ACC, Big Ten...you've chosen poorly

[FDNY99]

Gotta love the strength of UConn Nation this weekend. 6400 for hockey against UVM on Friday night with a puck drop of 8:30pm. The next day, in a blizzard no less, a sellout for a Noon tipoff against Georgetown. Both had good atmospheres. Neither BC or RU can or would do that.

No question whatsoever that with a B1G schedule and competitive record (as we are approaching now), football wouldn't sell out and we can expand the Rent to the 55-60K range that it was designed to hold when first built.

It used to sell out in the BE...attendance rapidly declined when Hathaway hired P

 

[Eddy Hall]

Hey A s s h a t...welcome back...before you even type the word attendance in a thread on our board you should make sure you take a remedial math class. Why...you can't even read numbers properly you :
I seem to remember you denying RU EVER had a game where attendance was 500...you were wrong..it was SUB-500 for 2 games!
Attendance is in bold!
(https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2013–14_Rutgers_Scarlet_Knights_men's_basketball_team)

11/25/2013*
7:30 pm Stillman College
NIT Season Tip-Off Consolation Round W 116–89 4–3
The RAC (392)
Piscataway, NJ
11/26/2013*
7:30 pm Fairleigh Dickinson
NIT Season Tip-Off Consolation Round L 72–73 4–4
The RAC (466)
Piscataway, NJ

You also stated RU has a stand alone football facility...you conveniently forgot the word INDOOR...why because RU doesn't have one!
Here is the link to UConn's in case you want to know what one looks like you tool:
http://www.uconnhuskies.com/school-bio/strength-conditioning-shenkman.html
I suggest at some point you answer this..or stop posting on our board!

You should take it easy on Mainline, that 1949 fencing title Rutgers won as their lone NCAA championship might have gone to his head a little.

 

[J187Money]

There was a golden opportunity to consolidate the northeast and build awareness of college football by keeping UCONN, BC, Rutgers and Syracuse together. Yes, that's not a murderer's row of football powerhouses, but it's one hell of a market that you cover.and UCONN and Syracuse play a little hoops. Now there this market is splintered and local play is hap hazard at best. Small people like DeFelippo are largely to blame for this mess. Sure, BC and Rutgers can feel good about the checks, but in terms of fan experience it's a disaster. And yes, football drives the duck*ing bus, but when you're getting men's basketball crowds in the hundreds...holy crap is it broken. Football will follow if there is not success and with BC you have a fan base that at its best is fickle. This little gem is just priceless: "Although there is still more than a month remaining in the basketball regular season, BC and Rutgers are on course to finish with a combined record of 1-49 in football and basketball."

I didn't think that could possibly be true. And then I looked at the standings. LMFAO.

 

[billybud]

Wes Durham, "voice of the ACC", stated on WRAL talk radio that he thought conferences would go to 16 teams...that the ACC would not get a network channel..etc. Not a "key" but he does have a lot of inside contact.

It is too much to wade through to get the nuggets...he discusses SEC payout, the flack he expects from ACC coaches re the recruiting advantages of a network. About FSU's BOT interest.

He thinks the conferences expand to 16, Notre Dame joins a conference, that if the ACC gets a network it will be some hybrid and not a dedicated channel, talks about a rights fee bump for the ACC ($3 million a team now) possibly in lieu.

http://www.wralsportsfan.com/colleges/audio/15254519/

 

[B1GOSU]

Rutgers doesn't have to be good. In fact, it benefits the rest of the B1G if Rutgers is bad. NJ recruits will be more likely to sign with another B1G school if Rutgers is bad. Adding Rutgers brought $$$$ and recruits into the B1G footprint and is in the AAU on top of that. Having BTN on the TV sets in NJ means the NJ top recruits can go to other B1G schools and have pretty much every game available on TV/internet for their families to watch back home and will allow for away games to be played in NJ in front of said families. So Rutgers can finish in last place in every sport every year and it won't matter.

Now Boston College didn't bring $$$ or recruits to the ACC.

