BiG CR articles

[btstimpy]

The University of Virginia is an outstanding university and would be a fantastic addition from the perspective of the B1G. However, the vote by Virginia in favor of raising the ACC exit fee and signing the ACC GOR, is evidence that Virginia has no desire to join the B1G. This can also be said of North Carolina, Duke and Georgia Tech for the exact same reason. Delany was hoping for North Carolina in combination with 1 or 3 of these other universities to follow Maryland and Rutgers to the B1G to establish an even stronger East Coast B1G presence. It is not to be. I do not see how any additional B1G expansion would involve a team from the ACC.

Virginia won't be joining the Big Ten Conference. There is no benefit for them to do so. I know of no other ACC school that would be interested either with the possible exception of Pittsburgh. But even Pittsburgh might be totally content in the ACC at this point.

 

[B1GALUM]

Virginia won't be joining the Big Ten Conference. There is no benefit for them to do so. I know of no other ACC school that would be interested either with the possible exception of Pittsburgh. But even Pittsburgh might be totally content in the ACC at this point.

You and I are in agreement: Virginia nor any team from the ACC will be joining the B1G.
All present or future ACC universities that voted in favor of a rise in the exit fee and signed the GOR did so because they desire to remain in the ACC.

 

[Adios]

UConn isn't "working" towards AAU in the sense that other schools are. UConn is throwing billions of dollars at the effort and is on a hiring binge unseen at nearly any university. OK and FSU may have the "plan" but UConn has the resources.

We are in Universitas 21. What more could we really ask for?

 

[B1GALUM]

The B1G has made it clear on this: CR is about making them money. And when you're a school like RU, who (apparently in their eyes) stands to make money for them through regional affiliation alone, so too goes the "too big to ignore football brand" stuff. RU has no real history in athletics, and MD, beyond their bball NC like 10+ years ago, hasn't done much of anything either in a very long time. None of the proposed schools, besides Mizzou who is apparently not even in the running anymore, have any kind of football program that you "can't ignore" like an Oklahoma or a Texas.

UConn is working its best at all the things it can control in light of our lack of a football brand that is too big to ignore. Our endowment is going to grow. The state just pumped a couple billion dollars in to UConn's science, math and engineering and general campus and faculty expansion, along with a few hundred million for our medical center, and we are getting close to AAU. We are already the flagship school of CT (and I argue potentially all of New England with the right B1G support). We are ranked ahead of most the the current B1G schools. We sit within and have strong fan bases in two major markets; more specifically, the B1G's main prize of NY. Our stadium is ready for expansion. The B1G has made it clear that they do still care about other sports, and there isn't an available school that would raise the conference's bball profile like UConn.

So, this "no interest" nonsense is, well, nonsense. There's no way the B1G can't be at least a little interested in UConn.

I share your opinion with an additional thought.

"There's no way the B1G can't be at least a little interested in UConn" if Dennis Dodd et al. are to believed that the B1G does want to expand in the near future as it heads into the negotiations for the new media rights.

How would the B1G expand in the next few years and not look at UConn?

The ACC and the Big 12 have GOR. Are Jim Delany et al. willing to challenge a GOR? Do any of the ACC and Big12 members really want to leave given their signing of the GOR?

The B1G has passed on Mizzou on multiple occasions. Why would the B1G invite them now rather than before and what is the likelihood of them even accepting a B1G invite given the prior passes by the B1G?

The B1G has "vetted" Vanderbilt but it is a southern school and a founding member of the SEC with membership dating back to 1932 and no dissatisfaction or finanical issues a la Maryland in the ACC. Why go B1G?

AAU members Rice and Tulane are available but how likely is it the B1G considers them for membership given neither brings any athletics of value to the B1G?

My thought on this is that UConn, although not AAU, is a state flagship public research university located in a region of interest to the B1G and brings two basketball brands to the B1G.

The B1G has to consider UConn if expansion is desired in the next few years.

 

[DarthGrumpy]

Every piece of news about B1G expansion is traced back to the Dodd comments in his article. Any news articles following up on this keep pointing back to Dodds with no new info. What does that tell you? It SHOULD tell you that there are a number of writers that have nothing new to write about until the start of CFB, so they may as well put out some filler articles to take up space (and meet their deadlines) until the start of the season. Also, it's big business now to get people to flock to the various sites looking for some obscure factoid about possible expansion. The fact that this is continuing is beyond ludicrous. If the B1G could not entice schools (or did not want to invite additional schools) to join before the GOR's at the other conferences went into place, why in the hell would they pursue it now? It makes no sense. It defies logic.

