All you need to know about Aresco

[upstater]

Thank you I didn't realize that. Note I said the math that you and Nelson like to do.

None of these schools are being valued in a vacuum. What any school gets is a product of the timing and the schools it shares a conference with. Tulane isn't as valuable as UConn any more than Washington State is as valuable as USC.

The Catholics are getting more longterm because they needed to get paid to split. I have no idea where the idea that any content had value but that was one of Waylon's common refrains: it's never been true. It's always been about quality and the Big East has zero quality that is committed to being there.

Wow, what in the world is wrong with you? What you wrote it totally irrelevant to what I wrote. Go back and read because you are clearly confused.

 

[whaler11]

But, doesn't that tell you that the CYO7 deal is wildly overpriced?

If the Catholics are worth $4 million per, and the current conference bball teams are worth $600k, then Butler, Xavier and Richmond are worth $22 million more a year than UConn, Louisville, Notre Dame, Cincinnati, Memphis, Rutgers, Temple, and CUSA.

This pretty much blows the theory out of the water that TV networks pay for competition. This is what Frank the Tank argued, but then how do you explain next season? Just like stocks, some things are overvalued, some things are undervalued. Talk to Warren Buffett. He bought Bank of America at 6 and people said he was crazy.

My response upstater is to this: Butler, Xavier and Richmond are not worth $22 million more than the Big East membership next year. Only you and Waylon seem to think the math works like that.

 

[Fishy]

Play the aggressor for one. I am so tired of hearing on this board that UConn should simply accept the fate others are determining for us. Why not stand up for UCONN? Why not tell the rest of the country and the Big 5 how we value ourselves? Perception becomes reality and if we perceive our worth to be tied with the NBE, I am sure the Big 10 and ACC will believe it as well. Its clear nothing will be handed to UConn so if our plan is simply to wait our turn, good luck. Instead, play the aggressor, and go out and get it!

In other words, you have no idea.

 

[Fishy]

The math is absolutely right. Frank argued that the league had so little value because the games would suck. That's an acceptable argument. But now that we see what the Big East is worth when UConn, ND, Louisville, Cincy, Memphis are in it, the argument loses power, because clearly next year's BE is going to blow away both the year after's BE AND the CYO7 in content. This literally means that content does not equal cash $.

His argument was that Fox overpaid in order to induce the C7 to split off of the Big East.

We'll have to see what the numbers end up being, but it seems plausible.

 

[upstater]

His argument was that Fox overpaid in order to induce the C7 to split off of the Big East.

We'll have to see what the numbers end up being, but it seems plausible.

He made a lot of arguments. I was talking about the one in which specifically he wrote that the value is determined by the competition (i.e. the content). That makes sense to me and I agreed with it in a vacuum. But this is different. Something else is certainly going on. And I can understand Fox overpaying, but $40 million for 10 or 12 versus $10 million for 18 when the 18 includes UConn, Louisville, and Notre Dame--now that is not credible. So clearly this is not solely about overpaying nor about the level of competition.

 

[upstater]

My response upstater is to this: Butler, Xavier and Richmond are not worth $22 million more than the Big East membership next year. Only you and Waylon seem to think the math works like that.

Then explain it, Einstein.

 

[sportsart]

Whaler11 vs Upstater.....phew. Now back to UConn vs Depaul. Not sure which matchup is more exciting.

 

[CL82]

And then what?

And then abiding by the majority wishes. It least it gives us a chance to say we think were more, much more then what was offered. I think we are silent far too often and it lets a mythology of mediocrity hang about us like the stank of the town dump.

 

[Fishy]

And then abiding by the majority wishes. It least it gives us a chance to say we think were more, much more then what was offered. I think we are silent far too often and it lets a mythology of mediocrity hang about us like the stank of the town dump.

There is such an insane desire for grand, futile gestures around here.

It's meaningless - completely.

 

[whaler11]

Then explain it, Einstein.

Wow you really believe the math works like that. This is the same formula that yields -131 million in Waylon's world.

Honestly if you are so obtuse to believe that methodology it's not even worth attempting to explain anymore because you'll never get it.

 

[RS9999X]

ESPN refused to pay one penny in premium for
the 1 transition year and that has meaning in evaluating individual teams?

Sent from my Lumia 920 via Windows 8. Now bite me Apple Droids.

 

[jbdphi]

ESPN refused to pay one penny in premium for
the 1 transition year and that has meaning in evaluating individual teams?

Sent from my Lumia 920 via Windows 8. Now bite me Apple Droids.

