ACC 2024-25 Season

[DallasDomer]

Angel Reese is a good comparison. Fournier’s strength is her motor.

She's a bit shorter than Reese at 6'2" and doesn't have the strength Reese has. If she starts rebounding a lot more maybe. Needs to get stronger imo.

How did Okananwa get 12 rebounds at 5'10"?

 

[Dillon77]

She's a bit shorter than Reese at 6'2" and doesn't have the strength Reese has. If she starts rebounding a lot more maybe. Needs to get stronger imo.

How did Okananwa get 12 rebounds at 5'10"?

How did Hannah Hidalgo get 10 rebounds at 5'6"?

 

[DallasDomer]

Dang, I've got to remember we've got this ACC Thread when I post "elevator" summaries of the ND games I just watched. This is what I posted on the ND thread immediately after the game and it went to what you were noting:

• Sonia Citron 25 points, 11 rebounds (10-15 shooting, 4-6 from three)
• Hannah Hidalgo: 24 points, 10 rebounds
• Olivia Miles: 20 points, 10 rebounds (also 8 assists)

@DallasDomer

Incidentally, ND shot 50% from the field and 37% from three.

Just wondering if you think the Uconn result will be similar to last years 22 point win? ND has Miles back but not Westbeld who scored 23. I think Ivey will use zone to control fouls and Uconn is off and on in shooting from distance particularly when there is an active zone like Hidalgo plays.

 

[WBBTakeover]

How did Okananwa get 12 rebounds at 5'10"?

First time seeing her play?

 

[WBBTakeover]

Duke did what it had to, which was to rebound after a poor showing against South Carolina. Toby was great in this game (offensively), which was not the case against the Gamecocks (where she looked like the third-best freshman on the court behind Joyce Edwards and Mouse McDaniel and was getting punked by Ashlyn Watkins). Overall, this win didn't feel very impressive considering the opponent (a very skittish Virginia Tech team with a first-year head coach/ACC newbie). Last year's victory over a Kitley-led VT team in Cameron was far more impressive. I was hoping for a game similar to the FSU massacre in Cameron last year, but no dice.

Anyone seen Reigan Richardson lately? Anyone?

Shout out to Oluchi Okananwa for another strong showing (played well against South Carolina and again against Virginia Tech)!

Thumbs down to ACC Network commentating. Please do better in the future.

 

[WBBTakeover]

If we're looking for more entries into the "find a Toby Fournier comparison" contest, I'll submit Natasha Howard.

 

[Rooster C.]

Well things went pretty much as expected today.
WF lost.
Pitt struggled with a 1 - 6 team but got the W
Virginia continues to struggle losing at home to BC
FSU won but man they gave up 85 points to a not so great SMU team. I will continue to say FSU wins at the FT line. If they didn't get 25-30 ft shots they could not win.
NC, Miami, and Clemson beat inferior opponents.
ND and Duke took care of business.

Still a lot of inconsistency at this point in the season but with only a few weeks until conference season begins in earnest teams need to figure it sooner rather than later.

 

[CAbballfan2]

Duke did what it had to, which was to rebound after a poor showing against South Carolina. Toby was great in this game (offensively), which was not the case against the Gamecocks (where she looked like the third-best freshman on the court behind Joyce Edwards and Mouse McDaniel and was getting punked by Ashlyn Watkins). Overall, this win didn't feel very impressive considering the opponent (a very skittish Virginia Tech team with a first-year head coach/ACC newbie). Last year's victory over a Kitley-led VT team in Cameron was far more impressive. I was hoping for a game similar to the FSU massacre in Cameron last year, but no dice.

Anyone seen Reigan Richardson lately? Anyone?

Shout out to Oluchi Okananwa for another strong showing (played well against South Carolina and again against Virginia Tech)!

Thumbs down to ACC Network commentating. Please do better in the future.

I will say Richardson didn’t show up against SC and that was a problem. However, today, Kara ran her offense thru the hot hand, which was Fournier. Richardson was solid defensively and had 7 assists. I don’t think it was a bad game for her.

 

[FanInNC]

State and ODU got out to a wonky start. Azaiah James picked up 2 fouls in the first 2 minutes of the game and sat all first half. ODU came out hitting and State came out flat. A couple of weird officiating moments early and giving up too many second chances early spelled a 19-17 ODU lead after 1.

