Ap poll is ridiculous

[Jerry1714]

Wichita State is proving that SOS can be gamed. They are playing a bunch of decent to mediocre teams but nobody dreadful and nobody great. That is how they keep a high SOS. They have no marque wins. Could they be great, yes, but they haven't played a single team as good as Florida (even as constituted against UConn).

OKSt does have a better resume than UConn.

Can you say with 100% certainty that any of the top ten you mentioned would beat UConn on a neutral court? That is a very poor argument to make.

I personally don't think UConn should be in the top ten right now but there are a few teams in the top 16 that should not be ahead of UConn. UK, UL, KU really shouldn't be. Wichita State is arguable until they play another top 25 team. Florida shouldn't be yet, though if their super freshman is as good as many say, I can understand the jump. Of course he may be more Ajou Ajou than Luol, if you get my meaning.

Not to you but, Florida is a top 15 team without their freshmen, top 12 with their freshman PG and maybe a top 10 or higher with Walker. It's a marquee win regardless. Any top 15 win is. It may not be as impressive as it would have been if Florida had its freshmen, but that's not the same as not being a marquee win.

I do think Florida is a Top 10, that is why I listed them there.

I agree 100% that no one can say UConn couldn't beat any of the top 10 teams, but no one can say they can, and no one can say they could beat someone like Iowa State or others in the Top 25, it is way to early, that is why the AP poll is meaningless right now, no one knows anything for sure. It is simply a opinion poll based on who people think are better with very little evidence.

 

[Hurleyman216]

I do think Florida is a Top 10, that is why I listed them there.

I agree 100% that no one can say UConn couldn't beat any of the top 10 teams, but no one can say they can, and no one can say they could beat someone like Iowa State or others in the Top 25, it is way to early, that is why the AP poll is meaningless right now, no one knows anything for sure. It is simply a opinion poll based on who people think are better with very little evidence.

We get your opinion already that the polls are useless Jerry...nothing like beating a dead horse. But your arguments for SOS and what constitutes a "good" team are weak at best. You think Virginia is a good team? Most nights they struggle to score 50 points. Did you happen to see the game they put up 38 on Wisconsin? Look, I realize people thought they would be decent this year, but they aren't. Right now, with the conference they're in that team is not even going to sniff the NCAA tournament and the NIT may even be a stretch for them. They will have a below .500 ACC conference record, mark it down. You keep throwing out these crap teams as being "good" but then you devalue wins that we have against a solid Florida team, BC and Indiana. Just stop already. And say what you want about the Kenpom ratings, but this time of year they're no more accurate than any of the other polls, so don't use them to try to prove a point. Everyone knows SOS can be gamed (we've done it before ourselves) and Witchita St. is a perfect example. Again, not a single team they've played is even within spitting distance of being a top 25 team. Have you actually watched them play? I bet you couldn't name a single player on their team, but yet you put them ahead of UConn because we played a putrid half of basketball against Stanford. If you think Florida is a top 10 team than so are we. There's so much pessimism on this board that no one seems to realize how bad a lot of these top 10-15 teams are. We've also got 2 guys that can break a defense down and score at will at the end of a game, most teams don't even have 1. Just remember we've gone 11-1 with essentially NO center and Daniels and Calhoun have not played well. I can't wait until Feb/March when we get some experience for our big guys and we start playing to our potential...if we can get Brimah and Nolan going forget top 10, we will be a top 5 team.

 

[Jerry1714]

I devalue a win against BC because they are terrible. The fact you can even reference that win is astonishing. Take off the uconn blue glasses and wake up.

St. louis is receiving votes, is that not spitting distance to being in the top 25? They have two single digit loses to WSU and Wisky, but yea they suck, and BC is a good.....

Baker, Cotton and Early. Quit while you are behind Ollie

 

[Hurleyman216]

I devalue a win against BC because they are terrible. The fact you can even reference that win is astonishing. Take off the uconn blue glasses and wake up.

