Eric Cobb commits to UConn

[upstater]

What is your point regarding the big men recruiting? That KO can recruit well, but the staff has been terrible at developing them? Because we have done absolutely nothing to date with any of those players.

I will also add,( and this isn't just for you,) but overall, everyone on here is overstating Facey's development to an incredible degree. People on this board repeatedly point to his development as a beacon of KO's (and staff) player development abilities.

It's absolutely true that Kentan has improved a ton this year. (His post game and finishing have improved dramatically. His d still isnt great, but its much better than where it was).

But its also true that he was able to improve so much, because he did absolutely nothing in his first 3 years here.

If you look at where he is now based on expectations 4 years ago, I would say this is more or less the expectation.

9 ppg and 7.5rpg in the AAC for a former top 100 recruit and NY state POY seems reasonable but is certainly not exceptional. If you told us 4 years ago this is what we would sign up for we would all take it for sure, but I don't think we would be jumping up and down.

Hes been worth the scholarship for sure and has been a great kid. But I wonder why we couldn't get anything out of him for 3 years when clearly the potential was there.

You can easily make this argument about Deandre Daniels as well. He was here 3 years, and as late as January in his junior year, people said he was a bust. Then he broke out, and the rest is history. Maybe even in February people were down on him. But it is undeniable that he broke out when he played power forward.

 

[Matrim55]

If weve had such trouble developing the bigs weve had,

I reject the premise that our bigs haven't developed, so I'm probably not the greatest person to have this conversation with.

then why should we think we can develop the ones in the future?

IDK man maybe because people get better at their jobs when they have more experience, just like Ollie's gotten better at recruiting as he's gotten more experience? Or maybe because last summer we hired a coach – Killings – who has three years of experience working with NBA big men, including Emeka? Or maybe because the whole point is we have way more in terms of raw materials to work with on this roster than at any previous point under KO?

We lost to Mississippi State in the 1996 Sweet 16 despite having, at worst, the second-best team in the country that year. Why should we think Calhoun would ever get any better at winning tournament games in the future?

 

[upstater]

See this is where you're very wrong.

If anyone in a position of power trusted Boneyard posters more than Ollie a few years ago, UConn would be a 3-time champion, and Steve Pikiell would be the coach.

 

[Chief00]

I reject the premise that our bigs haven't developed, so I'm probably not the greatest person to have this conversation with.


IDK man maybe because people get better at their jobs when they have more experience, just like Ollie's gotten better at recruiting as he's gotten more experience? Or maybe because last summer we hired a coach – Killings – who has three years of experience working with NBA big men, including Emeka? Or maybe because the whole point is we have way more in terms of raw materials to work with on this roster than at any previous point under KO?

We lost to Mississippi State in the 1996 Sweet 16 despite having, at worst, the second-best team in the country that year. Why should we think Calhoun would ever get any better at winning tournament games in the future?

Wow my man - that's a tough argument to make that our Bigs under Ciach Miller have developed. Quite frankly, I just don't see it.

 

[Chief00]

I reject the premise that our bigs haven't developed, so I'm probably not the greatest person to have this conversation with.


IDK man maybe because people get better at their jobs when they have more experience, just like Ollie's gotten better at recruiting as he's gotten more experience? Or maybe because last summer we hired a coach – Killings – who has three years of experience working with NBA big men, including Emeka? Or maybe because the whole point is we have way more in terms of raw materials to work with on this roster than at any previous point under KO?

We lost to Mississippi State in the 1996 Sweet 16 despite having, at worst, the second-best team in the country that year. Why should we think Calhoun would ever get any better at winning tournament games in the future?

Ok - I just noticed your dig at Calhoun - Chief advice to you - don't be a Stairmaster clone dumping on a HOF coach.

 

[Jimdish255]

Go ahead and call me clueless but i honestly think that we could have used Lubin this year. That kid had very very few garbage minutes but here's what I saw: He had long arms, decent hands, took up space, wouldn't' get pushed around, and could make a layup. The addition of Miller deep sixed him but I believe he would have been useful. Now someone tell me what he did this year so we can all have a good laugh.

