As Predicted By Anyone With A Brain, The ACC Is NOT Getting A TV Network

[Fishy]

Who really brings up academics when talking sports?

ACC fans.

Constantly.

 

[SAMCRO]

Who really brings up academics when talking sports?

That's all you heard form Swofford, ACC AD/Prez's, etc... During the initial and second raid of the BE. The phrase "like minded institutions" and the importance of having schools committed to academic excellence as members of the league were the talking points being spewed. That was the rationale provided by many as to why WVU was not selected over SyraPitt. What has evolved since then is UNC's suspect no show classes for athletes, and the open arms for UL. Had the ACC brass not been on their academic high horse the last few years, people wouldn't have scratched their heads at the UL selection.

 

[btstimpy]

This is more of your self-soothing.

You have to focus on UL's athletics because they're West Virginia academically. Any comparison with Ohio State is ridiculous.

I'm not soothing anything. I'm not impressed with Ohio State academically. I'm not impressed with Louisville academically either. They run together to me. There is a slight difference, 64% acceptance rate vs 76%. You might see a big difference. I don't. It's not a linear curve.

I'm impressed with Michigan. 36% acceptance rate. That's good for a public school. I get that Louisville isn't an academic powerhouse. But again if you can't even show up in the top 50, what difference does it make? Heck if you go to the USN&WR website, they only put 50 on a page.

 

[Fishy]

You're a blindingly simple human being if you're judging those two schools purely on acceptance rate.

You're wasting our bandwidth.

 

[dayooper]

I'm not soothing anything. I'm not impressed with Ohio State academically. I'm not impressed with Louisville academically either. They run together to me. There is a slight difference, 64% acceptance rate vs 76%. You might see a big difference. I don't. It's not a linear curve.

Really, you are not impressed with a top 100 world wide institution?

In international rankings (such as the QS and ARWU), OSU ranks ahead of UVa by metrics based on awards won by alumni, faculty, papers and research published, ext. UVa ranks higher on Forbes and USNRW, where they look at incoming scores, class ranks, and overall satisfaction.

I'm not bashing UVa in any way. It is a very good school (top 50 in my book) that is one of the best in the world. So is OSU.

 

[Fishy]

Virginia accepts about 30% of its applicants. So does San Diego State....

So they're the same.

 

[btstimpy]

That's all you heard form Swofford, ACC AD/Prez's, etc... During the initial and second raid of the BE. The phrase "like minded institutions" and the importance of having schools committed to academic excellence as members of the league were the talking points being spewed. That was the rationale provided by many as to why WVU was not selected over SyraPitt. What has evolved since then is UNC's suspect no show classes for athletes, and the open arms for UL. Had the ACC brass not been on their academic high horse the last few years, people wouldn't have scratched their heads at the UL selection.

The ACC does focus on academics. The ACC and the Ivy League are the only athletic conferences with 8 or more schools in the top 50 academically. The school the ACC lost was way down the list academically, and it was replaced by another one also way down the list academically. The brass wanted someone this time to beef up football and basketball. They added the Sugar Bowl Champion and the NCAA men's basketball champion. Seems like a good cut of beef to me. Maybe next time it will be an academic focus and Vanderbilt will grow tired of being the only token academic school in its league in the Top 50. Florida is close to top 50. I'm not sure they've cracked it though. Or maybe Pennsylvania will come out of its shell and beef up athletics and football. UVA played many games at Franklin Field at one time. Lost all but 1. It would be novel to do it again only this time winning more.

 

[dayooper]

The ACC does focus on academics. The ACC and the Ivy League are the only athletic conferences with 8 or more schools in the top 50 academically. The school the ACC lost was way down the list academically, and it was replaced by another one also way down the list academically. The brass wanted someone this time to beef up football and basketball. They added the Sugar Bowl Champion and the NCAA men's basketball champion. Seems like a good cut of beef to me. Maybe next time it will be an academic focus and Vanderbilt will grow tired of being the only token academic school in its league in the Top 50. Florida is close to top 50. I'm not sure they've cracked it though. Or maybe Pennsylvania will come out of its shell and beef up athletics and football. UVA played many games at Franklin Field at one time. Lost all but 1. It would be novel to do it again only this time winning more.

