B1G

[upstater]

I'm done with this. Don't feel like pushing it further. I think economic and population growth of the south is significant - both of which are outpacing the north and you don't. And I'm still mystified that "immigrants" are somehow even pertinent to this conversation, particularly when outside of Tx and Fl, immigration through the rest of the south is below the national average, not above. Immigrants have cable, buy fan gear and send their kids to college. So, not sure why they would even be mentioned.

Hilarious! I'm an immigrant. I wasn't knocking them. And maybe I know them better than you. They are not Delaney's demographic. They have relatively little interest in what he's selling.

 

[pj]

Hispanics were half of North Carolina's population growth between 2000 and 2010. As upstater says, they're not Delany's demographic.

 

[Adios]

We need our hockey program in the B1G so we can start producing NHL first round picks. Maybe we can take that $20+ million we are getting from the split and put it towards a fancy new hockey arena.

 

[Exit 4]

Hispanics were half of North Carolina's population growth between 2000 and 2010. As upstater says, they're not Delany's demographic.

Damn it, I really dont want to get caught up in these type of conversations.... NC added 1.5MM people over that decade. So, if you are correct about the hispanic percentage, 1/2 is still 750k people. You wont see 750k of growth in CT over the next 40 years, let alone the next decade. We just dont have the space unless people more rapidly take to true city living again.

And Upstater, my inlaws are all immigrants, so I guess that means I get to make blanket statements too.

And really, I am not looking to be a jerk on this board.

 

[upstater]

Damn it, I really dont want to get caught up in these type of conversations.... NC added 1.5MM people over that decade. So, if you are correct about the hispanic percentage, 1/2 is still 750k people. You wont see 750k of growth in CT over the next 40 years, let alone the next decade. We just dont have the space unless people more rapidly take to true city living again.

And Upstater, my inlaws are all immigrants, so I guess that means I get to make blanket statements too.

And really, I am not looking to be a jerk on this board.

I literally have no idea what you're talking about.

Your own stats reinforced what I said about the football states and immigrants. Surely it's no surprise that people coming to this country not only have little exposure to American football, but they prefer the sports they grew up watching, mainly soccer. Why is that a surprise?

 

[Exit 4]

Upstater, Perhaps we really a completely missing each other. All I am doing is rehashing why NC, from a demographic standpoint, is more attractive than CT. Stuff that I am sure has been outlined ad nasuem around here and elsewhere. NC has added 1.5MM people in the past decade vs CT's 170k. NC has a foreign born population under 10%, CT's is OVER 10%. If NC's last decade was 50% fueled by hispanics, what was CT's 60%?

I am hopeful - perhaps foolishly - that the B1G will be rebuffed by UNC, UVA and others and will look to Uconn and perhaps someone like Mizzu or Kansas to get to 16. I feel like if the ACC holds together and manages to get their BB tourny to MSG at somepoint in the future then the ACC will have a decent chance of elevating its profile in the very long run. Meanwhile the B1G might not get the Washington-NYC traction it really needs to counter the ACC in this region without adding Uconn. Rutty and MD alone are unable to deliver critical mass, in my opinion.

 

[Point6]

Upstater, Perhaps we really a completely missing each other. All I am doing is rehashing why NC, from a demographic standpoint, is more attractive than CT. Stuff that I am sure has been outlined ad nasuem around here and elsewhere. NC has added 1.5MM people in the past decade vs CT's 170k. NC has a foreign born population under 10%, CT's is OVER 10%. If NC's last decade was 50% fueled by hispanics, what was CT's 60%?

I am hopeful - perhaps foolishly - that the B1G will be rebuffed by UNC, UVA and others and will look to Uconn and perhaps someone like Mizzu or Kansas to get to 16. I feel like if the ACC holds together and manages to get their BB tourny to MSG at somepoint in the future then the ACC will have a decent chance of elevating its profile in the very long run. Meanwhile the B1G might not get the Washington-NYC traction it really needs to counter the ACC in this region without adding Uconn. Rutty and MD alone are unable to deliver critical mass, in my opinion.

 

[The Funster]

Forget immigrants, I'm focusing on UConn and Kansas to the B1G.

 

[upstater]

Upstater, Perhaps we really a completely missing each other. All I am doing is rehashing why NC, from a demographic standpoint, is more attractive than CT. Stuff that I am sure has been outlined ad nasuem around here and elsewhere. NC has added 1.5MM people in the past decade vs CT's 170k. NC has a foreign born population under 10%, CT's is OVER 10%. If NC's last decade was 50% fueled by hispanics, what was CT's 60%?

I am hopeful - perhaps foolishly - that the B1G will be rebuffed by UNC, UVA and others and will look to Uconn and perhaps someone like Mizzu or Kansas to get to 16. I feel like if the ACC holds together and manages to get their BB tourny to MSG at somepoint in the future then the ACC will have a decent chance of elevating its profile in the very long run. Meanwhile the B1G might not get the Washington-NYC traction it really needs to counter the ACC in this region without adding Uconn. Rutty and MD alone are unable to deliver critical mass, in my opinion.