Besides, what I highlighted in bold should actually make a lot of UCONN fans conclude that the B1G has no interest in UCONN. I also wouldn't put a whole lot of stock in the AAU. They run on their own schedule and are trying to keep the club as exclusive as possible. While UCONN may be working hard at AAU status, there are an awful lot of other schools doing the same and doing the same press releases as Herbst. Besides, I think if the B1G wanted to use "AAU status" as a litmus test, it's most likely more concerned with whether the school in question has the research metrics met as opposed to getting the official membership card. I cannot imagine the B1G reviewing the UCONN data and stating the following: "While UCONN demonstrated that they have the research cache worthy of an AAU invite, we're not going to invite them because they don't have the label attached to their school...". Ludicrous.

I generally agree; but, the B1G question is if the B1G wants to be at 14 members or 16 members for the next media contract review. If they want 16, the B1G will likely review UConn along with a handful of other schools.

 

[DarthGrumpy]

Virginia won't be joining the Big Ten Conference. There is no benefit for them to do so. I know of no other ACC school that would be interested either with the possible exception of Pittsburgh. But even Pittsburgh might be totally content in the ACC at this point.

I agree that Virginia (and UNC) will not join the B1G today. The big question is 20+ years from now when the ACC’s GoR expires. At that point, will the demographic trends, i.e. folks from the Northeast and Midwest migrating to DC, RTP & Charlotte, shift opinions at UVA (and UNC, assuming they are about 10 years behind UVA trend wise) to be closer to the B1G than the ACC (or even SEC).

 

[DarthGrumpy]

The B1G has passed on Mizzou on multiple occasions. Why would the B1G invite them now rather than before and what is the likelihood of them even accepting a B1G invite given the prior passes by the B1G?

With respect to Missouri to the B1G, history has left a sour taste in the mouth of folks in Colombia. That said, Missouri still has traditional rivalries with Illinois and Nebraska and I am sure the academic side of the house would still prefer the B1G. Plus, the SEC does not have a GoR; but, it does have a spa at Alabama.

http://www.rolltide.com/allaccess/?media=394427

As the B1G’s expansion plan A (acquire UVA, UNC, G Tech, Florida St) and plan B (add Texas, Oklahoma, Kansas & TBD) did not work out and if the B1G does indeed want to be at 16 schools for the new V contract, then I have to assume that Missouri would be in the mix.

 

[B1GALUM]

With respect to Missouri to the B1G, history has left a sour taste in the mouth of folks in Colombia. That said, Missouri still has traditional rivalries with Illinois and Nebraska and I am sure the academic side of the house would still prefer the B1G. Plus, the SEC does not have a GoR; but, it does have a spa at Alabama.

http://www.rolltide.com/allaccess/?media=394427

As the B1G’s expansion plan A (acquire UVA, UNC, G Tech, Florida St) and plan B (add Texas, Oklahoma, Kansas & TBD) did not work out and if the B1G does indeed want to be at 16 schools for the new V contract, then I have to assume that Missouri would be in the mix.

I agree Missouri would have to be in the mix if the B1G definitely decides to expand now rather than after GOR expirations.
The B1G and Missouri would have to swallow their respective pride to make it happen.
However, the increased money from the new media rights negotiations could certainly help ease hard feelings.

 

[btstimpy]

I agree that Virginia (and UNC) will not join the B1G today. The big question is 20+ years from now when the ACC’s GoR expires. At that point, will the demographic trends, i.e. folks from the Northeast and Midwest migrating to DC, RTP & Charlotte, shift opinions at UVA (and UNC, assuming they are about 10 years behind UVA trend wise) to be closer to the B1G than the ACC (or even SEC).

I seriously doubt it. The ACC already is a Northeast Conference. So that is nothing new. I don't see Virginia or North Carolina becoming more midwest. The Big Ten Conference has no traction whatsoever in either state. There are some alumni in the DC area from Big Ten schools. Here in Richmond, however, the Big Ten Conference is hardly discussed. The Atlantic 10 gets discussed because Richmond and VCU are in it. The SEC gets some traction in North Carolina, but not all that much. 3 ACC schools, soon to be 4 with Louisville, have SEC rivals, so we do see the SEC on a regular basis play ACC schools.

 

[NickyNewark]

Virginia won't be joining the Big Ten Conference. There is no benefit for them to do so. I know of no other ACC school that would be interested either with the possible exception of Pittsburgh. But even Pittsburgh might be totally content in the ACC at this point.