Rakim Lubin - 2016-17 - useful

 

[BigErnMcCracken]

Ok - I just noticed your dig at Calhoun - Chief advice to you - don't be a Stairmaster clone dumping on a HOF coach.

Anyone who refers to themselves in the third person is unquestionably a gaping a_shole.

 

[lange10]

So because he's big and strong we won't lose to the Wagner and Northeastern's of the college basketball world anymore? Anyone else perplexed by that sentiment?

 

[businesslawyer]

I must be missing something on this one. Without having seen him play, as I imagine none of you have before this thread, what is the tangible evidence to suggest he is any good at basketball? Seriously, I'm all ears.

I swear this board has a fetish for anybody who looks like they can host Monday night raw - even if he and Lubin are different, the same things were being said about Lubin ("nice to have somebody with muscle for a change!") as if it had never before occurred to the staff that muscle was important in basketball.

"Filling a need" is nonsense. We have gaping holes all throughout the front court and exactly zero proven players. You fill a need when you already have good players, not when you're in the process of throwing stuff at the wall to see what sticks. This is really about this boards collective frustration with Brimah. Anybody That's Not Him is going to draw rave reviews from this crowd, whether it's a dude that's a small scrapper or a big guy who looks like a bouncer.

"Knock Gary Clark on his ass" is a nice sentiment that makes fans feel better and does nothing else. We need guys who can play, and if we're looking for somebody to "fill a role" than look no further than Steve Enoch. What this move really does is occupy a ship that we can't use in the grad market to bring in somebody who is actually, you know, good. There are 1,000 of these kids out there, but hey, we had Shonn Miller one time and we didn't win a national championship with him, so who wants that? I'd much rather take a kid who might develop into a 5-10 minute guy by his senior year.

Do you honestly believe they gave out this offer forgetting it might stop them from taking a grad transfer? You don't think it's a little more likely that they evaluated what they could reasonably get in that market and made a decision that this was a good use of the schollie?

 

[businesslawyer]

Anyone who refers to themselves in the third person is unquestionably a gaping a_shole.

Agreed. But go to the cesspool and just add him to the list.

 

[uconnell]

Ok - I just noticed your dig at Calhoun - Chief advice to you - don't be a Stairmaster clone dumping on a HOF coach.

I didn't take it as a dump on JC, just the opposite. Fans didn't lose faith in JC after that loss, like the fans are doing to Ollie. Give Ollie time.

 

[Tenspro2002]

You can easily make this argument about Deandre Daniels as well. He was here 3 years, and as late as January in his junior year, people said he was a bust. Then he broke out, and the rest is history. Maybe even in February people were down on him. But it is undeniable that he broke out when he played power forward.

He broke out when he played power forward because he was a matchup nightmare for traditional bigs.

DD having success is more a byproduct of the value of the small lineup (he's really a 3 playing the stretch-4 -- an ideal college lineup IMO) than of DD having gotten good "big man development".

I wouldn't even consider him to be a "big" in the way it's truly intended here.

Edit: Another way to say this is: he succeeded because of his guard/wing skills for his height, not because of his "big man" skills.

 

[upstater]

He broke out when he played power forward because he was a matchup nightmare for traditional bigs.

DD having success is more a byproduct of the value of the small lineup (he's really a 3 playing the stretch-4 -- an ideal college lineup IMO) than of DD having gotten good "big man development".

I wouldn't even consider him to be a "big" in the way it's truly intended here.

Edit: Another way to say this is: he succeeded because of his guard/wing skills for his height, not because of his "big man" skills.

You remember it differently than I do. He was a terror down low on defense. Stopping drives, swatting balls away. Offensively, yet he was a European type PF. But defensively he was a presence--reminiscent of Roscoe Smith.

The point is, he was night-and-day in terms of his development. He made a big leap.

The book on Ollie's development of bigs is unwritten because we only have 3 guys to go on, and the Enoch story is unwritten. We have to remember that Amida Brimah has been here for all of Ollie's 4 years. He has been the starting center. And just because he hasn't developed, we suddenly have this idea that Ollie can't develop. Facey has developed, albeit in his senior year, though in his key junior year, he was superseded by Shonn Miller.

