Louisville's Move To The ACC Suddenly 'Not A Done Deal'

[Fishy]

So, the 5-year 'look-in'worked into the ACC's contract with ESPN is of no worth to us? Good to know.

Pray tell, why would ESPN offer more cash for something they currently own?

Just...because?

Where's the leverage? The bill for the Big East massacre is already figured into the contract. There's no network on the horizon. Every school is now locked into the conference until 2027. The ACC's short game has been played and now ESPN runs the long game.

 

[zls44]

Pray tell, why would ESPN offer more cash for something they currently own?

Just...because?

Where's the leverage? The bill for the Big East massacre is already figured into the contract. There's no network on the horizon. Every school is now locked into the conference until 2027. The ACC's short game has been played and now ESPN runs the long game.

I have never heard an argument other than "just because". It's made by people who buy into the ACC hype con, so they're starting out delusional and just going further under the kool-aid induced stupor.

There's no reason. It makes zero sense. It's like saying Southwest should have opted out of its brilliant fuel deal that allowed its business to explode nationwide just because everyone else was paying higher fuel rates.

 

[billybud]

Pray tell, why would ESPN offer more cash for something they currently own?

Just...because?

Where's the leverage? The bill for the Big East massacre is already figured into the contract. There's no network on the horizon. Every school is now locked into the conference until 2027. The ACC's short game has been played and now ESPN runs the long game.

I have never heard an argument other than "just because". It's made by people who buy into the ACC hype con, so they're starting out delusional and just going further under the kool-aid induced stupor.

There's no reason. It makes zero sense. It's like saying Southwest should have opted out of its brilliant fuel deal that allowed its business to explode nationwide just because everyone else was paying higher fuel rates.

No..it doesn't make much sense for ESPN to freely offer more for the content that they already have contracted for...yet that is what ESPN has done.

Like when they continued to pay the Big 12 the same money even after A&M, Nebraska, Colorado, and Mizzou defected...after the loss of a Big 12 CCG game to televise.

What the ACC has in the look in provision is a right, not to renogotiate the contract, but the right to review growth of value with ESPN and to take to arbitration if an agreement can not be reached with ESPN.

 

[billybud]

Clemson AD's comments...

"… For example this new contract has two look-in windows- one at five years and one at 10 years. The purpose of that – in talking with ESPN people and our people in the same room – is to look at the end of five years where are we- competitively, what’s our performance, and does it merit a significant increase in the rights fee."

 

[husky210]

Penn Stater born and raised in Philly living in Virginia Beach for the past five years, very much hope UConn gets invited to the B1G as it's safe to say PSU isnt leaving anytime soon and in my opinion they are a perfect institute to match the B1g's Northern identity and their northeastern aspirations, but good God the ACC homers need to give it a rest or at least take it to another forum. I mean there's page after page of Cavalier fans bashing Rutgers and Maryland on their Athletic Departmets, is UVA really more important than either of those schools athletically? The ACC and the B1G are similarly competitive in football at this point with one school carrying the conference banner and everybody else watching (ie as football conferences they both suck), but enough with the inferiority complexes. I truly hope UConn finds a home and was befuddled when they were not the next addition to the ACC. Been following this board since I was sitting in Afghanistan a year ago and can say at this point I route for UConn sports.

Welcome to our board! And thanks every much for your service!

 

[zls44]

Like when they continued to pay the Big 12 the same money even after A&M, Nebraska, Colorado, and Mizzou defected...after the loss of a Big 12 CCG game to televise.

The two situations were drastically, DRASTICALLY different.

 

[CAHUSKY]

Clemson AD's comments...

"… For example this new contract has two look-in windows- one at five years and one at 10 years. The purpose of that – in talking with ESPN people and our people in the same room – is to look at the end of five years where are we- competitively, what’s our performance, and does it merit a significant increase in the rights fee."

ACC: "can we have more money please"?
ESPN: "go pound sand, you have no other options"
ACC: "ok"

 

[Marty Jackson]

People in glass houses ...

