Dupree and DT Join - BG still being evaluated [merged thread] | Page 4 | The Boneyard

Dupree and DT Join - BG still being evaluated [merged thread]

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I don't agree with your take. I was watching the game -missed the 1sthalf ---and quite a bit what Carolyn Peck was talking in 2nd half was regarding the defense -was lack of interior defense. Anyone on the boneyard here that listened to the 2nd half couldattest to that. It sounds like what you're saying is - Dolson wasn't the problem it was everybody else." So the rookie got it all down, everyone else was messing up?

Nope - I don't see it that way. Secondly help and recover is also important. Bottomline Peck was saying our inside defense was the weaknest part - I didn't see great inside defense overall. And help and recover is also a key ingredient for "defense."

I try to never use what the announcers say, especially Peck, to help back a point I'm trying to make. They tend to find one thing wrong and beat it to death.

They were a little sloppy in covering the interior. It happens when you are together for a short time. I would expect improvement in the following games.

I certainly don't think it's an indication of a problem with the team or with Dolson.

I think Geno might have an idea on Dolson's capability and won't use one game to judge her.
 
Where's Cat? She has great perspective on these things, and I'd like to hear what she has to say....

Here I am. Just home from work and I'm too tired to read the entire thread but if the choice is between Lavender and Dolson and if I understand the role to be filled on the team I'd take Dolson. Full disclosure, I am not a fan of Lavender's and never have been. I think she plays soft. She's done better as a pro than I expected but considering the role needed on Team USA, I'd take Dolson as a bigger body, better (and harder) screener and better passer. Having said all that, I'd hope neither would need to play significant minutes much like Jayne Appel didn't play much in Prague in 2010.
 
I think anyone who honestly viewed the Canada game would accept the proposition that Stef cannot effectively guard a somewhat smaller but faster forward -- a player like Nneka or Dupree on the opposing team. If Nneka played against Stef, she would get to the basket pretty easily, as Canada's post did.

But Stef should be effective against players like Cambage: wide bodies who are big, strong and physical but not particularly fast or quick. Many European centers are of that stripe.

But the other side of the coin is offense. There, Stef can screen and pass probably better than anyone else the USA team, including Tina. I haven't seen a lot of Lavender, but those skills were not in evidence in the two games that I watched in the last week.

So if the opponent has a smaller, faster center as Canada did, then either Stef stays on the bench and Geno lets Stewie, Dupree, or Nneka guard their bigs, or USA plays a zone to protect Stef from having to guard those players 1-on-1. If their center is of the Mack truck variety, then Stef can play defense as well as anyone -- and get past that player on offense.
 
All I know is is give my right arm to see Sue, Maya, DT, Stewie, and Tina, on the court at the same time. That's the all-time UConn starting five once Breanna is done!
That lineup would have Cambage in foul trouble early, unless she has gotten a lot Quicker then 2 years ago in the WNBA.
 
Nope, I watched Lavender for 4 years in the Big 10 and was sadly disappointed by her performance every time. BTW, it isn't Steph. You clearly were watching the wrong player if she was called Steph.


Wow really...what Jantel Lavender were you watching lol....Ohio State's All time leading scorer and the Big Ten's all time leading rebounder, that Jantel Lavender? Or the Jantel Lavender that set a record for most consecutive double digit scoring games? Come on Mr Ice Bear...Ms Lavender was something serious in college, despite winning any Championships!
 
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dtbtbtb said:
Just found out that the games will be shown on TV (NBA TV chanel 1632) starting on 9/27

Someone posted earlier that the games this weekend will be shown on espn3. Sometimes espn3 doesn't show the offering until just as it starts so I'm going to hold off saying probably wrong until tomorrow when I look for it and it's not there at tip off.
 
I try to never use what the announcers say, especially Peck,

We can agree to disagree here doggyd.

1—I’ll use any announcer if I think he or she is right.

2—I value Peck’s opinion on things. It’s easy to pick apart anyone. Sometimes I disagree sure. In fact many times I often disagree with Rebecca but love her to death. I used to despise Debbie Antonelli – no longer I like her a lot. If I think any or all are right I’ll use their opinion over another and reference it.

3—Peck has predicted the National Team what I did to some extent and vive-versa so in a small way I am seeing what she is seeing.

to help back a point I'm trying to make. They tend to find one thing wrong and beat it to death.

