WVU gone from BE...Slive ( SEC commish) authorized to negotiate with WVU | Page 2 | The Boneyard

WVU gone from BE...Slive ( SEC commish) authorized to negotiate with WVU

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1. To the credit of the 'Neer fans, their board is not uniformly excited about this. Many, many are responding with thoughts of disliking the SEC, wanting the Big East to grow and keeping the rivalries they have. This is a class fan base, and no amounts of reports of some intimidation of opposing fans is going to easily change my mind on that (but, then again, I was there the week Jazz was murdered so I'm not neutral on this).

2. If Florida, Georgia, Kentucky and South Carolina are really ready to damage the SEC by looking at MIzzou or WVU because they are afraid to elevate FSU, Georgia Tech, Louisville and/or Clemson, respectively, to being an in-league competitor they are all mad. Talk about cutting off your nose to spite your face.

3. If this ( the move to 4 16 team conferences) has to happen, and I don't see why it does, would the three conferences driving the bus get on with it already so that everyone can adjust and get back to watching football please? For the life of me, I still don't see what an SEC member gets by expanding. But what do I know.
 
brasssbonanzaa said:
but in this scenario, MU wouldn't have that choice. supposedly, it's one or the other. of course, the "other" could very well be team 15 down the road.
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But seemingly if MU were to consider the BE, they would be going from instability to instability. So long as there are remaining moves on the chessboard, the BE will be at risk.
 
socttrojan said:
sorry SportsGuy,

you're absolutely wrong.

WVU competes for the SEC championship the minute they're a member (hope it doesn't happen)

sure, they stack up behind LSU, 'bama, Auburn, FL, but none other, they can stand firm w/ anybody in that conference, and on a good year, compete equally for their championship

they R the BIG east's bell cow, sure hope they stay w/ us...
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They will compete at the top of the SEC for the first couple of years (as BC did in the ACC for the first couple of years). But in the long term, they will not be able to compete with the other schools. The SEC is a completely different animal than any other conference. They will be the outcast in the conference. Within 5 years, WVU will be battling to get above .500 and make a bowl instead of battling to make a BCS bowl game as they do now.

But I guess that is just my opinion...neither of us can prove our point....time will tell. But I am very confident that WVU's on-field success will suffer significantly (but their bank account will be much bigger).
 
UConnSportsGuy said:
They will compete at the top of the SEC for the first couple of years (as BC did in the ACC for the first couple of years). But in the long term, they will not be able to compete with the other schools. The SEC is a completely different animal than any other conference. They will be the outcast in the conference. Within 5 years, WVU will be battling to get above .500 and make a bowl instead of battling to make a BCS bowl game as they do now.

But I guess that is just my opinion...neither of us can prove our point....time will tell. But I am very confident that WVU's on-field success will suffer significantly (but their bank account will be much bigger).
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Sure you cannot prove it, but can you say why WVU won't be able to compete long term?
 
BC stoppped competing in the ACC because OBrien left becuase Flipper is a moron, and Jags got fired because Flipper is a moron, and they hired Spaz who is terrible because Flipper is a moron. See the trend here? WVU would probably compete in the SEC, but I can't see them being a consistent powerhouse.
 
Morgantown is not a Southern town and hasn't been since 1863. Morgantown is 70 miles from Pittsburgh and only a few miles from the PA border. It's not culturally an SEC school and they would, to an extent, be an odd school out
 
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jpm25 said:
Sure you cannot prove it, but can you say why WVU won't be able to compete long term?
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I say this only half joking...but the WVU boosters do not have the deep pockets and willingness to break all rules that the established southern schools do (relatively speaking). Alabama, Auburn, Florida, LSU, Texas A&M, Georgia, Tennessee, and the list keeps going on and on. WVU would be a middle-of-the-pack SEC team in 5 years.
 
UConnSportsGuy said:
The irony is that Missouri may be electing to join the Big East over the SEC....which will then open up the SEC for WVU.

If WVU does take the SEC offer, they will live to regret the decision. They will become the BCU:ACC of the SEC. They will end up making more money, but their long term on-field success will suffer significantly. Be careful what you wish for...you might just get it.
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Not joining a conference because your afraid of the competition. Sorry, but this is a shit way to make decisions in life. If SEC or B10 invited UConn, I would take it in a heartbeat (ACC not so sure as I don't think they are all that).
 
uc1974 said:
Morgantown is not a Southern town and hasn't been since 1863. Morgantown is 70 miles from Pittsburgh and only a few miles from the PA border. It's not culturally an SEC school and they would, to an extent, be an odd school out
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That doesn't make sense to me. Morgantown isn't in Maine. Not much different than KY.
 
uconNYC said:
Not joining a conference because your afraid of the competition. Sorry, but this is a darn way to make decisions in life.
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It is not just the competition. It is culture, beliefs, and priorities. The SEC's are different that everyone else's. I don't believe that WVU will succeed in that culture and situation in the long term. Again, I think WVU would actually compete at the top of the SEC in the short term...so it isn't about talent/competition.
 
