Bilas on Uconn left out of expansion

[billybud]

1....Other than dreaming scenarios, there is little evidence that an ACC GOR with 13 years remaining can be discounted as a binding agent.

2....Miami, Clemson, FSU, VT, GT, NC State, Louisville are competing in the football arena with the SEC...it is football, football, football...Sure, the ACC is great at non revenue sports and had 10 schools in the top 25 of Director's Cup...but those don't count in the scheme of things.

The ACC is under pressure to do something that will provide the football schools the wherewithal to compete with the SEC.

3....Of course FSU may be in the same place that I am....a place where desperate measures must be taken....told by my oncologist that I had an inoperable tumor that was metastatic to the lymph nodes in my neck...I asked "what now? He said you'll have to walk through the fire. Radiation and chemo...I asked "and if I don't"...he shrugged and said 70% mortality in three years....SOOO...Facing a sure fading on one side and backed against a cliff over a raging river, I did a full Sundance Kid. I could see Clemson and FSU, backed against the cliff edge, holding hands and jumping screaming together into that uncertain fate of the river.

 

[upstater]

so… They would need… Other schools… That… Play… Foot…ball

How many games do you need for football? You need 8. Give me the candidates.

This is going to be a very weak league after they lose their good football schools.

Big12 schools aren't going to run to play Syracuse and Wake Forest.

They'll scrape the barrel. The world you imagine, of the ACC taking B12 members, it doesn't exist.

 

[upstater]

1....Other than dreaming scenarios, there is little evidence that an ACC GOR with 13 years remaining can be discounted as a binding agent.

2....Miami, Clemson, FSU, VT, GT, NC State, Louisville are competing in the football arena with the SEC...it is football, football, football...Sure, the ACC is great at non revenue sports and had 10 schools in the top 25 of Director's Cup...but those don't count in the scheme of things.

The ACC is under pressure to do something that will provide the football schools the wherewithal to compete with the SEC.

3....Of course FSU may be in the same place that I am....a place where desperate measures must be taken....told by my oncologist that I had an inoperable tumor that was metastatic to the lymph nodes in my neck...I asked "what now? He said you'll have to walk through the fire. Radiation and chemo...I asked "and if I don't"...he shrugged and said 70% mortality in three years....SOOO...Facing a sure fading on one side and backed against a cliff over a raging river, I did a full Sundance Kid. I could see Clemson and FSU, backed against the cliff edge, holding hands and jumping screaming together into that uncertain fate of the river.

You talk about dreaming and then tell us these schools are competing with the SEC.

I mean, I can't really help you after a sentence like that.

 

[Kolumbo]

If the ACC lost key members and was down to say 8-10 programs, I could see it going hybrid. If the ACC lost 4-6 programs, who exactly would it add to benefit either football or basketball? The pickings are extremely slim. UConn, Memphis, Temple, USF, Tulane, Tulsa, JMU, ODU, Troy?

1. Programs like Duke and Wake will want high quality basketball and there simply aren't any outside of the Big East.
2. Cincy, WVU, UCF. I don't see them leaving the Big XII for the ACC. At that point the Big XII would be far superior to the ACC. Why would anyone leave the Big XII, assuming they could leave, to backfill the ACC?
3. ACC could add 4 all-sports and 4 basketball-only to get to maybe 18 basketball, which would include Georgetown, Nova, SJU, Xavier?
4. Depending on how many left in this hypothetical, it would either go hybrid or be a BE/AAC 2.0. Either way, it would no longer be a P football conference.

 

[businesslawyer]

Bilas may not like it, but the ACC contract essentially sentences many of these schools to a 13 year suspended sentence before the walls cave in. FSU and Clemson have exit paths, Carolina and Virginia probably as well, but the rest? A strong Big East won't need the BC's and Wake Forests of the world when all is said and done.

The basketball only schools will not need them. UConn will.

 

[jostar1]

1....Other than dreaming scenarios, there is little evidence that an ACC GOR with 13 years remaining can be discounted as a binding agent.

2....Miami, Clemson, FSU, VT, GT, NC State, Louisville are competing in the football arena with the SEC...it is football, football, football...Sure, the ACC is great at non revenue sports and had 10 schools in the top 25 of Director's Cup...but those don't count in the scheme of things.

The ACC is under pressure to do something that will provide the football schools the wherewithal to compete with the SEC.

