Arbitrator rules in Ollie's favor re: protections

[UCDaveD]

How many schools around the country have deposed their own recruits in the past 5 years? If you can't see how that's a major problem, I don't know what to tell you.

I can say with absolute certainty that it’s much much less of a deal than you’re making it out to be.

 

[kemba]

I strongly doubt attorneys fees for this matter are anywhere near $55,000,000,000.

Paying Ollie an undeserved $11 million is the worst of possible outcomes and if anything is more damaging to our reputation than staying the course (and in all likelihood prevailing.) Now if KO wants to offer a reasonable settlement (which I've previously posted would be not greater than $1M paid over 4 years, with a general release, a joint statement (unintended mistakes were made) with a mutual non-disparagement clause) then by all means, he should offer it. UConn would probably accept it on a nuisance/uncertainty basis.

How is $1M a reasonable settlement?

 

[navery12]

How many schools around the country have deposed their own recruits in the past 5 years? If you can't see how that's a major problem, I don't know what to tell you.

I can't tell you that answer, and the reason is because outside of that team and their fans nobody cared

 

[UCDaveD]

How is $1M a reasonable settlement?

Because it's $1M more than he's entitled to.

 

[kemba]

Because it's $1M more than he's entitled to.

If you believe that then don't offer to settle at all. But that would not be a reasonable settlement offer, he'd be much better off just rolling the dice

 

[Husky68]

Maybe I'm a little slow. If arbitration ruled UConn's claim is to be decided on what UConn knew and claimed at time of dismissal; does all discovery have to relate to the claims they made in firing? My understanding is that Miller's relaying what his wife heard was not used to fire Ollie, so that even if he did get the mom paid it could not be used to support the firing. Am I missing something. Seems like that would narrow the deposition list and the amount and type of questions pretty narrowly.

 

[Rico444]

I can say with absolute certainty that it’s much much less of a deal than you’re making it out to be.

I believe that you want that to be true, but I don't believe it is.

Ollie torpedoed the program and absolutely doesn't deserve this money, but UConn fighting him on it has fractured Calhoun's relationship with our all-time most popular player. That same player has spoken out against the school, and blew off his former coach's charity golf tournament. Almost every article written in national media for the last year and a half has mentioned this court battle, and now we're deposing recruits who didn't even come here, they just visited and now they're dragged into this battle.

This is a really bad look for the program. I'm not saying it's going to destroy the basketball program or anything like that, but I wouldn't be surprised at all if we lost out on a recruit or two, and I wouldn't be surprised if Ray and coach Calhoun's relationship was irretrievably fractured. Is the collateral damage really worth it?

 

[McLovin]

I believe that you want that to be true, but I don't believe it is.

Ollie torpedoed the program and absolutely doesn't deserve this money, but UConn fighting him on it has fractured Calhoun's relationship with our all-time most popular player. That same player has spoken out against the school, and blew off his former coach's charity golf tournament. Almost every article written in national media for the last year and a half has mentioned this court battle, and now we're deposing recruits who didn't even come here, they just visited and now they're dragged into this battle.

This is a really bad look for the program. I'm not saying it's going to destroy the basketball program or anything like that, but I wouldn't be surprised at all if we lost out on a recruit or two, and I wouldn't be surprised if Ray and coach Calhoun's relationship was irretrievably fractured. Is the collateral damage really worth it?

no

 

[upstater]

I believe that you want that to be true, but I don't believe it is.

Ollie torpedoed the program and absolutely doesn't deserve this money, but UConn fighting him on it has fractured Calhoun's relationship with our all-time most popular player. That same player has spoken out against the school, and blew off his former coach's charity golf tournament. Almost every article written in national media for the last year and a half has mentioned this court battle, and now we're deposing recruits who didn't even come here, they just visited and now they're dragged into this battle.

This is a really bad look for the program. I'm not saying it's going to destroy the basketball program or anything like that, but I wouldn't be surprised at all if we lost out on a recruit or two, and I wouldn't be surprised if Ray and coach Calhoun's relationship was irretrievably fractured. Is the collateral damage really worth it?

