Yum...is this crow?! It's delicious!

[RS9999X]

Classic SI Cover Story from 1999. The rise of the pedophile coaches

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/features/cover/news/2000/04/14/nack_nightmare/

Sandusky and Fine are the tip of the iceberg.

 

[tzznandrew]

Interesting but they have deleted that thread.

Disappointing. It was the thread titled "Fine." Oh well. seems like it's about to hit the fan there.

I like Boeheim and hope he can survive this (if he, indeed, didn't know anything). It was silly, though, to call potential victims "liars," though, and that might be what ultimately costs him.

 

[upstater]

Interesting but they have deleted that thread.

That thread was a doozy

 

[tzznandrew]

That thread was a doozy

It was. I think it is okay to post what was said there (if not, mods, feel free to delete). The poster seemed legit, and was taken seriously because he had broke the tape a day before it became public.

Highlights, from memory:

1. Laurie Fine slept with several big name SU ball players from the 80s to 00s.
2. Feds raided the Fine household, found numerous letters from parents concerned about Fine's relationship with their children.
3. Fine threw out his laptop, which the feds recovered, and it was filled with seriously incriminating evidence.

I can't think of the other things at the moment.

 

[Husky999]

It was. I think it is okay to post what was said there (if not, feel free to delete mods). The poster seemed legit, and was taken seriously because he had broke the tape a day before it became public.

Highlights, from memory:

1. Laurie Fine slept with several big name SU ball players from the 80s to 00s.
2. Feds raided the Fine household, found numerous letters from parents concerned about Fine's relationship with their children.
3. Fine threw out his laptop, which the feds recovered, and it was filled with seriously incriminating evidence.

I can't think of the other things at the moment.

If any of that is true Beoheim is gone. No chance he survives that. NONE. And I truly find it hard to believe that he knew "nothing" the entire time. If the abuse was as widespread as this post indicates I just find it hard to believe that if the parents were "concerned about Fine's relationship with their children" Beoheim wasn't contacted or involved in that at all.

 

[upstater]

It was. I think it is okay to post what was said there (if not, feel free to delete mods). The poster seemed legit, and was taken seriously because he had broke the tape a day before it became public.

Highlights, from memory:

1. Laurie Fine slept with several big name SU ball players from the 80s to 00s.
2. Feds raided the Fine household, found numerous letters from parents concerned about Fine's relationship with their children.
3. Fine threw out his laptop, which the feds recovered, and it was filled with seriously incriminating evidence.

I can't think of the other things at the moment.

4. The DA knew about all this in 2003.
5. There are other accusers who are part of the investigation who don't want their identities made public as of yet.

 

[RS9999X]

More on other coaching scandals

USA Swimming from earlier this month at Sports Illustrated. This was after Sandusky

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

A number of similar lawsuits have been filed around the country alleging USA Swimming covered up wrongdoing and allowed a culture of abuse to exist in its coaching ranks.

USA Swimming said it investigates misconduct complaints and revokes membership if behavior was inappropriate. It has also banned at least 46 coaches and officials for life, mostly for sexual misconduct.

Now lawyers have filed a lawsuit alleging the culture around youth swimming allows pedophile coaches to prey on the kids entrusted to their care.

"We have a rotten, sick culture in USA Swimming," said attorney Jonathan Little at a news conference Thursday. "Just like in the Penn State case, those in authority ignored sexual abuse claims and failed to report sexual abuse complaints to law enforcement

Read more: http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2011/more/11/10/usa.swimming.lawsuit.ap/index.html#ixzz1f1LlZzEH​

 

[tzznandrew]

4. The DA knew about all this in 2003.
5. There are other accusers who are part of the investigation who don't want their identities made public as of yet.

That's right. 5 was a biggie. There's a fourth accuser who doesn't want to have his name dragged through the mud. That would, unfortunately, be damning to Boeheim, because of publicly calling potential victims liars is discouraging to other victims.

 

[RS9999X]

If any of that is true Beoheim is gone. No chance he survives that. NONE. And I truly find it hard to believe that he knew "nothing" the entire time. If the abuse was as widespread as this post indicates I just find it hard to believe that if the parents were "concerned about Fine's relationship with their children" Beoheim wasn't contacted or involved in that at all.

The funny part are the pictures of the Fine home. The captions usually point out its directly across the street from the Boeheim home.

BTW I think Jim might be OK on this and deserves the benefit of a doubt.

 

[tzznandrew]

The funny part are the pictures of the Fine home. The captions usually point out its directly across the street from the Boeheim home.

BTW I think Jim might be OK on this and deserves the benefit of a doubt.

I think he does deserve the benefit of the doubt. But will he get it? I'm not so sure, especially if that poster (who, like I said, was right before) is right with those 5 bits of information. Because here's your problem:

1. He knew about things and covered them up. He's got to go (unlikely).
2. He didn't know about things. One of his closest friends molested many children and had many players over his house to bang his wife, and he didn't know. If he doesn't know about these things (particularly the first), what kind of oversight does he have? Ignorance is ignorance. He may have to go.

Like I said, 2 will be the logic of many in the public post-Paterno, and that might be enough to get him fired.

 

[caw]

I think he does deserve the benefit of the doubt. But will he get it? I'm not so sure, especially if that poster (who, like I said, was right before) is right with those 5 bits of information. Because here's your problem:

1. He knew about things and covered them up. He's got to go (unlikely).
2. He didn't know about things. One of his closest friends molested many children and had many players over his house to bang his wife, and he didn't know. If he doesn't know about these things (particularly the first), what kind of oversight does he have? Ignorance is ignorance. He may have to go.

Like I said, 2 will be the logic of many in the public post-Paterno, and that might be enough to get him fired.

