ACC wants UConn if ND comes too

[noeynox]

Spin it how you like. The two sides have differing interests and they were unable to overcome them. The bball side pushed nova, the fb side balked and proposed say UCF, for arguments sake the bball side balked.

Who knows how much of what we read on the net is true, but supposedly the PITT president wanted to push for 12 in football and the bball side wasn't comfortable with that.

Bottom line, when you have a league where members will leave as soon as they are offered by another BCS league. That model doesn't work. For all the talk of the SEC raiding the ACC it hasn't happened and the SEC makes more money than the ACC.

 

[The Funster]

Wouldn't the service academies be for football only? Height restrictions put them at a serious disadvantage for hoops. Can't see any of them in a big conference for that reason.

 

[upstater]

The idea that a school would wrap a ball and chain around it instead of a life preserver is laughable. When the inevitable day comes that conferences like the BE and Big12 are sunk and lose their BCS bids due to defections, the last thing a school like UConn needs is Providence demanding both a huge chunk of money and/or their TV rights. Signing over your children makes you less attractive for potential conferences.

 

[Icebear]

The idea that a school would wrap a ball and chain around it instead of a life preserver is laughable. When the inevitable day comes that conferences like the BE and Big12 are sunk and lose their BCS bids due to defections, the last thing a school like UConn needs is Providence demanding both a huge chunk of money and/or their TV rights. Signing over your children makes you less attractive for potential conferences.

Yes, that would be about the most inane move possible.

 

[noeynox]

Agree. You would be better off letting yourself be kicked out the league than slitting your own wrist signing that.

That agreement may work in the Big 12, because as long as Texas and Oklahoma are in that conference they ain't losing their BCS bid. Who exactly is the big east's Texas or Oklahoma that is going to ensure the bid?

 

[upstater]

The entire discussion here needs to reset. Start with this fundamental question: do you believe that the big schools are intent on creating 4 superconferences in order to maximize revenue?

If you think the concept of the superconference is real and not a fantasy, then you simply do not adhere gorilla glue to yourselves and entities which stand a teeny chance of ever being admitted into a superconference. The logic is simple. If you want to use Elmer's sparkling glue stick, that's fine. But gorilla glue? Get out.

The superconference idea is also why UConn stands to be invited into the ACC, and it likewise explains why the ACC--as the weakest of the 4 potential superconferences--jumped first. And will likely jump again to 16 and soon. They want the best candidates for inclusion. If they come to feel that Notre Dame will really prefer say the Big10, they'll move on quickly. Why? Because eventually the Big12 will go to 16 too.

I don't know what the Pac10 is thinking but it seems to me that there are no other 4 schools in there region but for the ones they already talked to.

The horse has left the barn, superconferences are coming. If they weren't, we would not be seeing the SEC inviting Missouri, the ACC taking Pitt and Cuse. Now it's just a question of musical chairs.

 

[ctchamps]

The entire discussion here needs to reset. Start with this fundamental question: do you believe that the big schools are intent on creating 4 superconferences in order to maximize revenue?

If you think the concept of the superconference is real and not a fantasy, then you simply do not adhere gorilla glue to yourselves and entities which stand a teeny chance of ever being admitted into a superconference. The logic is simple. If you want to use Elmer's sparkling glue stick, that's fine. But gorilla glue? Get out.

The superconference idea is also why UConn stands to be invited into the ACC, and it likewise explains why the ACC--as the weakest of the 4 potential superconferences--jumped first. And will likely jump again to 16 and soon. They want the best candidates for inclusion. If they come to feel that Notre Dame will really prefer say the Big10, they'll move on quickly. Why? Because eventually the Big12 will go to 16 too.

I don't know what the Pac10 is thinking but it seems to me that there are no other 4 schools in there region but for the ones they already talked to.

The horse has left the barn, superconferences are coming. If they weren't, we would not be seeing the SEC inviting Missouri, the ACC taking Pitt and Cuse. Now it's just a question of musical chairs.

According to your scenario there will be five super conferences of 16: the ACC, B12, PAC, SEC and the B!G.

I'd love the reset to go back to someone explaining to me why this four of sixteen model is etched in stone and what is the rational exists that for this model by all those advocating this model.

