All Players Attending Hurley Presser

[JMick]

He sold a system to kids, and then felt obligated to roll with it when they couldn't run it, it seems.

The concept is pretty deadly, in theory. It's nearly impossible to run in the NBA. Really only the Warriors can run it. Which means it's completely impossible to teach to college kids who are 18-19, especially when half the team are transfers.

You need multiple people who can dribble and make decisions. This team had one guy who could do both, and we played like we had 4-5. Hence the record.

Part of me thinks he thought he could fill the roster with athletic looking guys and "just" teach them to shoot. It's the only explanation.

 

[djct1999]

He sold a system to kids, and then felt obligated to roll with it when they couldn't run it, it seems.

The concept is pretty deadly, in theory. It's nearly impossible to run in the NBA. Really only the Warriors can run it. Which means it's completely impossible to teach to college kids who are 18-19, especially when half the team are transfers.

You need multiple people who can dribble and make decisions. This team had one guy who could do both, and we played like we had 4-5. Hence the record.

Is this a subtle way of saying antione Anderson and David O. won't be on the Warriors next season?

 

[tzznandrew]

Part of me thinks he thought he could fill the roster with athletic looking guys and "just" teach them to shoot. It's the only explanation.

You can make kids shoot a lot and fix their mechanics, but so many of the basics of shooting are ingrained by the time they are 18 you better goshdarn hope you have gym rats who can shoot enough to build the muscle memory up in a rebooted shot.

The players we recruited--no offense to them at all--didn't seem to have that after 2014. Adams, for instance, hasn't really improved his 3pt%. That just doesn't seem logical to me. It's literally the one thing that keeps him from being unguardable.

 

[JMick]

You can make kids shoot a lot and fix their mechanics, but so many of the basics of shooting are ingrained by the time they are 18 you better goshdarn hope you have gym rats who can shoot enough to build the muscle memory up in a rebooted shot.

The players we recruited--no offense to them at all--didn't seem to have that after 2014. Adams, for instance, hasn't really improved his 3pt%. That just doesn't seem logical to me. It's literally the one thing that keeps him from being unguardable.

I don't know anything about Adams but considering he hasn't gotten any better shooting the three I have to think he was getting no instruction or just wasn't putting the work in.

 

[tzznandrew]

I don't know anything about Adams but considering he hasn't gotten any better shooting the three I have to think he was getting no instruction or just wasn't putting the work in.

That's my sense too. It's baffling. Again, I posted the Shabazz shooting numbers. Giffey's and Daniel's are similar. Kids struggle at first, and then get better. The Brian Fairs and Rashad Andersons are usually the exception rather than the rule.

 

[djct1999]

I don't know anything about Adams but considering he hasn't gotten any better shooting the three I have to think he was getting no instruction or just wasn't putting the work in.

This board loves to over rate Adams. There are some things he does well and there are many he doesn't. Would love to see what Hurley can do with him next year. I may be wrong, but in three years he has never impressed me. And I am homer.

 

[intlzncster]

You can make kids shoot a lot and fix their mechanics, but so many of the basics of shooting are ingrained by the time they are 18 you better goshdarn hope you have gym rats who can shoot enough to build the muscle memory up in a rebooted shot.

The players we recruited--no offense to them at all--didn't seem to have that after 2014. Adams, for instance, hasn't really improved his 3pt%. That just doesn't seem logical to me. It's literally the one thing that keeps him from being unguardable.

I think his % will increase if he isn't forced to do absolutely everything on offense for 40 minutes, all the while guarded by 2-3 guys.

 

[Towney007]

He sold a system to kids, and then felt obligated to roll with it when they couldn't run it, it seems.

The concept is pretty deadly, in theory. It's nearly impossible to run in the NBA. Really only the Warriors can run it. Which means it's completely impossible to teach to college kids who are 18-19, especially when half the team are transfers.

You need multiple people who can dribble and make decisions. This team had one guy who could do both, and we played like we had 4-5. Hence the record.

The concept is a pile of dog S at the college level. MAYBE a team that recruits like Kentucky could do it where you have 4-5 guys who are incredibly long, tall and can shoot from everywhere. At 95% of college basketball programs, it's not possible. Probably more. It's utterly dependent on high basketball IQ personnel with multiple physical advantages and highly developed skills. That's basically 1-4 kids in college.

