5 Takeaways from the McD All-Star Game

[EricSD]

IMO Breanna should start instead of Doty, if only to provide stability and guidance to the "second" team. If you have a 5 on the floor consisting of Mo, BB, Tuck, Breanna and Kiah while athletic and full of promise it does not look like a totally organized unit. Put CD in there instead of Breanna and suddenly you have 2 units who are full with scorers and everything else.

here's the thing, and doggy said it well. Caroline is in her first year after losing last year due to her 3rd torn ACL. frankly i think she's finally hitting her stride physically and is about at the peak of where she can expect to be after 3 ACL's.

if you watch what she does, she's NOT a scoring PG per se. but she's strong with the ball, a competent defender, good decision maker, almost as much a glue player (IMHO) as Kelly is. i don't think you can discount her leadership or what she brings in all around toughness. having said all that, i think she plays slightly even better next year. she may never average 10 PPG, but UCONN won't NEED her to do that.

i think it's pretty clear to most fans that as a freshman, Bree will be more talented and gifted a player than Caroline. but that's not WHY CD will start...

 

[doggydaddy]

But it is what will happen, alex. Especially, at the start of the season when Breanna can be coached on the bench at the start of the game.

I don't find it ridiculous or stubborn. It's smart. It sends a message to the younger players that you have to earn your starting position. That once you have it, you have to do something to lose it. And it will be the same when they are seniors and the next great thing is recruited.

 

[Bestiarius]

You absolutely stole this idea from me. I have posted it twice already. I'll see you in court!

How about on the court instead?

 

[Scotter]

IMO Breanna should start instead of Doty, if only to provide stability and guidance to the "second" team. If you have a 5 on the floor consisting of Mo, BB, Tuck, Breanna and Kiah while athletic and full of promise it does not look like a totally organized unit. Put CD in there instead of Breanna and suddenly you have 2 units who are full with scorers and everything else.

I don't think there is anyway that Breanna starts ahead of Caroline. Geno is not going to yank one of his senior captains from the starting lineup. What is a real possibility is Breanna starting in the spot vacated by Tiff instead of Kaleena. Not promoting a sophomore to the starting lineup is not the same thing as pulling a senior from the starting lineup in Genos world. Geno will do this for better rotational balance, but the players have to force their hands for this scenario to play out. I would say there is about a 45% chance that Breanna starts instead of Kaleena.

1. Breanna and Morgan both have to be ready to play. This an almost certainity to give their talent and just as importantly their background. Both were members of multiple USA Basketball teams and faced good competition in organized high school play, particularly for Morgan.

2. Kiah has to be meeting Geno's expectations for her consistent effort. Next year if she's not meeting his expeUSctations he will just give her playing time to somebody else and let that motivate her. Kiah, Breanna, and Morgan all have to be playing in a way that demands playing time. Given what Kiah has shown this year plus the motivating of competing with other talented posts everyday should make this a very likely scenario.

3. Moriah takes some time to adapt to playing UConn style basketball and earn Geno's complete confidence. This is somewhat likely in my opinion because Moriah doesn't come to UConn with the same experiences that are typical of UConn recruits that have success understanding the system quickly. Moriah didn't play at an elite high school and her home school team didn't play against those elite high school teams either like many of the other UConn players. She also hasn't played on any USA Basketball teams, and not having the same high school experience as many of the other guards probably didn't help her. She just comes to UConn without the advantage that someone like Kaleena came to UConn with having played on 3 USA basketball teams and gone to Mater Dei for high school. Moriah is going to play and make an impact because of her talent level, but it will almost certainly be a harder transition than it was for others. Now she may take to it like a duck to water once she is finally really exposed to it, but based on what I have seen of her I expect a transition period.

If those scenarios play out then I believe Geno will start Breanna to balance the rotation. Geno doesn't play 2 units, but it will be really hard to find quality playing time for Breanna, Morgan, and Kiah if all three are coming off the bench. Given that situation Geno will start Breanna and have primarily Kiah back up Stef and Morgan primarily back up Breanna. Kaleena will continue to come off the bench giving him a guard he really trusts and scoring punch off the bench that he likes. Moriah will play, but he won't be dependent on her as his guard off the bench. And Brianna Banks will have a chance to work into the rotation at least against non-competitive teams. The big thing is that the only way to effectively play 4 posts in a rotation is to start 2 of them. The post players have to force Geno's hand for Kaleena not to start, but I see it as a possibility unlike the last several years when the starting lineup was fairly obvious going into each season.