You could argue that they paid a discount since it is only for one year's worth of that content and it is the base year at that. There is no true valuation behind all of this. Fox may be paying a premium for the C7 or ESPN might be underpaying for the NBE or maybe it is a mix of both. Nobody knows the actual answer.

 

[The Funster]

Pay cheap for one year then market the crap out of "The Big East Death Tour" and reap a windfall of cash. ESPN ain't dumb.

 

[RS9999X]

When's the last time anyone saw Tulane sports?

You could ask people in New Orleans the same question. Tulane is to Louisiana sports what Yale is to CT television viewers. This is the problem. Villanova football is looking good again.

Sent from my Lumia 920 via Windows 8. Now bite me Apple Droids.

 

[djct1999]

In other words, you have no idea.

I do know its not rolling over and playing dead. Because, essentially, that's what will happen. In the nbe, our programs will die.

 

[Danzz]

Aresco didn't deliver a lucrative TV deal so in that sense he failed. To be fair, he can't make the market or put lipstick on a pig and make the NBE more attractive than it is.

 

[upstater]

Wow you really believe the math works like that. This is the same formula that yields -131 million in Waylon's world.

Honestly if you are so obtuse to believe that methodology it's not even worth attempting to explain anymore because you'll never get it.

No one even knows what you are talking about.

 

[upstater]

ESPN refused to pay one penny in premium for
the 1 transition year and that has meaning in evaluating individual teams?

Sent from my Lumia 920 via Windows 8. Now bite me Apple Droids.

$10 million for 18 for Louisville, UConn, ND.
$40 million for 10/12 without Louisville, UConn, ND.

That's not a premium, it doesn't fit your definition.

 

[whaler11]

$10 million for 18 for Louisville, UConn, ND.
$40 million for 10/12 without Louisville, UConn, ND.

That's not a premium, it doesn't fit your definition.

This is what I'm talking about:

You are trying to measure the real values of individual programs using what the collectives are paid. IT CAN'T BE DONE. The values of the collectives are not the sums of the individuals. What the collectives get paid is a function of timing, opportunity, contractual obligations, how the contract holder can monetize the rights....

Rutgers is the easiest and perfect example: Had the Big 10 not come calling they would be in the Big East getting paid peanuts, yet they were able to garner an invite to the Big 10 for twice the money of the ACC who consistently ignored them. Rutgers' absolute value is different in the Big East and the Big 10 - there is nothing inherently different about Rutgers in those two conferences - what changes is WHO THEY PLAY and how the contract holder monetizes the rights.

The C7 contract will be higher for a number of reasons. It won't be because of the INHERENT value of Butler, Xavier, Creighton, VCU, Richmond, St. Louis or whoever else they dig up. It will be because the collective can take advantage of timing, opportunity and most importantly the contractual obligation that requires Fox to overpay the schools to leave the Big East.

So please stop with the Nelson-math. We all know that one number is bigger than the other. That you can't seem to understand why is the agonizing piece.

 

[CL82]

There is such an insane desire for grand, futile gestures around here.

It's meaningless - completely.

Says the guy who had the Blutarsky avatar of 8 months....
What's so bad about saying we think we're worth more; we think this is a bad deal? The lack of self-promotion for the university may not be the reason why we are in this spot, but it sure isn't helping us. We need to change our narrative, and no one else is going to do it for us.

 

[upstater]

This is what I'm talking about:

You are trying to measure the real values of individual programs using what the collectives are paid. IT CAN'T BE DONE. The values of the collectives are not the sums of the individuals. What the collectives get paid is a function of timing, opportunity, contractual obligations, how the contract holder can monetize the rights....

No, I'm not measuring real values of teams. You can't get that even though I pointed it out numerous times. I stated facts. When you add Butler, Richmond and Xavier the contract skyrockets. That doesn't mean those teams are worth more. It means that the CYO7 contract is being valued by something other than the collective parts, and the level of competition, which is obviously much lower. In other words, Frank's point about the level of competition doesn't hold true. And that's what I wrote originally before you jumped in with inane negative value comments.

 

[zls44]

We know Fox is overpaying for the C7. They're doing it to get a national network off the ground.

They spend money. NBC is all talk. Difference.

 

[upstater]

We know Fox is overpaying for the C7. They're doing it to get a national network off the ground.

They spend money. NBC is all talk. Difference.

Let me put it to you guys this way. There is now an incentive to get Louisville, Rutgers, the CYO7, etc., out of the conference as soon as possible. You don't lose any money by doing so, you only make money.