 

[EricLA]

I'm not knocking you here, but I just don't understand this one. When the Big East dies, and the Catholic leagues reform into a smaller conference, what's to stop ND from parking its teams with the Catholics and staying independent in football?

that was my thought and is what i think ND will do. what incentive do they have to leave the ranks of the independents? they make more money that way. why join a league and make less?

 

[gars44]

If Louisville, USF, WVU, Cincy, TCU and us stay together, I think we can be fine for a while. But we're taking an ACC invite if it ever comes.

Exactly the problem with this league. So is everybody else.

 

[ctchamps]

that was my thought and is what i think ND will do. what incentive do they have to leave the ranks of the independents? they make more money that way. why join a league and make less?

I believe that ND has a tie into BE's BCS bid which they could lose if there are no BE football teams. Someone could clarify this. If they lose this they still have the NBC contract (not sure if details were ever disclosed) and will have to decide if the loss of BCS affiliation can hurt them in the future.

 

[2Infinity]

The ACC is never adding UConn and Rutgers. But hey, let's keep the dream alive.

As Funster asks you ...where is your proof of this...any proof?! Unlike you, I believe there is enough circumstantial evidence emerging that makes me believe UConn is quite likely to be invited to join the ACC. In fact, I believe that UConn officials may have been told of their favorable standing and are now in the mode of securing votes. That would help explain the phone call to, and now the rumored meeting with, the BC president by Prez Herbst. I'm not certain BC's vote is needed, but why not try to point out to BC, all of the positives which could accrue to them if UConn were admitted. If you're able to convince your chief antagonist, then you may also get any possible fence-sitters to come over to your side as well.

There are other reasons I believe this may already be at this stage. Granted, they are circumstantial in nature, but nonetheless, when gathered from different sources and locations, they begin to have much more credibility. Among them is Coach P's statement that we WILL be in a BCS conference. How does he KNOW this, especially with the future of the BE's automatic BCS bid now in question? Another is the well connected sports radio host in Raleigh suggesting that his sources have told him that UConn is in line to be invited in a matter of weeks. Finally, we have coaches K and Williams stating they would like to see the ACC expand to 16 teams. Why would two high profile basketball coaches who wield a lot clout in their conference say this publicly? Why not just be happy with the two new additions and ONLY talk about them? Could it be because they know the ACC is on the verge of adding one of the strongest basketball programs in the nation to their league? Are these facts? No! However, the composite picture is beginning to cast a favorable light on UConn's garnering an ACC invite.

 

[nelsonmuntz]

The idea that a school would wrap a ball and chain around it instead of a life preserver is laughable. When the inevitable day comes that conferences like the BE and Big12 are sunk and lose their BCS bids due to defections, the last thing a school like UConn needs is Providence demanding both a huge chunk of money and/or their TV rights. Signing over your children makes you less attractive for potential conferences.

No one is leaving the Big 12 unless the whole league dissolves, and that is very hard to pull off, which is why everyone is stuck there.

Your plan would be to jump off the boat without a life preserver and hope that the submarine that torpedoed us will let us on board. That seems like the height of stupidity, no?

We are not going to the ACC. It is time we all faced that reality. If the ACC wanted to invite us, they would have invited us. I bet there are a lot of posters on this board who spent a lot of Saturday's at home in high school waiting for girls to leave their boyfriends. I bet most of you were doing her homework for her too. Think through what Swofford is doing. Is there any logical reason for him to add UConn right now? I can't think of one.

UConn has ONE OPTION right now: Saving the Big East. Every other option results in the end of UConn's athletic program. Furthermore, if UConn is about to sign an agreement that will take it off the table for five years, it will force Swofford's hand. If you live in a fantasy world and think the ACC really wants us, my approach is the best approach. If you are a reality based person and you realize they only want to destroy us, my approach is the best approach. Why is this so difficult for people to understand?

 

[ctchamps]

No one is leaving the Big 12 unless the whole league dissolves, and that is very hard to pull off, which is why everyone is stuck there.

Your plan would be to jump off the boat without a life preserver and hope that the submarine that torpedoed us will let us on board. That seems like the height of stupidity, no?

We are not going to the ACC. It is time we all faced that reality. If the ACC wanted to invite us, they would have invited us. I bet there are a lot of posters on this board who spent a lot of Saturday's at home in high school waiting for girls to leave their boyfriends. I bet most of you were doing her homework for her too. Think through what Swofford is doing. Is there any logical reason for him to add UConn right now? I can't think of one.

