Big East expansion exercise approaching 2025…

[CL82]

For those thinking Kansas would leave the B12 for NBE, I propose an equally likely scenario.
The NBE forces the University of Scranton to go D1. They are Jesuit so the Catholics will be happy and they will bring in legions of dedicated fans of the show "The Office". This will greatly increase the number of eyeballs on the league and drive hoards of fans to Scranton thereby increasing the Fox payout.
Of course, they will have to change their name from "The Royals" to the "University of Scranton Dundering Mifflens" for marketing purposes.
Heck, maybe they can join along with Kansas.

Scranton has a lot of championships and men’s and women’s basketball could be a good add.

 

[Huskymagic]

You absolutely add Gonzaga if you can. Question is would Gonzaga do that. Big East is at a critical juncture, networks are probably going to want them to get to 14, maybe even 16 teams. There’s just not a lot of teams that really move the needle. Gonzaga, San Diego State is probably where I’d start, but that’s insane travel and who knows if either would even join. Adding the likes of Wichita State, Loyola Chicago, St Louis etc doesn’t do anything for the league IMO.

As usual I was right about adding Gonzaga before anyone else.

It is now confirmed by Big East commissioner herself.

Always bet on huskymagic. Never fails UCONN or the boneyard.

 

[The Shot]

Always bet on huskymagic. Never fails UCONN or the boneyard.

 

[Huskymagic]

Gonzaga is in the strategic interest of the Big East. Only strengthens the league and increases money, revenue, competition, and prestige of the league.

@freescooter don’t worry with the addition of the Zags, the Big East will have three national powers with UCONN, Villanova, and Zaga. The rest of the league is like every other power conference league.

Kansas and Notre Dame are next targets.

#GonzagaToBigEast
#DaggerTreyTy

 

[dennismenace]

True but it’s become an urban legend
Actually, Rutgers for sure and possibly Nova who was locked into big the big 5.
rejected bids. Not everyone believed Gavitt’s dream would be successful.
Of course after the fact it’s success becomes a no brainer.
Success has a million fathers and failure is an orphan.
I think the rise of cable and ESPN coincided with its formation and contributed to its success.
Remember all these schools were Indy’s in a loss affiliation called the ECAC. The Yankees Conference was long gone.

Great insight looking back on the impact of ESPN. Who can forget from those days the 24 hour coverage of EVERY NCAA tournament game including replays. Then regional coverage of Big Mondays
etc. The advent of the Big East with ESPN turned the cold dark winter nights into hotbed of college
basketball.

 

[imno1]

St. Bonaventure is the only team worth considering … the Bonnies deserve a shot simply by the fact that they were the only team I saw come in and kick Calhoun’s ass. If you can do that then you’ve earned my vote.

You or your kid must be one of the 12 students attending ST B. Coach Schmidt does a great job I don't see any upside in adding that school.

 

[Lynyrd]

You or your kid must be one of the 12 students attending ST B. Coach Schmidt does a great job I don't see any upside in adding that school.

I was saying it somewhat tongue in cheek but it makes about as much sense as the other ridiculous suggestions … do find it funny though that many are willing to put Gonzaga through the same travel nonsense we complained about for years while in the American and think it not an issue.

 

[MJ1]

I was saying it somewhat tongue in cheek but it makes about as much sense as the other ridiculous suggestions … do find it funny though that many are willing to put Gonzaga through the same travel nonsense we complained about for years while in the American and think it not an issue.

The difference is Gonzaga will make 2/3 times more money to join the Big East to offset the travel cost. UConn’s payout from the AAC did not compensate enough to offset the cost of travel, and no real rivals did not help.

 

[McLovin]

I don't know the answer to this: does Gonzaga fly to their conference games for non revenue sports? Most of their opponents are around 1000 miles away from them.

This. The west is massive and Spokane is still the middle of no where.

 

[Lynyrd]

The difference is Gonzaga will make 2/3 times more money to join the Big East to offset the travel cost. UConn’s payout from the AAC did not compensate enough to offset the cost of travel, and no real rivals did not help.

Uh okay

 

[UC1995]

That was without additions. Cincinnati is seriously threatening to win a national championship. Things may break in such a way that the B12 survives as a power conference.

Losing teams like Texas and Oklahoma seriously cuts down on eyeballs when it comes to BIG 12 games on television. Over time the memories of these schools will fade into a mediocre UCF and Houston team. Cincy might be the only one to come out of this as long as Fickell stays around (which he may now). Cincy is a nice story but not someone you hang your conference hopes on.

Money is going to drop for the BIG 12 to below 12 million. Depends on how much they need content.
Money is going to really drop for the AAC. Talking below 5 million no way they keep paying what is left (football schools are gone) and any team they bring in for the short and long term won't bring anything to the table. They are not going to pay for possible growth.

 

[HooperScooper]

The men's and women's basketball teams at Gonzaga take charter flights. So no issue there. But I'm guessing the non-revenue sports don't, so as you mentioned that would be an issue.