Beat it to death imo is irrelevant with the discussion I was having. IMO I agreed with what she was saying. The inside defense was their worst aspect maybe other than shooting. So it doesn’t matter how many times she says it. For my argument I agreed with it.


They were a little sloppy in covering the interior.

What you call “a little sloppy” I call “no good” in comparison to their talent.

It happens when you are together for a short time. I would expect improvement in the following games.

Okay but how does that change what I saw and what Peck said needs to be worked on?

I certainly don't think it's an indication of a problem with the team or with Dolson.

I’m not sure what you’re point is here. They won’t lose imo and they will blow everyone out. For player number 12 we can pick the worst player in the WNBA and we’ll still probably blow every team out. So just to baseline our issue of “problem with the team.” I agree as they play more together there won’t be a “problem” or the problem will be masked.

Anyhow, we’ve always heard great coaches look at points of improvement. IMO I think Peck a former coach nailed a position that needs improvement. And I believe Geno will focus on. i.e “the worst posts in America.”


I think Geno might have an idea on Dolson's capability and won't use one game to judge her.

Sure and as I stated before-- practices will be important of which I and everyone else can’t see. But as I also referenced before of her play in Washington – also stating that pro ball is a lot different than college. So my opinion is much more aligned with Peck.In addition, I believe what I saw with Washington is more of value than other posters referencing/valuing her college days more than I would.

In summary, I know what I saw and it wasn’t good defense. I know the little I saw in Washington as well- she needs to keep working of which I expect she will. Of what I saw in WNBA of Lavendar this year – imo she’s just better plus the references of her good play in overseas . I predict SD will surpass JL one day soon but I don’t’ see it yet.

On these posts I can’t reference every play otherwise I’d write a novel. Your reference “one game” it’s just one point of argument I had made. As for SD as stated- imo her attributes are size, passing and familiarity with Geno/UCONN system and any former UCONN connection players. I didn’t see the impact on defense with Washington, nor at this past exhibition game. You disagree? Why? I wasn’t referencing just Canada.
 
I try to never use what the announcers say, especially Peck,

We can agree to disagree here doggyd.

1—I’ll use any announcer if I think he or she is right.

Right. You will use an announcers opinion to back your point if it agrees with you. Makes sense, but it doesn't make either of you right. Especially when it's Peck.

2—I value Peck’s opinion on things. It’s easy to pick apart anyone. Sometimes I disagree sure. In fact many times I often disagree with Rebecca but love her to death. I used to despise Debbie Antonelli – no longer I like her a lot. If I think any or all are right I’ll use their opinion over another and reference it.

We can agree to disagree here. I think Peck is a blithering idiot. Yeah, maybe that is a little harsh, but she either states the obvious over and over or can't get out a sentence that makes any sense. And most announcers know no more than the posters here. So their opinions to me are just noise trying to make the game more interesting. Even they don't believe what they say half the time.

3—Peck has predicted the National Team what I did to some extent and vive-versa so in a small way I am seeing what she is seeing.

Yes, you see what she is saying that she is seeing. I'm saying that doesn't make it any more valid.

to help back a point I'm trying to make. They tend to find one thing wrong and beat it to death.

Beat it to death imo is irrelevant with the discussion I was having. IMO I agreed with what she was saying. The inside defense was their worst aspect maybe other than shooting. So it doesn’t matter how many times she says it. For my argument I agreed with it.

I would have to disagree that it's irrelevant to the discussion. When an announcer harps on the say idea over and over, it gets overplayed and people tend to overstate the issue. Saying you agreed with Peck only hurts your argument.

They were a little sloppy in covering the interior.

What you call “a little sloppy” I call “no good” in comparison to their talent.

Ok, let's go with "no good" then. It was still overstated by Peck.

It happens when you are together for a short time. I would expect improvement in the following games.

Okay but how does that change what I saw and what Peck said needs to be worked on?

It doesn't change what you saw. As I said before, it's one game. They hadn't practiced much and Canada took advantage of it. I think it's a one game problem. You appear to think it's a team weakness.

I certainly don't think it's an indication of a problem with the team or with Dolson.