UConn has ONE OPTION right now: Saving the Big East. Every other option results in the end of UConn's athletic program. Furthermore, if UConn is about to sign an agreement that will take it off the table for five years, it will force Swofford's hand. If you live in a fantasy world and think the ACC really wants us, my approach is the best approach. If you are a reality based person and you realize they only want to destroy us, my approach is the best approach. Why is this so difficult for people to understand?

Things are just being set up for the players to leave the league. They are going through the process that has already be informally agreed upon by the respective parties.

 

[nelsonmuntz]

As Funster asks you ...where is your proof of this...any proof?! Unlike you, I believe there is enough circumstantial evidence emerging that makes me believe UConn is quite likely to be invited to join the ACC. In fact, I believe that UConn officials may have been told of their favorable standing and are now in the mode of securing votes. That would help explain the phone call to, and now the rumored meeting with, the BC president by Prez Herbst. I'm not certain BC's vote is needed, but why not try to point out to BC, all of the positives which could accrue to them if UConn were admitted. If you're able to convince your chief antagonist, then you may also get any possible fence-sitters to come over to your side as well.

There are other reasons I believe this may already be at this stage. Granted, they are circumstantial in nature, but nonetheless, when gathered from different sources and locations, they begin to have much more credibility. Among them is Coach P's statement that we WILL be in a BCS conference. How does he KNOW this, especially with the future of the BE's automatic BCS bid now in question? Another is the well connected sports radio host in Raleigh suggesting that his sources have told him that UConn is in line to be invited in a matter of weeks. Finally, we have coaches K and Williams stating they would like to see the ACC expand to 16 teams. Why would two high profile basketball coaches who wield a lot clout in their conference say this publicly? Why not just be happy with the two new additions and ONLY talk about them? Could it be because they know the ACC is on the verge of adding one of the strongest basketball programs in the nation to their league? Are these facts? No! However, the composite picture is beginning to cast a favorable light on UConn's garnering an ACC invite.

I think Swofford is a total scumbag and his sole objective is to destroy the Big East and preserve his job, as cheaply as possible. We have lots of evidence of this. See: BCU, Miami, VTech, Syracuse, Pitt. If the ACC wanted to add UConn and Rutgers, it would have added UConn and Rutgers.

He will not add UConn unless he absolutely has no other option. So how do we force his hand? One way is to agree to sign an agreement that would make it impossible for UConn to leave the Big East. My guess is he doesn't have the votes to add UConn even if he wanted to, but he doesn't want or need to do anything. If the Big East schools all beg their way out, and someone else is successful, than Swofford accomplished his objective of destroying the Big East without spending any more money. If the league stays together in some format and he wants the schools later, he will not move until he absolutely has to. We have to force that to happen before the league just implodes on its own.

I think it is silly that so many posters would think that a guy who has tried to destroy UConn's athletic program is a friend and will help us, but hopefully I can disabuse you of that fantasy.

 

[upstater]

According to your scenario there will be five super conferences of 16: the ACC, B12, PAC, SEC and the B!G.

I'd love the reset to go back to someone explaining to me why this four of sixteen model is etched in stone and what is the rational exists that for this model by all those advocating this model.

64 is fewer than 80. Money split among fewer members. I don't understand your point about the B12 by the way. If Okie, OSU, Missouri, TT and Tex are gone from the Big12, how is the B12 a super conference? To get to 16, three conferences have to decimate the Big12.

 

[The Funster]

No one is leaving the Big 12 unless the whole league dissolves, and that is very hard to pull off, which is why everyone is stuck there.

Your plan would be to jump off the boat without a life preserver and hope that the submarine that torpedoed us will let us on board. That seems like the height of stupidity, no?

We are not going to the ACC. It is time we all faced that reality. If the ACC wanted to invite us, they would have invited us. I bet there are a lot of posters on this board who spent a lot of Saturday's at home in high school waiting for girls to leave their boyfriends. I bet most of you were doing her homework for her too. Think through what Swofford is doing. Is there any logical reason for him to add UConn right now? I can't think of one.