I have been one of the people stating from the start that UNC and even NC State is a big grab. I'm not one of the people comparing UConn to UNC (I haven't actually seen that) so we definitely agree on that. I was only responding to the idea that the ACC can exert any pull on the B1G. There's a reason why the B1g is shelling out twice as much money to its schools, and that's because it does have big population numbers around the Great Lakes.

 

[Marty Jackson]

Damn it, I really dont want to get caught up in these type of conversations.... NC added 1.5MM people over that decade. So, if you are correct about the hispanic percentage, 1/2 is still 750k people. You wont see 750k of growth in CT over the next 40 years, let alone the next decade. We just dont have the space unless people more rapidly take to true city living again.

And Upstater, my inlaws are all immigrants, so I guess that means I get to make blanket statements too.

And really, I am not looking to be a jerk on this board.

dude, not parsing your comments, but did you just suggest that 750K were people and the other 750K were hispanic?
WTF!!!

 

[GopherHawk]

We need our hockey program in the B1G so we can start producing NHL first round picks. Maybe we can take that $20+ million we are getting from the split and put it towards a fancy new hockey arena.

http://insider.espn.go.com/nhl/blog.../nhl-draft-ncaa-prospects-ready-break-through

UCONN would make a nice break in the schedule along with Penn State and tOSU for the Gophers, Badgers and Meechigan.

 

[chiller99]

Id like to see what links are used in some of this discussion its getting to sound like we are talking about freakin ufo aliens instead of groupings of people.But getting back to the point...I dont see a logical thought process for ACC raiding B1G...but even stronger object to the separation talk of the Carolina Trinity ..UNC NC State Duke..not gonna happen.The UCONN brand in sports other than hoops just doesnt happen and in football competes directly with Giants.Jets.Pats maybe even Bills..I think the school needs to take a look at schools like Oregon and Boise St who have top caliber athletes showing up just for unis...take a look...
http://www.grantland.com/story/_/id/6909937/how-does-oregon-football-keep-winning

 

[Exit 4]

dude, not parsing your comments, but did you just suggest that 750K were people and the other 750K were hispanic?
WTF!!!

Okay, so I should have said 'non hispanic people.'

I dont think the B1G is looking too closely at racial demographics in their expansion analysis. Nobody would avoid adding a school in CA, TX or FL based on racial or immigrant demographics and those are three of the four largest immigrant states (NY being the other). Upstater's original assertion that NC's growth is about immigrants is just flat out wrong. NC's growth has less to do with immigrants than the national average and less than CT's.

 

[upstater]

Okay, so I should have said 'non hispanic people.'

I dont think the B1G is looking too closely at racial demographics in their expansion analysis. Nobody would avoid adding a school in CA, TX or FL based on racial or immigrant demographics and those are three of the four largest immigrant states (NY being the other). Upstater's original assertion that NC's growth is about immigrants is just flat out wrong. NC's growth has less to do with immigrants than the national average and less than CT's.

You're so twisted man. So ridiculously twisted. You enjoy strawmen and quoting people for things they never ever said. Ridiculous. Go back and read and then figure it out.

 

[upstater]

And let me say this: the idea that the ACC may raid the B1G is flat out stupid.

 

[GopherHawk]

No one is leaving the B1G. It is more than an athletic conference. I know it sounds corny, but it family like. Not WV family like mind you, but like close cousins.

Al Gore is promising global warming anyway. That means Minnesota will be warm in the next 50 years and the east coast will be under water.

 

[Exit 4]

The big gains in the southern states are mainly immigrants.

This simply isnt true. Except for FL and Texas, the gains in the south are driven by higher birth rates and net positive internal migration within the US.

Focusing on the home of the ACC - North Carolina:
Internal migration (ie established US residents) - a net negative for CT and positive for NC.
http://interactive.taxfoundation.org/migration/
Birth rates: NC is a shade below the national average, CT in the bottom 5.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_U.S._states_and_territories_by_fertility_rate
Foriegn population as percentage: NC 7.4%, CT 13.2%
http://www.indexmundi.com/facts/uni...ll-states/foreign-born-population-percent#map

 

[Exit 4]

And let me say this: the idea that the ACC may raid the B1G is flat out stupid.

Ah, agreed, its not happening now or anytime soon. My ACC raid of the BiG was merely a point of hyperbole - not serious at all. Its the south that has better demographic trends and better growth story and the people running the show down there - IE the university decision makers and major boosters - are well aware of it. Its a point of major NC pride and thus in my opinion, will prevent the B1G from plucking off any other ACC schools.