I’m not sure what you’re point is here. They won’t lose imo and they will blow everyone out. For player number 12 we can pick the worst player in the WNBA and we’ll still probably blow every team out. So just to baseline our issue of “problem with the team.” I agree as they play more together there won’t be a “problem” or the problem will be masked.

My point is it was one poor defensive interior performance, not a weakness in the team. You seem to think it's a Dolson problem. She only played 8 minutes in that game.

Anyhow, we’ve always heard great coaches look at points of improvement. IMO I think Peck a former coach nailed a position that needs improvement. And I believe Geno will focus on. i.e “the worst posts in America.”

She nailed a position that needs improvement based on their first exhibition game. Short sighted and "announcer speak" in my opinion.

I think Geno might have an idea on Dolson's capability and won't use one game to judge her.

Sure and as I stated before-- practices will be important of which I and everyone else can’t see. But as I also referenced before of her play in Washington – also stating that pro ball is a lot different than college. So my opinion is much more aligned with Peck.In addition, I believe what I saw with Washington is more of value than other posters referencing/valuing her college days more than I would.

I'll say it one more time. Peck is not helping you here, IMO. I don't find her to be insightful or very intelligent. Yes, pro ball is different. But I have read several reviews of Dolson's rookie season and I didn't see any talking about her weak post defense. I saw several of her games this season. Yes, at times she got lost out there and at times she had to cover quicker players. But I think you and Peck are overstating the problem.

In summary, I know what I saw and it wasn’t good defense. I know the little I saw in Washington as well- she needs to keep working of which I expect she will. Of what I saw in WNBA of Lavendar this year – imo she’s just better plus the references of her good play in overseas . I predict SD will surpass JL one day soon but I don’t’ see it yet.

You didn't see the first half and you say you saw little in Washington yet you seem to know how she plays defense in totality. I just think you need more info. She only played a few minutes.

On these posts I can’t reference every play otherwise I’d write a novel. Your reference “one game” it’s just one point of argument I had made. As for SD as stated- imo her attributes are size, passing and familiarity with Geno/UCONN system and any former UCONN connection players. I didn’t see the impact on defense with Washington, nor at this past exhibition game. You disagree? Why? I wasn’t referencing just Canada.

Again, she played only 7 minutes. I don't see how it's fair to make a judgement on her defensive abilities based on that small sampling. And you said you only say "little" Washington games. Another small sampling. And while "one game" was not your only point, your posts are around 90 about that game. It was your main point.

I also watched a few Washington games. Maybe I saw the 3 games where she blocked 4 shots, or the several excellent rebounding games.

I guess my main point is that Dolson will not be selected or cut based on this one 7 minute stint in an exhibition game, but over practices and the next several games in totality and that the issues of defense in the interior by Dolson will be long forgotten.



Thanks a a fun debate and keeping it that way.
 
This debate (DD vs. HH) lends credence to the notion that The Boneyard Never Sleeps!

(It's 5:58 a.m. now, so where is Daddy Choc?):rolleyes:
 
Actually, it was Tina who guarded Cambage; AJ guarded Lauren Jackson for the most part. I re-watched the game not too long ago. Cambage's ineffectiveness in the 2nd half (0 points) was a combination of fatigue and Tina putting her body on her before she could set up in the lane. AJ played 10 very effective minutes and contained LJ.

I also felt that Cambage fizzled out in the second half due to fatigue. She gave almost all she had in the first half. I suspect that she will be in much better shape now and will be prepared to give a full effort for the entire game.
 
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The stats from the WNBA indicate that Lavender is a better offensive player and Dolson is a better defensive player, I didn't think her defense looked good against Canada, but maybe it's just a thing with adjusting to international basketball.

If you're picking purely on defense, Dolson is the pick. Overall, advanced metrics like Lavender a little better but some of the things Dolson does well do necessarily make the stat sheet.

Forced to choose, I'd probably take Dolson because in a couple of years I think she will be much better than Lavender. If it's close now, I'd give her the tiebreak.
 
Is it moot? I view BG as someone recovering from an injury and thus she could still get reinjured. If I were on the committee, I still think I'd want a backup.

