Caron Butler on how former players view UConn

[Stainmaster]

Because it seems as though KO torched the bridge to his mentor... If I was as connected to JC as many of these players let on, I'd have a tough time letting that go.

Well you aren’t, and they are, so...

 

[Huskybass]

"At the podium, I remembered something Coach had said before I left school.
“You’re going to be part of a family for life.”
He was right.
Thank you, Huskies. On Saturday, it’ll be a special moment when I attend the Huskies of Honor ceremony. This is a tremendous honor. And what’s crazy is, if Coach Calhoun hadn’t convinced me to stay after my first year, I might never have had my breakout sophomore season. I might never have met Andrea, who became my girlfriend that year. We’re still together today, married for 12 great years and counting, and we have five kids.
I became a man at UConn. I met the love of my life here. And I’ll never stop coming back here.
“Bad kid” or not."

I really like Caron. His story is a great one. I think he truly misses the family atmosphere that existed until about Boat's senior year. After that, things soured in lots of ways including the interpersonal relationships. It's all a mess, no matter how you slice it. Sad that such an amazing 15 year run soured so badly.

But with a 3 year show cause in effect against Ollie, there isn't really a logical way to conclude that UConn was wrong in firing Ollie for cause given the terms of the contract. Under the circumstances it was the right thing to do, regardless of the side effects or collateral damage.

If memory serves me correctly, KO had Hobbs, Blaney and Miller at his side when he first took over. That's decades of head coaching experience among the assistants, in addition to Calhoun's input. Within a couple of years, the relationship with Calhoun was severed and all the experienced assistants were gone. They were replaced by guys with a fraction of the experience and knowledge. At the same time, recruiting fell off due to misses, and recruiting a number of guys with chronic injuries including Gilbert, Diarra, and Durham. Combine those injuries with a couple of unused scholarships and you have an absolute mess. From National Champs to nobodies in about 3 years.

 

[superjohn]

I think that Ollie's experience at UConn looks very different to people in coaching and the business of basketball.

Ollie showed incredible loyalty to UConn when he didn't bolt after the 2014 championship and decided to stay at a school that had received a virtual permanent exile from big time basketball when we got left behind in the AAC. The AAC was a death sentence for UConn athletics. Most of the world recognized that there was no way the athletic program could be successful as the northern outlier in a southern mid-major conference. I think Ollie, who won a National Championship as an assistant in 2011 and another one as a Head Coach in 2014, had a big enough ego that he thought that he could pull off being the Gonzaga of the AAC.

Ollie was wrong. He chased recruits that he could have easily closed in the Big East, but didn't want to play at a mid-major, and then he ended up scrambling for players like Gilbert that were literally damaged goods. Even a lot of the players he closed decided they didn't want to be at a cold weather school that had been bounced out of the big time. Ollie should have better calibrated which recruits he could close at a program that was sliding down the basketball hierarchy, but there isn't a text book for managing a program down the path to irrelevancy. The closest historical comparable was Houston post-Guy Lewis and post-SWC, and Houston didn't manage it well either.

NO UCONN COACH could have maintained any level of success in the AAC. This conference was going to destroy UConn athletics, and even though we are going back to the big time, it may be too late. Ollie was a casualty of the conference debacle as much as anything, and I will not hold him completely responsible for UConn basketball's decline post-2014.

Then, after all that, UConn walks away from a contract that it had promised Ollie when he had a lot of other offers. That will leave a bad taste in a lot of people's mouth, like Caron's.

You talk such nonsense, where was Ollie going to leave to after 2014? Ollie didn't scramble for Gilbert and he wasn't damaged goods. Gilbert was a healthy McDonald's All-American type player when Ollie secured his pledge.

What are all these other offers Ollie had? UConn walked away from the contract because Ollie broke the terms of the contract by breaking NCAA rules, lying about it to UConn and the NCAA and he stopped doing his job.