 

[Exit 4]

No one is leaving the B1G. It is more than an athletic conference. I know it sounds corny, but it family like. Not WV family like mind you, but like close cousins.

Al Gore is promising global warming anyway. That means Minnesota will be warm in the next 50 years and the east coast will be under water.

I dont disagree with you at all. And just like the B1G is more than a conference, I am sure many at the heart of the ACC feel the same way. The ACC has succeeded despite a long standing financial shortfall compared to northern schools. The current TV landscape highlights and quantifies this issue in a public way, however its a shortfall that has always existed. Its been fascinating to see what happens. I'd love to be wrong about the ACC, those bastards have killed us.

 

[pj]

This simply isnt true. Except for FL and Texas, the gains in the south are driven by higher birth rates and net positive internal migration within the US.

Focusing on the home of the ACC - North Carolina:
Internal migration (ie established US residents) - a net negative for CT and positive for NC.
http://interactive.taxfoundation.org/migration/
Birth rates: NC is a shade below the national average, CT in the bottom 5.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_U.S._states_and_territories_by_fertility_rate
Foriegn population as percentage: NC 7.4%, CT 13.2%
http://www.indexmundi.com/facts/uni...ll-states/foreign-born-population-percent#map

Hispanics added 2000-2010: NC 421,000, CT 158,000.Hispanic population growth rate 2000-2010: NC 111.1%, CT 49.6%.

In general the southern and atlantic states had the largest percentage increases in Hispanic population. States in which Hispanic population grew by more than 100% 2000 to 2010 were (from table 2 here http://www.census.gov/prod/cen2010/briefs/c2010br-04.pdf): Alabama, Arkansas, Kentucky, Maryland, Mississippi, North Carolina, South Carolina, South Dakota, Tennessee. Georgia was 96% and Virginia 92%. Only South Dakota is outside the SEC - southern ACC footprint, and its Hispanic population is tiny.

I advised a company that served Hispanics and let me assure you, the south and southern atlantic states were where they saw future growth.

 

[upstater]

This simply isnt true. Except for FL and Texas, the gains in the south are driven by higher birth rates and net positive internal migration within the US.

Focusing on the home of the ACC - North Carolina:
Internal migration (ie established US residents) - a net negative for CT and positive for NC.
http://interactive.taxfoundation.org/migration/
Birth rates: NC is a shade below the national average, CT in the bottom 5.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_U.S._states_and_territories_by_fertility_rate
Foriegn population as percentage: NC 7.4%, CT 13.2%
http://www.indexmundi.com/facts/uni...ll-states/foreign-born-population-percent#map

At least this time you provide my actual quote instead of totally twisting it to some comment about North Carolina only (but I see you're still on your idiotic NC kick in the comments).

Southern numbers are heavy on immigration in the USA. When I look at the Great Lakes, they are not in the same stratosphere as the south. These football rich states show this. There are 11 states that pop up in the rankings (including North Carolina) before the 2nd Great Lakes state does (Minnesota, with Illinois at #10).

All this is irrelevant anyway since the numbers are small, the B1G has huge population numbers, and will never be raided by the ACC. Frankly, it's unbelievable that you even suggested it.

 

[upstater]

I dont disagree with you at all. And just like the B1G is more than a conference, I am sure many at the heart of the ACC feel the same way. The ACC has succeeded despite a long standing financial shortfall compared to northern schools. The current TV landscape highlights and quantifies this issue in a public way, however its a shortfall that has always existed. Its been fascinating to see what happens. I'd love to be wrong about the ACC, those bastards have killed us.

Maryland just left for the B1G!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Exit 4]

Maryland just left for the B1G!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

MD sure did. It had a well known financial hole. Lets see if the rest of the ACC cookie crumbles. I think it wont, but I sure would be happy to be wrong about it as I have no love for what they have done to the Big East.

Are you going to further defend your position about the south being fueled by immigrants or just ignore it?

 

[upstater]

MD sure did. It had a well known financial hole. Lets see if the rest of the ACC cookie crumbles. I think it wont, but I sure would be happy to be wrong about it as I have no love for what they have done to the Big East.

Are you going to further defend your position about the south being fueled by immigrants or just ignore it?

PJ's links back me up, so do yours. Over 10% of pop growth is immigration down there. It's the main difference.

 

[Exit 4]

Hispanics added 2000-2010: NC 421,000, CT 158,000.Hispanic population growth rate 2000-2010: NC 111.1%, CT 49.6%.

The percentages arent completely relevant. NC added 1.5 million people over the 2000-2010 decade. Assuming 421,000 are hispanic, that leaves over a million non hispanic people. Wow. Meanwhile CT added less than 170,000 and we havent applied the hispanic or foreign born % split to this figure.

PJ, even afte you net out hispanic population trends, the south still has underlying positive population trends that out strip CT or the midwest. The percentages you reference look strong because hispanics are coming off a small base number in 2000.