How Gonzaga travels: Behind-the-scenes look at how the Bulldogs take to the sky

Most college basketball teams fly to games. Commercially. In the same planes we all do. But one of the perks of playing for one of the nation’s elite college basketball programs is traveling on privately chartered jets. That rarefied company includes Gonzaga.

www.spokesman.com

 

[CallMeBruce]

Except you're ignoring tier 3 rights. The Big 12 doesn't own them. So that's an additional payout for Kansas. There is no feasible way (short of the Big 12 dissolving) for Kansas to end up in the Big East.

Big 12 sold tier 3 rights in package to ESPN for streaming on plus

 

[BapeKidd88]

I was blistered on here for advocating UConn to the Big East long before it happened. I was crazy and stupid for discussing what was impossible. I made the same points about the Big East TV contract bring greater than 20% of the American TV deal, and UConn would be better off financially taking the top Basketball conference TV deal and generating football revenue as an independent.

It’s the same model here.

UConn was a different story.

Zissou "advocated" for a UConn program that just had 3 straight losing seasons in the AAC.

That's a different scenario than an in-tact Kansas, who is not far removed from a Final Four, and who just saw their conference mate (Baylor) with the National Championship in a blowout over the other team you're pimping, Gonzaga.

The Big 12 is also not "a top 4 conference like the NBE." (The Big 12 is the Top 1.)

Kansas is a founding member of the Big 12 Conference (one of the Original Big 8). Why would they leave the Conference they founded and their rivals at KSU, Baylor, OSU, ISU, etc, to be an outlier in a far-flung NBE.

The NBE has only been around for 8 years, and barely has a lengthy history with the 10 founders. Why would Kansas see any stability in a fledgling league?
Big East Conference - Wikipedia

Perhaps the OBE would've had more lure with Notre Dame, Syracuse, Pittsburgh, Louisville, but that ship has sailed.
Big East Conference (1979–2013) - Wikipedia
(This is about the former league that played from 1979 to 2013. For its successor football-playing league, see American Athletic Conference. For the current league of the same name, see Big East Conference.)

 

[Zissou]

UConn was a different story.

Zissou "advocated" for a UConn program that just had 3 straight losing seasons in the AAC.

That's a different scenario than an in-tact Kansas, who is not far removed from a Final Four, and who just saw their conference mate (Baylor) with the National Championship in a blowout over the other team you're pimping, Gonzaga.

The Big 12 is also not "a top 4 conference like the NBE." (The Big 12 is the Top 1.)

Kansas is a founding member of the Big 12 Conference (one of the Original Big 8). Why would they leave the Conference they founded and their rivals at KSU, Baylor, OSU, ISU, etc, to be an outlier in a far-flung NBE.

The NBE has only been around for 8 years, and barely has a lengthy history with the 10 founders. Why would Kansas see any stability in a fledgling league?
Big East Conference - Wikipedia

Perhaps the OBE would've had more lure with Notre Dame, Syracuse, Pittsburgh, Louisville, but that ship has sailed.
Big East Conference (1979–2013) - Wikipedia
(This is about the former league that played from 1979 to 2013. For its successor football-playing league, see American Athletic Conference. For the current league of the same name, see Big East Conference.)

Why, why, why? The answer is still money and a stable path forward to a basketball-first athletic dept.

Founding members of the Big 8 - only Kansas remains.

Final members of the Big 8 that founded the Big 12, only four remain, Kansas, Kansas State, Iowa State, and Oklahoma State. “Although the Big 12 was essentially the Big Eight plus the four Texas schools, the Big 12 regards itself as a separate conference and does not claim the Big Eight's history as its own.” The higher football profile schools were poached - Missouri, Oklahoma, Colorado, and Nebraska.

Of the four Texas schools that joined the Big 8 schools to form the Big 12 in the late 1990s (17 years after the start of the Big East), the 2 highest profile programs were poached by the SEC - A&M and Texas.

There is certainly a perspective that Kansas has been “left behind”, and their next TV deal will show that. It does remain a solid basketball conference, albeit in less attractive markets than the Big East.

Nova joined the Big East in 1980, year 2 of the conference. Of the original first 8 Big East lineup, we today have Georgetown, St Johns, Providence, Seton Hall, UConn, and Nova. Only BC and Cuse are gone from the first 8. 6 of the first 8 are intact in the Big East today.

(For those keeping score on religious affiliation, there were 2 schools in the original founding members that were not Catholic, and there are 2 schools in the conference today that are not Catholic. Also, there was one public school in the founding members, and the same one public member in the current membership).

The new Big 12 has twice as many former C-USA programs than the Big East. Kansas has good reason to feel it is in a diluted Big 12.

Since the CR with the American - Big East split, zero teams have left the Big East.