And even if it was doable - Ollie didn't recruit players who were like that *at all*. Maybe Hamilton could kind of fit that bill. Larrier certainly did from a physicality POV. Outside of that, it was him just not giving direction to kids who not only needed it, but were screaming for it.

And even if it was doable AND Ollie recruited guys like that - when it doesn't work for years at a time - *you change it*. It's indescribable.

And based on his rotations, talent evaluations, etc - I'm 1,000% convinced at this point that he never had any real grasp on the talent he had at it disposal and even less of an idea as to how to use it. No one really evolved all that much or seemingly made progress. Adams is a little better offensively, but still non-existent on defense. Brimah could never really progress being a one-tool foul fest. Hamilton could never find conistency in his shot. He misused guys all over the court - some of which was driven by injury, but most of it due to the fact that he had no idea how to even structure a roster. I mean The University of Connecticut had a year where we didn't have a real point guard *on the entire roster*. UConn. The best guard school in the country. No actual, dedicated point guard. Not even an injured one. That's *nuts*.

And then again - mix it in with the rumors that swirled around, the transfers, the lack of trust/connection with many of his players, coaches... It's hard to make it more clear that you don't have a single, solitary idea of what you're doing - or at the very least, demonstrate that you're in a job that's just categorically way over your head.

He was awful. Great human being. Awful, awful, awful basketball coach.

 

[Towney007]

And for the record, there isn't a single guy i'm sitting on pins and needles to come back. The more, the better. Good for them, good for us. But There isn't a single guy i'm going to lose a sliver's worth of a second thought to losing from a basketball standpoint. Half the team isn't good enough to be here - and clearly not good enough to be here. Some of them seem like good kids, but yikes.

 

[JMick]

The concept is a pile of dog S at the college level. MAYBE a team that recruits like Kentucky could do it where you have 4-5 guys who are incredibly long, tall and can shoot from everywhere. At 95% of college basketball programs, it's not possible. Probably more. It's utterly dependent on high basketball IQ personnel with multiple physical advantages and highly developed skills. That's basically 1-4 kids in college.

And even if it was doable - Ollie didn't recruit players who were like that *at all*. Maybe Hamilton could kind of fit that bill. Larrier certainly did from a physicality POV. Outside of that, it was him just not giving direction to kids who not only needed it, but were screaming for it.

And even if it was doable AND Ollie recruited guys like that - when it doesn't work for years at a time - *you change it*. It's indescribable.

And based on his rotations, talent evaluations, etc - I'm 1,000% convinced at this point that he never had any real grasp on the talent he had at it disposal and even less of an idea as to how to use it. No one really evolved all that much or seemingly made progress. Adams is a little better offensively, but still non-existent on defense. Brimah could never really progress being a one-tool foul fest. Hamilton could never find conistency in his shot. He misused guys all over the court - some of which was driven by injury, but most of it due to the fact that he had no idea how to even structure a roster. I mean The University of Connecticut had a year where we didn't have a real point guard *on the entire roster*. UConn. The best guard school in the country. No actual, dedicated point guard. Not even an injured one. That's *nuts*.

And then again - mix it in with the rumors that swirled around, the transfers, the lack of trust/connection with many of his players, coaches... It's hard to make it more clear that you don't have a single, solitary idea of what you're doing - or at the very least, demonstrate that you're in a job that's just categorically way over your head.

He was awful. Great human being. Awful, awful, awful basketball coach.

I'm watching Villanova do it right now so it's not impossible but like you said it's highly unlikely. I think you can do it but I don't think he knew what he needed or was unable to get the kids he needed to run it. Or he got them and then they transferred when they realized what was going on.

 

[tzznandrew]

And for the record, there isn't a single guy i'm sitting on pins and needles to come back. The more, the better. Good for them, good for us. But There isn't a single guy i'm going to lose a sliver's worth of a second thought to losing from a basketball standpoint. Half the team isn't good enough to be here - and clearly not good enough to be here. Some of them seem like good kids, but yikes.