It's been tough for Atlantic Coast Conference schools to fill their stadiums — even during one of the league's best seasons on the field in years.

ACC stadiums have been less than 85 percent full this season, according to STATS LLC. That's the smallest number since the league expanded in 2004, and that's despite having three teams in the top 10 in the rankings.

"It takes a great fan to come to games now," said Wake Forest coach Jim Grobe, whose team lost at Miami last week before thousands of vacant orange seats. "Everywhere we go, we see empty seats."

Attendance in the ACC has been declining every year since 2007, when the stadiums were 93 percent full.

That number dipped to 88 percent in 2010 and fell to 85 percent last year, according to STATS.

Read more here: http://www.charlotteobserver.com/20...ns-a-struggle.html#.Un-R40Yo6Uk#storylink=cpy

in all fairness, the NFL and many other pro-sports are seeing the same trends.

 

[billybud]

The two situations were drastically, DRASTICALLY different.

D'Oh? But ESPN has a history of paying more money for inventory it already owns....and. even more so then the Big 12, the ESPN has a reason for seeing the ACC thrive...

 

[SouthronCross]

Pray tell, why would ESPN offer more cash for something they currently own?

Just...because?

No, the look-ins were negotiated into the contract after Pitt and Syracuse were added, IIRC. It is very dependent upon performance on the field, and, the court. If the league performs well enough, it will get paid. Will it still be less than the SEC or B1G? Yes, most likely it will. But, it will still be closer to theirs than what it was.

Where's the leverage? The bill for the Big East massacre is already figured into the contract. There's no network on the horizon. Every school is now locked into the conference until 2027. The ACC's short game has been played and now ESPN runs the long game.

You keep saying that there is no ACCN on the horizon, when nobody knows at this point. The SECN was 2-3 years in the making, and, they began exploring that in 2011. The ACC just began talking to ESPN about it. You are correct, in that it might not ever come to fruition. But, then again, it might. By the time an ACCN comes to fruition, conference networks might not be quite so valuable, especially if a la carte cable becomes reality.

 

[SouthronCross]

I have never heard an argument other than "just because". It's made by people who buy into the ACC hype con, so they're starting out delusional and just going further under the kool-aid induced stupor.

Which ACC fan who posts here on a regular basis says that an ACCN is a certainty? None that I can recall straight away.

There's no reason. It makes zero sense. It's like saying Southwest should have opted out of its brilliant fuel deal that allowed its business to explode nationwide just because everyone else was paying higher fuel rates.

ESPN also owns the SEC lock, stock, and barrel now, too. Is the SECN going to be a mistake for them, too?

 

[SouthronCross]

ACC: "can we have more money please"?
ESPN: "go pound sand, you have no other options"
ACC: "ok"

You really think ESPN is going to tell the ACC that? I don't. But, thats just me.

 

[Mr. Wonderful]

The only way the ACC gets more money out of ESPN is to add more schools just before the next look in window.

 

[Fishy]

I keep saying there is no ACC Network because there is no ACC Network and the conference doesn't own the rights to anything that might enable a network.

I would dearly love the ACC to begin their own network because they'd likely stumble over the fact that their closest member to New York City is Boston College and that's not a good thing.

However, our circumstances have turned us in the sports world's most perfect realists. (Ignore the people who think we're a cinch for the Big Ten - they sniff glue.)

The ACC would have to buy rights back. They would have to have ESPN create a network that largely would be in competition with the SEC Network...which ESPN owns.

And so, in keeping with our perfect nightmare, the ACC Network is a fantasy.

 

[FfldCntyFan]

I keep saying there is no ACC Network because there is no ACC Network and the conference doesn't own the rights to anything that might enable a network.

I would dearly love the ACC to begin their own network because they'd likely stumble over the fact that their closest member to New York City is Boston College and that's not a good thing.