3....Of course FSU may be in the same place that I am....a place where desperate measures must be taken....told by my oncologist that I had an inoperable tumor that was metastatic to the lymph nodes in my neck...I asked "what now? He said you'll have to walk through the fire. Radiation and chemo...I asked "and if I don't"...he shrugged and said 70% mortality in three years....SOOO...Facing a sure fading on one side and backed against a cliff over a raging river, I did a full Sundance Kid. I could see Clemson and FSU, backed against the cliff edge, holding hands and jumping screaming together into that uncertain fate of the river.

Sorry to hear about your health problems.

 

[billybud]

You talk about dreaming and then tell us these schools are competing with the SEC.

I mean, I can't really help you after a sentence like that.

Well...FSU did beat Auburn for a national championship in 2013...and beat the SEC West Champ, LSU last season...and FSU opens with LSU this season...and plays Florida as chief rival every year...and has scheduled home and homes with Georgia, Alabama.

Clemson has done well against the SEC.

FSU finished top ten last year in the final CFP poll...and beat Florida, LSU, and future SEC Oklahoma.

 

[upstater]

The only way Georgetown or Villanova are ever even hypothetically going to the ACC is if they upgrade their football to FBS.

ACC would absolutely backfill with UConn and look to WVU, Cincinnati, plus USF and others. It’s like some of you have learned nothing about the strategy these leagues have taken with P5 selections- the B12 and ACC have both recently added schools with prior success and/or commitment to athletics who are located in geographically advantageous areas. Teams like Louisville, TCU, UCF, Houston, etc getting the call up to the “big leagues” sounds dumb on a message board… until it happens.

If I had to guess any hypothetical ACC backfill candidates in a “worst case” scenario where they lost 8 football teams + ND and have to get back to 12 football teams…

UConn
Cincinnati
West Virginia
South Florida
Central Florida

Gets you to 12. I haven’t even mentioned SMU, who has already had conversations with the ACC in the past.. documented here by the Dallas Morning News.

The idea that the ACC would be looking to backfill with some sort of basketball only contingent consisting of random Big East teams is incredibly laughable- people need to get it in their heads that BE schools have little to no national following or appeal from a television standpoint in addition to not playing football. The league would need more football inventory with teams that have a someone reasonable argument that they could be successful by moving up to the P5 in the long term. The basketball filler inventory that comes with it is a bonus.

You're wildly overestimating the appeal of Wake Forest, Syracuse and Louisville

 

[upstater]

Well...FSU did beat Auburn for a national championship in 2013...and beat the SEC West Champ, LSU last season...and FSU opens with LSU this season...and plays Florida as chief rival every year...and has scheduled home and homes with Georgia, Alabama.

Clemson has done well against the SEC.

FSU finished top ten last year in the final CFP poll...and beat Florida, LSU, and future SEC Oklahoma.

FSU is one of the ones leaving. I'm not knocking FSU or Clemson.

I'm talking about ACC football as a whole

 

[billybud]

Ohhh...from your lips to God's ear.

The SEC has won 13 national championships sine 2006....during this SEC run, the ACC won three NC's....the B1G one...and everybody else..nada..

Someone needs to step up.and stop the Borg.

 

[CL82]

The only way Georgetown or Villanova are ever even hypothetically going to the ACC is if they upgrade their football to FBS.

ACC would absolutely backfill with UConn and look to WVU, Cincinnati, plus USF and others. It’s like some of you have learned nothing about the strategy these leagues have taken with P5 selections- the B12 and ACC have both recently added schools with prior success and/or commitment to athletics who are located in geographically advantageous areas. Teams like Louisville, TCU, UCF, Houston, etc getting the call up to the “big leagues” sounds dumb on a message board… until it happens.

If I had to guess any hypothetical ACC backfill candidates in a “worst case” scenario where they lost 8 football teams + ND and have to get back to 12 football teams…

UConn
Cincinnati
West Virginia
South Florida
Central Florida

Gets you to 12. I haven’t even mentioned SMU, who has already had conversations with the ACC in the past.. documented here by the Dallas Morning News.

The idea that the ACC would be looking to backfill with some sort of basketball only contingent consisting of random Big East teams is incredibly laughable- people need to get it in their heads that BE schools have little to no national following or appeal from a television standpoint in addition to not playing football. The league would need more football inventory with teams that have a someone reasonable argument that they could be successful by moving up to the P5 in the long term. The basketball filler inventory that comes with it is a bonus.