Adams is legitimately the difference between a 20-22 win season and a potential NCAA berth, and a .500 record.

 

[tzznandrew]

I'm watching Villanova do it right now so it's not impossible but like you said it's highly unlikely. I think you can do it but I don't think he knew what he needed or was unable to get the kids he needed to run it. Or he got them and then they transferred when they realized what was going on.

You need to start with the shooters and develop them elsewhere. He did the reverse...

 

[Towney007]

I'm watching Villanova do it right now so it's not impossible but like you said it's highly unlikely. I think you can do it but I don't think he knew what he needed or was unable to get the kids he needed to run it. Or he got them and then they transferred when they realized what was going on.

Like I said - in a given year 1-4 teams can probably do it per year in college hoops. That leaves 342 teams who can't.

And I mean you can choose any of those reasons I listed as to why it was a dumb idea. At the end of the day, it was a complete failure.

 

[JMick]

You need to start with the shooters and develop them elsewhere. He did the reverse...

you can't teach a kid who throws 80mph how to throw 90mph...

 

[djct1999]

The concept is a pile of dog S at the college level. MAYBE a team that recruits like Kentucky could do it where you have 4-5 guys who are incredibly long, tall and can shoot from everywhere. At 95% of college basketball programs, it's not possible. Probably more. It's utterly dependent on high basketball IQ personnel with multiple physical advantages and highly developed skills. That's basically 1-4 kids in college.

And even if it was doable - Ollie didn't recruit players who were like that *at all*. Maybe Hamilton could kind of fit that bill. Larrier certainly did from a physicality POV. Outside of that, it was him just not giving direction to kids who not only needed it, but were screaming for it.

And even if it was doable AND Ollie recruited guys like that - when it doesn't work for years at a time - *you change it*. It's indescribable.

And based on his rotations, talent evaluations, etc - I'm 1,000% convinced at this point that he never had any real grasp on the talent he had at it disposal and even less of an idea as to how to use it. No one really evolved all that much or seemingly made progress. Adams is a little better offensively, but still non-existent on defense. Brimah could never really progress being a one-tool foul fest. Hamilton could never find conistency in his shot. He misused guys all over the court - some of which was driven by injury, but most of it due to the fact that he had no idea how to even structure a roster. I mean The University of Connecticut had a year where we didn't have a real point guard *on the entire roster*. UConn. The best guard school in the country. No actual, dedicated point guard. Not even an injured one. That's *nuts*.

And then again - mix it in with the rumors that swirled around, the transfers, the lack of trust/connection with many of his players, coaches... It's hard to make it more clear that you don't have a single, solitary idea of what you're doing - or at the very least, demonstrate that you're in a job that's just categorically way over your head.

He was awful. Great human being. Awful, awful, awful basketball coach.

I realized a long time ago through my own apathy that this wasn't going well. After hearing we landed Hurley, the feelings about this program that I had always felt for years rushed back. It was at this tim that I finally realized the depths of how bad things were. I like KO and I wondered today how he felt. I wondered if he was relieved it was over. I don't doubt for one second his love for this university and this program. I don't know I will ever understand what happened to get us to this point. The last two years were that brutal.

 

[tzznandrew]

Like I said - in a given year 1-4 teams can probably do it per year in college hoops. That leaves 342 teams who can't.

And I mean you can choose any of those reasons I listed as to why it was a dumb idea. At the end of the day, it was a complete failure.

You better work your ass off and get a bunch of 6-5 to 6-9 guys.

Oops.

 

[Towney007]

Adams is legitimately the difference between a 20-22 win season and a potential NCAA berth, and a .500 record.

Maybe.

He's also an open scholarship that could be used to get a good player who'll be here a long time. Either way - it's being used well.

Based off of what I saw this year, I'm not really sure where this team is. Yeah, probably better with Adams than without - but this team's had him two years and haven't been close to good enough to be in. It's mostly the same personnel - so until I see otherwise, I'm not sure he's a difference maker on that kind of level. Just because i'm not sure this team is on that level.

That being said, i'd much rather have him than not. And I'm extremely optimistic that this team looks completely different with an actual adult in the room who knows what he's doing.

Still - my look is long-term, I guess. Next year is a colossal, fat whatever.