However, our circumstances have turned us in the sports world's most perfect realists. (Ignore the people who think we're a cinch for the Big Ten - they sniff glue.)

The ACC would have to buy rights back. They would have to have ESPN create a network that largely would be in competition with the SEC Network...which ESPN owns.

And so, in keeping with our perfect nightmare, the ACC Network is a fantasy.

Fishy, if the nightmare really was perfect both Jeff Hathaway and Paul Pasqualoni would still be working for the school.

 

[CAHUSKY]

You really think ESPN is going to tell the ACC that? I don't. But, thats just me.

Can you provide 1 reason why they wouldn't? What is the ACC's leverage in the "negotiation"? They already own the rights and don't have any other bidders.

 

[bingethinker]

I said that the financial advantage was the only advantage. But the Big Ten has always had more money, and they regularly lose the Rose Bowl and rarely are a threat for a National Championship in football, and have had a long dry spell in basketball. Ohio State is rolling through that schedule and will probably sit behind some 1 loss teams in the BCS because the Big Ten is such a weak football conference.

The high school football talent concentration has moved out of the Big Ten states and into the ACC, SEC, and PAC 12 states along with Texas. Maryland obviously did not make this move for football. They are leaving the football recruiting hotbeds behind to go to the Midwest where they have no recruiting presence or experience, and the quality high schol talent is diminishing in the midwest. Ask Ron Zook at Illinois. He's an expert on it. He's been at Florida and at Illinois. It's less of an issue with Urban Myer because there is some talent in Ohio, and he'll get it all.

In basketball, Maryland will find some good competition with Michigan, Michigan State, Ohio State, and Indiana. But they were not hurting for basketball competition in the ACC, especially now. So this move was not made for basketball either.

Anyone who thinks Maryland's decision to leave the ACC for the Big Ten was made because of the football and basketball rivalries is mistaken. A seat at the Big Ten's table >>>> A seat at the ACC's table. The ACC is a fine athletic conference, but the Big Ten defines institutions.

 

[NickyNewark]

Out of respect for Nicky, all I will say is congrats to Rutgers on your B1G invite. I wish y'all good luck, too.

I've always noted and appreciated the fact that your posts are considerate of everyone and w/o malice or arrogance.

 

[billybud]

Can you provide 1 reason why they wouldn't? What is the ACC's leverage in the "negotiation"? They already own the rights and don't have any other bidders.

The ACC can go to neutral arbitration if the two parties can not agree to value increase in the look-ins. That is a contractual stipulation.

 

[btstimpy]

Anyone who thinks Maryland's decision to leave the ACC for the Big Ten was made because of the football and basketball rivalries is mistaken. A seat at the Big Ten's table >>>> A seat at the ACC's table. The ACC is a fine athletic conference, but the Big Ten defines institutions.

Oooh, Fancy. The Big Ten has you impressed. They are the best of the Midwest.

 

[SouthronCross]

Can you provide 1 reason why they wouldn't? What is the ACC's leverage in the "negotiation"? They already own the rights and don't have any other bidders.

Yeah, simple business sense. ESPN and the ACC have a good business relationship. One that has been, and, needs to be, beneficial for both.

You keep mentioning leverage. There isn't any need for it. With the 5- and 10-year look-ins already written into the ACC's media deal, there will be automatic discussions about more money. If the league is able to deliver for them, they will get paid. Network or no network.

 

[SouthronCross]

Anyone who thinks Maryland's decision to leave the ACC for the Big Ten was made because of the football and basketball rivalries is mistaken. A seat at the Big Ten's table >>>> A seat at the ACC's table. The ACC is a fine athletic conference, but the Big Ten defines institutions.

The ACC takes a back seat to nobody when it comes to academics. Not even the B1G. And, don't give me the Louisville excuse. Nebraska is no academic heavyweight, either.

The B1G has always had more money than the ACC. That is nothing new.

The only possible fly in the ointment is if...IF...the B1G's revenue projections fall short of expectations.