 

[CL82]

The whole issue was a clusterduck but all the ex players see is that the school weaseled out of paying KO, which they did, justifiable or not. Yeah there was a perfect storm but let's face it: the school and its AD made some horrendous decisions. KO fell down, no doubt, but going about it the way they did was really bad form...certainly lacked integrity.

Could not disagree more. The school adhered to contract, Kevin did not. UConn is neither morally nor legally at fault here.

Think about it this way Funster. I'm not sure what you do for a living but if you 1) broke the law (or violated regulatory rules if you prefer) in your job, repeatedly; 2) lied to your bosses about it, repeatedly; 3) got caught and then lied to an outside regulatory agency, repeatedly and 4) all of that resulted in your employer getting sanctioned, you would get fired for cause 10 times out of 10. Why should that be any different with Kevin Ollie?

 

[gioff2323]

I actually before thought that how UConn let Ollie go was fine. But Iafter hearing Caron speak I have changed my mind. Those violations were not the reason they wanted him gone but it became there justification. Fan base was very unhappy so they made the change. But Caron is correct that Ollie made considerable sacrifices for UConn in staying. I think UConn needs to give him the money.

why don’t you give him the money if u think he deserved it? you can get together with others who feel similarly and create a go fund me page. Problem solved.

 

[gampelcrazies]

Why can't they disagree with Calhoun on one issue?

Because they are sticking up for someone who isn’t the same KO they knew. Jim Calhoun is the reason these players came to UConn and love UConn. Not Kevin Ollie.

 

[XLCenterFan]

The bottom line is Ollie got fired for losing and the school blamed it on minor violations. Pay the damn guy and let's move on!

 

[aceboon]

Because they are sticking up for someone who isn’t the same KO they knew. Jim Calhoun is the reason these players came to UConn and love UConn. Not Kevin Ollie.

...and you know KO more than they do? There are not many crazies I would place above the crazy of a college sports nut, the stuff some of you guys say, oh boy.

 

[gampelcrazies]

...and you know KO more than they do?

Probably. If you listen to the podcast Caron didn't even know when UConn games were on. But he's going to know whats going on behind the scenes.

 

[BigErnMcCracken]

Probably. If you listen to the podcast Caron didn't even know when UConn games were on. But he's going to know whats going on behind the scenes.

Just for the record, you just said that you probably know Kevin Ollie better than Caron does. Let that marinate for a second. This place, man.

 

[BigErnMcCracken]

What are all these other offers Ollie had? UConn walked away from the contract because Ollie broke the terms of the contract by breaking NCAA rules, lying about it to UConn and the NCAA and he stopped doing his job.

This has always sounded, to me, like the "AJ Price got a longer suspension than Marcus Williams because he lied and Marcus told the truth" that some people apparently believe.

 

[Excalibur]

You talk such nonsense, where was Ollie going to leave to after 2014? Ollie didn't scramble for Gilbert and he wasn't damaged goods. Gilbert was a healthy McDonald's All-American type player when Ollie secured his pledge.

What are all these other offers Ollie had? UConn walked away from the contract because Ollie broke the terms of the contract by breaking NCAA rules, lying about it to UConn and the NCAA and he stopped doing his job.

I also love how we "scrambled" for Gilbert, who committed in July of 2015, well before the fall signing period.

 

[HuskyHawk]

The bottom line is Ollie got fired for losing and the school blamed it on minor violations. Pay the damn guy and let's move on!

Why pay a guy who's contract (which is the only reason you'd pay him) says you don't have to pay him?

UConn chose to exercise its right to fire Ollie for cause because he was a terrible coach who wasn't doing the job. They were able to fire him "for cause" because he broke rules, lied to UConn and lied to the NCAA. UConn isn't required to exercise the right to fire him and if he was winning it probably wouldn't have. That's fine.

 

[XLCenterFan]

Why pay a guy who's contract (which is the only reason you'd pay him) says you don't have to pay him?

UConn chose to exercise its right to fire Ollie for cause because he was a terrible coach who wasn't doing the job. They were able to fire him "for cause" because he broke rules, lied to UConn and lied to the NCAA. UConn isn't required to exercise the right to fire him and if he was winning it probably wouldn't have. That's fine.