 

[FDNY99]

Rutgers doesn't have to be good. In fact, it benefits the rest of the B1G if Rutgers is bad. NJ recruits will be more likely to sign with another B1G school if Rutgers is bad. Adding Rutgers brought $$$$ and recruits into the B1G footprint and is in the AAU on top of that. Having BTN on the TV sets in NJ means the NJ top recruits can go to other B1G schools and have pretty much every game available on TV/internet for their families to watch back home and will allow for away games to be played in NJ in front of said families. So Rutgers can finish in last place in every sport every year and it won't matter.

Now Boston College didn't bring $$$ or recruits to the ACC.

Nope...just an open palm for the ACC to put their piece of the $$ pie into...LOL

 

[Ldandy]

Rutgers doesn't have to be good. In fact, it benefits the rest of the B1G if Rutgers is bad. NJ recruits will be more likely to sign with another B1G school if Rutgers is bad. Adding Rutgers brought $$$$ and recruits into the B1G footprint and is in the AAU on top of that. Having BTN on the TV sets in NJ means the NJ top recruits can go to other B1G schools and have pretty much every game available on TV/internet for their families to watch back home and will allow for away games to be played in NJ in front of said families. So Rutgers can finish in last place in every sport every year and it won't matter.

Now Boston College didn't bring $$$ or recruits to the ACC.

Somehow everybody in the universe can see this but Rutgers Fans.

 

[billybud]

Recruiting is still fairly regional...Penn State has 21 kids on the roster from New Jersey/NY.

That's more than the 14 that FSU (4) and Miami (10) combined have......neither Florida school really recruits the northeast as a primary area.

Virginia has more kids from the northeast (Pennsylvania, NY/New Jersey, Massachusetts (18) than from Florida.

But Boston College...they have 51 kids from Massachusetts, NY, NJ, Pennsylvania, Connecticut, and New Hampshire (1).

 

[mavblues]

On a semi-related note, I see our #2 rated football recruit de-committed and went on a visit to Rutgers...

 

[dayooper]

Recruiting is still fairly regional...Penn State has 21 kids on the roster from New Jersey/NY.

That's more than the 14 that FSU (4) and Miami (10) combined have.neither Florida school really recruits the northeast as a primary area.

Virginia has more kids from the northeast (Pennsylvania, NY/New Jersey, Massachusetts (18) than from Florida.

But Boston College...they have 51 kids from Massachusetts, NY, NJ, Pennsylvania, Connecticut, and New Hampshire (1).

Depends - Michigan has recruits from all over the place. In fact, they more recruits from NJ (5, with the potential for 2 more) than the entire Midwest (4, with the potential for 2 more). They have no commitments from Ohio or Illinois and only 1 from Michigan (the 2 possible recruits are from Michigan).

The big names will always recruit national, that's why they want schools in talent rich states.

 

[FDNY99]

Recruiting is still fairly regional...Penn State has 21 kids on the roster from New Jersey/NY.

That's more than the 14 that FSU (4) and Miami (10) combined have.neither Florida school really recruits the northeast as a primary area.

Virginia has more kids from the northeast (Pennsylvania, NY/New Jersey, Massachusetts (18) than from Florida.

But Boston College...they have 51 kids from Massachusetts, NY, NJ, Pennsylvania, Connecticut, and New Hampshire (1).

BC has always done well in NJ..especially with the Catholic schools, they have also had good luck on LI...especially at Chaminade

 

[Ldandy]

Depends - Michigan has recruits from all over the place. In fact, they more recruits from NJ (5, with the potential for 2 more) than the entire Midwest (4, with the potential for 2 more). They have no commitments from Ohio or Illinois and only 1 from Michigan (the 2 possible recruits are from Michigan).

The big names will always recruit national, that's why they want schools in talent rich states.

I think it has more to do with available resources than anything else. Schools like Michigan and ND are not located in states blessed with tons of talent. They have to recruit nationally if they want to be on an elite level. While UM has the national profile to pull kids from outside their areas, they could never close ranks and say we're going to build a class of Michigan Kids. It could not sustain their program. OTOH schools like Miami or USC could literally recruit within the confines of the city they are located in and still field credible classes.

While Michigan has always had success in NJ, I am surprised that there has not been more emphasis in the Midwest. Historically Michigan's great teams were built on the backs of Northern Ohio Talent. Its odd to see no one from OH, and only 1 from instate. Very odd. That said Harbaugh probably has different contacts, like California and NJ Private Schools, from his days at Stanford.