 

[DarthGrumpy]

The ACC takes a back seat to nobody when it comes to academics. Not even the B1G. And, don't give me the Louisville excuse. Nebraska is no academic heavyweight, either.

The B1G has always had more money than the ACC. That is nothing new.

The only possible fly in the ointment is if...IF...the B1G's revenue projections fall short of expectations.

Overall, the ACC is top heavy (PAC is ever more top heavy) and weaker on the backend while the B1G is stronger in the middle according to US News. I included Johns Hopkins in the B1G as is it as an ‘associate’ similar to ND is to the ACC ( I did not include U Chicago as they do not play in any of the B1G’s sports nor did I include Navy in the American as it is typically not ranked). For any school not ranked, I used the next lowest overall ranking available 202).
ACC: 1) Duke #7, 2) Notre Dame #18, 3) Virginia #23, 4) Wake Forest #23, 5) UNC #30, 6) BC #31, 7) Georgia Tech #36, 8) U Miami #47), 9) Clemson #62, 10) Syracuse #62, 11) Pittsburgh #62, 12) Virginia Tech #69, 13) Florida St #91, 14) NC St #101, 15) Louisville #161
B1G: 1) Johns Hopkins #12, 2) Northwestern #12, 3) Michigan #28, 4) Penn St #37, 5) Illinois #41, 6) Wisconsin #41, 7) Ohio St #52, 8) Maryland #62, 9) Purdue #68, 10) Rutgers #69, 11) Minnesota #69, 12) Michigan St #73, 13) Iowa #73, 14) Indiana #75, 15) Nebraska #101
As a FYI, the other power 5 are as follows:
XII: 1) Texas #52, 2) Baylor #75, 3) TCU #82, 4) Iowa St #101, 5) Kansas #101, 6) Oklahoma #101, 7) Kansas St #135, 8) Oklahoma St #142, 9) Texas Tech #161, 10) West Virginia #170
PAC: 1) Stanford #5, 2) Cal #20, 3) UCLA #23, 4) USC #23, 5) U Washington #52, 6) Colorado #86, 7) Oregon #109, 8) Arizona #119, 9) Utah #121, 10) Washington St #128, 11) Arizona St #142, 12) Oregon St #142
SEC: 1) Vanderbilt #17, 2) Florida #49, 3) Georgia #60, 4) Texas A&M #69, 5) Alabama #86, 6) Auburn #91, 7) Missouri #97, 8) Tennessee #101, 9) South Carolina #112, 10) Kentucky #119, 11) Arkansas #128, 12) LSU #135, 13) Mississippi St #142, 14) Ole Miss #150
And of course, the American: 1) Tulane #52, 2) UConn #57, 3) SMU #60, 4) Tulsa #86, 5) Temple #121, 6) Cincinnati #135, 7) Central Florida #170, 8) South Florida #170, 9) East Carolina #181, 10) U Houston #190, 11) U Memphis NR #202
UConn’s ranking is the third highest FBS school not aligned with a P5 conference, Rice (#18) is the highest, followed by Tulane (#52)
Overall ranking of conferences by average score: 1) B1G 54.2, 2) ACC 54.9, 2) PAC 80.3, 3) SEC 96.9, 4) XII 112.0, 5) American 129.4

 

[billybud]

Oh yeah...John Hopkins in the B1G...now that is a stretch.

The Big Ten site doesn't even have their logo up with the others....

Get outa heah!

 

[DarthGrumpy]

Oh yeah...John Hopkins in the B1G...now that is a stretch.

The Big Ten site doesn't even have their logo up with the others....

Get outa heah!

The B1G announced in June of 2013 that Johns Hopkins, which is AAU, would join the B1G as an affiliate member in men’s and women’s lacrosse beginning in the 2014/5 academic year.
http://www.bigten.org/sports/m-lacros/spec-rel/060313aah.html
Doubt it will show-up on anyone’s website until after this spring’s (2014) college lacrosse season. I am sure this made Maryland very happy.