St. louis is receiving votes, is that not spitting distance to being in the top 25? They have two single digit loses to WSU and Wisky, but yea they suck, and BC is a good.....

Baker, Cotton and Early. Quit while you are behind Ollie

As bad as BC is, at least they've played a good schedule. If Witchita St. had played BC's schedule not only would they have multiple losses, but we'd all have a feel for what kind of team they are. How does it feel to be the biggest on the Boneyard? You must feel so good waking up every morning posting from your pedestal. As bad as you think BC is, they will end up with more ACC wins than Virginia because they can score more than 50 points a game. You can continue to hate on UConn like you continuously do, but we'll be in the mix in March. Better get on board while you can because this team is going to be a tough out come March/April.

 

[Jerry1714]

As bad as BC is, at least they've played a good schedule. If Witchita St. had played BC's schedule not only would they have multiple losses, but we'd all have a feel for what kind of team they are. How does it feel to be the biggest on the Boneyard? You must feel so good waking up every morning posting from your pedestal. As bad as you think BC is, they will end up with more ACC wins than Virginia because they can score more than 50 points a game. You can continue to hate on UConn like you continuously do, but we'll be in the mix in March. Better get on board while you can because this team is going to be a tough out come March/April.

It must be tough not being able to understand what people write. I said we should be ranked higher, I just said we are not a top 10 team at the moment (nor have do we have the resume to prove we are).

4-9 BC is off to a great 0-1 start in the ACC with a HOME loss to maryland. Where can I sign up for this UVA v. BC bet?

 

[Hurleyman216]

It must be tough not being able to understand what people write. I said we should be ranked higher, I just said we are not a top 10 team at the moment (nor have do we have the resume to prove we are).

4-9 BC is off to a great 0-1 start in the ACC with a HOME loss to maryland. Where can I sign up for this UVA v. BC bet?

LOL...You just signed up pal. Good luck with your UVA team. You realize they have THE WORST offensive #'s out of any of the power 5 conferences and it isn't even close? I'm sure you knew that since you're a basketball genius that has all of the Kenpom ratings memorized. UVA should do great in a league of high scoring teams with their #315 ranked offense. I'm sure they'll have no problem holding Duke, UNC, or Syracuse to 50 points, right? You'll be lucky if they win 3 games in the ACC. All you see is the # of W's in front of UVA and you assume they don't suck, but all their wins are against cupcakes. Not only will BC have a better league record, BC will slaughter UVA when they play head to head and I don't even like BC...

 

[Jerry1714]

LOL...You just signed up pal. Good luck with your UVA team. You realize they have THE WORST offensive #'s out of any of the power 5 conferences and it isn't even close? I'm sure you knew that since you're a basketball genius that has all of the Kenpom ratings memorized. UVA should do great in a league of high scoring teams with their #315 ranked offense. I'm sure they'll have no problem holding Duke, UNC, or Syracuse to 50 points, right? You'll be lucky if they win 3 games in the ACC. All you see is the # of W's in front of UVA and you assume they don't suck, but all their wins are against cupcakes. Not only will BC have a better league record, BC will slaughter UVA when they play head to head and I don't even like BC...

If you actually used kenpom ratings you would know thats wrong, you simply looked at their PPG. Their adjusted O by kenpom is 152 What is not wrong is the fact BC has the 298th adjusted defense in the country, worst out of the power 5, and almost worse in the country. UVA is 8th, BCU gave up almost 90 to FAU, look forward to how they do in the league.

BC is rated between fordahm and datmouth by sargain, kenpom thinks more highly of them, has them between oakland and weber state, but I forgot everyone is wrong but you, they are the best 4-9 team ever.

 

[methodology]

LOL...You just signed up pal. Good luck with your UVA team. You realize they have THE WORST offensive #'s out of any of the power 5 conferences and it isn't even close? I'm sure you knew that since you're a basketball genius that has all of the Kenpom ratings memorized. UVA should do great in a league of high scoring teams with their #315 ranked offense. I'm sure they'll have no problem holding Duke, UNC, or Syracuse to 50 points, right? You'll be lucky if they win 3 games in the ACC. All you see is the # of W's in front of UVA and you assume they don't suck, but all their wins are against cupcakes. Not only will BC have a better league record, BC will slaughter UVA when they play head to head and I don't even like BC...