I'm not the overly litigious type. In life, there's the contract, and there's what you SHOULD do. I've had plenty of dealings with people where the contract (or agreement) gets informally renegotiated or simply ripped up after facts or situations change.

We all know that if Ollie was winning, the school would have probably his defended his violations.

This is not a good look for UCONN, and I hope Danny looked Benedict in the eye before he came on and told him: "none of these stunts with me pal." Instead of dragging this out and paying lawyers, just pay Ollie, and let's keep it moving. Sometimes, even when you don't want to, you have to pay someone off and put it behind you. Ollie is family, right? Families don't pull this stuff on each other. I have Ollie's back in this spot.

 

[nelsonmuntz]

I also love how we "scrambled" for Gilbert, who committed in July of 2015, well before the fall signing period.

Why don't you pick a coherent position, and then we can debate. On one hand, the current players are bad, but apparently the recruiting under Ollie was excellent. Which is it?

And are you arguing the AAC was good for UConn basketball?

 

[Chief00]

Most of the former players, understandably, feel this way. Most feel Ollie deserved to be fired for his performance, the ncaa violations were minor and much worse was tolerated in the past and would have been tolerated if Ollie was winning. Also, what Glenn Miller did was pretty disgusting and the players who love and will always love Calhoun, do not like that he is on Miller’s side with this.
I know what I said doesn’t really fly around here but that’s what it is.

Agree, Calhoun aligning with Miller is a mistake. Miller is in D1 coaching no man’s land. Unlikely most head coaches will hire a disloyal assistant because minor or major rules get broken at all schools. He’s also very unpopular in the player community because he’s viewed as a “rat”.

 

[Madmannsucks]

I like seeing the board turn slowly on CB, as they did on RA. Because they have a different perspective. Remember all these guys played ball in college and saw rules broken every day. Not all at Uconn, just across the board. Think THAT might slant their perspective.?

 

[Hans Sprungfeld]

Ollie is family, right? Families don't pull this stuff on each other.

I recollect the first time I said this to a friend in a situation where it made great sense to do so. He said, "Sure they do." While that wasn't and isn't the case in my family, and in healthy families, I had to admit that he had a point. As Jerry Seinfeld once said, "Have ya been out there?"

The only thing I know for certain in all of this is that I don't know anything for certain. That puts me in position to say, "You may be right," or, "You're probably right" to quite a few people who post in these threads when this subject comes. The only question is which people to say this to. Or is it perhaps all of them?

 

[superjohn]

I like seeing the board turn slowly on CB, as they did on RA. Because they have a different perspective. Remember all these guys played ball in college and saw rules broken every day. Not all at Uconn, just across the board. Think THAT might slant their perspective.?

Who on the board has turned on Caron Butler?

 

[Drumguy]

No one is happy about this situation. Turning a blind eye to it, doesn't mean he's right. You can feel bad for your friend and still understand the University's position. As another poster said, pony up the settlement dollars if you all feel so bad for KO.

While I believe there was just cause (which we don't have to argue about as the court's will decide) Ollie alienated a whole string of players who felt they had to leave to be successful. How many players underachieved? Accepted Losing? How many transferred out and how many more would have if Danny not tried exceptionally hard to retain them. Not only did Ollie cheat and get caught, he set us up for this dismal trek in the desert. How does Caron feel about how a generation of UConn players getting fed up enough to leave or want to leave. There was obviously something wrong with his relationship with players.

Fair or not, I place the blame for this whole awful stretch on Ollie, his impact is still being felt..

 

[Leebo]

Why don't you pick a coherent position, and then we can debate. On one hand, the current players are bad, but apparently the recruiting under Ollie was excellent. Which is it?

Ollie brought in some players with great rankings next to their names. They either left or haven't lived up to the rankings. Where's the discrepancy?

 

[XLCenterFan]

I LOVE the avatar Drumguy...I need to make a run to the Alchemist soon.

