BCU and Rutroh - a study of ineptitude

[hardcorehusky]

Do we all realize that Holy Cross and Yale are now ahead of BC basketball!!

 

[dwalks93]

Syracuse will be BC 's annual football rival game, imo. In order to have a football rivalry, both school's and its fanbases have to recognize it as such ( Uconn knows this from Central Florida's position re. Diaco's quest to make Central Florida, Uconn's football rival.). BC voted for Uconn's admittance to the Big East, when Uconn made its quest to join. BC also voted " yes " for Uconn's quest to join Hockey East. BC does not want Uconn in the ACC, but if Commish Swofford and the other ACC school Presidents wanted Uconn in the ACC, they could have acted on it at any time, and BC could not have stopped it on their own. That said, BC, under their new AD Bates, did agree to play Uconn in football again ( and against the wishes of Uconn's Jim Calhoun, and quite a few BC older alums ). The vast majority of younger students at BC now come from outside of N.E however., so for most of them, putting Uconn football back on BC's schedule draws no more than a shrug from them at seeing Bates add Uconn to its football schedule for a game every few years or so.

Check your 2016 ACC football calendar...BC's "rivalry" game next year is Wake Forest, it is not Syracuse. Syracuse's rivalry game is Pittsburgh. This is what the lack of regional rivalries has done to BC. The ACC has put BC out to pasture with the other program which is struggling. The only rivalry and commonality between BC and WF is a football game no one wants to watch.

Perhaps I will be proven wrong but the rowdiest game next year on the BC calendar will be the UConn game. If Rutgers came to BC the environment would not be that exciting or contentious. BC may not want to acknowledge UConn's relevance but the rest of the college sports world does...

BTW using ND as an example of how to manage competition is a de facto losing argument. There is a reason ND is 0-4 in BCS bowl with some of the worst blow outs in BCS history. If a program is going to act arrogantly then it better back it up in big games. Ducking competition does not mean you are a better program.

BC fans can down play the UConn game all they want but it is a significant game for both programs...UConn is just honest enough to admit it. Denial seems to be a way of life recently at BC.

 

[uconndogs]

BC, Syracuse, Rutgers and UCONN should have never separated. College athletics is largely a regional following. ND in football, probably UCONN in hoops command national attention, but none of BC, Cuse, Rutty or UCONN command any kind on meaningful national attention in football. Were reasonable business people running those athletic departments they would have done all they could to keep those programs together. Gene DeFelippo was about as far away from a reasonable business person as one could possibly get and I suspect Fr. Leahy holds little interest in seeing high level athletic success given what he has put up with from his AD.

BC has a pay check and I guess fans can be happy with that. The ones that show up for games anyway. When you start counting men's hoop attendance by the hundreds you have no small problem on your hands. Adazio sh!ts the bed next season and BC is in a world of hurt. UCONN bring 10k fans to Alumni will be no small thing. God knows we used to fill Conte.

 

[DarthGrumpy]

Not to split hairs, but to clarify my remarks above, I did not state that " BC is is at its lowest point " ever ". ( I said " in awhile ). I was in the stands in '78 for example when BC under Coach Ed Cheblek was winless at 0-11 in football that season, and was shut out that season by Umass 27-0. Later that season the BB was found losing to Holy Cross, Stonehill and the like. Things do go in cycles however. BC has won regular season Atlantic Division football and basketball titles since joining the ACC, and they have been in the cellar in both basketball and football too. I know some in the media think that BC will not bounce back from their current last place positions in ACC Basketball and football, but many of them tend to be unfamiliar with the history of BC football and Basketball that since WW2 has had both its ups and its downs, but BC has rarely gone more than a few years without bouncing back again. The suggesion we read in some quarters that BC will never become competitive again in either football of basketball could prove prophetic.. who knows,... but it would have to overcome 60 years of historical data from the past that shows otherwise for this to become true in the future.

I agree that sport programs are cyclical in nature. The concern for BC in my opinion is not just the quality, or the lack of such, on the field/court; but, the fact that BC seems more interested in cashing those ACC checks and not investing in any of their sport programs - coaching or facilities. On the facilities front, BC is well behind most of the ACC and UConn and that is going to keep hurting the Eagles going forward. The recent 'master plan' announcement is well and good; but, 1) they have not identified where the money is coming from for those projects, especially the indoor football facility, which is a must for northern football programs today, and 2) have not even tried to gain approval from Boston and Newton for these projects, which is a process that is a nightmare in the best of circumstances. Until BC starts investing in their sport programs beyond hockey, they are going to be stuck in the basement of the ACC for a while.