I don’t know that I see the smoldering ruins of the ACC stealing away members of the big 12. Right now, that’s not an upward move, even less so if there’s only six or eight teams left.

 

[CL82]

They'll scrape the barrel.

Yep, but the Big East teams aren’t the bottom of the barrel, they are beneath the barrel, scratching out an existence in the dirt …..because… they… don’t… have… football.

 

[upstater]

Yep, but the Big East teams aren’t the bottom of the barrel, they are beneath the barrel, scratching out an existence in the dirt …..because… they… don’t… have… football.

This is why I'm asking you to name the teams.

Get me from 6 to 12 please.

That's all I'm asking.

BTW, you claimed above that no one that knows college sports would think this, but the exercise I'm asking you to do is exactly what ACC Twitter was discussing months ago. If Uva, UNC, ND, FSU, Miami, Clemson leave, and heaven forbid they take VT or Duke or NC ST with them, how do you add 6 new teams?

Name them.

 

[buddy]

1....Other than dreaming scenarios, there is little evidence that an ACC GOR with 13 years remaining can be discounted as a binding agent.

2....Miami, Clemson, FSU, VT, GT, NC State, Louisville are competing in the football arena with the SEC...it is football, football, football...Sure, the ACC is great at non revenue sports and had 10 schools in the top 25 of Director's Cup...but those don't count in the scheme of things.

The ACC is under pressure to do something that will provide the football schools the wherewithal to compete with the SEC.

3....Of course FSU may be in the same place that I am....a place where desperate measures must be taken....told by my oncologist that I had an inoperable tumor that was metastatic to the lymph nodes in my neck...I asked "what now? He said you'll have to walk through the fire. Radiation and chemo...I asked "and if I don't"...he shrugged and said 70% mortality in three years....SOOO...Facing a sure fading on one side and backed against a cliff over a raging river, I did a full Sundance Kid. I could see Clemson and FSU, backed against the cliff edge, holding hands and jumping screaming together into that uncertain fate of the river.

There are new advances in oncology everyday. Less toxic treatments, fewer side effects, more favorable outcomes. Then more time you can buy, the more chance for a breakthough. Best wishes for successful outcome!

 

[CL82]

This is why I'm asking you to name the teams.

Get me from 6 to 12 please.

That's all I'm asking.

BTW, you claimed above that no one that knows college sports would think this, but the exercise I'm asking you to do is exactly what ACC Twitter was discussing months ago. If Uva, UNC, ND, FSU, Miami, Clemson leave, and heaven forbid they take VT or Duke or NC ST with them, how do you add 6 new teams?

Name them.

The question is: What hypothetical teams will join a hypothetical ACC conference in a hypothetical amount of time in the future that has lost an unknown amount of teams.

The answer is: Lol…How the fook would I know?! There are so many random variables in that there is no way to predict that with anything that even vaguely approaching certainty.

 

[Drew]

I don’t know that I see the smoldering ruins of the ACC stealing away members of the big 12. Right now, that’s not an upward move, even less so if there’s only six or eight teams left.

I don’t know that it would necessarily happen… but that’s absolutely where they’d start their search.

 

[billybud]

There are new advances in oncology everyday. Less toxic treatments, fewer side effects, more favorable outcomes. Then more time you can buy, the more chance for a breakthough. Best wishes for successful outcome!

Thank you...let's leave my medical as a analogy...I am weathering the chemo...the radiation is a bear.

But it is a sure fate causing an only move...and I do see desperation in Clemson and FSU regarding keeping up...and desperation will drive you to a choice.

 

[CL82]

I don’t know that it would necessarily happen… but that’s absolutely where they’d start their search.

If they could, but I don’t see anyone leaving a then stable big 12 for the smoldering ruins of the ACC.

 

[Slasher]

The weaker conference is always the one that gets raided. The Pac-12 was the stronger conference and could have had 4 Big 12 schools. They voted against it. Then UCLA/USC left and now the Big 12 is the stronger conference and will likely steal a couple from the Pac. If the ACC loses their most important members, those Big 12 schools aren't going to join the ACC. I think the ideal short term scenario for UConn is the Big 12 adding 3 west members and needing a 4th member to balance it out. Maybe the team that won the most recent national title in hoops??