You are sounding like a fool by stating numbers but ignoring what is happening behind the scenes to get to those numbers. UVA is a very solid team and I would not be surprised to see them get into the tourney this year (they should make it there).

UVA offense is not ranked 315, as you claim, maybe if you take just raw numbers you get that but if you normalize the numbers their offense is ranked 152 (middle of the pack) for offensive efficiency. Their eFG% is ranked 163. So no they are not a bottom of the barrel offensive team. They play at a pace of only 63 possessions per a game which ranks 340 out of 351 for slowest paces/fewest possessions. Its pretty simple less possessions = less points/scoring opportunities.

Their defense is 8th in the nation for efficiency, they are 14th for fewest FT attempts by opponent (play great D without fouling), 27th eFG% defense, and 9th in the nation on defense at preventing offensive rebounds. That is what they are built on and that has always been a trademark of Tony Bennett teams.

News flash Wisky is the same type of team thus why only 38 points were scored by UVA. Just because they aren't flashy doesn't mean UVA is a poop team.

VCU, SMU, Green Bay, Wiscy, Tenn is a pretty good OOC schedule.

 

[Hurleyman216]

You are sounding like a fool by stating numbers but ignoring what is happening behind the scenes to get to those numbers. UVA is a very solid team and I would not be surprised to see them get into the tourney this year (they should make it there).

UVA offense is not ranked 315, as you claim, maybe if you take just raw numbers you get that but if you normalize the numbers their offense is ranked 152 (middle of the pack) for offensive efficiency. Their eFG% is ranked 163. So no they are not a bottom of the barrel offensive team. They play at a pace of only 63 possessions per a game which ranks 340 out of 351 for slowest paces/fewest possessions. Its pretty simple less possessions = less points/scoring opportunities.

Their defense is 8th in the nation for efficiency, they are 14th for fewest FT attempts by opponent (play great D without fouling), 27th eFG% defense, and 9th in the nation on defense at preventing offensive rebounds. That is what they are built on and that has always been a trademark of Tony Bennett teams.

News flash Wisky is the same type of team thus why only 38 points were scored by UVA. Just because they aren't flashy doesn't mean UVA is a poop team.

VCU, SMU, Green Bay, Wiscy, Tenn is a pretty good OOC schedule.

You guys can spin the #'s any way you want, but the fact is the UVA is one of the worst scoring teams in the entire country. Wisconsin gets by with their slow-it-down half court style of play in the Big 10 because the Big 10 has been predominantly a lower scoring, half court league. The ACC is the total opposite. UVA is not going to slow down teams like Syracuse, UNC or Duke like they could with OOC opponents. How successful would Wisconsin be in the ACC? Probably not very successful with their current style of play, they would have to adjust. As a GENERAL rule, the better team dictates the tempo of the game. UVA will not be able to dictate the tempo in the ACC in very many games. Can they adjust to the faster style of play? We'll see, but my money is on them not winning many games.

 

[methodology]

If you took kenpom, statsheet sagarin, and massey and averaged them the top 25 would look like this:

1. Zona71.75
2. OSU133.25
3. OKST164
4. Wisky174.25
5. Cuse194.75
6. Nova307.5
7. Iowa St328
8. Kansas379.25
9. Wichita4310.75
10. Mich St4411
11. Florida5313.25
12. Louisville5513.75
13. Oregon5714.25
14. Kentucky6015
15. Iowa6416
16. Duke6416
17. Umass6917.25
18. Pitt7117.75
19. Baylor7418.5
20. Memphis8320.75
21. Zags8922.25
22. Colorado9022.5
23. SDSU9724.25
24. Creighton10325.75
25. UNC10626.5
26. Uconn10726.75

 

