Baylor (3) @ Stanford (11) - 12/15/18

[CocoHusky]

A lot of pro scouts there had to see Brown is still in less than optimum physical condition, has mediocre activity level, has problems against double teams, doesn't use her girth effectively in close and rarely shoots from beyond 6 feet. Last year she was dominated in the post by Gulich. Remember, she was the one Geno gave the watch challenge to. Honestly, regardless of the competition she should be getting double figure rebounds even when she's not scoring, every game. She doesn't. What does that tell you?

Tells me everything and the WNBA GM probably nothing. This is shaping up to be Aliana Coates all over again-#2 pick in the draft but a severe liability with the ball in her hands more than 5 feet away from the basket. If I'm a WNBA GM in need of a big I'd take Shepard well before I take Brown or McCowan.

 

[oldude]

Mobile BIGs who can play away from the basket are still a rarity in WBB. We were all spoiled by Stewie. There just aren’t many (any?) players that can do what she does on the court. IMO, the real problems start when you try to play two BIGS at the same time who both want to play in the paint.

 

[JordyG]

Tells me everything and the WNBA GM probably nothing. This is shaping up to be Aliana Coates all over again-#2 pick in the draft but a severe liability with the ball in her hands more than 5 feet away from the basket. If I'm a WNBA GM in need of a big I'd take Shepard well before I take Brown or McCowan.

All day everyday. If Shepard loses 10 more pounds of fat, puts on 15-20 of muscle, works on her footwork and 10-15 footer that could be a 2nd team all star.

 

[CocoHusky]

Speaking of the WNBA draft @nwhoopfan I don't know how to break this to you. I was looking through a couple of mock drafts for the 2019 WNBA. One name that showed up in the 2019 mock was Destiny Slocum. The USA basketball website list her as 21 so I guessing that's correct and she'll turn 22 and be eligible in 2019. Would be a big blow to both Oregon and Oregon State to lose Sabrina and Destiny early to WNBA. Slocum would have 2 years of eligibility remaining.

 

[Shades]

Speaking of the WNBA draft @nwhoopfan I don't know how to break this to you. I was looking through a couple of mock drafts for the 2019 WNBA. One name that showed up in the 2019 mock was Destiny Slocum. The USA basketball website list her as 21 so I guessing that's correct and she'll turn 22 and be eligible in 2019. Would be a big blow to both Oregon and Oregon State to lose Sabrina and Destiny early to WNBA. Slocum would have 2 years of eligibility remaining.

She’s not that great that she should pass up getting a degree. Doubt she’s very close to that unless she’s worked as hard as Anriel Howard.

 

[CocoHusky]

She’s not that great that she should pass up getting a degree. Doubt she’s very close to that unless she’s worked as hard as Anriel Howard.

We've had a similar discussion regarding other players before. She "should" do whatever her heart desires. Some student/athletes don't like the student part of the equation and want to get it over as soon as possible. The mock draft I saw had her being picked at the end of the second round a few spots behind Anriel Howard. The WNBA is a spring summer endeavor which leaves plenty of time to complete a degree if that is what is desired.

 

[DeeHusky]

Been reading the posts related to the draft this year, Napheesa will be the best player in the draft. The game against Notre Dame proved that. She was relentless and made every shot in tough moments. She also grabbed every rebound. Had she not sat the almost the whole fourth quarter, she probably would’ve have more points and definitely more rebounds.

 

[SECbbfan24]

When was the last time Kalani Brown was held to 5 points?

I gotta say, her play thus far this year has been lackluster at best.

She hasn't been the same player this year, not sure why. Cox isn't playing to her potential as well, I'm sure her illness is having an impact. Its not easy I'm sure.

I think Mulkey moving forward needs to find an offense than is not just lob it up to the bigs. Not that you shouldn't ever do it but its literally the same thing every time down the floor. The offense isn't moving, kids aren't cutting or screening. Baylor has some great players, the freshmen in particular offer a lot. The bigs are very athletic as well. They need to start using the ball screens more. The offense is predictable and isn't a recipe to work consistently vs top teams. Not that Baylor is a bad team, they are very good but have some significant flaws that need to be addressed.

Losing Morris was a major blow. She was a true PG, she shoots the 3 ball and commanded the offense much better.

Maybe this game can be a wake up call but some of the same issues we saw today are the same ones that have plagued Baylor in the post season over the years, and it still hasn't been addressed.

 

[JordyG]

She hasn't been the same player this year, not sure why. Cox isn't playing to her potential as well, I'm sure her illness is having an impact. Its not easy I'm sure.