SU would give up hoops to get into the B1G and I'm on their boards alot!When they heard RU to the B1G almost to a man they said "why not us" or "lucky devils" and they worship (subconsciously) and look up to PSU who they think considers them a rival !I'd guess 85% of the SU fan base given the choice would pick the B1G!And I live in CNY and know the ACC's weak perception here.Who knows if its really that weak as even the B1Gs bowl record has been down but the ACC has a shameful BCS bowl record topped off by Clemson's humiliating thrashing by WVU 2 years ago.Edit..stimpy,you should know this already since your a member of their board for a couple years!

 

[btstimpy]

I share your opinion with an additional thought.

"There's no way the B1G can't be at least a little interested in UConn" if Dennis Dodd et al. are to believed that the B1G does want to expand in the near future as it heads into the negotiations for the new media rights.

How would the B1G expand in the next few years and not look at UConn?

The ACC and the Big 12 have GOR. Are Jim Delany et al. willing to challenge a GOR? Do any of the ACC and Big12 members really want to leave given their signing of the GOR?

The B1G has passed on Mizzou on multiple occasions. Why would the B1G invite them now rather than before and what is the likelihood of them even accepting a B1G invite given the prior passes by the B1G?

The B1G has "vetted" Vanderbilt but it is a southern school and a founding member of the SEC with membership dating back to 1932 and no dissatisfaction or finanical issues a la Maryland in the ACC. Why go B1G?

AAU members Rice and Tulane are available but how likely is it the B1G considers them for membership given neither brings any athletics of value to the B1G?

My thought on this is that UConn, although not AAU, is a state flagship public research university located in a region of interest to the B1G and brings two basketball brands to the B1G.

The B1G has to consider UConn if expansion is desired in the next few years.

I still don't understand why the Big Ten passed on Missouri 2 years ago when Missouri was trying hard to join the Big Ten. I don't know if the Big Ten can get them now.

I also don't see southern schools wanting to join the Big Ten unless they are schools in the AAC or Conference USA wanting to upgrade their conference. And the two private schools you mention don't really fit a Big Ten profile other than they are AAU. Michigan-Rice football games don't have a lot of appeal.

I can see Kansas potentially having interest along with Iowa State. The Big Ten apparently doesn't want Iowa State. But they are AAU and fit perfectly. They are regionally connected with Nebraska, Minnesota, Iowa, etc.

 

[NickyNewark]

I agree that Virginia (and UNC) will not join the B1G today. The big question is 20+ years from now when the ACC’s GoR expires. At that point, will the demographic trends, i.e. folks from the Northeast and Midwest migrating to DC, RTP & Charlotte, shift opinions at UVA (and UNC, assuming they are about 10 years behind UVA trend wise) to be closer to the B1G than the ACC (or even SEC).

Already NC has passed NJ in population due to the fact so many NY/NJ/Conn/Pa and Del transplants moving there in the last 20 years for lower cost of living,cheaper housing and jobs moving south!I remember when b4 the exodus of Yankee's to the south Fla was a swampy backwater and the Carolinas were sparsely populated.As more Yank's move south they will bring their likes and habits along with there favorite teams (in their hearts) down with them!

 

[btstimpy]

SU would give up hoops to get into the B1G and I'm on their boards alot!When they heard RU to the B1G almost to a man they said "why not us" or "lucky devils" and they worship (subconsciously) and look up to PSU who they think considers them a rival !I'd guess 85% of the SU fan base given the choice would pick the B1G!And I live in CNY and know the ACC's weak perception here.Who knows if its really that weak as even the B1Gs bowl record has been down but the ACC has a shameful BCS bowl record topped off by Clemson's humiliating thrashing by WVU 2 years ago.

The funny thing about this is that when Notre Dame joined the ACC, the Penn State boards were saying "why not us", "lucky devils", and "I'm jealous". About half of the Penn State fan base would love to get into the ACC. I guess the grass is somehow greener on the other side. I also don't know too many happy campers in the Maryland fan base about now. I know several who are unhappy. Most of the Syracuse folks I talk to are very happy. The only ones that are not are the basketball fans that think they will miss Georgetown. I just suggest that they try to get Georgetown on the schedule.

 

[upstater]

Besides, what I highlighted in bold should actually make a lot of UCONN fans conclude that the B1G has no interest in UCONN. I also wouldn't put a whole lot of stock in the AAU. They run on their own schedule and are trying to keep the club as exclusive as possible.