 

[DarthGrumpy]

BC, Syracuse, Rutgers and UCONN should have never separated. College athletics is largely a regional following. ND in football, probably UCONN in hoops command national attention, but none of BC, Cuse, Rutty or UCONN command any kind on meaningful national attention in football. Were reasonable business people running those athletic departments they would have done all they could to keep those programs together. Gene DeFelippo was about as far away from a reasonable business person as one could possibly get and I suspect Fr. Leahy holds little interest in seeing high level athletic success given what he has put up with from his AD.

BC has a pay check and I guess fans can be happy with that. The ones that show up for games anyway. When you start counting men's hoop attendance by the hundreds you have no small problem on your hands. Adazio sh!ts the bed next season and BC is in a world of hurt. UCONN bring 10k fans to Alumni will be no small thing. God knows we used to fill Conte.

Completely agree and the reason is obvious. While the media can 'create' a rivalry, say UConn v. Duke in hoops in the late '90's and early 00's, college rivalries are based on the respectively student bodies. Roughly 80% of college student go to a college (at least in the East) within a 4 hour (250 miles) car ride from home. In college, every student wants bragging rights over their old friends from high school. So, Mr. Smith from Shelton CT who goes to UConn wants to beat the pants off of his former classmates who went to BC, Syracuse, Rutgers, etc. especially when he takes a road trip to visit those friends for a football or basketball game. That is the heart of college sports.

 

[DarthGrumpy]

Do we all realize that Holy Cross and Yale are now ahead of BC basketball!!

Holy Cross has now won the same number of NCAA tournament games in the last 10 years (after 2006) as BC has won - 1.

 

[Yawkey Way]

. BC may not want to acknowledge UConn's relevance but the rest of the college sports world does...

.[/QUOTE]

I'm not so sure about this. I'm not convinced that either the BC football program, nor the Uconn football program has much relevance to " the rest of the college sports world ", thats my take of the national pulse outside of New England anyway regarding the perception of both N.E. football programs. Both are an afterthought, regrettably, imo. I don't think I'm in denial on this. I think I'm just being realistic here. If Uconn football was considered " relevant to the rest of the college sports world", my view is that Uconn would have been in a P5 Conference by now. Rightly or wrongly, my perception is that the " rest of the college sports world " considers Uconn almost exclusively a " Basketball School ", where its Basketball programs.... combined.... are traditionally now considered the best in college sports most seasons. If College Basketball drove the P5 expansion however, Uconn would have been in... and most likely even before BC got to the ACC. But as we know, its Football more than Basketball that is the driving engine on these things.

 

[Yawkey Way]

Holy Cross has now won the same number of NCAA tournament games in the last 10 years (after 2006) as BC has won - 1.

Holy Cross started playing football in 1937... 78 years ago. One thing we can safely say with certainty is that Holy Cross has never... and will never.... win a Major College Football Bowl Game. That said, congrats to Holy Cross in their basketball tourney win.

 

[buddy]

Given a chance, UConn would have been much more successful in football than they have been. Unfortunate circumstances drove the program backwards, but it is on the way up now. UConn and BC are sort of passing each other on an escalator now with UConn going up and BC going down. UConn would have been in the P5 Conference if BC did not intentionally block them on the first ACC attempt. So saying that UConn would have been in a P5 Conference if they were any good in football is bogus. UConn was blackballed when the opportunity presented by BC. No arguing that for the one millionth time here.

 

[Sea Goat]

Syracuse will be BC 's annual football rival game, imo. In order to have a football rivalry, both school's and its fanbases have to recognize it as such ( Uconn knows this from Central Florida's position re. Diaco's quest to make Central Florida, Uconn's football rival.). BC voted for Uconn's admittance to the Big East, when Uconn made its quest to join. BC also voted " yes " for Uconn's quest to join Hockey East. BC does not want Uconn in the ACC, but if Commish Swofford and the other ACC school Presidents wanted Uconn in the ACC, they could have acted on it at any time, and BC could not have stopped it on their own. That said, BC, under their new AD Bates, did agree to play Uconn in football again ( and against the wishes of Uconn's Jim Calhoun, and quite a few BC older alums ). The vast majority of younger students at BC now come from outside of N.E however., so for most of them, putting Uconn football back on BC's schedule draws no more than a shrug from them at seeing Bates add Uconn to its football schedule for a game every few years or so.