I think Mulkey moving forward needs to find an offense than is not just lob it up to the bigs. Not that you shouldn't ever do it but its literally the same thing every time down the floor. The offense isn't moving, kids aren't cutting or screening. Baylor has some great players, the freshmen in particular offer a lot. The bigs are very athletic as well. They need to start using the ball screens more. The offense is predictable and isn't a recipe to work consistently vs top teams. Not that Baylor is a bad team, they are very good but have some significant flaws that need to be addressed.

Losing Morris was a major blow. She was a true PG, she shoots the 3 ball and commanded the offense much better.

Maybe this game can be a wake up call but some of the same issues we saw today are the same ones that have plagued Baylor in the post season over the years, and it still hasn't been addressed.

Frankly Kim has been slacking with her offense. She has been running the same dump it into the bigs offense since Griner. Spread the floor, keep them honest with a few outside shots, get it inside. She's lost since Griner for basically two reasons.

1) The defense effectively collapsed inside with 1 or 2 helpers and the outside shooters went cold. Since they were mostly shooters and not able to create off the dribble, and the hi/lo couldn't work with the log jam inside, they lost.

2) The big was effectively neutralized by the opposing big and the team could concentrate on the perimeter. Otherwise, see above.

From what I've seen she has never run an offense using high post screens, pick and roll. She's never run a guard oriented offense. She's never run an offense using any variation off a Princeton offense. She's never run an isolation offense using clear outs. Next year then she's going to have go out of her comfort zone and use one of these. I hope she bites the bullet and uses an option offense. This kind of offense wins, but not immediately. The others may get her to an FF (Maybe. Probably just an E8) but they don't win championships. We'll see.

 

[CocoHusky]

Been reading the posts related to the draft this year, Napheesa will be the best player in the draft. The game against Notre Dame proved that. She was relentless and made every shot in tough moments. She also grabbed every rebound. Had she not sat the almost the whole fourth quarter, she probably would’ve have more points and definitely more rebounds.

Love Napheesa's game. Sitting in the ND though should be part of evaluating her game because that pine time was self inflicted by an aspect of her game (the cheap foul) which has plagued her since her Freshman year. She also lacks ideal size to be an WNBA PF and might struggle to defend SF on the perimeter at the next level. If I'm a WNBA GM in need of a PF I would have a hard time taking Napheesa over Kristine Anigwe because of those extra 3 inches. Likewise if I'm a WNBA GM in need of a small forward I would have a hard time taking Napheesa over KLS because KLS has an elite skill (shooting) that will transfer very well to the WNBA.

 

[UcMiami]

Not sure we should read too much into this one road game at Stanford, especially when Tara had so much time to prepare her team. Tara is a very good tactician and has done the same kind of thing to Uconn and other strong teams especially on her home court.

I was surprised by the result, but not shocked. Baylor has always had an Achilles heal with their perimeter play.

As for the draft - I expect McCowan will go #1 - I think she is better than Brown and has had better coaching.
I think Lou will go early and Napheesa will follow - Napheesa needs more development of her range - probably 2-3 or 3-4

 

[nwhoopfan]

Huh. I thought she might go a year early because of transferring and sitting out a year. Leaving with 2 years of eligibility left? Never even considered the possibility. I guess we'll have to wait and see.

 

[IrishTiger]

We've had a similar discussion regarding other players before. She "should" do whatever her heart desires. Some student/athletes don't like the student part of the equation and want to get it over as soon as possible. The mock draft I saw had her being picked at the end of the second round a few spots behind Anriel Howard. The WNBA is a spring summer endeavor which leaves plenty of time to complete a degree if that is what is desired.

She could always take online classes or go back in the off season if she didn’t wanna go play overseas. There are options to finish Your degree even if You go Pro early.

 

[mudcat]

When did she get the extension?

The SEC just seems so down this year: Alabama, Ole Miss, Vandy and Florida are hot humid messes. Missouri and South Carolina have been disappointing so far. Geezus, Arkansas might even finish about .500 this year.

Oh I forgot Georgia: add them to the "disappointing" list along with Mizzou and SC. Texas A&M is also down from last year.

I think Alabama will be better this year, and with a weaker SEC might move up in the standings. And I haven't given up hope that Georgia might right the ship and finish in the top 4. But if not, who really cares....

 

[Sakibomb25]

Tells me everything and the WNBA GM probably nothing. This is shaping up to be Aliana Coates all over again-#2 pick in the draft but a severe liability with the ball in her hands more than 5 feet away from the basket. If I'm a WNBA GM in need of a big I'd take Shepard well before I take Brown or McCowan.

Coaches always think they can teach players the skills that will make them All-Stars... that's why they take a gamble on big kids beacuse you can't teach height. But rarely, it seems, does it work out.

