Caron Butler on how former players view UConn | Page 7 | The Boneyard

Caron Butler on how former players view UConn

8893 said:
As I've said, perception is reality. That's his perception and apparently it is shared by more than a few other former players and it is keeping them at "arm's length" from the University. I don't know what factors into their perception, but seeing as they had direct experience as players in the program, and I did not, I am not about to dismiss their perception as unfounded. One might wonder, for example, if the reason they "gloss over" those details is because no one paid much attention to such things when they were players.
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Aspects to this saga such as a 3 year Show Cause penalty against Ollie are part of the real world whether a former player chooses to completely ignore that they exist or not. Isn't UConn down one scholarship this season as well? These are real ramifications of this mess, even if a former player chooses to not consider them in forming his opinion. These details are part of the real world, and thus part of the dispute between the University and Ollie. Sticking your head in the sand doesn't change anything.
 
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8893 said:
I'm not offended by your curious crusade; I'm moreso bemused by it. I am simply hoping for a resolution that leaves as few of our ambassadors as possible estranged from the school. I welcome you to tell Caron that he is full of crap. He and others have aired their opinion that UConn was not fair to KO and I would like to see that perception repaired because I don't think it's good for the school. I don't know what it would cost, but I do believe that the financial constraints have been a factor.

If you say money has never been an issue that's welcome news to me.
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Much like I never showed any “zeal to see Ollie crushed” I’ve also never said “Caron is full of crap.” Interesting that you felt the need to insert both of those straw men to try to bolster your point. That said, the suggestion that the school couldn’t afford to pay Ollie the full buyout is flat out wrong. I wonder why you’d suggest otherwise.

Where we can find agreement is in the hope that the matter gets resolved. Unfortunately, Kevin’s representation seems intent on stretching the matter out as long as they can. Likely because they aren’t confident they will prevail before the arbiter. That’s unfortunate and seems inconsistent with the intent of the parties when they included a arbitration provision in the contract. It has burned bridges between Kevin and Jim Calhoun and created the distance that Caron talks about between some of our alumni and the school. It also has done considerable damage to kevin’s professional and personal reputation. One wonders if it was really in their client’s best interest.
 
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CL82 said:
I’ve also never said “Caron is full of crap.” Interesting that you felt the need to insert both of those straw men to try to bolster your point.
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CL82 said:
You are right though, I do like to knock down the bull crap mythology that has grown up around here on this issue, including that somehow Connecticut was unfair to Kevin
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Huskybass said:
Aspects to this saga such as a 3 year Show Cause penalty against Ollie are part of the real world whether a former player chooses to completely ignore that they exist or not. Isn't UConn down one scholarship this season as well? These are real ramifications of this mess, even if a former player chooses to not consider them in forming his opinion. These details are part of the real world, and thus part of the dispute between the University and Ollie. Sticking your head in the sand doesn't change anything.
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John Calipari, Sean Miller, Will Wade and Bruce Pearl are still coaching at the same schools where everyone knows they pay players, and two of them were caught on wiretaps agreeing to pay players. What did Ollie do again? Invite Ray Allen to a practice?

Hurley better not have another .500ish season, or UConn may self-report some infractions on him.
 
Excalibur said:
You can believe that all you want . . .
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It's not a belief, it is a fact. Ollie could burn the program to the ground if he wanted, but he would incinerate his network and never work again in athletics or the state of Connecticut for that matter. We are lucky he is in his 40's and not his 60's.
 
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@8893 Lol, are you suggesting that Caron is posting on the Boneyard? I would love that to be true, although I find it to be highly unlikely.
 
CL82 said:
@8893 Lol, are you suggesting that Caron is posting on the Boneyard? I would love that to be true, although I find it to be highly unlikely.
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One thing I brought up earlier. From a players perspective, they have seen any and every rule broken during their careers...so to them it is no big deal....Not saying right or wrong, but it has to slant their view.
 
nelsonmuntz said:
John Calipari, Sean Miller, Will Wade and Bruce Pearl are still coaching at the same schools where everyone knows they pay players, and two of them were caught on wiretaps agreeing to pay players. What did Ollie do again? Invite Ray Allen to a practice?

Hurley better not have another .500ish season, or UConn may self-report some infractions on him.
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You can't actually believe most of the crap you post. If you do, I have no idea how you make it through the day.
 
Leebo said:
Ollie brought in some players with great rankings next to their names. They either left or haven't lived up to the rankings. Where's the discrepancy?
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I think it goes way beyond great recruits not living up to their hype. Anyone who was at the games with Ollie coaching and is now at the games under Hurley sees a major difference in morale, in hustle and in placement on the floor. Ollie outcoached the opposition when we won the NCAA title. Whatever happened after that is a mystery. His ego took over? He got lazy? He retired while still coachinG? Who knows but he wasn’t doing the job and recruiting was only part of it.
 
Madmannsucks said:
One thing I brought up earlier. From a players perspective, they have seen any and every rule broken during their careers...so to them it is no big deal....Not saying right or wrong, but it has to slant their view.
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Wow, that is one heck of indictment Mandman, anything to support it other than speculation?
 
Huskybass said:
You can't actually believe most of the crap you post. If you do, I have no idea how you make it through the day.
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So Calipari, Miller, Pearl and Wade are model citizens?

I have a [pick your cliche] to sell you.
 