Again, it comes down to the metrics on how you judge them. In general, ACC schools do better in undergrad rankings while Big 10 schools do better in grad and research.

 

[Fishy]

Maryland and Louisville aren't in the same orbit academically.

UL is Mississippi State on a good day. West Virginia every other day.

Maryland is Syracuse/Pitt.

More self-soothing.

 

[btstimpy]

Virginia accepts about 30% of its applicants. So does San Diego State....

So they're the same.

California schools are rising up the charts fast. 20 years ago UVA was ahead of all of them with UC-Berkley right about where we are. Now UC-Berkley is ahead of UVA. We have USC and UCLA right with us. UC-Davis and UC-San Diego have cracked the top 40. If San Diego state can continue to be as selective as it has been lately, we'll watch them rise right up the chart like the others.

 

[SAMCRO]

The ACC does focus on academics. The ACC and the Ivy League are the only athletic conferences with 8 or more schools in the top 50 academically. The school the ACC lost was way down the list academically, and it was replaced by another one also way down the list academically. The brass wanted someone this time to beef up football and basketball. They added the Sugar Bowl Champion and the NCAA men's basketball champion. Seems like a good cut of beef to me. Maybe next time it will be an academic focus and Vanderbilt will grow tired of being the only token academic school in its league in the Top 50. Florida is close to top 50. I'm not sure they've cracked it though. Or maybe Pennsylvania will come out of its shell and beef up athletics and football. UVA played many games at Franklin Field at one time. Lost all but 1. It would be novel to do it again only this time winning more.

Wrong. The ACC - the athletic conference - doesn't care. Selecting UL was a clear and indisputable action that the ACC doesn't give a about maintaining a conference of "like minded institutions" Some schools within the ACC care (Duke, BC, UVa, GT, WF), but the ACC does not care.

 

[Pat125]

I don't get too hooked on academic rankings. There are so many, and of course, they don't quite match up. I just googled a couple, and both had Maryland, Rutgers, and Ohio St. ranked higher than Virginia. No, I don't actually believe that. But it does show that determining comparisons of academics based on one ranking system is faulty at best. In my opinion, I don't think Louisville's academic quality is as bad as most make it out to be, but still well behind, for example, Ohio St.

 

[btstimpy]

Again, it comes down to the metrics on how you judge them. In general, ACC schools do better in undergrad rankings while Big 10 schools do better in grad and research.

I don't agree with that. Some of the best Medical, Law, Business, and Engineering schools in the US are in the ACC. I'd probably say more than in the Big Ten without doing the research on each one. They are each ranked individually. The only thing I'd agree with is the Big Ten schools tend to be much larger than ACC schools in terms of enrollment.

However, when the ACC is talking about athletic and academic excellence, it is talking about student athletes. We are not filling up our Medical, Law, Business, and PhD programs with student athletes. They are 95+% undergraduate student athletes. So this Graduate program comparison is another "What difference does it make?" regarding this discussion about the athletic conference.

Every time this comes up I get people questioning USN&WR as the metric and wanting the leave the sphere of the student athlete to worry about graduate research or a specialized field. It's off on a tangent.

 

[btstimpy]

I don't get too hooked on academic rankings. There are so many, and of course, they don't quite match up. I just googled a couple, and both had Maryland, Rutgers, and Ohio St. ranked higher than Virginia. No, I don't actually believe that. But it does show that determining comparisons of academics based on one ranking system is faulty at best. In my opinion, I don't think Louisville's academic quality is as bad as most make it out to be, but still well behind, for example, Ohio St.