 

[mbr33ct]

Really surprised at all the empty seats. For a top 15 match up the attendance was a mere 3,440.

 

[SCGamecock]

Does BTN or SEC Network provide free streams (to non-subscribers) of games that are broadcast on their network? I get BTN with my cable package, but not SEC. I don't know the answer, but I'm kinda thinking the answer is no. I'm sure Longhorn Network doesn't give stuff away for free.

If you want to be mad at somebody, be mad at ESPN for not picking the game up. They can broadcast any game they want to and are ahead of Pac 12 Network in the pecking order. So is Fox Sports.

Be mad at ESPN for a lot of things, but not this. Because the game was on Stanford’s home court, PAC 12 Network has first rights to it... ESPN could’ve picked it up (and likely would’ve) had they denied it. Same for Baylor, if the game was on their home court, FS1 likely would’ve picked the game up and if they didn’t, then ESPN would’ve picked the rights up... so if there is anybody to blame, blame the conferences for not aligning themselves with a network that can broadcast nationally.

Another example, South Carolina plays Purdue tomorrow AT Purdue.. Big Ten Network has first dibs, but turned it down for whatever reason and even then, I believe BTN is affiliated with FOX, so that game still could’ve ended up on a Fox network... but anyway, ESPN negotiated and picked it up and that game will be on ESPN2.

Closer to home, I believe SNY has some kind of dibs on UConn games, but those few games that are shown on SNY (usually AAC Conference games) are blacked out locally on ESPN but may be shown nationally on either ESPN’s linear OR non-linear network (WatchESPN/E3).

This also explains why you don’t run into these issues of being unable to watch a game with UConn/South Carolina/Louisville etc.. (ACC/SEC) schools.. because through their regional networks, ESPN has first dibs on those games and they’ll always take the big games from the SEC Network, the ACC Network (not linear yet, but ESPN has long had priority to ACC games) or SNY and place them on their national linear networks. ESPN doesn’t have that power over the Pac12 or Big 12 (minus Texas).

 

[UConnCat]

Be mad at ESPN for a lot of things, but not this. Because the game was on Stanford’s home court, PAC 12 Network has first rights to it... ESPN could’ve picked it up (and likely would’ve) had they denied it. Same for Baylor, if the game was on their home court, FS1 likely would’ve picked the game up and if they didn’t, then ESPN would’ve picked the rights up... so if there is anybody to blame, blame the conferences for not aligning themselves with a network that can broadcast nationally.

Another example, South Carolina plays Purdue tomorrow AT Purdue.. Big Ten Network has first dibs, but turned it down for whatever reason and even then, I believe BTN is affiliated with FOX, so that game still could’ve ended up on a Fox network... but anyway, ESPN negotiated and picked it up and that game will be on ESPN2.

Closer to home, I believe SNY has some kind of dibs on UConn games, but those few games that are shown on SNY (usually AAC Conference games) are blacked out locally on ESPN but may be shown nationally on either ESPN’s linear OR non-linear network (WatchESPN/E3).

This also explains why you don’t run into these issues of being unable to watch a game with UConn/South Carolina/Louisville etc.. (ACC/SEC) schools.. because through their regional networks, ESPN has first dibs on those games and they’ll always take the big games from the SEC Network, the ACC Network (not linear yet, but ESPN has long had priority to ACC games) or SNY and place them on their national linear networks. ESPN doesn’t have that power over the Pac12 or Big 12 (minus Texas).

What you've described is not accurate. Nowhere in these conference TV contracts does ESPN or Fox relinquish Tier 1 broadcast rights to a conference network. In fact, it's the exact opposite: the conference networks are left with whatever events ESPN and or Fox choose not to broadcast on one of their platforms.

For the PAC 12, ESPN has Tier 1 rights to women's basketball games. Those games not selected for broadcast on the ESPN platform will then be picked up by the PAC-12 network. In other words, ESPN could have selected the Stanford/Baylor game but chose instead to stick to its normal schedule of broadcasting men's college basketball on Saturday afternoons. If the game were played on Sunday I bet ESPN would have broadcast the game.

The same is true with the Big 10's deal. ESPN owns the Tier 1 rights to women's basketball (and olympic sports). Those events not chosen to appear on the ESPN platform will then be available for the BTN network.

SNY owns Tier 3 rights for UConn games. Tier 1 rights belong to ESPN. After ESPN is done selecting the games it wants to broadcast, CBS Sportsnet (Tier 2 rights) selects the games it wants to broadcast. SNY (ESPN3) gets what is left over.

 

[CocoHusky]

Frankly Kim has been slacking with her offense. She has been running the same dump it into the bigs offense since Griner. Spread the floor, keep them honest with a few outside shots, get it inside. She's lost since Griner for basically two reasons.