It doesn't make me conclude that at all. People have already interpreted that in a variety of ways. UConn's eligibility for the B1G relies on its achieving the metrics needed for the AAU, and despite what you think, the academic program is elevating itself to that level.

 

[NickyNewark]

The funny thing about this is that when Notre Dame joined the ACC, the Penn State boards were saying "why not us", "lucky devils", and "I'm jealous". About half of the Penn State fan base would love to get into the ACC. I guess the grass is somehow greener on the other side. I also don't know too many happy campers in the Maryland fan base about now. I know several who are unhappy. Most of the Syracuse folks I talk to are very happy. The only ones that are not are the basketball fans that think they will miss Georgetown. I just suggest that they try to get Georgetown on the schedule.

No one outside of the fans disguntled with the way they were ostacised REALLY feels that way and as a native New Jerseyan Im in tune with all things PSU as after RU they are the favorite team and then ND!!But ND's fans are aging and getting harder to find and their ACC move didn't help but ND really will always be OK unless they give up CF independence!They stand proudly alone!

 

[NickyNewark]

The funny thing about this is that when Notre Dame joined the ACC, the Penn State boards were saying "why not us", "lucky devils", and "I'm jealous". About half of the Penn State fan base would love to get into the ACC. I guess the grass is somehow greener on the other side. I also don't know too many happy campers in the Maryland fan base about now. I know several who are unhappy. Most of the Syracuse folks I talk to are very happy. The only ones that are not are the basketball fans that think they will miss Georgetown. I just suggest that they try to get Georgetown on the schedule.

Try 3/4% at TOPS!There not stupid!Md was 50/50 at first but they're finally realizing it was a wise move and now Id guess 80/20 pro-B1G!

 

[UConn Dan]

I love how back in 2010, we were the 2nd best available option for B1G expansion as seen by CBS's Dennis Dodd in this blog post to not being on the radar at all for any conference. Take it for what it is, it's Dodd after all.
http://www.cbssports.com/mcc/blogs/entry/6270202/21083956?tag=headlines;collegefootball

 

[NickyNewark]

Try 3/4% at TOPS!There not stupid!Md was 50/50 at first but they're finally realizing it was a wise move and now Id guess 80/20 pro-B1G!

"@In regard to Stimpys responce to me about SU fans preference."
What else would you expect SU fans to say knowing they were snubbed?I living here know their hearts and I'd be too proud to admit it too but use common sense and check out their horrid recruiting!

 

[B1GALUM]

I still don't understand why the Big Ten passed on Missouri 2 years ago when Missouri was trying hard to join the Big Ten. I don't know if the Big Ten can get them now.

I also don't see southern schools wanting to join the Big Ten unless they are schools in the AAC or Conference USA wanting to upgrade their conference. And the two private schools you mention don't really fit a Big Ten profile other than they are AAU. Michigan-Rice football games don't have a lot of appeal.

I can see Kansas potentially having interest along with Iowa State. The Big Ten apparently doesn't want Iowa State. But they are AAU and fit perfectly. They are regionally connected with Nebraska, Minnesota, Iowa, etc.

The opportunity to pick up Nebraska as a 12th team was a great add for the B1G given their status as a historical college football brand. If the B1G decided to move beyond adding a 12th team, then I think Missouri likely would have been invited. However, because the decision was made to just get a 12th team, Nebraska is going to trump Missouri in that situation given their (Nebraska) status.

I do not know if the B1G could get Missouri now if Delany et al. had a change of mind. Missouri is not going to compete well in the SEC but still has the prestige of being a football team in the SEC, access to SEC recruiting grounds and will likely make significant money in the SEC.

I agree with you on the southern schools. I threw Rice and Tulane as well as Vanderbilt out there just because of all the talk about the B1G only taking AAU members. None of these are going to the B1G.

Kansas has been discussed for at least two decades as an option for the B1G but the Big 12 GOR presents a significant obstacle for any expansion with Kansas in the near term.

The challenge of course for Iowa State, beyond the Big 12 GOR, is that it does not open up any new markets to the B1G.

 

[upstater]

The opportunity to pick up Nebraska as a 12th team was a great add for the B1G given their status as a historical college football brand. If the B1G decided to move beyond adding a 12th team, then I think Missouri likely would have been invited. However, because the decision was made to just get a 12th team, Nebraska is going to trump Missouri in that situation given their (Nebraska) status.

I do not know if the B1G could get Missouri now if Delany et al. had a change of mind. Missouri is not going to compete well in the SEC but still has the prestige of being a football team in the SEC, access to SEC recruiting grounds and will likely make significant money in the SEC.