 

[ju6381]

Been doing a lot of thinking on the starting lineup and the way Geno has ran things in the past. Unless there is injury the starters will be the 4 returning and KML. Great players like DT, Maya, KML (anyone remember if Sales was #1?) were all players of the year in HS and started the year on the bench with the first 2 only starting after multiple injurys. As one announcer described, "when you are on the court you are either building equity or time on the bench." Well Kelly and Caroline will be seniors and have a lot of stored equity, does anyone think they will stop working hard between now and their senior year? In facat, being their senior year I could see them being more locked in then ever. Doubt either will slack off.

Now as to why it will not be the end of the world if 1 of the great freshman does not start. The start of the game may be the only time that those 5 are on the court together. Lets also remember that there is only 1 ball on the court so only 1 person can be shooting. Caroline will be there to handle the ball and help get Bria, Dolson and KML going. This will not be like hockey with 5 for 5 line changes, it will be a rotation of 9-10 players (hopefully) that will see 1-2 players changing at sub oppurtunities.

Also can not see the starting 5 depend on the style of the other team. When you are looking to be the best team in the country you do what you do and make teams adjust to you. However that first wave of subs could depend on what is working or not working.

 

[Sonny44]

How about on the court instead?

Nah, I couldn't dunk if the basket were at 6'.

 

[rocky rococo]

if you think back to the last time UConn had this much depth, you'll recall how Geno substituted on the 2000-2001 team.It wasn't wholesale hockey changes, but it wasn't one at a time either. He had these different cluster packages of 2 or 3 players that he would fit together to accomplish different purposes out on the court. I expect we'll see him developing similar clusters as the season goes along next year.

 

[Bestiarius]

if you think back to the last time UConn had this much depth, you'll recall how Geno substituted on the 2000-2001 team.It wasn't wholesale hockey changes, but it wasn't one at a time either. He had these different cluster packages of 2 or 3 players that he would fit together to accomplish different purposes out on the court. I expect we'll see him developing similar clusters as the season goes along next year.

I see it this way too. With so much talent on the bench, subbing in will not diminish on court effectiveness regardless of who is on the floor. With no need to conserve energy, defensive effort can be 100% at all times. What a year it may be!

 

[Buckaroobanzai]

Watching the McD all star game (twice - with and without Abby Waner), marveling at the skill set of Breanna, Moriah and Morgan, and then reading some of the particularly astute analysis in this thread, it becomes pretty clear to me that the coaching staff could have serious "minutes" problems in the 2012-2013 and 2013-2014 seasons. Notwithstanding Geno's loyalty to his seniors, I simply cannot conceive of Breanna and KML not starting next year. And the same could be said for Moriah and Morgan in the following season. I wonder whether this perceived "minutes" conundrum may be the reason why DD has not yet committed to Uconn. Where would her minutes come from?

 

[sarals24]

By the time DD got there, Kelly and Caroline would be gone, Bria would be a senior, KML a junior. She would have plenty of opportunities for minutes, or she would play a bit her freshman year and step in the year after as a sophomore.

Great players will always find minutes at UConn...but you might be right, that could be a factor. Somehow I don't think Diamond is worried about finding minutes anywhere she goes, she seems very confident in her abilities. As she should be.

 

[doggydaddy]

if you think back to the last time UConn had this much depth, you'll recall how Geno substituted on the 2000-2001 team.It wasn't wholesale hockey changes, but it wasn't one at a time either. He had these different cluster packages of 2 or 3 players that he would fit together to accomplish different purposes out on the court. I expect we'll see him developing similar clusters as the season goes along next year.

Great example with the 2000-2001 teams.

Abrosimova - 24.5 mpg, 14.1 ppg
Cash - 23.8 mpg, 12.2 ppg
Taurasi - 24 mpg, 10.0 ppg
Bird - 27.7 mpg, 10.9 ppg
Williams - 19.9 mpg, 9.8 ppg
Ralph - 23.7 mpg, 9.7 ppg
Jones - 19.5 mpg, 8.7 ppg
Schumacher - 16.9 mpg, 6.3 ppg
Johnson - 17.9 mpg, 5.7 ppg

That was pretty much the regular rotation. Nine players getting between 16.9-27.7 mpg and 14.1-5.7 ppg.