We were throwing you a bone you stooge. Stick your alleged "rivalry" with Syracuse up your back stairs you self absorbed . BC can continue to to devolve into irrelevancy.

 

[Yawkey Way]

Things will get worse at BC before they get any better.

' Not sure 2017-2018 could be much worse than 2015-2016. That said, if BC football is going to get even worse next season according to many here who seem to believe they know the BC football program pretty well, then Uconn should handle BC in football pretty easily up at Alumni this November. Thats because I'm reading on here that expectations for the Uconn football team next year is that apparently the Uconn football team will be much better than this year... and so the sentiment I'm getting from reading things here is that BC probably should not have scheduled this game, as from all indications, the Uconn football team will embarrass BC in their place this November. Do I have the prevailing sentiments from most Uconn football fans on here accurately on this ? Just asking, as from my readings on here, it appears BC football will " get worse before they get better ".

 

[Yawkey Way]

. UConn would have been in the P5 Conference if BC did not intentionally block them on the first ACC attempt. .

There appears to be some genuine confliction on this. For example, when BC was contemplating leaving the Big East for the ACC, I distinctly remember reading on the Uconn football boards that if BC goes to the ACC.. " BC will never have any influence in the ACC as Tobacco Road runs that league, and will make its decisions on all things and turn a deaf ear to any of BC's concerns ". However, once BC took the invite to the ACC, the prevailing thought on the Uconn boards seemed to be that BC had such enormous political leverage within the ACC that it could single handedly keep Uconn out of the ACC by prevailing upon the other ACC schools to act upon BC's bidding. Did BC have the enormous political leverage among the other long standing ACC schools to keep Uconn out of the ACC ? No. I don't think so. They had one vote, no more, no less. Besides, it is my assessment that if the Schools in the ACC... and its Commissioner... wanted Uconn in the ACC, Uconn would be in the ACC, and BC could not stop the other schools. That said, if some on here want to stay with the narrative we have heard on here before, that BC has such enormous political leverage that they can single handedly keep Uconn out of he ACC, they are entitled to that narrative. But I would just respectfully disagree that BC has such political muscle in the ACC among Tobacco Road, and the other ACC Schools.

 

[Yawkey Way]

.[/QUOTE]

I suspect Fr. Leahy holds little interest in seeing high level athletic success

.

This is an assessment where the vast majority of both Uconn football fans and BC football fans would come together in mutual agreement, imo. Some insiders at BC tell me that Leahy is scheduled to retire... and within the year.

 

[Yawkey Way]

Check your 2016 ACC football calendar...BC's "rivalry" game next year is Wake Forest, it is not Syracuse. Syracuse's rivalry game is Pittsburgh. This is what the lack of .

I suppose we would need to define " rivalry game ". I'm not sure we are both utilizing the same definition. Perhaps thats the confusion with this. If you define the" rivalry game" as the game played last, then yes Wake Forest would seem to fit your definition of BC's " rivalry annual game ". However, my definition of a " rivalry game " uses the more conventional definition of a " rivalry game ", ie a game in which a) both play each other each and every season b) both fan bases equally accept the other as their annual football " rivalry game " c) the 2 teams have played each other for years and years d) both compete for the same level of football recruits a lot on the recruiting trail e) both football programs are currently in the same division in their league, and look to be so, long into the future. With this definition, it would appear that Syracuse and BC will become football rivals once again. Wake Forest is not BC's " rivalry game " ( and BC not Wake's " rivalry game ") despite the fact that its the last game of the 2 schools for the 2016 season. USC and ND have " rivalry games ", but neither school has the other as its scheduled last game of the season each year.

 

[Adios]

Holy Cross started playing football in 1937... 78 years ago. One thing we can safely say with certainty is that Holy Cross has never... and will never.... win a Major College Football Bowl Game. That said, congrats to Holy Cross in their basketball tourney win.

Holy Cross started playing football in 1891. You should start writing BC-themed fiction novels. Novels where they win championships in sports other than hockey. Or even are relevant in sports other than hockey. Whichever suits your readers.

 

[Yawkey Way]

BC, Syracuse, Rutgers and UCONN should have never separated. College athletics is largely a regional following. .

I'm a bit older than you. There were hopes that Pitt and Penn State could have worked out their differences in the 60's, 70's... and with that, perhaps a good football eastern Conference could have possibly kept the hope alive of a regional coordination that would make some geographical sense at least. But alas, it was not to be. Now the league realignments ... except for the SEC... really don't seem to make much geographical sense whatsoever, imo.