From then on State had their way. A 12-0 run in the 2nd and a 18-0 run in the 3rd made this a laugher quickly. State went deep into their bench for extended minutes.

On a positive note, Awou went for 10 and 7 and is showing signs of growth. Her and Collier have had a couple of positive games now to build on against Ole Miss and now ODU.

 

[Dillon77]

Just wondering if you think the Uconn result will be similar to last years 22 point win? ND has Miles back but not Westbeld who scored 23. I think Ivey will use zone to control fouls and Uconn is off and on in shooting from distance particularly when there is an active zone like Hidalgo plays.

There was a give and take with a poster a week back and all agreed that, while there are similarities between last year's teams -- most notably Hidalgo and Bueckers --- there are also a lot of key players from that game no longer on the court: A. Edwards and N. Muhl for the Huskies and M. Westbeld and K. Watson for the Irish.

Edwards was a dependable presence for Geno A. on all fronts and Westbeld's impact on the game with her "pops" of the pick, was huge.
In a subtle way, Watson was exceedingly important, too, holding down the middle of the Irish defense.

Strong brings strong offensive presence, for sure, and Fudd -- if left open -- can be murder. On the other hand, they're playing against a backcourt that all just scored a double-double against a P5 team (doesn't really matter how down 'Cuse is this year).
Ivey going to the zone two games ago has given the Irish reps, so she can mix and match it. Some keys: which Koval will show up? The (yikes!) frosh who had 5 turnovers in the first half or the one who played a clean second half, calmly hitting her spinning layups.
And, can Liatu King continue to play an effective undersize power forward? UConn has to shoot well. Plus, if they can stop one of the ND scoring guards, that's critical.

Gosh knows ESPN is playing this up and it will (if it has not) get its own thread. I'll just try to enjoy it all.

 

[DallasDomer]

There was a give and take with a poster a week back and all agreed that, while there are similarities between last year's teams -- most notably Hidalgo and Bueckers --- there are also a lot of key players from that game no longer on the court: A. Edwards and N. Muhl for the Huskies and M. Westbeld and K. Watson for the Irish.

Edwards was a dependable presence for Geno A. on all fronts and Westbeld's impact on the game with her "pops" of the pick, was huge.
In a subtle way, Watson was exceedingly important, too, holding down the middle of the Irish defense.

Strong brings strong offensive presence, for sure, and Fudd -- if left open -- can be murder. On the other hand, they're playing against a backcourt that all just scored a double-double against a P5 team (doesn't really matter how down 'Cuse is this year).
Ivey going to the zone two games ago has given the Irish reps, so she can mix and match it. Some keys: which Koval will show up? The (yikes!) frosh who had 5 turnovers in the first half or the one who played a clean second half, calmly hitting her spinning layups.
And, can Liatu King continue to play an effective undersize power forward? UConn has to shoot well. Plus, if they can stop one of the ND scoring guards, that's critical.

Gosh knows ESPN is playing this up and it will (if it has not) get its own thread. I'll just try to enjoy it all.

Good points. Imo Koval will show up well my only concern with her is getting fouls, some real some not. Prosper is decent place holder for her.

Westbeld I agree is the biggest loss from last year but ND gets Miles back to help the offense. She and Hidalgo will need to be shooting well.

I expect more zone than man. In an earlier game, maybe UNC, they went into a zone late and Uconn had trouble with it. Fudd was not back then and I don't know if she'll play or not but she does seem sensitive to contact, understanably.

Citron will be Citron so it may come down to King. She's averaging 11 rebounds which is more than Strong. If King gives ND her usual double double I think that seals the deal.

Michaela Mabrey devised the game plan last year and I expect another good one. The crowd should help but it won't be an easy game.

 

[DallasDomer]

Good points. Imo Koval will show up well my only concern with her is getting fouls, some real some not. Prosper is decent place holder for her.

Westbeld I agree is the biggest loss from last year but ND gets Miles back to help the offense. She and Hidalgo will need to be shooting well.

I expect more zone than man. In an earlier game, maybe UNC, they went into a zone late and Uconn had trouble with it. Fudd was not back then and I don't know if she'll play or not but she does seem sensitive to contact, understanably.

Citron will be Citron so it may come down to King. She's averaging 11 rebounds which is more than Strong. If King gives ND her usual double double I think that seals the deal.