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Huskybass said:
Aspects to this saga such as a 3 year Show Cause penalty against Ollie are part of the real world whether a former player chooses to completely ignore that they exist or not. Isn't UConn down one scholarship this season as well? These are real ramifications of this mess, even if a former player chooses to not consider them in forming his opinion. These details are part of the real world, and thus part of the dispute between the University and Ollie. Sticking your head in the sand doesn't change anything.
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even Boeing paid their disgraced ex ceo.

if they just paid KO all these bad optics wouldn’t be hanging around the program
 
CL82 said:
Wow, that is one heck of indictment Mandman, anything to support it other than speculation?
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I am not talking about Uconn in particular-just being recruited, being around college sports having friends at other schools that they played with/against in High School.....pretty sure they saw it every day or pretty close to it.
 
Huskybass said:
Aspects to this saga such as a 3 year Show Cause penalty against Ollie are part of the real world whether a former player chooses to completely ignore that they exist or not. Isn't UConn down one scholarship this season as well? These are real ramifications of this mess, even if a former player chooses to not consider them in forming his opinion. These details are part of the real world, and thus part of the dispute between the University and Ollie. Sticking your head in the sand doesn't change anything.
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It is possible that former players, having been in the business, might have their own views of what is serious misconduct by a college basketball head coach and might not think using an outside trainer, having an unsanctioned shootaround and facilitating a phone call between a recruit and Ray Allen are fireable offenses. Obviously, that behavior was shocking to David Benedict, coming as he did from Auburn University where Bruce Pearl is famously a stickler for NCAA rules compliance, but some players may not view things from the same pristine perspective.
 
In the real world you need to pick your battles. In this case we had a coach who was violating NCAA rules to the extent that he is effectively banned for 3 years, and he was doing a bad job on top of that. In such a case the university was unwilling to go into battle with the NCAA. In effect it chose to save itself from serious penalties and got rid of the source. Not so different from what an NBA team might do if it had say a former all star now past his prime who was reduced to a bench guy and got caught in s domestic violence thing let’s say. Guy is now more trouble than he is worth so they would likely cut him and try mightily to avoid paying him a full contract. On the other hand if it happened to their shiny 1st round pick they might well take steps to get him back as soon as possible. Counseling, pr support, and so forth. If he is good enough they will even accept some negative publicity. If not they won’t.
 
The other note here is that Caron was a former criminal who no major program would touch. Had Calhoun and the UConn admissions folks not looked past his past so to speak he might well have spent his career in Turkey or Latvia or someplace rather than the NBA.
 
What's wild is people don't even know a 1/10th of what a dumpster fire the program was Ollie's last few years. I mean stuff that'd make your head explode.

Ollie ran the program into the ground. Some outside forces helped expedite that. But it's on him. I'm sorry the old players feel that way - and they're there to help a friend. I get it. I don't blame them and to them - it's probably as cut and dry as that.

But no sane athletic director in history would allow what was going on in that program. No one.
 
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Towney007 said:
What's wild is people don't even know a 1/10th of what a dumpster fire the program was Ollie's last few years. I mean stuff that'd make your head explode.

Ollie ran the program into the ground. Some outside forces helped expedite that. But it's on him. I'm sorry the old players feel that way - and they're there to help a friend. I get it. I don't blame them and to them - it's probably as cut and dry as that.

But no sane athletic director in history would allow what was going on in that program. No one.
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That would be the winning argument of "Should UConn have fired Ollie in 2018" debate. But since no one is arguing that Ollie didn't deserve to get fired in 2018, your post is irrelevant.
 
freescooter said:
The other note here is that Caron was a former criminal who no major program would touch. Had Calhoun and the UConn admissions folks not looked past his past so to speak he might well have spent his career in Turkey or Latvia or someplace rather than the NBA.
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So we have to hate ex-UConn players now?
 
nelsonmuntz said:
That would be the winning argument of "Should UConn have fired Ollie in 2018" debate. But since no one is arguing that Ollie didn't deserve to get fired in 2018, your post is irrelevant.
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Bull$&#t. You believe that he's the greatest coach in the history of coaches. Your own words have betrayed you here . . .
 
Dave Carlson said:
It is possible that former players, having been in the business, might have their own views of what is serious misconduct by a college basketball head coach and might not think using an outside trainer, having an unsanctioned shootaround and facilitating a phone call between a recruit and Ray Allen are fireable offenses. Obviously, that behavior was shocking to David Benedict, coming as he did from Auburn University where Bruce Pearl is famously a stickler for NCAA rules compliance, but some players may not view things from the same pristine perspective.
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A+
 
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Excalibur said:
Bull$&#t. You believe that he's the greatest coach in the history of coaches. Your own words have betrayed you here . . .
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You are not nearly as good at this as I am.
 
Dave Carlson said:
It is possible that former players, having been in the business, might have their own views of what is serious misconduct by a college basketball head coach and might not think using an outside trainer, having an unsanctioned shootaround and facilitating a phone call between a recruit and Ray Allen are fireable offenses. Obviously, that behavior was shocking to David Benedict, coming as he did from Auburn University where Bruce Pearl is famously a stickler for NCAA rules compliance, but some players may not view things from the same pristine perspective.
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AWESOME POST.
 
My momma always said love all your brothers equally. It's a damn shame Caron publicly declared he loves Ollie more than Taliek.
 
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