UConn has ONE OPTION right now: Saving the Big East. Every other option results in the end of UConn's athletic program. Furthermore, if UConn is about to sign an agreement that will take it off the table for five years, it will force Swofford's hand. If you live in a fantasy world and think the ACC really wants us, my approach is the best approach. If you are a reality based person and you realize they only want to destroy us, my approach is the best approach. Why is this so difficult for people to understand?

Sorry, I think people understand your position but simply don't agree with it. You keep saying we are not going to the ACC and offer only one reason why and that is the fact that we haven't been offered yet. There are valid reasons why we haven't been offered yet, reason that do not preclude us ever receiving an offer. You discount that potentiality but offer no reason why.

Plus, you keep making a lot of lovelorn analogies. Personal issues?

 

[Carl Spackler]

If something is worth a dollar, and you can get it for 50 cents, you go get it. I don't have any problem with the ACC taking the action they've taken, or Syracuse and Pittsburgh acting in their own interests.

I will have a problem with the ACC if they don't finish the job they started, and leave the Northeast market in rubble.

Because you know what, universities and students, and chancellors and fans will be annoyed and upset.

But if the ACC causes the northeast television market around live college sports to turn into a disaster, there are some much more powerful business interests in the world that are going to be a lot more pissed at the ACC than university officials and fans.

 

[businesslawyer]

I believe that ND has a tie into BE's BCS bid which they could lose if there are no BE football teams. Someone could clarify this. If they lose this they still have the NBC contract (not sure if details were ever disclosed) and will have to decide if the loss of BCS affiliation can hurt them in the future.

NO. ND does not have a tie in to the Big East's BCS slot -- ND's access to the BCS comes from a separate agreement it has with the BCS. ND going to the BCS does not take the Big East's slot.

ND's bowl tie ins with the Big East at the moment are limited to taking the Champs once in a four year cycle.

 

[nelsonmuntz]

Sorry, I think people understand your position but simply don't agree with it. You keep saying we are not going to the ACC and offer only one reason why and that is the fact that we haven't been offered yet. There are valid reasons why we haven't been offered yet, reason that do not preclude us ever receiving an offer. You discount that potentiality but offer no reason why.

Plus, you keep making a lot of lovelorn analogies. Personal issues?

Why would Swofford pay another $30 million a year for something, the New York/New England market, that he can get for free when UConn and Rutgers join the MAC. He has absolutely no incentive to expand, because time helps him. If the Big East dissolves, as he hopes, he is NEVER, EVER offering UConn or Rutgers. Why would he add two future MAC teams? If the Big East looks like it might survive, maybe he sticks another shiv in the conference and takes UConn and Rutgers. He has to think the league is going to survive to do that.

If, as I suspect, he doesn't want UConn or Rutgers anyway and doesn't have the votes to add them if he did, then we get to work on rebuilding the Big East as soon as possible.

 

[mets1090]

Why would Swofford pay another $30 million a year for something, the New York/New England market, that he can get for free when UConn and Rutgers join the MAC. He has absolutely no incentive to expand, because time helps him. If the Big East dissolves, as he hopes, he is NEVER, EVER offering UConn or Rutgers. Why would he add two future MAC teams? If the Big East looks like it might survive, maybe he sticks another shiv in the conference and takes UConn and Rutgers. He has to think the league is going to survive to do that.

If, as I suspect, he doesn't want UConn or Rutgers anyway and doesn't have the votes to add them if he did, then we get to work on rebuilding the Big East as soon as possible.

He would add UConn and/or Rutgers now because eventually they have to get to 16 teams (assuming the 4x16 model emerges) and Rutgers and UConn would make the most sense. The reason he would do it sooner rather than later is because of what you just said. If UConn goes to the MAC, the football program probably loses value. That chops off one of the ACC's options when they do choose to go to 16 teams.

If they can't get ND and another higher value program, they will take UConn IMO.

 

[ctchamps]

NO. ND does not have a tie in to the Big East's BCS slot -- ND's access to the BCS comes from a separate agreement it has with the BCS. ND going to the BCS does not take the Big East's slot.

ND's bowl tie ins with the Big East at the moment are limited to taking the Champs once in a four year cycle.

Thanks.

 

[upstater]

No one is leaving the Big 12 unless the whole league dissolves, and that is very hard to pull off, which is why everyone is stuck there.
Your plan would be to jump off the boat without a life preserver and hope that the submarine that torpedoed us will let us on board. That seems like the height of stupidity, no?