 

[Ldandy]

Recruiting is still fairly regional...Penn State has 21 kids on the roster from New Jersey/NY.

That's more than the 14 that FSU (4) and Miami (10) combined have.neither Florida school really recruits the northeast as a primary area.

Virginia has more kids from the northeast (Pennsylvania, NY/New Jersey, Massachusetts (18) than from Florida.

But Boston College...they have 51 kids from Massachusetts, NY, NJ, Pennsylvania, Connecticut, and New Hampshire (1).

I'd wager that recruiting is 80-90% regional for the majority of programs. There are a handful of schools such as Michigan, ND, Duke, NW, Vandy and Stanford who have specific reasons/philosophies for shopping nationally. You also have to throw in The B1G West Division Schools, as the majority of programs are located in states with little home grown talent. If you're Minnesota or Iowa you better be recruiting Texas, Florida, Cali, GA, etc. If not you are in BIG trouble. If FSU or Miami are regularly recruiting NJ, outside of the occasional can't miss prospect, something has gone horribly wrong with their connections at home.

 

[Seaa Blue]

Historically Michigan's great teams were built on the backs of Northern Ohio Talent. Its odd to see no one from OH, and only 1 from instate. Very odd.

What Urban wants...

 

[billybud]

Depends - Michigan has recruits from all over the place. In fact, they more recruits from NJ (5, with the potential for 2 more) than the entire Midwest (4, with the potential for 2 more). They have no commitments from Ohio or Illinois and only 1 from Michigan (the 2 possible recruits are from Michigan).

The big names will always recruit national, that's why they want schools in talent rich states.

This year, out of Michigan's 24 commits, one is from Michigan. But, to be fair, that is a Harbough thing, there are 41 Michigan guys on the current roster.

But...you are right about national recruiting. Even sitting in the recruiting hot bed of Florida...FSU has recruits this year from New York, Pennsylvania, Kansas, California, Missouri, North Carolina, Virginia, and Georgia.

 

[billybud]

I'd wager that recruiting is 80-90% regional for the majority of programs. There are a handful of schools such as Michigan, ND, Duke, NW, Vandy and Stanford who have specific reasons/philosophies for shopping nationally. You also have to throw in The B1G West Division Schools, as the majority of programs are located in states with little home grown talent. If you're Minnesota or Iowa you better be recruiting Texas, Florida, Cali, GA, etc. If not you are in BIG trouble. If FSU or Miami are regularly recruiting NJ, outside of the occasional can't miss prospect, something has gone horribly wrong with their connections at home.

You are right...teams out of region will attempt to cherry pick an area...Last year, three of FSU's starting 11 on offense were from New Jersey. Schools will go out of state for needs. Some northern schools look south for DB's and speedy WR's/RB's. Florida schools look north for offensive lineman.

 

[billybud]

I will now go where angels fear to tread...talk race, genetics, and football recruiting.

There is a reason that every single medalist in the men's 100 meter for the last five Olympics has ancestral origins in West Africa. It can not be a coincidence. West Africans, as a whole, have more fast twitch muscle cells and different leg muscle physiology from northern european derived peoples. It is no coincidence that 13% of the US population is so heavily represented in football/basketball and track.

It is no coincidence that you do not see Black power lifters medal at the Olympics or world meets. That is a northern european thing. The ice age evolved europeans to have shorter limbs to conserve heat. And it is no coincidence that you see more Whites playing O line than wide receiver. And, controversially, recent findings show that the average person with ancestry based in europe, has some Neanderthal DNA while Africans do not.

It is not a coincidence that Ohio State's two deep at LB, CB, and safety last year were African American.

There are exceptions to every rule...e,g. you'll have a Joey Bosa or Wes Welker....

But...I think that programs that do not have access to a black population of high school football players will find it more difficult to compete at the highest level

 

[pj]

I will now go where angels fear to tread...talk race, genetics, and football recruiting.

There is a reason that every single medalist in the men's 100 meter for the last five Olympics has ancestral origins in West Africa. It can not be a coincidence. West Africans, as a whole, have more fast twitch muscle cells and different leg muscle physiology from northern european derived peoples. It is no coincidence that 13% of the US population is so heavily represented in football/basketball and track.