I agree with you on the southern schools. I threw Rice and Tulane as well as Vanderbilt out there just because of all the talk about the B1G only taking AAU members. None of these are going to the B1G.

Kansas has been discussed for at least two decades as an option for the B1G but the Big 12 GOR presents a significant obstacle for any expansion with Kansas in the near term.

The challenge of course for Iowa State, beyond the Big 12 GOR, is that it does not open up any new markets to the B1G.

I know Kansas has good basketball, but Missouri's market is much bigger, it has a bigger population AND decent-sized cities. I know there is crossover in Kansas City, but still Mizzou seems to have a much bigger market.

I'm surprised that Kansas would have more appeal than Mizzou, especially given the crossover between So. Illinois and Missouri. Mizzou is practically already inside the B10s footprint whereas Kansas is an outlier.

 

[btstimpy]

No one outside of the fans disguntled with the way they were ostacised REALLY feels that way and as a native New Jerseyan Im in tune with all things PSU as after RU they are the favorite team and then ND!!But ND's fans are aging and getting harder to find and their ACC move didn't help but ND really will always be OK unless they give up CF independence!They stand proudly alone!

I heard it from quite a few that I met when they visited Charlottesville last fall. There is a significant part of the Penn State fan base that has never liked the Big Ten Conference from the day they joined it. The school isn't paying them any attention though.

 

[upstater]

I heard it from quite a few that I met when they visited Charlottesville last fall. There is a significant part of the Penn State fan base that has never liked the Big Ten Conference from the day they joined it. The school isn't paying them any attention though.

As a PSU alum (grad school) I hate the B1G. That being said, I would say there is a very tiny minority that would prefer the ACC. Up until the scandal, the talk among fans was about PSU luring Maryland and Virginia to the B1G. Paterno was long rumored to have had Maryland in his "back pocket" back when he was proposing PSU and Miami to the BE in the late 1980s. He said Maryland would come along.

 

[B1GALUM]

I know Kansas has good basketball, but Missouri's market is much bigger, it has a bigger population AND decent-sized cities. I know there is crossover in Kansas City, but still Mizzou seems to have a much bigger market.

I'm surprised that Kansas would have more appeal than Mizzou, especially given the crossover between So. Illinois and Missouri. Mizzou is practically already inside the B10s footprint whereas Kansas is an outlier.

I actually think Kansas and Mizzou would both be of value to the B1G. I am surprised that inclusion of these two universities into the B1G has never happened.
Here is an article from - 1993! - that discusses the possibility of these two universities joining the B1G. Of note, Rutgers is mentioned as well.
http://articles.chicagotribune.com/...ommissioner-jim-delany-big-southwest-missouri

 

[btstimpy]

As a PSU alum (grad school) I hate the B1G. That being said, I would say there is a very tiny minority that would prefer the ACC. Up until the scandal, the talk among fans was about PSU luring Maryland and Virginia to the B1G. Paterno was long rumored to have had Maryland in his "back pocket" back when he was proposing PSU and Miami to the BE in the late 1980s. He said Maryland would come along.

I agree that most wouldn't have preferred the ACC up until recently. They viewed it as a Southern Conference. But some I've talked with like the idea of Boston College, Syracuse, Pitt, and Notre Dame in there now. It makes the ACC a whole lot more attractive to them than it was a decade ago. The Maryland and Rutgers invites were done in part to try to get some eastern presense in the Big Ten to try to keep Penn State content.

The direct access to Florida, Georgia, and the Carolinas for recruiting football talent would be a bonus. Paterno was already recruiting in Virginia and Maryland anyway.

 

[DarthGrumpy]

I seriously doubt it. The ACC already is a Northeast Conference. So that is nothing new. I don't see Virginia or North Carolina becoming more midwest. The Big Ten Conference has no traction whatsoever in either state. There are some alumni in the DC area from Big Ten schools. Here in Richmond, however, the Big Ten Conference is hardly discussed. The Atlantic 10 gets discussed because Richmond and VCU are in it. The SEC gets some traction in North Carolina, but not all that much. 3 ACC schools, soon to be 4 with Louisville, have SEC rivals, so we do see the SEC on a regular basis play ACC schools.

I down the road when all of the GoR’s expire and the P5 becomes the P4, I do believe that the ACC is in stronger shape that the XII to be the 4th P4 conference. If the ACC is the conference to implode, I believe that in 20 years UVA will definitely go to the B1G while UNC is about 50/50 between the B1G and the SEC.