I get hooked on 2 rankings. USN&WR Best National Universities, and Leerfield Sports Director's Cup. As long as UVA does well in both of these, I'm happy. And I don't look past 50 in either much. UVA is pretty well topped out in the USN&WR because the state legislature has mandated that only 35% of the enrollment can be out of state. If the legislature eliminated that restriction, UVA could go up the chart higher. They are doing well to maintain where they are with that restriction. As for Director's Cup the sky is the limit, but this football team needs a serious overhaul. Many of the other sports are doing well.

 

[Pat125]

I get hooked on 2 rankings. USN&WR Best National Universities, and Leerfield Sports Director's Cup. As long as UVA does well in both of these, I'm happy. And I don't look past 50 in either much. UVA is pretty well topped out in the USN&WR because the state legislature has mandated that only 35% of the enrollment can be out of state. If the legislature eliminated that restriction, UVA could go up the chart higher. They are doing well to maintain where they are with that restriction. As for Director's Cup the sky is the limit, but this football team needs a serious overhaul. Many of the other sports are doing well.

My point is that relying on one ranking is an arbitrary indicator of academic quality.

 

[dayooper]

I don't agree with that. Some of the best Medical, Law, Business, and Engineering schools in the US are in the ACC. I'd probably say more than in the Big Ten without doing the research on each one. They are each ranked individually. The only thing I'd agree with is the Big Ten schools tend to be much larger than ACC schools in terms of enrollment.

However, when the ACC is talking about athletic and academic excellence, it is talking about student athletes. We are not filling up our Medical, Law, Business, and PhD programs with student athletes. They are 95+% undergraduate student athletes. So this Graduate program comparison is another "What difference does it make?" regarding this discussion about the athletic conference.

Every time this comes up I get people questioning USN&WR as the metric and wanting the leave the sphere of the student athlete to worry about graduate research or a specialized field. It's off on a tangent.

It's not an off tangent when like minded schools are in question. The ACC went back on everything they said they were when they admitted Louisville. Southern School, Eastern Seaboard School, Academic Orientated School. They broke what they said they were about. I don't have a problem with that, but to say it's no big deal is not correct. It was a move to keep the conference together by appeasing FSU and Clemson. Louisville is an outlier in every way possible. Outliers are not good for cohesion with in the group. Ask WVU and the Big12 or the members of the old Big East. There has to be something more than sports that keeps the schools connected. Louisville and The ACC need to find that connection.

As far as academic rankings go, both leagues have great schools. If you marginalize Michigan, Wisconsin, Northwestern, Illinois, Purdue, Minnesota, PSU, and OSU as elite or just under, you are showing an East Coast arrogance and will never see past locale. I'm fine with that, and I am sure you are as well.

 

[buddy]

The ACC sold their soul when they took ND as a partial member and Louisville under any pretense.

 

[upstater]

I get hooked on 2 rankings. USN&WR Best National Universities, and Leerfield Sports Director's Cup. As long as UVA does well in both of these, I'm happy. And I don't look past 50 in either much. UVA is pretty well topped out in the USN&WR because the state legislature has mandated that only 35% of the enrollment can be out of state. If the legislature eliminated that restriction, UVA could go up the chart higher. They are doing well to maintain where they are with that restriction. As for Director's Cup the sky is the limit, but this football team needs a serious overhaul. Many of the other sports are doing well.

There are AAU schools very low in the US rankings while some low resource schools are ranked very high. If you're really taking those rankings as gospel, you are surely missing a lot. Even on their small college roster, they used to drop a place like Reed College into the third tier while jacking colleges that were nearly unaccredited into the first.

 

[btstimpy]

There are AAU schools very low in the US rankings while some low resource schools are ranked very high. If you're really taking those rankings as gospel, you are surely missing a lot. Even on their small college roster, they used to drop a place like Reed College into the third tier while jacking colleges that were nearly unaccredited into the first.