We are not going to the ACC. It is time we all faced that reality. If the ACC wanted to invite us, they would have invited us. I bet there are a lot of posters on this board who spent a lot of Saturday's at home in high school waiting for girls to leave their boyfriends. I bet most of you were doing her homework for her too. Think through what Swofford is doing. Is there any logical reason for him to add UConn right now? I can't think of one.

UConn has ONE OPTION right now: Saving the Big East. Every other option results in the end of UConn's athletic program. Furthermore, if UConn is about to sign an agreement that will take it off the table for five years, it will force Swofford's hand. If you live in a fantasy world and think the ACC really wants us, my approach is the best approach. If you are a reality based person and you realize they only want to destroy us, my approach is the best approach. Why is this so difficult for people to understand?

If your bolded remark above is proven wrong this week, do you promise never to make such statements ever again?

 

[2Infinity]

I think Swofford is a total scumbag and his sole objective is to destroy the Big East and preserve his job, as cheaply as possible. We have lots of evidence of this. See: BCU, Miami, VTech, Syracuse, Pitt. If the ACC wanted to add UConn and Rutgers, it would have added UConn and Rutgers.

He will not add UConn unless he absolutely has no other option. So how do we force his hand? One way is to agree to sign an agreement that would make it impossible for UConn to leave the Big East. My guess is he doesn't have the votes to add UConn even if he wanted to, but he doesn't want or need to do anything. If the Big East schools all beg their way out, and someone else is successful, than Swofford accomplished his objective of destroying the Big East without spending any more money. If the league stays together in some format and he wants the schools later, he will not move until he absolutely has to. We have to force that to happen before the league just implodes on its own.

I think it is silly that so many posters would think that a guy who has tried to destroy UConn's athletic program is a friend and will help us, but hopefully I can disabuse you of that fantasy.

NM..I'm not a fan of Swofford's either! I think his tactics are far from admirable! In fact, he's probably a great poker player! lol I don't believe he is attempting to destroy the BE and UConn specifically, but rather to weaken it and cherry-pick the best schools. One thing is certain, he is not being stopped from doing so, by a proactive BE administration! The reality is that the Big East has chosen to dilute it's power by having two factions rather than one. This has caused us to lack unity in mission. After the raid in 2003, the leadership decided to remain in that structure. Even now, after raid 2, they show no signs of altering format. This will only lead to further league weakness, especially as the other leagues consolidate power and become even more so! So the time has come for a top flight university to move on. It's really unfortunate to have to say that...there are so many great BE memories! But if we don't decide our own fate now, someone else will for us!

The reason the ACC has not added UConn, as of yet, is that they don't want to bring in a single school as the 15th. They are waiting on ND to decide if it will join as well. That's seems to be a real long shot at this point. I'm sure they thought the Pac-12 was going to 16 with UT joining. As such, ND may have felt more inclined to make a move into a conference as well...and there was the ACC invite, ready and waiting for them. As it is now, they are a lot less likely to accept, unless they see the BE falling apart entirely, endangering ND's use of the BE. If they don't accept, the next in line would seem to be Rutgers. The ACC will announce whichever two schools it ends up being, together. They will also do so proactively by not waiting for the other conferences to move first! That is where I begrudgingly give Swofford some credit.

 

[nelsonmuntz]

If your bolded remark above is proven wrong this week, do you promise never to make such statements ever again?

If the 4 x 16 never happens in our lifetime, what do I get?

 

[intlzncster]

UConn has ONE OPTION right now: Saving the Big East. Every other option results in the end of UConn's athletic program. Furthermore, if UConn is about to sign an agreement that will take it off the table for five years, it will force Swofford's hand. If you live in a fantasy world and think the ACC really wants us, my approach is the best approach. If you are a reality based person and you realize they only want to destroy us, my approach is the best approach. Why is this so difficult for people to understand?

I still don't see how this is an option. No matter what happens, the Big East is dead. Whether it's now...or in a few years. All it takes is one domino to fall somewhere to get a whole lot of participants moving. If any BE school gets a sniff of another conference, they are jumping, television deal or no. Even if the BE starts looking good in a few years, any school with the opportunity will jump, mainly because they think any other school will do the same. We've got the ultimate game theory scenario going right now.