 

[FDNY99]

' Not sure 2017-2018 could be much worse than 2015-2016. That said, if BC football is going to get even worse next season according to many here who seem to believe they know the BC football program pretty well, then Uconn should handle BC in football pretty easily up at Alumni this November. Thats because I'm reading on here that expectations for the Uconn football team next year is that apparently the Uconn football team will be much better than this year... and so the sentiment I'm getting from reading things here is that BC probably should not have scheduled this game, as from all indications, the Uconn football team will embarrass BC in their place this November. Do I have the prevailing sentiments from most Uconn football fans on here accurately on this ? Just asking, as from my readings on here, it appears BC football will " get worse before they get better ".

I was referring to BC basketball. But if you want to believe your boy Gene D's quote in the Globe article that he thought Donahue was 1 season away from turning the program round go ahead. That program has gone from competitive to the absolute worst P-5/G-5 program in the country and it doesn't look like things will change anytime soon.

 

[Ldandy]

This thread is amazing. It might be true that BC alone can't keep UCONN out of The ACC, but at best they weren't Pro Husky, and at worst have actively politiced against their inclusion at every opportunity.

This sentiment was immortalized in black and white by BC's leadership in a major media publication. The sad thing is that BC needs regional opponents to spur fan interest more than most. They will never be a national program regardless of if they turn things around or not. IF BC believes that they are strong brand, then there is literally no downside to being in a league with UCONN.

 

[Kgun7]

I love it how WVU has clamored for a regional rival and travel partner ever since joining the BIG 12 ... while BCU has actively fought against the same. It's pretty obvious which program needs it more!!

 

[06029]

I love it how WVU has clamored for a regional rival and travel partner ever since joining the BIG 12 ... while BCU has actively fought against the same. It's pretty obvious which program needs it more!!

Apples and Oranges. WVU closest conference game is 1500 miles away. And the closest major airport to Morgantown is almost 100 miles away. WVU is in a world of hurt in terms of travel. Think about it, adding Uconn cuts their travel distance for at least 1 game by 2/3.

 

[buddy]

There appears to be some genuine confliction on this. For example, when BC was contemplating leaving the Big East for the ACC, I distinctly remember reading on the Uconn football boards that if BC goes to the ACC.. " BC will never have any influence in the ACC as Tobacco Road runs that league, and will make its decisions on all things and turn a deaf ear to any of BC's concerns ". However, once BC took the invite to the ACC, the prevailing thought on the Uconn boards seemed to be that BC had such enormous political leverage within the ACC that it could single handedly keep Uconn out of the ACC by prevailing upon the other ACC schools to act upon BC's bidding. Did BC have the enormous political leverage among the other long standing ACC schools to keep Uconn out of the ACC ? No. I don't think so. They had one vote, no more, no less. Besides, it is my assessment that if the Schools in the ACC... and its Commissioner... wanted Uconn in the ACC, Uconn would be in the ACC, and BC could not stop the other schools. That said, if some on here want to stay with the narrative we have heard on here before, that BC has such enormous political leverage that they can single handedly keep Uconn out of he ACC, they are entitled to that narrative. But I would just respectfully disagree that BC has such political muscle in the ACC among Tobacco Road, and the other ACC Schools.

Pitt was available at that time and they took Pitt because BC cried that they didn't want UConn. It was initially Cuse and UConn to the ACC, but BC's objections got them Pitt.

 

[DarthGrumpy]

Pitt was available at that time and they took Pitt because BC cried that they didn't want UConn. It was initially Cuse and UConn to the ACC, but BC's objections got them Pitt.

And the ACC would have locked-up Boston (as much as pro-sports Boston can be locked-up by a college sports) with BC and UConn and the combination of Syracuse, ND & UConn would have made NYC and ACC town with the B1G looking in the window with Rutgers. Instead, BC has become almost irrelevant in its home market (Boston) and NYC is now a two conference race between the B1G and the ACC and could become a 3 conference race should the XII expand and take UConn. All because BC was afraid that it was no longer going to new New England's team, whatever the heck that is.

 

[Noworriesbro]

Pitt was available at that time and they took Pitt because BC cried that they didn't want UConn. It was initially Cuse and UConn to the ACC, but BC's objections got them Pitt.

from what i was told this is correct, it was uconn and cuse but bc went nuts and the fsu/clemson football schools were heavily in favor of pitt also

 

[Yawkey Way]

Pitt was available at that time and they took Pitt because BC cried that they didn't want UConn. It was initially Cuse and UConn to the ACC, but BC's objections got them Pitt.