 

[RS9999X]

What they did was terra forming and are skimming the best.

The C-7 will have a territorial stamp, a brand identity. I'd rank it the 3rd best conference behind the ACC and BiG once the smoke clears.

In any given year it will be better than the MVC, the SEC, the PAC-12, the remaining A-10 or NNBE or C-USA. Better than the Big-12 most years.

Lunardi has the Big Ten leading the pack with 7 bids. The ACC will top that next year.

The Big 12 has 6 but Baylor played their way off the list with 3 losses in a row. Next update the Big-12 is down to 5 teams.

The PAc-12 has 6 but AZ State lost with its 88 RPI and is likely looking in and the PAC-12 down to 5 teams.


The C-12?

Here's the potential C-12 teams with bids this years
Butler
VCU
Georgetown
Marquette
St Louis
Villanova
Creighton

Bubble
St Johns
Xavier (They play the top 3 teams in their last 4 games. 3 home games out of 4).

That deserves a premium price tag. The 3rd best conference.

The NNBE? The 8th best behind the MWC the C-12 and the Big 5. A 4 bid conference if Temple and Cincy schedule enough good schools OOC to raise their RPI. Otherwise it's like the old A-10. 4 decent teams playing for 3 slots

 

[upstater]

What they did was terra forming and are skimming the best.

The C-7 will have a territorial stamp, a brand identity. I'd rank it the 3rd best conference behind the ACC and BiG once the smoke clears.

In any given year it will be better than the MVC, the SEC, the PAC-12, the remaining A-10 or NNBE or C-USA. Better than the Big-12 most years.

Lunardi has the Big Ten leading the pack with 7 bids. The ACC will top that next year.

The Big 12 has 6 but Baylor played their way off the list with 3 losses in a row. Next update the Big-12 is down to 5 teams.

The PAc-12 has 6 but AZ State lost with its 88 RPI and is likely looking in and the PAC-12 down to 5 teams.


The C-12?

Here's the potential C-12 teams with bids this years
Butler
VCU
Georgetown
Marquette
St Louis
Villanova
Creighton

Bubble
St Johns
Xavier (They play the top 3 teams in their last 4 games. 3 home games out of 4).

That deserves a premium price tag. The 3rd best conference.

The NNBE? The 8th best behind the MWC the C-12 and the Big 5. A 4 bid conference if Temple and Cincy schedule enough good schools OOC to raise their RPI. Otherwise it's like the old A-10. 4 decent teams playing for 3 slots

I wonder sometimes if you guys even know how to read.

I am not discussing here the future NBE versus the CYO7.

If your point is that this conference you list above is better than a conference without Butler and Xavier but with Louisville, UConn, Notre Dame, then you are hopelessly lost.

 

[upstater]

No sooner than I posted about the incentive for Louisville and the like to leave ASAP but now Blauds says that in the next few days, the CYO7 exit will be all settled.

But the money is so short that it simply doesn't matter much for UConn if it's split 18 ways or 10 ways. UConn is better off playing the 18 teams next year.

 

[RS9999X]

But the money is so short that it simply doesn't matter much for UConn if it's split 18 ways or 10 ways. UConn is better off playing the 18 teams next year.

It could be the last decent conference schedule in my life time Boo Hoo.

If Nappier and Wolfe come back UConn will be one of the favorites to win. I'm all for that.

 

[RS9999X]

I wonder sometimes if you guys even know how to read.

I am not discussing here the future NBE versus the CYO7.

If your point is that this conference you list above is better than a conference without Butler and Xavier but with Louisville, UConn, Notre Dame, then you are hopelessly lost.

The point is the C7 is getting paid fairly as is the NNBE. The transition year doesn't matter. The break up only matters in the sense they are creating a better league not because they are getting paid to leave.

 

[upstater]

The point is the C7 is getting paid fairly as is the NNBE. The transition year doesn't matter. The break up only matters in the sense they are creating a better league not because they are getting paid to leave.

10m to 40m isn't a premium. It's an exponential rise. And fairness has little to do with it. My only point is that it's certainly not based on level of competition. Absolutely no one can argue that since the CYO7 will have an inferior product.

 

[gars44]

This is just a money play. We don't have any choices. It's not the value of the content driving this deal. It's the fact that if we don't take it, there is no other place to go. ESPN is basically saying, "here it is, eat or starve, your choice." Hard and real business.

Some of these suggestions that we make a statement and quit? And do what? Fold the program for a year?