I'm not missing much of anything. I'm not focused on graduate research. It doesn't benefit the student athletes at all, and it doesn't benefit that many of the students in general. The faculty might get their jollies about it, and that's about it. AAU just happens to be a fetish of the Big Ten Conference. 99% of the posters focused on conference realignment have no idea what its about, and only 2% have probably benefited from it. Yes UVA is a member of the AAU. It joined in 1904. Was sponsored by Pennsylvania and Harvard. But Dartmouth, Notre Dame, Georgetown, and Wake Forest are all top 25 academically ranked schools not AAU.

This will get us back to SUNY-Buffalo to the Big Ten idea. With this AAU fetish, it is not out of the realm of possibility for them to look there. They would get AAU, but not an academic gem. Athletically SUNY-Buffalo might be able to put their mind to it and compete. But for Football they will be fighting the same demographic challenges as the rest of the Big Ten and doing it with no tradition or history in football. UCF and USF will have easier paths ahead of them for football. Can they become AAU? Depends on the cross pollination of the faculty with AAU schools and the politics. The University of Florida is in it. Will they help them? Who knows. But it won't help the football teams.

 

[upstater]

I'm not missing much of anything. I'm not focused on graduate research. It doesn't benefit the student athletes at all, and it doesn't benefit that many of the students in general. The faculty might get their jollies about it, and that's about it. AAU just happens to be a fetish of the Big Ten Conference. 99% of the posters focused on conference realignment have no idea what its about, and only 2% have probably benefited from it. Yes UVA is a member of the AAU. It joined in 1904. Was sponsored by Pennsylvania and Harvard. But Dartmouth, Notre Dame, Georgetown, and Wake Forest are all top 25 academically ranked schools not AAU.

This will get us back to SUNY-Buffalo to the Big Ten idea. With this AAU fetish, it is not out of the realm of possibility for them to look there. They would get AAU, but not an academic gem. Athletically SUNY-Buffalo might be able to put their mind to it and compete. But for Football they will be fighting the same demographic challenges as the rest of the Big Ten and doing it with no tradition or history in football. UCF and USF will have easier paths ahead of them for football. Can they become AAU? Depends on the cross pollination of the faculty with AAU schools and the politics. The University of Florida is in it. Will they help them? Who knows. But it won't help the football teams.

You can dismiss it all you want but the fact is, when you give lower resources to faculty, it stretches thin. Academic reputation is largely based on how much money a school commits to the teaching of students. USNews takes a very warped view of this. There are 4-3 load schools that are ahead of many well respected 2-2 load schools, which is a total distortion of what actually happens in the classroom, and what kind of research is being conducted. That's why I brought up AAU. I didn't bring it u to discuss the B1G nor UB etc.

Then there are the wacky small school anomalies, like Reed in the 3rd tier. Holy Cross and Richmond ahead of them, not to mention Colorado Coll., Kenyon,, etc.

 

[Sea Goat]

The ACC sold their soul when they took ND as a partial member and Louisville under any pretense.

I'm not soothing anything. I'm not impressed with Ohio State academically. I'm not impressed with Louisville academically either. They run together to me. There is a slight difference, 64% acceptance rate vs 76%. You might see a big difference. I don't. It's not a linear curve.

I'm impressed with Michigan. 36% acceptance rate. That's good for a public school. I get that Louisville isn't an academic powerhouse. But again if you can't even show up in the top 50, what difference does it make? Heck if you go to the USN&WR website, they only put 50 on a page.

Stimp, your recent comments regarding the relative academic standing of various institutions strains the limits of credulity. I would often check out your comments on this board because I thought they were sourced with a thoughtful individual. Please stop this nonsense and restore my confidence in you as a purveyor of sound thought and observation. I don't want to see the Cavalier avatar and feel the urge to cringe anymore. OK?

 

[btstimpy]

Stimp, your recent comments regarding the relative academic standing of various institutions strains the limits of credulity. I would often check out your comments on this board because I thought they were sourced with a thoughtful individual. Please stop this nonsense and restore my confidence in you as a purveyor of sound thought and observation. I don't want to see the Cavalier avatar and feel the urge to cringe anymore. OK?