Regardless of what happened, or how this situation deteriorated, we need to put this to bed. We cannot go back and change what happened. At this point, we have 2 options: pay him and it's over, or continue to litigate. No matter what, I think UCONN looks like the villain, and I highly prefer the first option. It's not like we can sue Ollie for the damages incurred to the program, which were likely more attributable to conference realignment than anything he did or did not do.

 

[HuskyHawk]

I'm not the overly litigious type. In life, there's the contract, and there's what you SHOULD do. I've had plenty of dealings with people where the contract (or agreement) gets informally renegotiated or simply ripped up after facts or situations change.

We all know that if Ollie was winning, the school would have probably his defended his violations.

This is not a good look for UCONN, and I hope Danny looked Benedict in the eye before he came on and told him: "none of these stunts with me pal." Instead of dragging this out and paying lawyers, just pay Ollie, and let's keep it moving. Sometimes, even when you don't want to, you have to pay someone off and put it behind you. Ollie is family, right? Families don't pull this stuff on each other. I have Ollie's back in this spot.

I guess I completely disagree on what UConn Should Do. They had a coach who had become lazy, and largely incompetent. He had stopped doing the job to the best of his ability. He had quit on UConn. He wasn't putting in the work recruiting, teaching players or even on the sidelines. As a result he needed to stop being our coach. So you think that a guy who stopped performing for two years and who got paid over $6M over those two years, was somehow owed $10M not to have to work at all? I can see no moral or ethical case for Kevin getting any money from UConn. I can see a case for him paying some back for being a total slacker while he was being paid. Fortunately, UConn drafted the contract well enough that some of Ollie's many transgressions allowed them to fire him for cause and not have to pay him not to work.

Who expects to be paid not to work? Since when is that normal? Sure it applies in some contracts with athletes and coaches, but that's simply the athlete applying the letter of the contract against the employer. The Red Sox paid Jose Offerman for several years after he stopped being able to play (and now Pedroia as well). That's not the team doing the "right thing". The right thing would see them not accepting that pay since they aren't earning it. Kevin is certainly not earning any money from UConn.

 

[Madmannsucks]

Who on the board has turned on Caron Butler?

Slowly, it will happen. Most on this board want KO to silently go away. I get that(although I am not in that camp). Saw it happen with Allen. Former players have a different perspective. And while they are loyal to Coach JC, as one poster noted, not so much to Miller.

 

[XLCenterFan]

I guess I completely disagree on what UConn Should Do. They had a coach who had become lazy, and largely incompetent. He had stopped doing the job to the best of his ability. He had quit on UConn. He wasn't putting in the work recruiting, teaching players or even on the sidelines. As a result he needed to stop being our coach. So you think that a guy who stopped performing for two years and who got paid over $6M over those two years, was somehow owed $10M not to have to work at all? I can see no moral or ethical case for Kevin getting any money from UConn. I can see a case for him paying some back for being a total slacker while he was being paid. Fortunately, UConn drafted the contract well enough that some of Ollie's many transgressions allowed them to fire him for cause and not have to pay him not to work.

Who expects to be paid not to work? Since when is that normal? Sure it applies in some contracts with athletes and coaches, but that's simply the athlete applying the letter of the contract against the employer. The Red Sox paid Jose Offerman for several years after he stopped being able to play (and now Pedroia as well). That's not the team doing the "right thing". The right thing would see them not accepting that pay since they aren't earning it. Kevin is certainly not earning any money from UConn.

Unless you're on the staff, or have a super inside information connection, I don't know how we can judge how hard Ollie was working. To say he "quit" on UCONN is quite a statement that is pretty much unable to be proven. I always thought our fall was much more related to conference realignment than who our coach was. There's so many moving parts in a college hoops season/program, that we cannot control the variables well enough to predict what would have happened otherwise. Therefore, we cannot point to any one reason for why we are not where we, as a fan base, want to be right now. To solely blame KO is wrong, and to pretend that we fired him for violations is also wrong. We let him go because the team was not winning and the fan base wanted change. Pay him off and let's forget about all of this already.