So do the players banging L. Fine count as them receiving impermissible benefits? Can we say bye-bye National Championship? I know this is no joking matter but I couldn't help myself.

 

[uc1974]

Laurie Fine having sex with consenting adults is a non-issue and knowing about it is a non-issue. Sleazy, yes, but not the problem here.
Knowing about sexual molestation and not reporting it is a very serious issue. If Boeheim noted a parade of young men (18 or older) visiting Mrs. Fine or Mr. Fine
I would submit those facts, in and of themselves, mean nothing. Molesting children and non-traditional sexual relationships are two different things. One is a crime, one isn't.

 

[upstater]

Laurie Fine having sex with consenting adults is a non-issue and knowing about it is a non-issue. Sleazy, yes, but not the problem here.
Knowing about sexual molestation and not reporting it is a very serious issue. If Boeheim noted a parade of young men (18 or older) visiting Mrs. Fine or Mr. Fine
I would submit those facts, in and of themselves, mean nothing. Molesting children and non-traditional sexual relationships are two different things. One is a crime, one isn't.

No one said it's a crime.

But you're underplaying the relevance of the assistant coach's wife sleeping with basketball players.

 

[Donyell]

This is getting weirder by the minute. What is up with this Fine lady man she is a real doozy. How many players slept with her? Sounds like there was more than a couple and with Bernie in the mix evidently. What a household! JB across the street. A lot of years of sex going on so close to him was he totally blind that right under his nose there was strange happening going on.

 

[upstater]

This is getting weirder by the minute. What is up with this Fine lady man she is a real doozy. How many players slept with her? Sounds like there was more than a couple and with Bernie in the mix evidently. What a household! JB across the street. A lot of years of sex going on so close to him was he totally blind that right under his nose there was strange happening going on.

You seem to have understood the relevance of that bit of rumor.

 

[uc1974]

You don't want to be the sex police. Relationships with those under the age of consent is a crime. With certain statutory exceptions, relationships where both parties are adults is not a crime. I don't think NY state law makes coach's spouse, scholar athlete sex a crime absent any quid pro quo. Is it sleazy? You bet. If Boeheim "knew" about it should he have reported it? Retrospectively with great hindsight, yes. Would I have reported it? Unknown. I probably would have consulted legal counsel and followed his advice.

 

[The Funster]

Even if the sexual escapades are completely legal if I were coach, I'd feel compelled to deal with it. I mean, if my assistant's wife is banging ex ball boys or ex players then I'm having a conversation with the assistant. Either he gets it under control or his contract doesn't get renewed. You can't have that kind of stuff undermining your control of the program. You can turn a blind eye and maybe get away with little or no damage but chances are it will have some kind of negative effect on your program.

 

[RS9999X]

There's the image of the program thing and coercive sex from authority figures angle. Ironically Syracuse was the first University in the Nation to write a formal policy prohibiting staff and faculty from relationships with undergrads.

>> SU's policy prohibits staff and faculty, including teaching assistants, from having intimate relationships with undergraduate students, but only strongly discourages these relationships with graduate students, according to the SU Faculty Manual Policies and Procedures.

When Murphy wrote SU's policy in 1993, it was the only known policy of its kind at that time, Autrey said.

"The sentiment in 1993 that would probably prevail today is that people have the right to relationships," Murphy said. "So we put in as many protections as we can, short of prohibition."
<<

http://www.maristcircle.com/syracus...on-student-faculty-dating-1.2451089?pagereq=1

 

[freescooter]

Seems like there was an awful lot of strange stuff going on in Syracuse NY. As more and more information comes out, it is beginning to seem more and more like Boeheim either ignored lots of warning signals or didn't care. Players sleeping with the assistan head coach's wife? While it might not be a crime, it sure isn't something I'd want to encourage if I were a head coach. Yipes. Seems to me that there are certain lines you don't want to cross and the fines crossed them. While I guess you can't fire Boeheim for that, I have to think that any idea that he wasn't aware is mainly because he chose not to be aware. And it is sounding more and more like there was more going on with kids. If that does turn out to be the case, I have to believe that Boeheim is gone. His ocmments were completely inappropriate, and again, I have to believe that even if he didn't "see" anything, over 30 years he must have heard things and suspected things and I suspect his lack of knowledge was the result of not wanting to know.

 

[Deadrody]

Laurie Fine having sex with consenting adults is a non-issue and knowing about it is a non-issue. Sleazy, yes, but not the problem here.
Knowing about sexual molestation and not reporting it is a very serious issue. If Boeheim noted a parade of young men (18 or older) visiting Mrs. Fine or Mr. Fine
I would submit those facts, in and of themselves, mean nothing. Molesting children and non-traditional sexual relationships are two different things. One is a crime, one isn't.

Eh. I think it speaks to the culture surrounding the Fine household. Mrs. Fine let Mr. Fine be a pedophile pervert so long as she was getting hers from the players Mr. Fine funneled in her direction. Quite a sordid affair going on in the Fine household, to say the least.

And when you think about this kind of circus atmosphere, does it not make Boeheim's bizzaro speech after their title in 2003 in that goofy-ass giant orange cowboy hat make a little more sense ? You do have to wonder what level of institutional control he has there.

 

[SouthTampaBill]

We haven't even touched (so to speak) the lesbian stuff in college between coaches and players.

 

[Waquoit]

We haven't even touched (so to speak) the lesbian stuff in college between coaches and players.

But I bet you have and are touching yourself right now.

 

[ctchamps]

Interesting but they have deleted that thread.

I was in the middle of reading that thread when it was pulled.

 

[SouthTampaBill]

But I bet you have and are touching yourself right now.

Big problem with girls hoops and field hockey and soccer....

 

[SouthTampaBill]

Big problem with girls hoops and field hockey and soccer....

How would you feel if men's coaches and players were having sex. OK with you?