& what could the school possibly want with those recruits anyway?

 

[whaler11]

Suzy is on a beach with a Cohiba and two shots of tequila checking in on ACC lacrosse recruiting.

 

[CL82]

How many schools around the country have deposed their own recruits in the past 5 years? If you can't see how that's a major problem, I don't know what to tell you.

When we have recruits saying well I would’ve gone to you can but I didn’t want to be subject to a deposition, I’ll start worrying. Until then I’ll tell you it’s pretty much only this board that gives a rats patootie about this.

 

[UCDaveD]

I believe that you want that to be true, but I don't believe it is.

Ollie torpedoed the program and absolutely doesn't deserve this money, but UConn fighting him on it has fractured Calhoun's relationship with our all-time most popular player. That same player has spoken out against the school, and blew off his former coach's charity golf tournament. Almost every article written in national media for the last year and a half has mentioned this court battle, and now we're deposing recruits who didn't even come here, they just visited and now they're dragged into this battle.

This is a really bad look for the program. I'm not saying it's going to destroy the basketball program or anything like that, but I wouldn't be surprised at all if we lost out on a recruit or two, and I wouldn't be surprised if Ray and coach Calhoun's relationship was irretrievably fractured. Is the collateral damage really worth it?

There wont be a single recruit who decides not come here just because of some former coach's legal battle with the university over money. 16, 17, and 18 year old kids don't give a single Spartacus about it. 99.9% of people outside of the state don't give a Spartacus about it.

Almost every national media article has mentioned it? Go ahead and control+f "Ollie" in the following national media articles about UConn. Not a single mention. No one cares.

Big East officially announces UConn's return

UConn officially rejoins the Big East with big welcome at Madison Square Garden

UConn’s Big East Return Is the Right Kind of Conference Realignment

 

[selles]

I believe that you want that to be true, but I don't believe it is.

Ollie torpedoed the program and absolutely doesn't deserve this money, but UConn fighting him on it has fractured Calhoun's relationship with our all-time most popular player. That same player has spoken out against the school, and blew off his former coach's charity golf tournament. Almost every article written in national media for the last year and a half has mentioned this court battle, and now we're deposing recruits who didn't even come here, they just visited and now they're dragged into this battle.

This is a really bad look for the program. I'm not saying it's going to destroy the basketball program or anything like that, but I wouldn't be surprised at all if we lost out on a recruit or two, and I wouldn't be surprised if Ray and coach Calhoun's relationship was irretrievably fractured. Is the collateral damage really worth it?

This is so overwrought. Y'all need to let the lawyers take care of the lawyer stuff, Hurley take care of the Hurley stuff, and Benedict take care of the Benedict stuff. You don't pay a dude 11 million dollars because you're worried Ray and the Oakland Soldiers (or whoever) might be irked about it. We'll be fine.

 

[CL82]

How is $1M a reasonable settlement?

Because his legal case is extraordinarily weak. He had a contract which terminated upon his committing NCAA violations and he committed and he committed NCAA violations. So realistically the settlement amount is the amount you pay to get rid of the nuisance of having to deal with the suit.

Note that I didn’t say the value of his case was worth 1 million I said that I wouldn’t pay more than 1 million and only over 4 years. His representation is well aware he loses on the merits, which is why they going out of their way to be as annoying as possible. Otherwise, they wouldn’t have destroyed Kevin Ollie’s reputation. They would’ve litigated and kept a low profile which would be more in keeping with their clients interests.

 

[husky8273]

The professors union was previously granted the right to depose of former UConn basketball players Ray Allen, Terry Larrier, Sterling Gibbs and Rodney Purvis, as well as former coaches Ricky Moore, Dwayne Killings and Kevin Freeman. Others on the list to be deposed of were former athletic director Warde Manuel, former recruit James Akinjo and his guardian Rachel Kackson, as well as his stepfather Chris Wright, former player development coach Danny Griffin and former audio/visual coordinator Dave Sevush

Uh, Ray, UConn didn't ask for you to be deposed. Ollie did.

