2018 New Targets - Freshmen and Grad Transfers

[Mokum]

JC changed that by recruiting nationally and it worked out pretty well. I guess there are more than one way to build a program.

JC recruited INTERNATIONALLY. He would have gone to the Moon if there was agood player there.

 

[Mokum]

I've posted this a few times, but it's worth repeating:

Nova recruiting class rankings:

From 247
2015 - 29
2014 - 48
2013 - 36
2012 - 27
From ESPN
2015 - 24
2014 - 37
2013 - 31
2012 - >25


Those classes led to the 2016 NC.

Their 2016 class rankings were 45 and 33 respectively.

They're very likely looking at NC#2 out of them.

Recruiting all the five stars is not the answer. How has that worked out lately for Kentucky? Better to get 4 and 3 star guys who stay. Plus I wouldn't put too much stock in how many stars a guy has. There are other factors involved like exposure, and politics that determine how many stars a guy gets after his name.

 

[djct1999]

Recruiting all the five stars is not the answer. How has that worked out lately for Kentucky? Better to get 4 and 3 star guys who stay. Plus I wouldn't put too much stock in how many stars a guy has. There are other factors involved like exposure, and politics that determine how many stars a guy gets after his name.

On a side note, I would argue that it has worked out just fine for Kentucky. They almost always go to the Elite 8/Final 4 on talent alone. With a slightly less stubborn coach who was also a bit better with X's and O's the sky is the limit at Kentucky. Every year. They don't win because of Calipari. The 5 star recruits almost always pull their end.

 

[mwc22]

Recruiting all the five stars is not the answer. How has that worked out lately for Kentucky? Better to get 4 and 3 star guys who stay. Plus I wouldn't put too much stock in how many stars a guy has. There are other factors involved like exposure, and politics that determine how many stars a guy gets after his name.

Well if we are talking recently... Last 5 years made the tournament. 4 out of the 5 they made it to the Sweet 16. 3 out of the 5, Elite 8. 2 out of the 5, made Final Four. 2014 runner up (go UConn!). Won it all in 2012 .

Everyone finds their success their own way. There is no "right way" when it comes to one and done or 4 year players. Personally I like the 4 year route UConn tends to have.

 

[Mokum]

Well if we are talking recently... Last 5 years made the tournament. 4 out of the 5 they made it to the Sweet 16. 3 out of the 5, Elite 8. 2 out of the 5, made Final Four. 2014 runner up (go UConn!). Won it all in 2012 .

Everyone finds their success their own way. There is no "right way" when it comes to one and done or 4 year players. Personally I like the 4 year route UConn tends to have.

Me too. That's why mid majors are competitive and sometimes really good. My point about Kentucky is they don't dominate college BB. On paper they should. I really think one and dones care more about themselves than the team and winning championships at the college level. Not saying they don't want to win, but when you know you will soon be a multi millionare it is hard to care all that much. Plus, if you are building a team with guys who are staying 3-4 years, bringing in a one and done is disruptive to team chemistry. There will be resentment from guys who have worked hard and now losing playing time to a guy who doesn't give a crap and will be making millions this time next year.

 

[Lefty2one]

I disagree that UK should dominate on paper. Youth/rawness/inexperience will always be their Achilles Heel. Their recent teams (since Karl Towns) haven't been anything special, not to say they haven't been good. They are always overrated in the preseason and always have a few games each year where they click and you see all that future NBA talent look unstoppable. Then the next few games you see their youth and inexperience bit them in the arse. The reality is always somewhere in the middle.

 

[mwc22]

Me too. That's why mid majors are competitive and sometimes really good. My point about Kentucky is they don't dominate college BB. On paper they should. I really think one and dones care more about themselves than the team and winning championships at the college level. Not saying they don't want to win, but when you know you will soon be a multi millionare it is hard to care all that much. Plus, if you are building a team with guys who are staying 3-4 years, bringing in a one and done is disruptive to team chemistry. There will be resentment from guys who have worked hard and now losing playing time to a guy who doesn't give a crap and will be making millions this time next year.

Kentucky has been pretty dominant, no? last 9 years under Calipari these are their seeds: 5, 2, 4, 1, 8, 1, 4, 1... a with some of these season records being: 38-1, 35-2, 35-3, 32,6. That seems pretty dominant to me? They also won a National Championship on top of all that.

Don't kid yourself. Kentucky is dominant. But there are also other ways to be dominant, and that is okay sir!