 

[djct1999]

Adams is legitimately the difference between a 20-22 win season and a potential NCAA berth, and a .500 record.

Only if he buys in to what Hurley is preaching.

 

[tzznandrew]

you can't teach a kid who throws 80mph how to throw 90mph...

You can improve a shot, but even by the time I'm coaching kids at 14, there's a huge difference between those who have the fundamentals and those who coaches let shoot however they want. The latter camp can improve, but they just need to devote themselves to the gym and shoot so many shots they don't remember shooting shots. That's literally the only way.

 

[Towney007]

I realized a long time ago through my own apathy that this wasn't going well. After hearing we landed Hurley, the feelings about this program that I had always felt for years rushed back. It was at this tim that I finally realized the depths of how bad things were. I like KO and I wondered today how he felt. I wondered if he was relieved it was over. I don't doubt for one second his love for this university and this program. I don't know I will ever understand what happened to get us to this point. The last two years were that brutal.

This is literally the first familiar old-UConn feeling I've had in years was this weekend. Honestly. There isn't a single thing this program has done or really that the ADept. as a whole has done since winning a national title in 2014 that 'felt right'. Sometimes it's not about counting beans - it's just doing the right thing. And they clearly did the right thing and you can clearly feel that undertone in the UConn community right now. Not to be an out-there nerd, but these kinds of things always have an energy about them and you could really feel the difference.

 

[mhshuskies]

As much as I liked KO and was really hoping it would work out for him, I get a feeling we have taken a step toward Where UCONN should be, ALWAYS in the conversation for championships!

 

[JMick]

You can improve a shot, but even by the time I'm coaching kids at 14, there's a huge difference between those who have the fundamentals and those who coaches let shoot however they want. The latter camp can improve, but they just need to devote themselves to the gym and shoot so many shots they don't remember shooting shots. That's literally the only way.

athletic intelligence is a thing and (almost) every single pro has it. it's also something most high level athletes are just born with. a lot of kids have good habits when they're 7 or 8 years old before they've ever been coached and 9 times out of 10 those are the kids that make it. I remember growing up with a kid who was just good at everything. He never played baseball before age 12 and he decided to play one year and was the best player in the league. then he picked up lacrosse in high school and got a D1 scholarship.

 

[the Q]

We were one of the worst teams in America last year. Let that sink in.

If we do win the conference tournament, it will be a miracle.

It might take a while for the kids to understand what it takes. This isn't like a lightswitch.

2 hurley classes.

And I’m just gonna keep saying Akinjo and Harris (after uri releases him from his Loi) In their senior year will be a final four contender.

Until those 2 are total impossibilities I’m gonna stock with it. Stubborn as all hell. Lol

 

[the Q]

athletic intelligence is a thing and (almost) every single pro has it. it's also something most high level athletes are just born with. a lot of kids have good habits when they're 7 or 8 years old before they've ever been coached and 9 times out of 10 those are the kids that make it. I remember growing up with a kid who was just good at everything. He never played baseball before age 12 and he decided to play one year and was the best player in the league. then he picked up lacrosse in high school and got a D1 scholarship.

I hate those kinds of kids.

 

[Towney007]

You can improve a shot, but even by the time I'm coaching kids at 14, there's a huge difference between those who have the fundamentals and those who coaches let shoot however they want. The latter camp can improve, but they just need to devote themselves to the gym and shoot so many shots they don't remember shooting shots. That's literally the only way.

Well - you can help kids who throw 80 throw 90. There's ways to do it.

But I do agree, there's levels to everything. Some kids just have a physical gear others don't. Things come easier, more effortlessly and without expending a lot of energy. There's also that mentally - where kids can learn at a high level, digest a lot of information, process it and even pass it along to others. To be good in college sports, you need a good mix of both of these. Some might have more of one than the other, but whatever works for your team at that time is what you need to do. And if you're lucky enough to be able to get a human who can do both - you have a pretty special player.

A coach's job - #1 - is to do that.

Job #2 is getting the most out of the skills they have and bringing them to the next level.

Ollie had no idea how to do #1. Because of that, he just couldn't do #2 even if he wanted to. The few times he had the chance, he proved he couldn't do it.