 

[Scotter]

Not a huge difference, but the minutes are inflated some because of the major injuries. In the 19 games before Svet was injured for the season:

Bird - 27.0 mpg, 9.6 ppg
Abrosimova - 24.5 mpg, 14.1 ppg
Cash - 24.5 mpg, 12.2 ppg
Ralph - 23.5 mpg, 8.7 ppg
Taurasi - 20.8 mpg, 9.8 ppg
Williams - 19.3 mpg, 10.8 ppg
Jones - 18.0 mpg, 8.6 ppg
Johnson - 13.8 mpg, 4.4 ppg
Schumacher - 14.5 mpg, 5.8 ppg

Schumacher played in 13 of the 19 games and Johnson played in 18 of the 19 games, everyone else played in all 19 games. In looking at the individual games Geno was pretty consistent about playing all nine players over ten minutes and he even typically found double digit minutes for someone else in the games Schuey missed, usually Morgan Valley.

 

[HuskyMJ]

The big takeaway from this game is that Morgan Tuck is definately one of the top 5-10 players in the country. HG has her underrated. #1 #2 and another girl who could be considered top 5 that is called a dominant class. Follow that up with Mercedes Russell who saw Louisville end weak with 2nd round loss and Diamond Deshields who saw Maryland and Duke both struggle in elite 8 and things are looking up.

 

[ju6381]

The big takeaway from this game is that Morgan Tuck is definately one of the top 5-10 players in the country. HG has her underrated. #1 #2 and another girl who could be considered top 5 that is called a dominant class. Follow that up with Mercedes Russell who saw Louisville end weak with 2nd round loss and Diamond Deshields who saw Maryland and Duke both struggle in elite 8 and things are looking up.

Mercedes Russell will not be at UConn....

 

[easttexastrash]

I think the strongest lineup would be Jefferson at the point, Hartley at the 2, KML at the 3, Stewart at the 4 and Dolson at the 5. I think that Dolson can be very effective if she has someone to take some pressure off of her, which Stewart will easily do.

You would have strong three points shooters at 1-4. That would be tough to defend.

 

[Timeout]

As far as starting and playing time, KML hasn't suffered at all coming off the bench. I don't know that this is a concern for Diamond, but when you play well Geno well find everyone the minutes. By the time Diamond gets here (fingers crossed) Doty and Faris, seniors next year, won't be around. I do think that Geno won't start - won't need to start - any of the freshmen. He did pretty well this year and next season everyone coming back will be that much better. The future is awful bright with every player coming to UConn in the best of hands.

 

[Sonny44]

Watching the McD all star game (twice - with and without Abby Waner), marveling at the skill set of Breanna, Moriah and Morgan, and then reading some of the particularly astute analysis in this thread, it becomes pretty clear to me that the coaching staff could have serious "minutes" problems in the 2012-2013 and 2013-2014 seasons. Notwithstanding Geno's loyalty to his seniors, I simply cannot conceive of Breanna and KML not starting next year. And the same could be said for Moriah and Morgan in the following season. I wonder whether this perceived "minutes" conundrum may be the reason why DD has not yet committed to Uconn. Where would her minutes come from?

I still think that is a pretty good guess.
The longer it goes on, the less our chances are IMO.

 

[doggydaddy]

I still think that is a pretty good guess.
The longer it goes on, the less our chances are IMO.

Why? You've held this position for a while, but as they said in the McD's game last night, most of the 2013 recruits have not committed.

 

[alexrgct]

I don't find it ridiculous or stubborn. It's smart. It sends a message to the younger players that you have to earn your starting position. That once you have it, you have to do something to lose it. And it will be the same when they are seniors and the next great thing is recruited.

I disagree with this word for word.

Starting a senior simply because she's a senior actually sends a horrible message to the team. NO ONE should be entitled to a starter's role simply because they had one the previous season. Every year, kids go, new kids come in, some kids improve, and others plateau or regress. Simply penciling last year's starters in because they haven't graduated ignores all of those facts.

Now specific to Doty, she adds the following value:

• Leadership and competitiveness
• Dealing with press defenses and getting the halfcourt offense established.
• Keeping the mood light (see those silly videos, which I actually think are really valuable to the team's chemistry)
• Just being an inspiration. When young players struggle with what Geno demands of them, they can just see Caroline doing it on one leg.

None of that, however, changes the following:

• Kelly is playing out of position, and the game is only getting longer and bigger by the year.
• With Tiff leaving, there's a huge void left in terms of perimeter defense, a void Kelly is best suited to fill.
• The lack of a second interior scoring threat has been absolute hell on Stef this year and has made her less effective than anticipated.
• Although Caroline is great at handling pressing and trapping defense, her scoring and assist totals once UConn gets into a hafcourt offense are liabilities, especially when Kelly is inconsistent as an offensive player and teams have been able to clog the lane and make things tough for Stef. This is why our offense has struggled at times this season.