1) The defense effectively collapsed inside with 1 or 2 helpers and the outside shooters went cold. Since they were mostly shooters and not able to create off the dribble, and the hi/lo couldn't work with the log jam inside, they lost.
2) The big was effectively neutralized by the opposing big and the team could concentrate on the perimeter. Otherwise, see above.

From what I've seen she has never run an offense using high post screens, pick and roll. She's never run a guard oriented offense. She's never run an offense using any variation off a Princeton offense. She's never run an isolation offense using clear outs. Next year then she's going to have go out of her comfort zone and use one of these. I hope she bites the bullet and uses an option offense. This kind of offense wins, but not immediately. The others may get her to an FF (Maybe. Probably just an E8) but they don't win championships. We'll see.

Went back and watched UCONN Baylor from CDIII's freshmen year I conclude that this might be a skills issues.
It looked like Baylor tried to run some aspects of flex action to free up the wings Wallace and Prince. The problem is that the Baylor post players were so poor at setting the cross, up & down screens it actually was hurting Jones more than it was helping. After a while Jones started waving off the screens and went without it. The other aspect of that offensive is one of the post players must be a threat when you end up with a 2 X 3 configuration with a big and PG at the top. Mompremier and Davis started, Davis took one desperation shot from top of the key. When Brown and Cox came in the game Cox also only took one shot from about the same spot. Cave was actually Baylor's best post in this game. I have not watched Baylor vs Stanford game yet, it pains me greatly that Kalani brown is about to graduate and she has not mastered the skill of setting a good screen yet. ONO is learning she had two offensive fouls called on her setting screens this year so far. Knowing Geno and CDI ONO will have this mastered by Christmas break.

 

[Bama fan]

All day everyday. If Shepard loses 10 more pounds of fat, puts on 15-20 of muscle, works on her footwork and 10-15 footer that could be a 2nd team all star.

Damned with faint praise!

 

[Golden Husky]

Didn't see the game but doubt it could have been any more entertaining than the comments on this thread. JordyG, you're a pithy pleasure.

 

[JordyG]

Didn't see the game but doubt it could have been any more entertaining than the comments on this thread. JordyG, you're a pithy pleasure.

Thanks. But I'm pretty much a prime example of the adage, "A little knowledge is a dangerous thing"

I was at a performance Thursday of my favorite singer Cecile McLorin Salvant at the Jazz Standard and I spoke to her at the bar afterwards. Yeah, jazz musicians are accessible and personable. She asked if I were a musician and I said, "No. But I've tried over the course of my life to become the best listener I can be". It's been the same with BB. I don't play, but I've tried to become the best watcher I can be. My secret is I cheat. I watch some games 4, 5, or 6 times. The ND game maybe 10 times this year. I slo-mo through sets, defensive series, watching body language, breaking down plays etc. I also try to lip read. And yeah, what Geno said was a continuation of the stuff he'd been saying to the ref all game and Arike heard maybe the 5th iteration of it. And yeah, when I say Christyn is a great offensive player, but gave up as many opportunities on defense as points she scored, it's true. She has work to do.

When Coco says Mulkey tried some flex action, tried is the key word. Running the flex is a continuity type offense and isn't as complicated as a Princeton style offense where you're taught the many offensive options off of every position. The flex has your 2 best ball handlers on the perimeter and you set the 3 others pretty much in a line with one under the hoop. The 3 must move and change positions in order to open the lane for cutters. In essence, widening the lane. It also depends on the 3 to set precise and timely screens. It takes practice, precision and commitment, and the 2 up top had better be good outside shooters as well as good ball handlers. If it's done slipshod it means your charges haven't practiced this formation very much. Mulkey decided on this as a resort option once her bigs proved so ineffective against Geno's sagging defense. Also Davis was and remains not a very good shooter. Mulkey lucked out with Smith who seems to be the best shooting forward she's had in 10 years. Something Cox should have been. I still hold out hope for her. The rest of her forwards are brick layers beyond 6-8 feet. Mulkey has some decisions to make next year.

 

[donalddoowop]

Jordy, you say CW gave up as many opportunities on defense as points scored, when Chong did that she went to the bench and did not become a starter again until her senior season. I know who replaced her but I always wondered what would have happened to her confidence if she had been give a chance to start the next game.

 

[chrissaran]

How can Baylor lose to Stanford? Tara is a fantastic coach, but there's more to it than that. Kim is less than the best. With all the talent she's had she's won only two NCs. Yes, it's more than many other coaches. Those other coaches didn't have 6'8" Britney Griner and Odyssey Sims.

 

[Shades]