I'd say this is way too small a sample--and as Mau has pointed out many times, the people Ollie has been in charged with developing are two soccer players who picked up a bball at the age of 15, and one kid--Enoch--who didn't make his Soph. HS team and was scouted by people here who aside he was so so so far behind kids his age in terms of playing basketball. He came to UConn at the age of 17.

 

[superjohn]

I reject the premise that our bigs haven't developed, so I'm probably not the greatest person to have this conversation with.


IDK man maybe because people get better at their jobs when they have more experience, just like Ollie's gotten better at recruiting as he's gotten more experience? Or maybe because last summer we hired a coach – Killings – who has three years of experience working with NBA big men, including Emeka? Or maybe because the whole point is we have way more in terms of raw materials to work with on this roster than at any previous point under KO?

We lost to Mississippi State in the 1996 Sweet 16 despite having, at worst, the second-best team in the country that year. Why should we think Calhoun would ever get any better at winning tournament games in the future?

That loss still hurts, it was the one game where both Ray and Doron didn't show up and not having Ricky Moore was a killer. Also a shame UConn and UMass didn't play each other. They were clearly two of the best three teams in the country and there was so much star power with Ray, Camby, Calhoun, and Calipari.

 

[HuskiesAllDay]

You can easily make this argument about Deandre Daniels as well. He was here 3 years, and as late as January in his junior year, people said he was a bust. Then he broke out, and the rest is history. Maybe even in February people were down on him. But it is undeniable that he broke out when he played power forward.

Very true. But I think you'll be hard pressed to find anyone who considers DD a big. He was great no matter what you label him though. I agree on that

 

[UConnDan97]

Welcome to the Dog Pound, Eric!!!

 

[Matrim55]

That loss still hurts, it was the one game where both Ray and Doron didn't show up and not having Ricky Moore was a killer. Also a shame UConn and UMass didn't play each other. They were clearly two of the best three teams in the country and there was so much star power with Ray, Camby, Calhoun, and Calipari.

It is the one loss I will never get over. I know people get hung up on the 6 OT game, George Mason, Donyell's free throws or obviously Laettner, but nothing comes close to that MSU game. It's the most despondent I've ever been as a UConn fan and was convinced we'd never make the Final 4 afterward, simply because we hadn't to that point.

Imagine applying that type of a-logic in the modern day after all this program has been through! Who could possibly be so silly?

 

[gtcam]

Ok - I just noticed your dig at Calhoun - Chief advice to you - don't be a Stairmaster clone dumping on a HOF coach.

I didn't consider it a dig at JC at all
I've told you this before - JC is a big boy and has done so much he doesn't need you protecting him Chiefoo!!!

 

[gtcam]

You remember it differently than I do. He was a terror down low on defense. Stopping drives, swatting balls away. Offensively, yet he was a European type PF. But defensively he was a presence--reminiscent of Roscoe Smith.

The point is, he was night-and-day in terms of his development. He made a big leap.

The book on Ollie's development of bigs is unwritten because we only have 3 guys to go on, and the Enoch story is unwritten. We have to remember that Amida Brimah has been here for all of Ollie's 4 years. He has been the starting center. And just because he hasn't developed, we suddenly have this idea that Ollie can't develop. Facey has developed, albeit in his senior year, though in his key junior year, he was superseded by Shonn Miller.

I'd say this is way too small a sample--and as Mau has pointed out many times, the people Ollie has been in charged with developing are two soccer players who picked up a bball at the age of 15, and one kid--Enoch--who didn't make his Soph. HS team and was scouted by people here who aside he was so so so far behind kids his age in terms of playing basketball. He came to UConn at the age of 17.

Couldn't agree with you more - spot on

 

[Tenspro2002]

You remember it differently than I do. He was a terror down low on defense. Stopping drives, swatting balls away. Offensively, yet he was a European type PF. But defensively he was a presence--reminiscent of Roscoe Smith.

The point is, he was night-and-day in terms of his development. He made a big leap.

We do remember this differently. DD had a few nice blocks, mostly in help defense, but he wasn't a tough, physical presence on the defensive blocks the way Roscoe was.