Thats actually untrue. In the summer of 2003, officials at Miami and BC met together ind Miami school officials informed BC ( 1st school in the then BE to be informed ) of Miami's intentions of leaving the BE for the ACC in 2004. BC tried, unsuccessfully to persuade Miami to stay. But Miami, long upset with the basketball centric leadership of Mike Tranghese out of Providence, by 2003 had had enough and told BC this. BC came backfrom that meeting and told Syracuse that if Miami bolted for the ACC, BC would consider the loss of Miami as a blow to the BE that would soon start to dominos to fall that would quickly lead to the collapse of the BE football league. BC decided then and there to seek out the ACC on behalf of themselves as well.In late 2003, BC, Miami, Syracuse officials met with Swofford, and told Swofford the 3 were prepared as a group to leave for the ACC. However, in Dec. 2003, Boeheim at Syracuse got wind of this, and told the School that he did not support the school leaving the BE for the ACC. Syracuse then became conflicted between the football faction at Syracuse that wanted to leave the BE, and the Basketball faction there that wanted to see Syracuse stay in the BE. In the vacumn of indecisiveness from Syracuse, Virginia Tech then stepped into the fray to supplant Syracuse as a school to go with Miami, and BC. Then the Virginia state legislature stepped in and squelched VT ( temporarily ) on behalf of their state flagship school, Univ. Vurginia. Note, that in all this timeline, Pitt was a bystander, and not really involved in serious negotiations at all. If they were, Pitt would more than likely got into the ACC before BC got the invite. Pitt was actually a Plaintiff in the BE orchestrated lawsuit against the ACC's Swofford, Miami, BC. Perhaps you were not aware that Pitt was an initial Plaintiff in the ACC lawsuit. ( factually verifiable, by the way ). So no, BC did not replace Pitt in the intended move of BE schools to the ACC. This is simply untrue. As for the consideration of Uconn to the ACC back in the 2003, 2004 time frame, Uconn's AD Perkins made contact privately with Swofford of the ACC and was informed that Uconn was not on the ACC potential invite list. This overture by Perkins came out in the depositions, and Blumenthal was furious, as he was not infirmed that Uconn has been maki g contact with Swofford to get uconn to the ACC, at the very time Blumenthal was suing the ACC on behalf of Uconn. Perkins later bolted Uconn to take a job 2,000 miles away. There is no love lost between Blumenthal and Perkins to this very day. I know this because Blumenthal told me this directly at a wedding reception in Connecticut in 2010.

 

[CallMeBruce]

Thats actually untrue. In the summer of 2003, officials at Miami and BC met together ind Miami school officials informed BC ( 1st school in the then BE to be informed ) of Miami's intentions of leaving the BE for the ACC in 2004. BC tried, unsuccessfully to persuade Miami to stay. But Miami, long upset with the basketball centric leadership of Mike Tranghese out of Providence, by 2003 had had enough and told BC this. BC came backfrom that meeting and told Syracuse that if Miami bolted for the ACC, BC would consider the loss of Miami as a blow to the BE that would soon start to dominos to fall that would quickly lead to the collapse of the BE football league. BC decided then and there to seek out the ACC on behalf of themselves as well.In late 2003, BC, Miami, Syracuse officials met with Swofford, and told Swofford the 3 were prepared as a group to leave for the ACC. However, in Dec. 2003, Boeheim at Syracuse got wind of this, and told the School that he did not support the school leaving the BE for the ACC. Syracuse then became conflicted between the football faction at Syracuse that wanted to leave the BE, and the Basketball faction there that wanted to see Syracuse stay in the BE. In the vacumn of indecisiveness from Syracuse, Virginia Tech then stepped into the fray to supplant Syracuse as a school to go with Miami, and BC. Then the Virginia state legislature stepped in and squelched VT ( temporarily ) on behalf of their state flagship school, Univ. Vurginia. Note, that in all this timeline, Pitt was a bystander, and not really involved in serious negotiations at all. If they were, Pitt would more than likely got into the ACC before BC got the invite. Pitt was actually a Plaintiff in the BE orchestrated lawsuit against the ACC's Swofford, Miami, BC. Perhaps you were not aware that Pitt was an initial Plaintiff in the ACC lawsuit. ( factually verifiable, by the way ). So no, BC did not replace Pitt in the intended move of BE schools to the ACC. This is simply untrue.

That's not what he said.