Maybe you ought to rethink who your angry with.

Ray objected to the University's treatment during the process not to who made the request. Interesting to see Ray's Coral Gables home valued at $11MM.

 

[nelsonmuntz]

Thread #500 on the Ollie termination, and the "pay him nothing" position continues to be based on the fact he was losing. I hope the university lawyers have something better.

 

[pj]

Applicable AAUP Language (pg 50 of CBA) - Note that the “level of proof shall be the preponderance of the evidence” and the language in 37-12 A ii regarding serious noncompliance w/ “NCAA rules and regulations”:

View attachment 45593

The above is the critical post in this thread, everything else is window dressing. UConn has to prove by a preponderance of evidence that just one of the following is true:
1. Ollie neglected his responsibilities. I'm sure they have assembled plenty of evidence here.
2. Non-compliance with NCAA rules or regulations or the university code of ethics. We know they have this one.
4. Sexual harassment. There have been rumors of inappropriate Ollie behavior with at least one female student. I doubt UConn wants the bad blood this would bring, but if push comes to shove ...
5. Repeated, documented failure to meet generally accepted satisfactory standards of job performance. After the transfers, Benedict met with players and documented Ollie's failure to meet the generally accepted standard that a coach should retain his players. Then Benedict gave Ollie a documented warning and a year to shape up. Then we hear that at the end of his final season, a lot of players were contemplating leaving. I think UConn has this one covered.

So UConn has strong evidence on 3 points, possible evidence on a fourth, and only needs to prove one with a preponderance of evidence.

Ollie's odds of winning are very low here.

 

[Vermonster]

This has become such a black eye for everyone involved. I don't blame either side for fighting for what they want but, at some point you have to look at it from a higher level and see how badly this affects the UConn brand.

 

[Rico444]

When we have recruits saying well I would’ve gone to you can but I didn’t want to be subject to a deposition, I’ll start worrying. Until then I’ll tell you it’s pretty much only this board that gives a rats patootie about this.

Lol, no recruit is going to come out and say that's the reason they didn't come here. They all play the game.

There wont be a single recruit who decides not come here just because of some former coach's legal battle with the university over money. 16, 17, and 18 year old kids don't give a single Spartacus about it. 99.9% of people outside of the state don't give a Spartacus about it.

Almost every national media article has mentioned it? Go ahead and control+f "Ollie" in the following national media articles about UConn. Not a single mention. No one cares.

Big East officially announces UConn's return

UConn officially rejoins the Big East with big welcome at Madison Square Garden

UConn’s Big East Return Is the Right Kind of Conference Realignment

Yeah, that's why I said almost every article. The move to the big east was one of the single biggest college basketball stories of the offseason, so it overshadowed the Ollie stuff. Pretty much every other article at least mentioned the case.

 

[CL82]

Lol, no recruit is going to come out and say that's the reason they didn't come here. They all play the game.

They’re not going to say it, because they’re not gonna think about it for even 10 seconds. But you know what let’s agree to disagree and see how Danny does with recruits. So far it really doesn’t look like it’s impacting us at all, agree?

 

[UConnDad]

The above is the critical post in this thread, everything else is window dressing. UConn has to prove by a preponderance of evidence that just one of the following is true:
1. Ollie neglected his responsibilities. I'm sure they have assembled plenty of evidence here.
2. Non-compliance with NCAA rules or regulations or the university code of ethics. We know they have this one.
4. Sexual harassment. There have been rumors of inappropriate Ollie behavior with at least one female student. I doubt UConn wants the bad blood this would bring, but if push comes to shove ...
5. Repeated, documented failure to meet generally accepted satisfactory standards of job performance. After the transfers, Benedict met with players and documented Ollie's failure to meet the generally accepted standard that a coach should retain his players. Then Benedict gave Ollie a documented warning and a year to shape up. Then we hear that at the end of his final season, a lot of players were contemplating leaving. I think UConn has this one covered.