[methodology]

You guys can spin the #'s any way you want, but the fact is the UVA is one of the worst scoring teams in the entire country. Wisconsin gets by with their slow-it-down half court style of play in the Big 10 because the Big 10 has been predominantly a lower scoring, half court league. The ACC is the total opposite. UVA is not going to slow down teams like Syracuse, UNC or Duke like they could with OOC opponents. How successful would Wisconsin be in the ACC? Probably not very successful with their current style of play, they would have to adjust. As a GENERAL rule, the better team dictates the tempo of the game. UVA will not be able to dictate the tempo in the ACC in very many games. Can they adjust to the faster style of play? We'll see, but my money is on them not winning many games.

Its not spin its the actual facts of the matter.

If a team only shoots 40 shots a game how on gods green earth are they suppose to score more than 60? Explain number guru.... At shooting 50% and 30% of those made shots being 3s that comes out to (28+18= 46 points then take into account 10 made FT and that's 56 points scored).

Now take a team that shoots 60 shots a game but only shoots 40%.... 34+21+10= 65 points.

Based on your logic example B is the better offensive team because they score more points however they are actually less efficient and not as good a team but the raw numbers (that you solely rely on) paint a false picture.

 

[Jerry1714]

LOL...You just signed up pal. Good luck with your UVA team. You realize they have THE WORST offensive #'s out of any of the power 5 conferences and it isn't even close? I'm sure you knew that since you're a basketball genius that has all of the Kenpom ratings memorized. UVA should do great in a league of high scoring teams with their #315 ranked offense. I'm sure they'll have no problem holding Duke, UNC, or Syracuse to 50 points, right? You'll be lucky if they win 3 games in the ACC. All you see is the # of W's in front of UVA and you assume they don't suck, but all their wins are against cupcakes. Not only will BC have a better league record, BC will slaughter UVA when they play head to head and I don't even like BC...

BC loses at home again, UVA picks up a big road win.......And your argument that you cannot name 10 better teams then UConn, well.......

 

[mauconnfan]

Just curious how everyone is feeling about the AP poll right about now?

Not rubbing it in just saying it's worthless…..we were never the 9th best team and honestly we aren't worst than 25 teams………they just need to play better now!

 

[GlastonTim]

Starting tomorrow night!

 

[Jerry1714]

LOL...You just signed up pal. Good luck with your UVA team. You realize they have THE WORST offensive #'s out of any of the power 5 conferences and it isn't even close? I'm sure you knew that since you're a basketball genius that has all of the Kenpom ratings memorized. UVA should do great in a league of high scoring teams with their #315 ranked offense. I'm sure they'll have no problem holding Duke, UNC, or Syracuse to 50 points, right? You'll be lucky if they win 3 games in the ACC. All you see is the # of W's in front of UVA and you assume they don't suck, but all their wins are against cupcakes. Not only will BC have a better league record, BC will slaughter UVA when they play head to head and I don't even like BC...

UVA now 3-0 in the league with 2 road wins. I thought I would be lucky if they won 3 games in the ACC??

This posting is priceless

 

[Jerry1714]

LOL...You just signed up pal. Good luck with your UVA team. You realize they have THE WORST offensive #'s out of any of the power 5 conferences and it isn't even close? I'm sure you knew that since you're a basketball genius that has all of the Kenpom ratings memorized. UVA should do great in a league of high scoring teams with their #315 ranked offense. I'm sure they'll have no problem holding Duke, UNC, or Syracuse to 50 points, right? You'll be lucky if they win 3 games in the ACC. All you see is the # of W's in front of UVA and you assume they don't suck, but all their wins are against cupcakes. Not only will BC have a better league record, BC will slaughter UVA when they play head to head and I don't even like BC...

Was the BC slaughter of UVA taking place when they were down 20 with 5 to go? Oh no that was UVA, that team you claimed would be luckily to win 3 games in the ACC, moving to 9-1 while BC is stuck at 2 wins. Good thing you don't put money on your basketball opinions......