would respect him greatly if that is the case (and I thought his Jesus in the huddle comments were a huge mistake). Would show he feels so strongly about his statement that he will go to a school that would allow him to state that.

I think his Jesus in the huddle statement is non-PC in the PC state of Connecticut. If you can't talk about Jesus, who will decide if Geno or Kevin or Bob say something that is non-PC?

Should BD hire a nonreligious person or how about him hiring a Muslim anti-American? At least UConn won't have to hear 'Jesus in the huddle' statements.

Support Free Speech for all!!!

 

[HuskyDogArt]

Why don't you understand why he should keep religion out of the workplace?

Why should he keep quiet about Jesus. USF football coach talks about Jesus every interview! USF is a state institution. Of course it is in Florida.

 

[Marty Jackson]

Why are you so angry about everything? We disagree. .

not angry... sensitive to your suggesting that what uconn did in moving the MD game to accommodate the Jews celebrating Yom Kippur was similar to a coach suggesting that his players will know Jesus, regardless of religious beliefs.

you can tell me the earth is flat and that we disagree on that as well. You're still wrong.

 

[Marty Jackson]

I think just because he is a religious man, him resigning is STUPID. As I said in a political site, if you can't say anything about our savior, who will stand up for your freedom of speech.

who brought the cool kid?