Breanna Stewart IMMEDIATELY remediates all of these limitations. Caroline coming in off the bench doesn't lessen any of the value she adds. Breanna makes Stef and Kelly better by her mere presence and turns UConn into a super long, super athletic team. Additionally, Caroline comes in and out of the game all the time, so I don't buy the "you can't warm her up to sit her down" argument. She can either play or she can't.

No one is suggesting Geno just assume Breanna will start from Day One. But if she comes to Storrs and does the things it's expected she can and will, she should be part of the starting lineup, the lineup that sets the tone. It was silly this season watching us struggle each half of the BET final until KML could come in and do KML things. It will be even sillier next season.

 

[doggydaddy]

I disagree with this word for word.

Starting a senior simply because she's a senior actually sends a horrible message to the team. NO ONE should be entitled to a starter's role simply because they had one the previous season. Every year, kids go, new kids come in, some kids improve, and others plateau or regress. Simply penciling last year's starters in because they haven't graduated ignores all of those facts.

Now specific to Doty, she adds the following value:

• Leadership and competitiveness
• Dealing with press defenses and getting the halfcourt offense established.
• Keeping the mood light (see those silly videos, which I actually think are really valuable to the team's chemistry)
• Just being an inspiration. When young players struggle with what Geno demands of them, they can just see Caroline doing it on one leg.

None of that, however, ignores the following:

• Kelly is playing out of position, and the game is only getting longer and bigger by the year.
• With Tiff leaving, there's a huge void left in terms of perimeter defense, a void Kelly is best suited to fill.
• The lack of a second interior scoring threat has been absolute hell on Stef this year and has made her less effective than anticipated.
• Although Caroline is great at handling pressing and trapping defense, her scoring and assist totals once UConn gets into a hafcourt offense are liabilities, especially when Kelly is inconsistent as an offensive player and teams have been able to clog the lane and make things tough for Stef. This is why our offense has struggled at times this season.

Breanna Stewart IMMEDIATELY remediates all of these limitations. Caroline coming in off the bench doesn't lessen any of the value she adds. Breanna makes Stef and Kelly better by her mere presence and turns UConn into a super long, super athletic team. Additionally, Caroline comes in and out of the game all the time, so I don't buy the "you can't warm her up to sit her down" argument. She can either play or she can't.

No one is suggesting Geno just assume Breanna will start from Day One. But if she comes to Storrs and does the things it's expected she can and will, she should be part of the starting lineup, the lineup that sets the tone. It was silly this season watching us struggle each half of the BET final until KML could come in and do KML things. It will be even sillier next season.

And I disgree with you. Aint' this country great?

Geno didn't start Lewis this year. He's not starting Stewart next year.

He's silly, stubborn and whatever else you want to call him. But he is all about loyalty. You will be proven wrong.

 

[MilfordHusky]

I think the strongest lineup would be Jefferson at the point, Hartley at the 2, KML at the 3, Stewart at the 4 and Dolson at the 5. I think that Dolson can be very effective if she has someone to take some pressure off of her, which Stewart will easily do.

You would have strong three points shooters at 1-4. That would be tough to defend.

Or maybe at 1-5.

 

[alexrgct]

And I disgree with you. Aint' this country great?

Geno didn't start Lewis this year. He's not starting Stewart next year.

He's silly, stubborn and whatever else you want to call him. But he is all about loyalty. You will be proven wrong.

Loyalty is what breeds complacency, entitlement, and mediocrity. Seniority being a proxy for merit sends a horrible message in any organizational context. This isn't debatable, no matter how great this country may be.

Kaleena should have started this year. Breanna should start next year.

Oh, but I'll be "proven" wrong because we start less than our best five and will still slaughter everyone but Baylor. Doesn't mean it's not ridiculous.

 

[ju6381]

Loyalty is what breeds complacency, entitlement, and mediocrity. Seniority being a proxy for merit sends a horrible message in any organizational context. This isn't debatable, no matter how great this country may be.

Kaleena should have started this year. Breanna should start next year.

Oh, but I'll be "proven" wrong because we start less than our best five and will still slaughter everyone but Baylor. Doesn't mean it's not ridiculous.

I just dont get what being the best 5 has to do with who starts??? Its about more then just being one of the 5 best players. If we start the best 5 players next year we will not have a point guard on the court. Caroline will start because she will not be out worked by anyone on the team and she adds something to the team, just as everyone on the roster does. Worry more about who are the 5 with the most minutes played. The 5 most experianced may just be the best 5 to set the tone.


By the way, anyone else think that Breanna might just be ok with coming off the bench??

 

[doggydaddy]

Loyalty is what breeds complacency, entitlement, and mediocrity. Seniority being a proxy for merit sends a horrible message in any organizational context. This isn't debatable, no matter how great this country may be.

