XL Center- Plan C, D or ???

[Ts5034]

Ok. I’m not against any major upgrade to the XL. Honestly they should just knock it down and build a new 12-14k seat arena and try to attract an NHL team. Hartford is still going in the wrong direction and I for one would love to see it become the city it should be. Unfortunately I feel that Stamford has been and will continue to outpace it.

How the hell did they ever let the atrium end up in private hands? Whoever allowed that to happen I hope has lost their job.

That is very bizarre how the atrium is owned by a completely different entity. It just makes an already difficult project more complicated. I don't want to be repetitive on here. I know the goal of this renovation is to attract more "big" acts and celebrities obviously, but I still don't think this will move the needle away from Mohegan and Foxwoods that much.

 

[CTBballfan243]

Connecticut, as usual, screwed up. Should put together some sort of RFP tha included a gambling parlor/ sports betting component to the downtown development and made a new arena part of the deal. You want to run a casino in Hartford you build Hartford a new arena. The Casino gets to keep all gambling revenue plus arena revenue from events they run. If pro team ever relocated to Hartford they get revenue from tickets/suites/concessions from the sporting events. The City of Hartford get an attraction to bring people into the City on a regular basis. Sports betting is only going to get bigger. CT missed the boat.

 

[Chin Diesel]

Connecticut, as usual, screwed up. Should put together some sort of RFP tha included a gambling parlor/ sports betting component to the downtown development and made a new arena part of the deal. You want to run a casino in Hartford you build Hartford a new arena. The Casino gets to keep all gambling revenue plus arena revenue from events they run. If pro team ever relocated to Hartford they get revenue from tickets/suites/concessions from the sporting events. The City of Hartford get an attraction to bring people into the City on a regular basis. Sports betting is only going to get bigger. CT missed the boat.

Doesn't CT have a dope deal with the Indian casinos that in exchange for yearly payments to the states, the state can't open up more casinos without their consent? Or something like that?

 

[CTBballfan243]

Doesn't CT have a dope deal with the Indian casinos that in exchange for yearly payments to the states, the state can't open up more casinos without their consent? Or something like that?

Yeah, but they were planning on opening a casino in East Windsor to compete with MGM in Springfield. If they’re still going ahead with this then it should be built in Hartford regardless if an arena is included:

 

[freescooter]

10-12,000 is about right for this market. Does UConn draw more for 5 games/ year? Sure but it doesn’t make sense to spend the extra money for 5 events out of what, 100 per year. Uconn hockey and the Wolfpack if they stay each probably average 3-5000. UConn Women might sell out 3-4 games. But Neither team is selling 16000 for New Hsmpahire or Marist or Central. Add that live attendance is dropping everywhere and UConn’s was falling for a decade BEFORE the AAC and this move is totally logical. Yeah I know the Big East blah blah blah, but reality is that after a year or two we are more likely to sell out a non-conference game with UNC than a Big East game with Creighton.
‘S

 

[Ts5034]

Doesn't CT have a dope deal with the Indian casinos that in exchange for yearly payments to the states, the state can't open up more casinos without their consent? Or something like that?

Thats exactly how it works. A few years back MGM wanted to build a casino in Bridgeport, and Mohegan and Foxwoods threatened the state with litigation.

There was some talk recently about the tribes managing a new arena in Hartford or the XL, but that never happened

 

[freescooter]

Oh and for what it’s worth Mohegan Sun Arena seats around 10,000. So does Webster Bank in Bridgeport.

 

[Chin Diesel]

Yeah, but they were planning on opening a casino in East Windsor to compete with MGM in Springfield. If they’re still going ahead with this then it should be built in Hartford regardless if an arena is included:

Thats exactly how it works. A few years back MGM wanted to build a casino in Bridgeport, and Mohegan and Foxwoods threatened the state with litigation.

There was some talk recently about the tribes managing a new arena in Hartford or the XL, but that never happened

Oh and for what it’s worth Mohegan Sun Arena seats around 10,000. So does Webster Bank in Bridgeport.

Okay.
So it doesn't make sense for the tribes to help rejuvenate a competitor 45 minutes away. Not too many performers are going to play Hartford on Tuesday and Mohegan Sun on Tuesday.
I'm thinking the option of adding a casino to make the XL more attractive is a non-starter.

 

[Kolumbo]

Wintrust Arena cost $173 million and only seats 10k, if my sources are correct. I like the idea of tearing down the HCC and replacing it with a modern facility brand new from the ground up, inside and out. But it sure is expensive.

 

[superjohn]

Okay.
So it doesn't make sense for the tribes to help rejuvenate a competitor 45 minutes away. Not too many performers are going to play Hartford on Tuesday and Mohegan Sun on Tuesday.
I'm thinking the option of adding a casino to make the XL more attractive is a non-starter.

The casino would've been the tiribes, it's absurd they keep dumping money on this building which ran it's course at least 15 years ago.