So UConn has strong evidence on 3 points, possible evidence on a fourth, and only needs to prove one with a preponderance of evidence.

Ollie's odds of winning are very low here.

You seem to have inside info. I have not seen this evidence and documentation. Is this accessible by the public?

 

[kemba]

Yea this has been ugly for the people involved, but as far as having an impact on the future of the program, there is none. It's barely a national story. Nobody cares. Even locally it gets reported on but most people don't care. Recruits don't care at all.

 

[UConnDad]

At this pace the 3 year show cause will expire before the case is settled.

 

[Jbirdp5]

No recruiting website has ever mentioned UConn’s legal dispute as any reason a kid may not choose UConn. It’s a non factor for basketball

 

[intlzncster]

.
This is a really bad look for the program. I'm not saying it's going to destroy the basketball program or anything like that, but I wouldn't be surprised at all if we lost out on a recruit or two, and I wouldn't be surprised if Ray and coach Calhoun's relationship was irretrievably fractured. Is the collateral damage really worth it?

There wont be a single recruit who decides not come here just because of some former coach's legal battle with the university over money. 16, 17, and 18 year old kids don't give a single Spartacus about it. 99.9% of people outside of the state don't give a Spartacus about it.

The only thing recruits know about UConn:

1. It's a storied program,
2. Now in the big East
3. Dan Hurley is coach

The only way it might have hurt UConn would be if Ollie had strong and deep/wide recruiting connections. Since the lack of those was one of his problems, that won't be an issue.

 

[Rico444]

The only thing recruits know about UConn:

1. It's a storied program,
2. Now in the big East
3. Dan Hurley is coach

The only way it might have hurt UConn would be if Ollie had strong and deep/wide recruiting connections. Since the lack of those was one of his problems, that won't be an issue.

They don't have to know what's going on here, other head coaches will make sure to let our recruits know that they should have a good lawyer ready just in case.

I don't expect it to affect all that many recruits, but do I think Akinjo's AAU program might steer clear of us if we have interest in one of their kids, or someone that's friends with him will hear what that kid has to go through and decide it's not worth the hassle? Probably, yeah. And it'll be a damn shame if Calhoun doesn't have a relationship with Ray Allen or Ricky Moore in the future because of this.

 

[Jbirdp5]

They don't have to know what's going on here, other head coaches will make sure to let our recruits know that they should have a good lawyer ready just in case.

I don't expect it to affect all that many recruits, but do I think Akinjo's AAU program might steer clear of us if we have interest in one of their kids, or someone that's friends with him will hear what that kid has to go through and decide it's not worth the hassle? Probably, yeah. And it'll be a damn shame if Calhoun doesn't have a relationship with Ray Allen or Ricky Moore in the future because of this.

Akinjo is from California which is well out of our recruiting footprint at this time. So if 1 kid out of 50 that we are interested in doesn’t come because of it I don’t think Hurley will lose even a minute of sleep. As most people are saying your making it a bigger deal on the basketball level than it really is

 

[BlueMAB]

Compared to the $51,000,000,000 state debt, yes it is a very small amount of money. $11 million isn't going to bankrupt the state, they are well past that point. Making a statement over this amount of money is going to do more harm than good and may end up costing them more in the end when you factor in all the costs (even if they win).

Different budgets. It doesn’t matter what the state deficit/budget is. It’s UConn’s budget that UConn is concerned about.

If the legislature stepped in and passed a bill to pay Ollie his money then the state deficit would be relevant. But they aren’t, and it isn’t.

 

[Dean Wormer]

$11 million is great, but to say that nobody outside of the state of Connecticut notices this or cares about it is just plain foolish. We're asking former recruits to come in and give depositions? If you think other programs won't use that to negatively recruit against us...

And no, to be clear, I don't think Ollie deserves a penny of the money. Deserve's got nothing to do with it. It's too late to do anything but fight this to the end at this point, but I'm of the opinion now that they screwed up not paying Ollie.

Extra credit for the "Unforgiven" reference.

 

[methodology]

Just pay the man and be done with this circus