Michaela Mabrey devised the game plan last year and I expect another good one. The crowd should help but it won't be an easy game.

I should add that some teams worry too much about players they don't have. So far my view of coach Ivey is she focusses on winning with what she has.

I failed to mention Emma Risch. She did well vs Syracuse and she can be useful with 3's and spelling some players.

 

[HuskyNan]

I expect more zone than man. In an earlier game, maybe UNC, they went into a zone late and Uconn had trouble with it. Fudd was not back then and I don't know if she'll play or not but she does seem sensitive to contact, understanably.

Geno pulled the starters for the last 13 minutes of the game so, yes, the freshmen and less experienced sophomores had problems with the zone. But, please do play zone with Bueckers, Fudd, Strong, and Shade in the game.

 

[Dillon77]

Geno pulled the starters for the last 13 minutes of the game so, yes, the freshmen and less experienced sophomores had problems with the zone. But, please do play zone with Bueckers, Fudd, Strong, and Shade in the game.

Hah , wishful thinking on your part 'Nan (as @oldude and I pondered). Ivey and Michaela Mabrey (who drew up the scout for last year and probably will this year) are a little too on their game for that. (BTW, in my years of watching the Huskies with their mid-range shooting, a reason for their success is the quickness with which the ball is delivered. Snap and pop...it's up!)

Mabrey will plan exactly what she did last year: mix of man and zone with a lot of semi-drops on Paige to help Citron out, who will draw the assignment. Of course, the million dollar question isn't so much who draws Hidalgo (has to be KK Arnold in my mind), but who draws Miles.

 

[oldude]

Hah , wishful thinking on your part 'Nan (as @oldude and I pondered). Ivey and Michaela Mabrey (who drew up the scout for last year and probably will this year) are a little too on their game for that. (BTW, in my years of watching the Huskies with their mid-range shooting success is the quickness with which the ball is delivered. Snap and pop...it's up!)

Mabrey will plan exactly what she did last year: mix of man and zone with a lot of semi-drops on Paige to help Citron out, who will draw the assignment. Of course, the million dollar question isn't so much who draws Hidalgo (has to be KK Arnold in my mind), but who draws Miles.

Dillon, here’s a take on this game. Each team’s trio of outstanding guards basically cancel each other out. That leaves King vs Strong and Koval vs Brady/el Alfy. If it gets into the bench, the Huskies have a clear advantage. Home court could matter and there’s always the matchup of the coaches.

I honestly don’t know which way this game plays out. It could come down to execution on a handful of plays during the last few minutes of the 4th qtr. I hate OT, so I hope that the game ends in regulation.

 

[oldude]

By the way, I do not expect a repeat of last year’s ND-UConn game. In that game, Westbeld & Citron vs Edwards $ Bueckers basically cancelled each other out. No Miles & King for ND. No Fudd & Strong for UConn.

Hidalgo obviously destroyed UConn. Much of that had to do with Nika Muhl having perhaps her worst game as a Husky. She tried to overplay Hidalgo and get physical with her. Hidalgo baited Nika into one foul after another. Nika played only 19 minutes before fouling out.

I don’t think you play Hidalgo tight, where she can blow by you and get to the basket. You try to stay in front of her. If Hidalgo hits her outside shots, you live with it. I am certain that Chen gets the defensive assignment on Hidalgo, sharing it with Arnold.

Citron and Paige match up as do Miles and Fudd/Shade. King is a veteran but she will have her hands full with freshman Strong who plays like a senior. The game may turn on the matchup in the post. If Koval holds her own against Brady/el Alfy then ND is in really good shape. If Koval gets into foul trouble, then ND is in trouble.

 

[Dillon77]

By the way, I do not expect a repeat of last year’s ND-UConn game. In that game, Westbeld & Citron vs Edwards $ Bueckers basically cancelled each other out. No Miles & King for ND. No Fudd & Strong for UConn.

Hidalgo obviously destroyed UConn. Much of that had to do with Nika Muhl having perhaps her worst game as a Husky. She tried to overplay Hidalgo and get physical with her. Hidalgo baited Nika into one foul after another. Nika played only 19 minutes before fouling out.

I don’t think you play Hidalgo tight, where she can blow by you and get to the basket. You try to stay in front of her. If Hidalgo hits her outside shots, you live with it. I am certain that Chen gets the defensive assignment on Hidalgo, sharing it with Arnold.