 

[superjohn]

Wintrust Arena cost $173 million and only seats 10k, if my sources are correct. I like the idea of tearing down the HCC and replacing it with a modern facility brand new from the ground up, inside and out. But it sure is expensive.

View attachment 62493

That isn't expensive, they'll have dumped that much putting lipstick on the decrepit XL center.

 

[huskymedic]

Yeah, but they were planning on opening a casino in East Windsor to compete with MGM in Springfield. If they’re still going ahead with this then it should be built in Hartford regardless if an arena is included:

They just pulled the plug on it (at least for now)...Tribes drop plans for East Windsor casino in near future.

 

[BlueDogs]

Needs to be rebuilt from the ground up with a vision and clear purpose. Build something aesthetically consistent with the City’s history (Yard Goats Stadium Style), create some public uses, and make sure it is superior to regional alternatives. It’s a building in search of a reason for existing.

 

[UCLJ0211]

Time to cut bait on the XL. Other than UConn, who has other options, what's left? We're spending $100 for AHL Hockey and the occasional monster truck rally? Wtaf?

Take $80M and build a new ice barn in Storrs or take $150M and build a new Gampel.

At 12k, no more NCAA regionals, no more concerts competing with Mohegan Sun.

I'm all for UConn playing at the XL, but doing it for 2k extra seats makes no sense if they pay anything for the use of the building.

They will have the capability to increase the seating capacity to over 12,000 if needed. Removable walls in the upper level.

 

[Chin Diesel]

The casino would've been the tiribes, it's absurd they keep dumping money on this building which ran it's course at least 15 years ago.

Understand the tribes would have run that casino but they are content running what they have, paying off the state and not having any competitors. They don't need to split the same money over two locations.

 

[gtcam]

Typical BS from everyone connected to the City of Hartford, State of CT and quite frankly, UConn - lets reform the place to sit as many as Gampel just when UConn joins the NBE - INSANE
But, it doesn't make any difference because it will never happen - no one has $ and ant $ the state gets will be poured into that DB Larsen's plan to replicate DB Kennedy's Big Dig of Boston to 84 and 91 around Hartford
Plus Lamont and his dolt of a Lt Gov will probably still be in Covid -19 mode in 2025
Let's play everything at Gampel and raze the XL for an off ramp of Hartford's Big Dig

 

[Ts5034]

Typical BS from everyone connected to the City of Hartford, State of CT and quite frankly, UConn - lets reform the place to sit as many as Gampel just when UConn joins the NBE - INSANE
But, it doesn't make any difference because it will never happen - no one has $ and ant $ the state gets will be poured into that DB Larsen's plan to replicate DB Kennedy's Big Dig of Boston to 84 and 91 around Hartford
Plus Lamont and his dolt of a Lt Gov will probably still be in Covid -19 mode in 2025
Let's play everything at Gampel and raze the XL for an off ramp of Hartford's Big Dig

I think it's safe to say that for the time being, zero games in Hartford is just not going to work. Ive suggested in the countless other threads on this topic that the answer that meets everybody in the middle is just less games in Hartford. The UConn athletic department isn't happy with Hartford and the XL Center and you can't blame them. It's kind of wacky that the school has to pay money to play there. The coaches are not happy with the place. Hurley is pretty much on record saying that. I remember going back over 10 years ago that some of the players at the time, mens and women's, were part of a Facebook group called something like "Gampel Pavilion, the real home of UConn basketball". It seems like the situation with the XL Center is finally coming to a head so to speak, and an easy way to keep everybody happy is to continue to play mens and women's games at the XL Center, but just play less of them at the XL Center.

 

[Chief00]

Freimuth specializes in losing money and being in over his head. So many bad ideas, where to start?
He’s living back in the 1980’s Hartford. Nothing he says rings true.

I haven’t eaten more than a couple pretzels at XL in 30 years. But the best way to increase concessions revenues is to get people out of the restroom lines and into the concession areas before the game and at halftime by building much greater restroom capacity. This shouldn’t be a huge ticket item just get it done.

Another thought, staff the entrance gates better, so people get inside sooner to spend money. Freimuth just doesn’t get business other than have your lobbyist friends bail you out with bad bills and pay off your political cronies with no bid contracts. So what when you lose even more money again, repeat the process.

What Freimuth and believe it or not Benedict seem to not acknowledge is that UConn has promised season ticket holders they can keep their SAME seats for the UConn seat donation. Now Freimuth is blowing all that up with apparently UConn’s ok. Very strange especially since these are the same loyal customers who are paying seat donations at 50% to 100% of what they would be paying if they actually had games to attend this year - so they can keep them in the future.

I think it’s a bad business practice not to treat customers in the upper bowl with minimum respect. They are your future lower bowl people in some instances but that doesn’t matter. Give them restrooms, nice seats etc.

Hartford is NOT the home to corporate HQ’s any more. UTC and Aetna are the two latest casualties. With good and exciting games we can make money through volume not this mindless luxary mythology.

