AP poll 2/4: How far will UConn drop?

[Vowelguy]

I have been "lectured" all morning that Quality Wins mean MORE than bad losses.

Please don't pretend you're trying to understand. It's clear you had your mind made up before you started responding to this thread.

And btw, yes, for the committee, Quality Wins _do_ matter more than bad losses.
This thread is about the AP sports writers poll. NC doesn't have 1 bad loss. It had many. It is slowly gaining voters' respect, but it's hard to know which is the real UNC team. If they keep doing well, they will be ranked.

 

[Vowelguy]

I totally understand why they are not in the top 25, but if I had a ballot, they would be on it.

Likely for me as well, but voters vote on inertia and UNC had so many negative points from earlier in the year, hard for them to climb out.

Not to mention that the team that moved in Miami is 7-2 in conf while UNC is just 5-4.

 

[DefenseBB]

Please don't pretend you're trying to understand. It's clear you had your mind made up before you started responding to this thread.

And btw, yes, for the committee, Quality Wins _do_ matter more than bad losses.
This thread is about the AP sports writers poll. NC doesn't have 1 bad loss. It had many. It is slowly gaining voters' respect, but it's hard to know which is the real UNC team. If they keep doing well, they will be ranked.

VG, I would add that the sheer number of losses, 9 of them, outweighs the 2 quality wins so that @PAHuskeyFan can “chew” on that. Massey has them at #30 and they are playing very well right now so it’s not like they are overlooked, they need to keep it up...much to my chagrin

 

[Plebe]

VG, I would add that the sheer number of losses, 9 of them, outweighs the 2 quality wins so that @PAHuskeyFan can “chew” on that. Massey has them at #30 and they are playing very well right now so it’s not like the are overlooked, they need to keep it up...much to my chagrin

Because the AP voters and the committee follow very different processes and rationales, it's not unusual for a team's AP ranking to differ significantly from their seeding.

But in UNC's case, interestingly, the two are almost the same: The AP poll has them in 28th place while Charlie has them at 27th.

 

[PAHuskeyFan]

Please don't pretend you're trying to understand. It's clear you had your mind made up before you started responding to this thread.

And btw, yes, for the committee, Quality Wins _do_ matter more than bad losses.
This thread is about the AP sports writers poll. NC doesn't have 1 bad loss. It had many. It is slowly gaining voters' respect, but it's hard to know which is the real UNC team. If they keep doing well, they will be ranked.

That was a bit harsh.

 

[Vowelguy]

This came up recently: when are the Top16 rankings coming out? Gotta be this week, Id think.

 

[Plebe]

This came up recently: when are the Top16 rankings coming out? Gotta be this week, Id think.

I saw where someone asked Charlie and he said Feb. 11. Presumably at halftime of the SC game.

 

[Vowelguy]

I saw where someone asked Charlie and he said Feb. 11. Presumably at halftime of the SC game.

CORRECT!
11 Feb & 4 Mar
Road to the Championship | NCAA.com

 

[DefenseBB]

Sounds like a “lovefest” between @Plebe and @vowelguy, NOT THAT THERE’S ANYTHING WRONG WITH THAT!....

 

[Plebe]

CORRECT!
11 Feb & 4 Mar
Road to the Championship | NCAA.com

Color me mildly disappointed because last year, IIRC, they did 3 reveals spaced 2 weeks apart. This year it's only 2 spaced 3 weeks apart. Less for my geeky self to look forward to

 

[IWearShoes]

In looking at the way the pollsters voted, I am particularly perplexed by Percy Allen of the Seattle Times. Last week, he did not even have SC ranked, and this week, his ranking of SC falls way outside that of each other pollster by a long shot. Then, upon further investigation, I have to seriously question his logic. He clearly is either not taking his responsibility seriously, or he hasn't watched any women's basketball games this year and only looks at final scores and ignores opponents, SOS, actual flow of games (some scores are definitely not true pictures of how close the game was played, i.e. ND/Louisville, SC/MSU, etc.). For example, he still has NCSU ranked #6 despite losing to unranked UNC and having an overall weak schedule thus far this season. He also has TAMU and Kentucky ranked in the top 15, and BYU is listed at #25 despite taking 2 losses this week to unranked teams. I understand rankings are more for the fans than anything, particularly at this point of the season; however, I believe if you are tasked with the responsibility of casting a ballot, you should at least put forth some effort.

No, he's clearly a mad genius. Has MSU at #2.

Honestly, not easy to defend some of his positioning to put it mildly.

 

[Carnac]

I guess I don't understand the philosophy behind the rankings. IMO, if you're a top 5 team, and you lose to an UNRANKED opponent, that is a very bad loss, and you should drop down in the rankings accordingly.
Similar to if you defeat the #1 team while unranked, you should move in to the top 25 accordingly.

At least into the top half of the top 25. Why? If the #1 team is ranked at the top, it's because they are "perceived" to be better than all the teams BELOW them. Usually they are an "elite" major that has a very strong and dominant team, who theoretically would beat everyone ranked below them. I can also understand that if an unranked team did beat #1, that does not mean they are better than all of the other top 25 teams, and consequently not does it mean they would/could defeat any or all of them. If you do not deserve to be in the top 25, you won't be there long.

I thought #1 ND should have dropped a lot further than they did after their loss to North Carolina. NC was only 2 games over .500 (11/9) at the time. Not exactly a team on the rise. They only fell 4 spots to #5. Not far enough. Not because they are ND, but because they were #1. I can only imagine the tenor of the comments here if UConn were to lose to an unranked AAC opponent.