Most of that season DD was described as a 3 playing out of position at the 4, in order to justify why he wasn't much of a stout defender or rebounder. He was a finesse player, not that there's anything wrong with that.

Roscoe was the opposite, a physical forward who JC tried to shoehorn in at the 3.

 

[HuskiesAllDay]

I reject the premise that our bigs haven't developed, so I'm probably not the greatest person to have this conversation with.


IDK man maybe because people get better at their jobs when they have more experience, just like Ollie's gotten better at recruiting as he's gotten more experience? Or maybe because last summer we hired a coach – Killings – who has three years of experience working with NBA big men, including Emeka? Or maybe because the whole point is we have way more in terms of raw materials to work with on this roster than at any previous point under KO?

We lost to Mississippi State in the 1996 Sweet 16 despite having, at worst, the second-best team in the country that year. Why should we think Calhoun would ever get any better at winning tournament games in the future?

The question isnt whether it can happen. It's whether it will happen or not. Or course it's possible that the staff becomes better at developing our bigs. But based on the evidence at hand, I don't really see how you can come to any other conclusion than to be skeptical. I mean almost anyone who has been watching the last 5 years can tell you that our bigs have barely developed at all.

I'm not disagreeing with you that things can get better. I certainly hope they do. And I'll be the first one to give ko and staff credit for it.

But I'm simply basing my argument off of our actual past rather than trying to speculate on the future based on very limited evidence. It's almost blind faith on your part.

Again, it's very possible it happens. I sure hope it does. But it's not really much of an argument.

If anything you could say that we've gotten worse at these things as ko has gotten more experience.

Our execution, game plans, in game adjustments, and player development all seemed to be a lot better in his first two years. So if anything the trend is going the other way.

I support ko. I don't want him fired. I think he's the best shot we have at returning to glory. But I'm just telling it how i see it.

 

[Walker11]

Do you honestly believe they gave out this offer forgetting it might stop them from taking a grad transfer? You don't think it's a little more likely that they evaluated what they could reasonably get in that market and made a decision that this was a good use of the schollie?

I had a relatively long post that made this same comment and then got busy and gave up on it. Completely agree. The staff was in on Shonn Miller the summer before his junior year. There were talks of Gibbs being a lock in what, January? I think KO assessed and realized the prospects of a grad transfer weren't great. And I bet he will still attempt to jump in the mix with a grad big, but he clearly doesn't feel especially optimistic about any prospects.

You remember it differently than I do. He was a terror down low on defense. Stopping drives, swatting balls away. Offensively, yet he was a European type PF. But defensively he was a presence--reminiscent of Roscoe Smith.

The point is, he was night-and-day in terms of his development. He made a big leap.

The book on Ollie's development of bigs is unwritten because we only have 3 guys to go on, and the Enoch story is unwritten. We have to remember that Amida Brimah has been here for all of Ollie's 4 years. He has been the starting center. And just because he hasn't developed, we suddenly have this idea that Ollie can't develop. Facey has developed, albeit in his senior year, though in his key junior year, he was superseded by Shonn Miller.

I'd say this is way too small a sample--and as Mau has pointed out many times, the people Ollie has been in charged with developing are two soccer players who picked up a bball at the age of 15, and one kid--Enoch--who didn't make his Soph. HS team and was scouted by people here who aside he was so so so far behind kids his age in terms of playing basketball. He came to UConn at the age of 17.

These are all good points. I may strongly disagree with @Matrim55 that KO has done a good job in developing bigs, but I wouldn't say he can't develop bigs. As you said, the sample size is small, the prospects were very raw, and even top 40ish bigs tend to take a while to develop. I am not confident but I'd say the jury is out. That said, add me to the mix of folks advocating for a new big man coach.

 

[superjohn]

I had a relatively long post that made this same comment and then got busy and gave up on it. Completely agree. The staff was in on Shonn Miller the summer before his junior year. There were talks of Gibbs being a lock in what, January? I think KO assessed and realized the prospects of a grad transfer weren't great. And I bet he will still attempt to jump in the mix with a grad big, but he clearly doesn't feel especially optimistic about any prospects.