 

[CL82]

The weaker conference is always the one that gets raided. The Pac-12 was the stronger conference and could have had 4 Big 12 schools. They voted against it. Then UCLA/USC left and now the Big 12 is the stronger conference and will likely steal a couple from the Pac. If the ACC loses their most important members, those Big 12 schools aren't going to join the ACC. I think the ideal short term scenario for UConn is the Big 12 adding 3 west members and needing a 4th member to balance it out. Maybe the team that won the most recent national title in hoops??

Agreed.

It’s amazing how the balance of power flips around. If ESPN doesn’t bail out the big 12 by creating, the Longhorn Network, Kansas, and a couple other schools, or ready to head to the Big East. If that happened, the big east becomes stabilized, remains a all sport, but basketball centric conference, and the C7 would not have had the votes to leave.

Going back even further, if we get one more vote for the admission of Penn State, we probably end up, picking up Maryland in the Big East and have a solid football/basketball conference.

Heck, if Villanova had decided to upgrade their football program, the C7 wouldn’t have had the votes to leave.

I am inclined to believe that the P5 becomes the P3, or more accurately the P2 +1. Right now, it looks like that would be the Big Ten in the SEC with the big 12 being a weak sister to the other two. The PAC and the ACC look like they will eventually get relegated. But that’s what the landscape looks like today. It could flip in a heartbeat.

 

[upstater]

The question is: What hypothetical teams will join a hypothetical ACC conference in a hypothetical amount of time in the future that has lost an unknown amount of teams.

The answer is: Lol…How the fook would I know?! There are so many random variables in that there is no way to predict that with anything that even vaguely approaching certainty.

If you can't answer this basic question, then you have no business even talking about this topic.

Because the whole thing depends on it.

I started by saying they would merge because 6 or 8 teams could not find another 4 or 6 football schools to add. Sure, they can add USF and Old Dominion, but the prospect of merging with the BE is so much more appealing. The B12 schools aren't moving to a small school or small market football conference. Not happening

 

[CL82]

If you can't answer this basic question, then you have no business even talking about this topic.

Because the whole thing depends on it.

I started by saying they would merge because 6 or 8 teams could not find another 4 or 6 football schools to add. Sure, they can add USF and Old Dominion, but the prospect of merging with the BE is so much more appealing. The B12 schools aren't moving to a small school or small market football conference. Not happening

Lol, it’s not a “basic question” it is a five variable unanswerable question.

 

[noeynox]

I think if the ACC lost all those schools they would be stripped of their P5 status such as the Big East was stripped of their BCS status. No one is paying the remaining ACC schools P5 money for tv regardless of who they add.

 

[HuskyHawk]

How many games do you need for football? You need 8. Give me the candidates.

This is going to be a very weak league after they lose their good football schools.

Big12 schools aren't going to run to play Syracuse and Wake Forest.

They'll scrape the barrel. The world you imagine, of the ACC taking B12 members, it doesn't exist.

You're delusional about some key realities here. In term of $ and stability, the P5 are ranked this way.
1A B1G - 1B SEC
3 ACC
4 Big 12
5 Pac

The ACC GOR is solid and so is the ND deal. So 13 years of stability. The new B12 deal is 5 years b/c no network would commit longer than that. The Pac has no deal at all. They struck out on landing a deal with any linear TV carrier. So while FSU, Clemson, UNC and UVA may be appealing, they aren't available in the time period where things need to happen. The Pac teams are right now and the B12 teams will be soon. So that's where the B1G or SEC will look, if they do. I'm not convinced that they want or need to get bigger. Report was the B1G Presidents shot down a 24 team league that functioned like two 12 team leagues with a championship game.

There are a few ways this can go. The B12 could add Pac schools now (UA, ASU, UC and Utah). If they don't, then in 3-4 years the best B12 teams could merge with the SEC and create a league that legit competes with the B1G and SEC. KU, OK State, Baylor, Houston and Cinci join ACC. The Big 12 scraps combine with the Pac scraps.

 

[LoyalFanCT]

I'm not so sure the ACC GOR is solid. As Business Lawyer pointed out it has not faced any lawsuits yet. One has to wait to see what happens if one of the members challenges it in court. ND also may be able to find a way to wiggle out of its agreement. FSU and Clemson are among the likely ACC members that could find a way to bolt from the conference.