It is no coincidence that you do not see Black power lifters medal at the Olympics or world meets. That is a northern european thing. The ice age evolved europeans to have shorter limbs to conserve heat. And it is no coincidence that you see more Whites playing O line than wide receiver. And, controversially, recent findings show that the average person with ancestry based in europe, has some Neanderthal DNA while Africans do not.

It is not a coincidence that Ohio State's two deep at LB, CB, and safety last year were African American.

There are exceptions to every rule...e,g. you'll have a Joey Bosa or Wes Welker....

But...I think that programs that do not have access to a black population of high school football players will find it more difficult to compete at the highest level

Angels don't fear to tread there, everyone knows it ... but who doesn't have access to blacks? They are all over the country. It's true SEC country has more, which may be their largest source of competitive advantage. However, among football playing schools, only Nebraska/Minnesota/Iowa/Colorado/Utah are in a region with low black population. http://www.indexmundi.com/facts/uni.../all-states/black-population-percentage#chart

 

[billybud]

Your chart makes one wonder why New York, with a similar size population, and a higher percentage of Blacks, does not put out the football players that Florida does.

Urban basketball orientation? Spring weather?

 

[SubbaBub]

Kids and kids parents like to be able to go to the games. Regional schools and regional conference mates allow that to occur more often. That is why regional football matters.

No kid is picking UConn over Ohio State, but he might pick UConn over Iowa State if he is from Florida.

 

[noeynox]

I will now go where angels fear to tread...talk race, genetics, and football recruiting.

There is a reason that every single medalist in the men's 100 meter for the last five Olympics has ancestral origins in West Africa. It can not be a coincidence. West Africans, as a whole, have more fast twitch muscle cells and different leg muscle physiology from northern european derived peoples. It is no coincidence that 13% of the US population is so heavily represented in football/basketball and track.

It is no coincidence that you do not see Black power lifters medal at the Olympics or world meets. That is a northern european thing. The ice age evolved europeans to have shorter limbs to conserve heat. And it is no coincidence that you see more Whites playing O line than wide receiver. And, controversially, recent findings show that the average person with ancestry based in europe, has some Neanderthal DNA while Africans do not.

It is not a coincidence that Ohio State's two deep at LB, CB, and safety last year were African American.

There are exceptions to every rule...e,g. you'll have a Joey Bosa or Wes Welker....

But...I think that programs that do not have access to a black population of high school football players will find it more difficult to compete at the highest level

This post reminds me of when Jimmy The Greek got fired from CBS. I was a kid and remember the interview, but I think what really did him in was his opinion of black QBs.

 

[DarthGrumpy]

Depends - Michigan has recruits from all over the place. In fact, they more recruits from NJ (5, with the potential for 2 more) than the entire Midwest (4, with the potential for 2 more). They have no commitments from Ohio or Illinois and only 1 from Michigan (the 2 possible recruits are from Michigan).

The big names will always recruit national, that's why they want schools in talent rich states.

Harbaugh & Michigan are having a field day in Jersey this year...

http://www.northjersey.com/sports/h...from-penn-state-then-picks-michigan-1.1498748

 

[billybud]

Taking a look at 3.4.5 stars (Rivals 2013)

1295 were from Florida
277 from Alabama
462 from Ohio
78 from New York
758 from Georgia
333 Louisiana
190 Michigan
284 North Carolina

less than 55....

Wisconsin
Hawaii
Connecticut (39)
Minnesota
Massachusetts
Nebraska
Oregon
Iowa
Nevada
Idaho
West Virginia
Wyoming

 

[SAMCRO]

This post reminds me of when Jimmy The Greek got fired from CBS. I was a kid and remember the interview, but I think what really did him in was his opinion of black QBs.

Ya, I remember that. Wasn't he out at dinner or something, had a few drinks, and went on to talk about how slave owners would breed the biggest and strongest male slaves with the biggest and strongest female slaves to have the biggest and strongest slave baby's? There was definitely more to it, as you mentioned, on whether black athletes were smart enough to play QB? I can't recall.