Citron and Paige match up as do Miles and Fudd/Shade. King is a veteran but she will have her hands full with freshman Strong who plays like a senior. The game may turn on the matchup in the post. If Koval holds her own against Brady/el Alfy then ND is in really good shape. If Koval gets into foul trouble, then ND is in trouble.

Logically, I can't really argue with one thing you've said.
But....
....there's this undeniable confluence between big games and Hannah Hidalgo's exuberant love for the game that takes her up even another notch in big-time games: South Carolina, UConn, U.$.C., Texas, etc.

If Chen and KK Arnold can do what you say, then there will be a really tight match. I'm just not sure that happens. While I like to think I'm pretty objective and grounded, this kid's wired differently....and the proof is in what she delivers (1,000 pts. scored in 44 games) and, of course, how she does it.

 

[oldude]

Logically, I can't really argue with one thing you've said.
But....
....there's this undeniable confluence between big games and Hannah Hidalgo's exuberant love for the game that takes her up even another notch in big-time games: South Carolina, UConn, U.$.C., Texas, etc.

If Chen and KK Arnold can do what you say, then there will be a really tight match. I'm just not sure that happens. While I like to think I'm pretty objective and grounded, this kid's wired differently....and the proof is in what she delivers (1,000 pts. scored in 44 games) and, of course, how she does it.

Keep in mind that your description of Hidalgo could easily be said about PB.

 

[WBBTakeover]

I will say Richardson didn’t show up against SC and that was a problem. However, today, Kara ran her offense thru the hot hand, which was Fournier. Richardson was solid defensively and had 7 assists. I don’t think it was a bad game for her.

It was still a far cry from her National Player of the Week status. She's a senior who is looking to lock up 1st team All-ACC honors and maximize her draft stock as a shooting guard. Can't no-show in the biggest game of the season to date and then follow that up with another clunker against an overmatched opponent in the ACC opener.

 

[cancontent]

I will say Richardson didn’t show up against SC and that was a problem. However, today, Kara ran her offense thru the hot hand, which was Fournier. Richardson was solid defensively and had 7 assists. I don’t think it was a bad game for her.

Didn't show up, or didn't get into a rhythm? I recall she was benched for most of the first half after picking up a foul within the first minute of the game. I agree it was a problem however I would challenge that Coach Lawson sitting her early didn't help things.

 

[DallasDomer]

Geno pulled the starters for the last 13 minutes of the game so, yes, the freshmen and less experienced sophomores had problems with the zone. But, please do play zone with Bueckers, Fudd, Strong, and Shade in the game.

Last year the zone worked very well because of the reactions of the high players. I'm don't know what Ivey has in mind but the zone controlled USC and Texas so I'm sure you will get you wish. I'm not sure you'll like the results but it will be a good game.

 

[DallasDomer]

Hah , wishful thinking on your part 'Nan (as @oldude and I pondered). Ivey and Michaela Mabrey (who drew up the scout for last year and probably will this year) are a little too on their game for that. (BTW, in my years of watching the Huskies with their mid-range shooting, a reason for their success is the quickness with which the ball is delivered. Snap and pop...it's up!)

Mabrey will plan exactly what she did last year: mix of man and zone with a lot of semi-drops on Paige to help Citron out, who will draw the assignment. Of course, the million dollar question isn't so much who draws Hidalgo (has to be KK Arnold in my mind), but who draws Miles.

You phrased it better than I did. It will be a mix of defenses with Hidalgo Miles and Citron coming out to deal with the midrange. It's a much more active Defense than the word zone implies.

 

[CajunHusk94]

Some intriguing games in the ACC this weekend

NC St/Louisville
UNC/GT

 

[DallasDomer]

Azzi Fudd will not play in the Notre Dame game Thursday, sad that she has such terrible injury luck.

But I guess that keeps the possible surprise open for a tournament game when hopefully she will be back for Uconn and Westbeld and Karlen will be back for ND. Still expect a good game with lots of ESPN hype.

 

[oldude]

Azzi Fudd will not play in the Notre Dame game Thursday, sad that she has such terrible injury luck.

But I guess that keeps the possible surprise open for a tournament game when hopefully she will be back for Uconn and Westbeld and Karlen will be back for ND. Still expect a good game with lots of ESPN hype.

Don’t forget Aubrey, who should also be back on the court sometime soon.