Kaleena should have started this year. Breanna should start next year.

Oh, but I'll be "proven" wrong because we start less than our best five and will still slaughter everyone but Baylor. Doesn't mean it's not ridiculous.

And it doesn't mean it is.

Starting, coming off the bench. I don't think your correct in the impact.

Here's the difference. I don't think I know more than Geno. You apparently do.

 

[alexrgct]

I just dont get what being the best 5 has to do with who starts??? Its about more then just being one of the 5 best players. If we start the best 5 players next year we will not have a point guard on the court. Caroline will start because she will not be out worked by anyone on the team and she adds something to the team, just as everyone on the roster does. Worry more about who are the 5 with the most minutes played. The 5 most experianced may just be the best 5 to set the tone.


By the way, anyone else think that Breanna might just be ok with coming off the bench??

Who said she wasn't??? Anyone else think Caroline might just be OK coming off the bench herself, given that it wasn't clear at one time whether she'd be playing at all?

The notion that Caroline is our PG is silly, or at least the notion that the "PG" is an especially meaningful designation in Geno's offense is silly. She's fourth on the team in assists...and a distant fourth at that. She averages a whopping .18 more assists per game than Stefanie Dolson.

Again, this season proved time and time again that the most experienced five were not, in fact the best five to set the tone. Go back and rewatch the two most impressive wins of the season (Stanford and ND) and tell me that the most experienced five put us in the position we want to be early. We fell behind and looked completely out of sorts in both cases until KML came in. KML was also instrumental in keeping us in the game against Baylor and the first ND game. I don't especially care who sets the tone against Providence and Marquette.

Saying someone works hard is a pretty poor reason to start them. Everyone who plays significant minutes for Geno works really, really hard.

 

[Scotter]

Starting your best 5 players is rarely a good idea unless roster makeup dictates it. Even on the NBA level where there are millions of dollars at stake and little to no loyalty the winning teams and best coaches purposefully do not start their 5 best players.

Kaleena coming off the bench this year was a smart basketball decision irregardless of what class she was in versus the starters. So smart she may even do it again next season. DD obviously disagrees with me there, but Kaleena definitely should have come off the bench this season for purely basketball reasons.

 

[alexrgct]

And it doesn't mean it is.

Starting, coming off the bench. I don't think your correct in the impact.

Here's the difference. I don't think I know more than Geno. You apparently do.

You apparently think Geno equates seniority with merit. And if he really does, he's wrong. I certainly don't know more about Xs and Os of basketball than Geno, or recruiting, or being the face of a program, or a host of other issues. But I also don't believe he just says, "She started last year, so she's starting this year."

 

[pap49cba]

These debates about 'who starts' are amazing. When was the last time any of you read a game report that summarized the game and it said, 'But the starters were 1, 2, 3, 4 and 5?' Even Geno has said NUMEROUS times on his show "Who cares? People get too hung up on this stuff."

I could care less who the starters are. It means nothing in the final analysis. Geno will start whomever he likes and all the tea in China isn't going to change that until some BYer is appointed Head Coach.

Will the starters for the USA National Team be the key decision that determines whether we win the gold medal? I think not.

JMHO.

 

[alexrgct]

Starting your best 5 players is rarely a good idea unless roster makeup dictates it. Even on the NBA level where there are millions of dollars at stake and little to no loyalty the winning teams and best coaches purposefully do not start their 5 best players.

Kaleena coming off the bench this year was a smart basketball decision irregardless of what class she was in versus the starters. So smart she may even do it again next season. DD obviously disagrees with me there, but Kaleena definitely should have come off the bench this season for purely basketball reasons.

So looking like crap against Stanford and ND until KML came in was smart? Starting someone who couldn't get open against Baylor's perimeter defense was smart? Got it.

On an related note, those are the other three teams in the Final Four this weekend.

 

[alexrgct]

These debates about 'who starts' are amazing. When was the last time any of you read a game report that summarized the game and it said, 'But the starters were 1, 2, 3, 4 and 5?' Even Geno has said NUMEROUS times on his show "Who cares? People get too hung up on this stuff."

I could care less who the starters are. It means nothing in the final analysis. Geno will start whomever he likes and all the tea in China isn't going to change that until some BYer is appointed Head Coach.

Will the starters for the USA National Team be the key decision that determines whether we win the gold medal? I think not.

JMHO.

If the starting five do an effective job setting the tone, whether or not they're the best five players, you're absolutely right- it isn't important. When that's manifestedly not the case, it's an issue.