 

[SAMCRO]

This post reminds me of when Jimmy The Greek got fired from CBS. I was a kid and remember the interview, but I think what really did him in was his opinion of black QBs.

Ya, I remember that. Wasn't he out at dinner or something, had a few drinks, and went on to talk about how slave owners would breed the biggest and strongest male slaves with the biggest and strongest female slaves to have the biggest and strongest slave baby's? There was definitely more to it, as you mentioned, on whether black athletes were smart enough to play QB? I can't recall.

Here's the video clip that got him fired. It was also comments about black coaches. That if blacks take over coaching there would be no jobs left for white people in football.

 

[billybud]

Michael Johnson...gold medalist

"Quote: "All my life I believed I became an athlete through my own determination, but it's impossible to think that being descended from slaves hasn't left an imprint through the generations. Difficult as it was to hear, slavery has benefited descendants like me—I believe there is a superior athletic gene in us."

 

[Kolumbo]

Taking a look at 3.4.5 stars (Rivals 2013)

1295 were from Florida
277 from Alabama
462 from Ohio
78 from New York
758 from Georgia
333 Louisiana
190 Michigan
284 North Carolina

less than 55....

Wisconsin
Hawaii
Connecticut (39)
Minnesota
Massachusetts
Nebraska
Oregon
Iowa
Nevada
Idaho
West Virginia
Wyoming

No Texas?
I still think adding say Houston to the Big 12 is no biggie for UT. Texas should be able to recruit wherever it wants, including Florida.

 

[Ldandy]

Your chart makes one wonder why New York, with a similar size population, and a higher percentage of Blacks, does not put out the football players that Florida does.

Urban basketball orientation? Spring weather?

Yes and Yes.

The metro Northeast is predominantly a basketball culture. Kids in the inner cities grow up playing basketball, and often don't have access to football/baseball or their programs are woefully underfunded. Spring football does not exist in the majority of the Northeast, so athletes are often far more raw coming out of HS or completely unidentified by college recruiters. The Athletes are there, the opportunities not as much.

The Deep South is clearly a football culture. Kids grow up playing the game above all others. They have access to far better coaching and competition. Recruiters are all over the state so identifying talent is typically not an issue. Better weather is certainly a major plus for camps and training facilities, as is the availability of Spring football practice for most programs.

 

[noeynox]

Here's the video clip that got him fired. It was also comments about black coaches. That if blacks take over coaching there would be no jobs left for white people in football.

Yeah, I forgot some of that. What I remembered was the quote about the thighs and I related it to @billybud 's comments about the fast twitch muscles in the legs. Jimmy the Greek never recovered from that. I don't believe he was being a racist but his comments were too controversial. Especially the part about the coaches and QBs.

 

[IMind]

Yes and Yes.

The metro Northeast is predominantly a basketball culture. Kids in the inner cities grow up playing basketball, and often don't have access to football/baseball or their programs are woefully underfunded. Spring football does not exist in the majority of the Northeast, so athletes are often far more raw coming out of HS or completely unidentified by college recruiters. The Athletes are there, the opportunities not as much.

The Deep South is clearly a football culture. Kids grow up playing the game above all others. They have access to far better coaching and competition. Recruiters are all over the state so identifying talent is typically not an issue. Better weather is certainly a major plus for camps and training facilities, as is the availability of Spring football practice for most programs.

I think you hit the nail on the head when you said funding. Here in PA high school programs get major dollars. The smallest school districts have football stadiums that probably rival the best programs in CT... and youth football football starts at 4 years of age, 5 days a week. The youth organizations get their playbooks from the head coach of the local high school. We DID NOT have this in CT growing up. Soccer maybe the #1 sport by the number of participants, but it's not taken anywhere near as seriously by most of the participants as youth football is here. It probably explains the number of PA kids as well. And this is in Eastern PA... an area that I think is actually under-recruited.

I actually think one of the advantages UConn has is that it's smack dab in the middle of some decent football playing areas that are overlooked by the majority of college programs. Eastern PA, the New York suburbs, upstate NY, and New England. It just takes a lot of work to find those kids... they aren't scouted from 5th grade up. They don't have access to the regional camps that get the most attention... but I think Edsall proved they were there. Fast is fast, no matter what state you come from.