Do we think that Charles is incapable of playing the 5? We seem to have plenty of firepower at the 4 with Nneka, Stewart and Dupree. It seems to me that Charles and Griner would be able to play the 5 with Stewart pulling some time at that position if necessary. I can't imagine that anyone would think that Dolson and Lavender would be more capable of playing the 5 than Charles, but I could be wrong.
 
The stats from the WNBA indicate that Lavender is a better offensive player and Dolson is a better defensive player, I didn't think her defense looked good against Canada, but maybe it's just a thing with adjusting to international basketball.

If you're picking purely on defense, Dolson is the pick. Overall, advanced metrics like Lavender a little better but some of the things Dolson does well do necessarily make the stat sheet.

Forced to choose, I'd probably take Dolson because in a couple of years I think she will be much better than Lavender. If it's close now, I'd give her the tiebreak.

I agree that Dolson has a lot more upside than Lavender and I can see her as part of Team USA for years to come. She is a big body that can lean on opposing centers and can shoot the 15-footer. We are going to need big bodies to match up with Cambage going forward. The only issue I can see with her is the ability to cover players that can extend the defense away from the basket.
 
Do we think that Charles is incapable of playing the 5? We seem to have plenty of firepower at the 4 with Nneka, Stewart and Dupree. It seems to me that Charles and Griner would be able to play the 5 with Stewart pulling some time at that position if necessary. I can't imagine that anyone would think that Dolson and Lavender would be more capable of playing the 5 than Charles, but I could be wrong.
I think he is suggesting if BG is on the team and then in the third game has an issue with her eye that prevents her from continuing, then Charles would have no back-up. That was the situation with Sylvia going into the last WC as she was nursing an injury and no one was sure she would be able to go 9 games straight so the USA committee added Appel as insurance. Same sort of thing happened with the Olympic team and the choice of Jones as insurance as a PF/Center.
I think the eye thing is probably a less likely 'recurrence' if BG gets cleared to join the team, but they might still go that direction.
 
The stats from the WNBA indicate that Lavender is a better offensive player and Dolson is a better defensive player, I didn't think her defense looked good against Canada, but maybe it's just a thing with adjusting to international basketball.

If you're picking purely on defense, Dolson is the pick. Overall, advanced metrics like Lavender a little better but some of the things Dolson does well do necessarily make the stat sheet.

Forced to choose, I'd probably take Dolson because in a couple of years I think she will be much better than Lavender. If it's close now, I'd give her the tiebreak.
I think that is probably the strongest argument in favor of Dolson over Lavender - the future and not the present. But I do think the international game with a few exceptions tends toward more mobile centers with good mid-range to 3 point range. That is slowly changing in the US as well - C. Paris type centers are more difficult to find in HS as everyone wants to shoot threes. CD and Geno have both talked about that change.

Edit: Look at the bigs in the incoming freshman for example: Turner, Wilson. Everyone wants to be the next Jackson, Parker, Stewart and not the next Paris/Fowles.
 
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I think it is a silly argument in some ways. Both players have shortcomings and both have plus sides. Some are related to their skill set, some only to their experience and again, both pluses and minuses on both issues.

As above, I think the idea of the "future" may tilt it in Dolson's favor, as well as presumed familiarity with general system and expectations.
 
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No Mike, I'm 79 years old, played a lot of baseball but you may be thinking about Chris Samperi my cousins son.
That's exactly who I'm thinking of. I saw the last name and just now remembered that it was Chris......

I'm Michael's older and FAR wiser brother (with the questionable memory).:D
 
Look further down my boyo - Jim refuted his post and confirmed the Yet to be determined story re BG....FYI
For the record I'm not a boyo :D

I hope Griner can go. I read a Norwich Bulletin article today that said USA is thin in the post this year.
 
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I saw in a recap that Cambage fell down in the first half and did not play the rest of the game. Does anyone know what happened? Is she okay?
 
We need BG! get her on a boat to Europe and then a train to Istanbul so she does not need to fly…by the 27th she’ll make it there
 
We need BG! get her on a boat to Europe and then a train to Istanbul so she does not need to fly…by the 27th she’ll make it there

BG also enjoys kayaking and I hear can get up to a pretty nice clip.
 
I saw in a recap that Cambage fell down in the first half and did not play the rest of the game. Does anyone know what happened? Is she okay?
Might be an Achilles' tendon injury...being evaluated, but she was crying when she left the floor...
 
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