When you fall from the top, you can usually work your way back near the top, IF there's enough time. UConn falling to #5 seems right to me. They lost to the team immediately below them in the rankings. I guess that some sort of "standard" should be established that we can all use (and feel comfortable with) to judge the weight of a loss, or a win. Because judging from the comments here, we're clearly not all using the same unit(s) of measurement. i.e., losing to a top 25 opponent would not be as bad (and not considered a "bad" loss) as much as losing to an unranked opponent.

The way UConn is playing right now, and based on the way they struggled with unranked Cincinnati (14-8) Saturday and using the simple "eye test", I'm not sure they could beat any of the other top 12 teams if they played them tonight. Right now UConn is out of sync, and it cannot be assumed what those results would be. When they're in sync and clicking on all cylinders like they were against UCF (19-3). They posted a 36 point win over a much better UCF team than Cincinnati. There were in sync and running on all cylinders. They are a true top 5 team when they are right, and could very well win the NC come April.

 

[Bajan Best]

To me This is all a bunch of nonsense, not that it matters anyways..
But For augments sake lets just acknowledge the following;

Baylor has a collection of "Better wins"
And Uconn has a collection of "Better Losses"
Then shouldn't the tie-breaker be head to head matchup?
And I haven't even looked at whether games were played on the road or at home etc

Bottom Line, a win is a win and a loss is a loss. Anything else is excuses to justify preferences.

They were ranked and un-ranked teams in past years who played UConn close, but just because that team presented a better matchup to UCONN on a given night did not mean they were automatically the 2nd best team in the country. Just as when Uconn beat the 2nd ranked team in the country by 25 points it didn't mean the team should drop below all the other teams that played Uconn closer..

In my book all Losses are bad and all wins are good, period.

 

[PAHuskeyFan]

Dear @vowelguy apparently my attempt to use logic to understand this process is not just me...as per posts from @Scoop and @Bajan Best above. And...in reply to your previous comments to me...my comments were in the line of the AP poll voters... I didn't make the leap to braketology except to indicate that Charlie Creme IS NOT (as far as anyone has ever said) one of the committee that makes the final Brackets.

SO... I attempted to use Logic to understand a process that is not built on logic. That's all.

 

[hussybulldog]

AP ranking is like Oscar voters, they don’t have to know the teams/games, they vote according to their personal likes. I trust coaches’ ranking better. Tomorrow we will see UConn ranked ahead of ND. It does not matter how pretty one paints ND’s loss to NC, it ain’t prettier than UConn’s loss to either Baylor or Louisville, one can’t say the former one was a quality loss. One can argue last week’s Stanford’s two losses are “quality losses” but certainly not ND’s. A pig with lipsticks, shall we say?

 

[triaddukefan]

Having watched them the last two Sundays, I find it hard to believe they are not one of the best 25 teams right now.

I also can't understand how they lost to the likes of Ohio State and Colorado earlier this year. They are truly a mystery.

I totally understand why they are not in the top 25, but if I had a ballot, they would be on it.

 

[DallasBUFan]

I don't agree is Iowa State at 22. I also don't think A&M deserves to be 18 either.

 

[Orangutan]

In looking at the way the pollsters voted, I am particularly perplexed by Percy Allen of the Seattle Times.

His rankings caught my eye as well because he had NC State at 6 and ND at 7, which is quite a unique take. I'll spare everyone the big rant, but the big criticism against ND that they lost to unranked UNC obviously doesn't play here given that NC State lost by more and at home.

I checked the guys twitter. No tweets that I could find about women's college basketball over the last several days. It appears his primary beat is Washington men's basketball. Makes you wonder

 

[Vowelguy]

A poll ranking should be who are the best teams. If someone really thinks UConn is better than ND right now, then they'll rank them higher.
Looking at how UConn has played lately, I would not agree with that assessment.

 

[JordyG]

Yeah, times are tough. UConn is only number 4. I guess Geno's must be on suicide watch.

 

[Plebe]

The 2/11 game in Storrs will be absolutely no cakewalk. UConn will have to bring it or else the Boneyard will completely implode.

Oops actually I just checked the schedule and it’s in Hartford. Either way ...

 

[triaddukefan]

As an aside..... these abbreviations are confusing me when i go through this and other threads. MSU? Im thinking Michigan State... OSU.... Im thinking Oklahoma State I saw a SC ... a NC ... Southern Cal ? National Championship?

 

[Fightin Choke]

As an aside..... these abbreviations are confusing me when i go through this and other threads. MSU? Im thinking Michigan State... OSU.... Im thinking Oklahoma State I saw a SC ... a NC ... Southern Cal ? National Championship?

What I hate is when people write "LV" when they mean Louisville. I always associate that with the Lady Vols.

 

[IWearShoes]

MSU? Im thinking Michigan State...

So Mississippi State hasn't done enough in the last 3 seasons to earn national use of MSU on a Women's BB board. Tough crowd.

When I use it I kinda assume my avatar and the name below it help.

 

[JordyG]

As an aside..... these abbreviations are confusing me when i go through this and other threads. MSU? Im thinking Michigan State... OSU.... Im thinking Oklahoma State I saw a SC ... a NC ... Southern Cal ? National Championship?

What I hate is when write "LV" when they mean Louisville. I always associate that with the Lady Vols.

With me it's always MSS for Mississippi State, UT for Tenn, Okla State for you know what. Avoids confusion.