I think you were touting the founding member angle in the perspective of stability and tradition. The Big East has as much claim to its origins as any conference, and more so than the Big 12

 

[Zissou]

I like the Big Ten - Big East (plus Kansas) scenario more…

But in the Big East expansion with Kansas plus schools that follow scenario:

East 8: UConn, Providence, St Johns, Seton Hall, Nova, Georgetown, Temple, Cincy.

West 8: Marquette, DePaul, X, Butler, Creighton, Kansas, Kansas State, Iowa State.

That’s a very reasonable footprint for Kansas, and also for the rest of the conference.

Two games in region and one game across region in the annual schedule.

Adding Kansas is enough of an incentive to expand and add the other programs (and give up the full double round robin schedule). Without Kansas, expansion is dilution, so just stand pat.

 

[Zissou]

Big 12 basketball is Kansas. Baylor had a great year and went it’s first Final Four in over 70 years and earned its title, but Kansas has dominated the Big 12 conference like no other team in modern history.

Kansas has won 19 of the 30 conference titles in the entire history of the Big 12. Even Kentucky in the bottom heavy SEC can’t match that record over that time period.

I’d expect Creighton, X, and Marquette to be more competitive at the top of the Big East West with Kansas over the next 10 years than the rest of the Big 12 with Kansas over the last 10 years. And that’s only in the West. Kansas would be just another blue blood among peers when it came East!

 

[Big East Fa]

The Big 12 distributed $345 million to its 10 members this year ($34.5 million apiece), down from the previous year because of the pandemic. Most of that revenue comes from the Big 12′s TV deals, including ESPN & FOX.

 

[freescooter]

Big 12 basketball is Kansas. Baylor had a great year and went it’s first Final Four in over 70 years and earned its title, but Kansas has dominated the Big 12 conference like no other team in modern history.

Kansas has won 19 of the 30 conference titles in the entire history of the Big 12. Even Kentucky in the bottom heavy SEC can’t match that record over that time period.

I’d expect Creighton, X, and Marquette to be more competitive at the top of the Big East West with Kansas over the next 10 years than the rest of the Big 12 with Kansas over the last 10 years. And that’s only in the West. Kansas would be just another blue blood among peers when it came East!

Almost as good as Villanova in the NEWBIE. Texas Tech was runner up in 2019. Baylor won last year. Kansas is a power. Ok State is generally solid. The NWEBIE is on inch deep. The true power conferences are multiple teams deep. Would it be good for the NOOB to get Gonzaga? Sure. It would bring a marquee program. But it would present a huge logistical nightmare and make a farce of everything the NOOB claims it represents. The second point I know Is out of fashion, but the first is crazy problem.

 

[Zissou]

Almost as good as Villanova in the NEWBIE. Texas Tech was runner up in 2019. Baylor won last year. Kansas is a power. Ok State is generally solid. The NWEBIE is on inch deep. The true power conferences are multiple teams deep. Would it be good for the NOOB to get Gonzaga? Sure. It would bring a marquee program. But it would present a huge logistical nightmare and make a farce of everything the NOOB claims it represents. The second point I know Is out of fashion, but the first is crazy problem.

The Big 12 has one school with multiple modern day (since ‘80) titles. Kansas has 2. In the Big East UConn has 4 and Nova has 3.

They are both good basketball conferences. Both top 4.

Texas Tech? Who finished runner up in the American League last year?

 

[freescooter]

The B12 has multiple nationally competitive teams. It is far deeper than the NOOB. It just is. Right now the NOOB has 1, Villanova. UConn hasn’t been relevant on the national scene since 2014. If it doesn’t make a deep run in the next year or 2 it very likely becomes Indiana. Remember when Indiana was good? In the NEWBIE there is Villanova, maybe UConn and a bunch of interchangeable parts. But here’s the thing. If one of those parts gets hot, the coach will be on a different sideline the next season Unless he is damaged goods. Even then he might be.

Look, in my view, and it used to be the view of most UConn fans, getting to the NCAA tournament isn’t success. It is the minimum expected. As a Villanova fan you really ought to understand that.
Seton Hall, Providence, those other jokers, they don’t view it that way. In the late 1990s after going to the Elite 8 in 1990, 95 and 98 there was a movement to oust Jim Calhoun. After the 2006 disaster there was a smaller But similar movement because he “might be past his prime.” If Seton Hall did that they’d rename the school. That applies to all the rest, too. Well, except DePaul. They consider getting to .500 a success.

 

[Get a Job]

I hate to say it, but @freescooter is practically inarguably right that the Big 12 is far deeper than the Big East. They'll probably have years when 10 teams make the tourney.

Everything else he posts is dead-horse-beating drivel.

 

[shizzle787]

I hate to say it, but @freescooter is practically inarguably right that the Big 12 is far deeper than the Big East. They'll probably have years when 10 teams make the tourney.

Everything else he posts is dead-horse-beating drivel.

There is no way they will ever get 10. With a likely 20 game schedule, they will probably get around 7 max.