 

[Chief00]

Typical BS from everyone connected to the City of Hartford, State of CT and quite frankly, UConn - lets reform the place to sit as many as Gampel just when UConn joins the NBE - INSANE
But, it doesn't make any difference because it will never happen - no one has $ and ant $ the state gets will be poured into that DB Larsen's plan to replicate DB Kennedy's Big Dig of Boston to 84 and 91 around Hartford
Plus Lamont and his dolt of a Lt Gov will probably still be in Covid -19 mode in 2025
Let's play everything at Gampel and raze the XL for an off ramp of Hartford's Big Dig

Good post other than Larson though is a good dude as CT politicians go. You can actually talk history with him and he gets context.

 

[TyroneShoo]

Lipstick on a pig

 

[JohnFSilver]

Good enough. Then they should have stuck with the eminent domain in '18, taken the property and cut a check for the fair value. Backing off the eminent domain has me wondering if there are other negotiations (threats) going on between the parties unrelated to XL.

Eminent domain is a politically toxic move. I know Supreme Court ruled in Kelo that it can be used to go from private owner to another private owner, let’s be honest, the juice isn’t worth the squeeze there. CRDA is quasi public, this would end up in Supreme Court again imo. Tying it up for the next 2-3 years with unclear result.

 

[Chin Diesel]

Eminent domain is a politically toxic move. I know Supreme Court ruled in Kelo that it can be used to go from private owner to another private owner, let’s be honest, the juice isn’t worth the squeeze there. CRDA is quasi public, this would end up in Supreme Court again imo. Tying it up for the next 2-3 years with unclear result.

I think there is a huge gulf between Kelo where they took private property from one person and gave it to another to generate more tax revenue and what would need to be done here. For one XL is a state funded and supported facility and Northland isn't doing anything with the atrium. To me this is more akin to someone holding a deed on an easement or finding a 200 year old deed and using it for bargaining.

 

[Deepster]

We're never getting the NHL back in Hartford. We blew it. CT stopped following the team once it was not shiny and new and they were bottom 3 in attendance for enough years to drive them out of town.

Then the Rangers were smart enough to put their minor league team here. The NHL would never put a team here with us having the Rangers farm team with the Rangers, Devils and Bruins all within 2 hours. It's never ever ever happening.

 

[Deepster]

And to pick at the Yard Goats scab and the development there.

That park was supposed to open in 2016 and didn't. Sat empty for a year. They opened to great success in 2017 and played there to sell out crowds in 2017, 2018 and 2019. Then sat empty for another year due to COVID.

That park is 5 years old now with 2 dead seasons and they're just breaking ground in the development around there....and who knows when or what that turn out like? Hartford did that park and team a disservice and would flop the same with a new XL reno.

 

[8893]

And to pick at the Yard Goats scab and the development there.

That park was supposed to open in 2016 and didn't. Sat empty for a year. They opened to great success in 2017 and played there to sell out crowds in 2017, 2018 and 2019. Then sat empty for another year due to COVID.

That park is 5 years old now with 2 dead seasons and they're just breaking ground in the development around there....and who knows when or what that turn out like? Hartford did that park and team a disservice and would flop the same with a new XL reno.

Is it still the plan to have a Hard Rock Hotel and Cafe be the centerpiece of the development around the park?

 

[Zissou]

Luxury bunkers, lol.

it’s a bad trend to ruin prime seating in favor of a bar area. Move the bar areas across the concourses so they don’t interfere with seating. Accept that this is an old building. Make the seating and viewing of the actual event as nice as possible.

if the bar venues are nice enough they will attract pre game and post game anyway. In Philly we have the Xfinity Live! venue across the parking lot and not even attached to the arena. It thrives even for college events. Some students and fans watch the game there and don’t even enter the arena.

 

[bfs3]

Awful take.

You say you both want a 12k-14k and something that will attract an NHL team. Do you you realize the incongruity in those statements?

And that doesn't even get in to of Hartford built an 18k-20k state of art arena, they aren't getting an NHL team.

Well true I don’t know anything about hockey or the NHL because Hockey sucks but I do think it would be huge for the city. If that’s the case then I have no issue with what they’re proposing.

Either way you’re a dick.

 

[Chin Diesel]

Well true I don’t know anything about hockey or the NHL because Hockey sucks but I do think it would be huge for the city. If that’s the case then I have no issue with what they’re proposing.

Either way you’re a dick.

Yes, I am. Long and distinguished. Which is why your mom loves it so much.

But at least I don't enter a thread suggesting Hartford build a 12k-14k arena to attrack an NHL team and then admit I don't follow or know the sport.

 

[Waquoit]

That park is 5 years old now with 2 dead seasons and they're just breaking ground in the development around there....and who knows when or what that turn out like? Hartford did that park and team a disservice and would flop the same with a new XL reno.

So much bad faith here it's not worth dissecting.

 

[Deepster]

So much bad faith here it's not worth dissecting.

This isn't a "faith" issue. It's a business venture. And again, 2 years out of 5 (40%) of that parks revenue is virtually 0.00 and there still is not a single new business in the surrounding area. At what point does your faith change that? 2025?