These are all good points. I may strongly disagree with @Matrim55 that KO has done a good job in developing bigs, but I wouldn't say he can't develop bigs. As you said, the sample size is small, the prospects were very raw, and even top 40ish bigs tend to take a while to develop. I am not confident but I'd say the jury is out. That said, add me to the mix of folks advocating for a new big man coach.

As we all know losing Clyde Vaughan was a big blow for this program, we've never replaced what he brought to the table.

 

[Matrim55]

These are all good points. I may strongly disagree with @Matrim55 that KO has done a good job in developing bigs...

I didn't say he's done a good job developing bigs, I just don't think he's done a bad job of developing bigs. Amida and Kentan are about where they reasonably should/could be given their limitations.

Ollie's "bad job" was his inability to recruit more advanced players over them (Abu, Colson, Stone, Govan) in '14 and '15. We got lucky that Enoch fell into our laps and Miller chose us, and only in 2016 did we start landing big men who'd been playing basketball for more than 3 or 4 years. Of course, we have nothing close to a full sample with them since injuries have either slowed (Durham) or temporarily halted (Diarra) any kind of development.

I will grant you that I'm disappointed in Enoch's sophomore year. I hope he's on the Hilton/Gavin/Kentan path, but fear he's on the Nantambu path. Hopefully, though, Carlton will be better than expectations (some of our sharper posters think that'll be the case) and provide us some cushion.

 

[champs99and04]

Do you honestly believe they gave out this offer forgetting it might stop them from taking a grad transfer? You don't think it's a little more likely that they evaluated what they could reasonably get in that market and made a decision that this was a good use of the schollie?

Oh I'm sure they have considered every possible option, I just don't agree with the decision. There are sure to be tons of options out there in the grad market and those guys are bound to be better than whatever we get from Cobb in year one.

It's possible that I am completely off and KO has found a diamond in the rough, but based on recent history there is little reason for me to have confidence that's the case.

 

[Walker11]

I didn't say he's done a good job developing bigs, I just don't think he's done a bad job of developing bigs. Amida and Kentan are about where they reasonably should/could be given their limitations.

Ollie's "bad job" was his inability to recruit more advanced players over them (Abu, Colson, Stone, Govan) in '14 and '15. We got lucky that Enoch fell into our laps and Miller chose us, and only in 2016 did we start landing big men who'd been playing basketball for more than 3 or 4 years. Of course, we have nothing close to a full sample with them since injuries have either slowed (Durham) or temporarily halted (Diarra) any kind of development.

I will grant you that I'm disappointed in Enoch's sophomore year. I hope he's on the Hilton/Gavin/Kentan path, but fear he's on the Nantambu path. Hopefully, though, Carlton will be better than expectations (some of our sharper posters think that'll be the case) and provide us some cushion.

OK, so apparently we are on the same page. I won't go full Ollie on Enoch but I believe he will be a very good offensive player by the time he is a senior. He has skills that players who are infinitely more productive don't have. Something is just missing. I'm not sure if anyone has watched a lot of Carlton film but there are reasons to be encouraged. You may have been the one to point this out, but GTown fans were pissed he got away and thought he was quite underrated.

 

[Matrim55]

Something is just missing.

Reps. He doesn't understand the geometry of the court as the game is in motion – it's all mechanical. I wish we'd been in a position to tell him to take an extra year of grad school last season.

I'm not sure if anyone has watched a lot of Carlton film but there are reasons to be encouraged. You may have been the one to point this out, but GTown fans were pissed he got away and thought he was quite underrated.

You can see on the highlights that TOS recently posted, and hear from a few folks around the DC hoops scene that he's put it together a little bit more from a physical standpoint. He's springier and quicker and more engaged, which goes with what's – by our standards – an advanced understanding of the game for his age.

He's a better basketball player than he is a prospect, which is just fine.

 

[jleves]

This is quintessential Boneyard derailment of a thread. We really need an "I'm Calling You Stupid" board for some of you to go play in.

Welcome to the UConn family Eric and please ignore the children.

 

[CL82]

Yes he has pretty good footwork. Struggles to finish tho

Big man who can't finish? Well at least he'll be good fit.

 

[CL82]

We really need an "I'm Calling You Stupid" board for some of you to go play in.

Cesspool.