 

[HuskyHawk]

I disagree that UK should dominate on paper. Youth/rawness/inexperience will always be their Achilles Heel. Their recent teams (since Karl Towns) haven't been anything special, not to say they haven't been good. They are always overrated in the preseason and always have a few games each year where they click and you see all that future NBA talent look unstoppable. Then the next few games you see their youth and inexperience bit them in the arse. The reality is always somewhere in the middle.

Agreed. When UK is refreshing most of the roster with freshmen, they will struggle, especially early. This year, they got better and better and won the SEC tournament in a year when the SEC was very strong. That's what they need to hope happens. I am not sure what some are saying about Cal. They guy is a fantastic basketball coach, not just a recruiter. I know we don't like him, but I'm not about to make the mistake of thinking he isn't a great coach.

Duke next year will have a team like UK often does. Insane amounts of young talent. Let's see what K does. My guess is that it will be similar. Struggles early, then pull together. Capable of beating anyone, or losing to lesser teams.

Experience and age matter a lot in college basketball. Often the best teams will have experience at key positions and a few young transcendent talents at other positions. But there is no one way to build a roster.

 

[polycom]

Agreed. When UK is refreshing most of the roster with freshmen, they will struggle, especially early. This year, they got better and better and won the SEC tournament in a year when the SEC was very strong. That's what they need to hope happens. I am not sure what some are saying about Cal. They guy is a fantastic basketball coach, not just a recruiter. I know we don't like him, but I'm not about to make the mistake of thinking he isn't a great coach.

Duke next year will have a team like UK often does. Insane amounts of young talent. Let's see what K does. My guess is that it will be similar. Struggles early, then pull together. Capable of beating anyone, or losing to lesser teams.

Experience and age matter a lot in college basketball. Often the best teams will have experience at key positions and a few young transcendent talents at other positions. But there is no one way to build a roster.

In all basketball. Rookies aren't great in the NBA playoffs when it comes to carrying a team.

 

[HuskyHawk]

In all basketball. Rookies aren't great in the NBA playoffs when it comes to carrying a team.

Certainly true. But I think that's partly because most rookies in NBA are college sophomores. Guys like Magic Johnson and Larry Bird were much more experienced (even if Magic left Jr year). Also, any NBA rookie will be surrounded by veterans. In college, teams like UK and Duke increasingly have teams made up almost entirely of young guys.

 

[mauconnfan]

I disagree that UK should dominate on paper. Youth/rawness/inexperience will always be their Achilles Heel. Their recent teams (since Karl Towns) haven't been anything special, not to say they haven't been good. They are always overrated in the preseason and always have a few games each year where they click and you see all that future NBA talent look unstoppable. Then the next few games you see their youth and inexperience bit them in the arse. The reality is always somewhere in the middle.

These are not typical freshman though these are kids who have already played on the biggest stages of the game at the HS, prep and AAU levels - hundreds of games and All Star/AA games. They should by 2nd half of the year be the cram of the crop with some solid coaching. He still thinks he should win this way or else he would stop bringing them in, this isn't about Cal getting these kids ready for the next level if you believe that you've succumbed to his BS like everyone else. I am sure the UK fans aren't happy at all. As JC always said they aren't freshman anymore and damn he had some perform on the big stages like they were upperclassmen when they hit the Dance. And they weren't rated as high as these kids either.

Cal's a bit overrated just like maybe some of the kids.

 

[Lefty2one]

These are not typical freshman though these are kids who have already played on the biggest stages of the game at the HS, prep and AAU levels - hundreds of games and All Star/AA games.

That really doesn't mean much, none of those compare to high-major basketball. Now they're playing against 22-24 year old kids with tons of experience at the highest level. Now they're facing legit scouting reports for the first time and more complicated offensive and defensive schemes. None of them have gone through the grind of a D1 season; from the travel to the talent level of the opposition. None of them have experience in the Big Dance either. Cal doesn't know who's going to hit the freshman wall, who's going to choke under the bright lights, etc. For the first time in their lives, they can't win solely based on their athleticism and natural gifts. Not to mention leadership is a huge concern when you're dealing with that many freshmen.

They should by 2nd half of the year be the cram of the crop with some solid coaching. He still thinks he should win this way or else he would stop bringing them in, this isn't about Cal getting these kids ready for the next level if you believe that you've succumbed to his BS like everyone else. I am sure the UK fans aren't happy at all. As JC always said they aren't freshman anymore and damn he had some perform on the big stages like they were upperclassmen when they hit the Dance. And they weren't rated as high as these kids either.

Calhoun's situation was always different. Having one or two freshmen stepping up with a core of upperclassmen is one thing. UK has five freshman starters quite often; it's not the same.