I know that you want to think that the ACC passed on Yale to take Appalachian Community College. If they both played top 25 FBS football, the ACC would have invited Yale. This is simply not remotely true. BTW, I'd love to have Yale. The 10-0 victory by UVA in New Haven in 1915 against Walter Camp is one of the biggest football wins in UVA history. Yale's first ever loss to a team from the South. And William Lambeth of UVA was on Walter Camp's rules committee for years helping add the helmets and forward pass. It would be great to renew the rivalry from a century ago, but Yale got out of the football business during WWII. I don't think they want to return. I'm not old enough to remember the glory days. But it was nice to see an ACC player, FSU's Jameis Winston, win the Walter Camp award in 2013.

And there aren't any academic marvels in the United States ranked below 50, so worrying about whether someone is ranked 65 or 165 makes little difference really. Whether someone is ranked 2 vs 30 is a big difference. The ACC would like to have all of its schools in the top 50, and yes Louisville has a long way to go to get there. They are spending $300 million on a health science research complex to dominate their region in biomedical research. Their claim to fame seems to be medical. We'll have to see if they make progress.

 

[NickyNewark]

Stimp, your recent comments regarding the relative academic standing of various institutions strains the limits of credulity. I would often check out your comments on this board because I thought they were sourced with a thoughtful individual. Please stop this nonsense and restore my confidence in you as a purveyor of sound thought and observation. I don't want to see the Cavalier avatar and feel the urge to cringe anymore. OK?

I'm not sure exactly what it is about stimpy but I'm wary of many of his ACC justifying comments. He seems innocent enough but some of his posts set off warning signal's in my mind? Subliminal suggestion? Seems he blends a mixture of truths and half truths that make me wonder(he's smooth) about him but I'm suspicious by nature. He says he's all about the Directors Cup? Thats unusually rare amongst fan's of schools here in the CR wars.

 

[btstimpy]

I'm not sure exactly what it is about stimpy but I'm wary of many of his ACC justifying comments. He seems innocent enough but some of his posts set off warning signal's in my mind? Subliminal suggestion? Seems he blends a mixture of truths and half truths that make me wonder(he's smooth) about him but I'm suspicious by nature. He says he's all about the Directors Cup? Thats unusually rare amongst fan's of schools here in the CR wars.

The Director's Cup would be rare to fans with blinders on to Football. But what is even more rare is the justification for the additions that the Big Ten just made. They were obviously not concerned about Football or the Director's Cup. Cable Boxes was their concern, and this is a really new phenomenon due to the business model of their rather recent television arrangements.

 

[upstater]

I know that you want to think that the ACC passed on Yale to take Appalachian Community College. If they both played top 25 FBS football, the ACC would have invited Yale. This is simply not remotely true. BTW, I'd love to have Yale. The 10-0 victory by UVA in New Haven in 1915 against Walter Camp is one of the biggest football wins in UVA history. Yale's first ever loss to a team from the South. And William Lambeth of UVA was on Walter Camp's rules committee for years helping add the helmets and forward pass. It would be great to renew the rivalry from a century ago, but Yale got out of the football business during WWII. I don't think they want to return. I'm not old enough to remember the glory days. But it was nice to see an ACC player, FSU's Jameis Winston, win the Walter Camp award in 2013.

And there aren't any academic marvels in the United States ranked below 50, so worrying about whether someone is ranked 65 or 165 makes little difference really. Whether someone is ranked 2 vs 30 is a big difference. The ACC would like to have all of its schools in the top 50, and yes Louisville has a long way to go to get there. They are spending $300 million on a health science research complex to dominate their region in biomedical research. Their claim to fame seems to be medical. We'll have to see if they make progress.

Unbelievable.

There are schools ranked below 50 that are on the world top 30 list!

Ridiculous to put schools like Texas, Pittsburgh, Ohio State, Minnesota, Stony Brook on par with Seton Hall, Hofstra, St John Fisher, Miss. St, Illionois St, UMBC, La Verne.

Quit while you're way behind.