Actually it is a lot different than KY. I spent some time there and in Lexington about 17 years ago when my son was looking at colleges. He ended up at UTenn. in Knoxville. That's a Southern school and it certainly fits the SEC profile. UK does, too, although not quite as much. Anyway, my opinion certainly isn't gospel.
 
not so fast....everyone's favorite mouthpiece chip brown is reporting that part of a&m's acceptance to the sec is contingent on every big 12 school signing a waiver saying they will never sue the sec for this move. could be just more posturing via leaks from the UT administration trying to stick it to aTm, or this could be something. either way, i can't see baylor, KU, KSU, ISU, or just about anyone in the big 12 signing that. also sets a precedent for future expansion, would every big east team have to sign that waiver for wvu? this basically creates a process by which other conference members can block another school from leaving.
 
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Baylor's President is Ken Starr. Fat chance they won't sue.

I wouldn't blame WVU one bit. The conference leadership has been pitiful all around. At this point I wouldn't blame anyone for leaving.
 
I believe that mentioning WVU is just a ploy to smoke out Mizzou.

Once aTm and the Texoma crew bolt, that would leave five BXII schools to pick up the pieces. There would be plenty of pressure (as well as precedent) to allow the five to reconstitute themselves while keeping their BCS bid. Because of cultural differences, Mizzou may be more inclined to rebuild the BXII (while biding time for an elusive B1G invite) than to lock themselves into the SEC.

Meanwhile Slive & Co. are clearly averse to litigation in all of this, and Mizzou - in addition to bringing a big market and some built-in rivalries - offers the 'path of least resistance' for the SEC. Let's face it, them going after WVU just before the Big East enters contract negotiations would become a major legal issue for them, as well as for ESPN/CBS.

IMHO, they really want Mizzou to get with the program more than anything else...
 
If WVU wants the SEC invite, they better get it. By entertaining this invitation, they open the floodgates. Pitt, Rutgers, UConn and Syracuse are all better candidates for ACC expansion because of markets and academics.
 
nelsonmuntz said:
If WVU wants the SEC invite, they better get it. By entertaining this invitation, they open the floodgates. Pitt, Rutgers, UConn and Syracuse are all better candidates for ACC expansion because of markets and academics.
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That floodgate is open already.
 
jpm25 said:
Would MU choose a WVU-less BE over the SEC? Not sure about that.
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Makes a lot sense that if the SEC wants Mizzou, and they think Mizzou wants the Big East, that they try to coerce Missouri by saying if you go them "we'll just take WVU, and where does that leave you/Big East.

Oliver Luck has spoken publicly about a stable Big East being a better home for them than the SEC. WVU could in theory, use this to bring the football schools and agree them to sign an astronomical exit fee to get out in the future. Probably wishful thinking
 
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brasssbonanzaa said:
CUSA schools are 100% irrelevant in all of these discussions, they will be a non-factor. ISU is in no way linked with KU and KSU. Granted, ISU is kind of a non-starter as it is, give me the BCS team over the CUSA morons. I'd argue for Baylor over ISU due to location, more money, and bigger upside than ISU.
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What is the background for the "CUSA morons" comment? Knowledge, fact, foolishness, or just an opinion? Inadvertently, you make an interesting argument for UCF and even Houston compared with the Cyclones in Ames, Iowa and the Bears in Waco. I'd rather be in a hybrid with some ACC schools or possibly the Big 10, but Orlando, FL and Houston may offer some advantages over back water Ames and small private, non-existent TV market Waco. Tradition versus growth upside? Is that the reasoning, or something else that's less apparent?
 
WVU will succeed in the SEC. The AD will promote success, the fans would demand success.

WVU was successful as an independent......and had highly touted recruits that went on to be successful in the NFL. They recruit well from the SE and Texas as a BE member (Pat White, et al) ......don't you think they'll do better as a SEC member? I bet more of the top athletes would rather play for a team that competes against the best as opposed to one that doesn't.

Compared to the other BE programs, the atmosphere at WVU games is really BIG TIME. Most of the time the stadium is packed before games and the fans are cheering sideline to sideline. And they travel very well to bowl games.....no excuses. They will mesh well with any super conference that wants to poach them.

They certainly are (were) a big asset to the BE. But with economic problems nationwide and budgets to state schools being trimmed, who could blame them for going to where the BIG MONEY is going to be. Will they be favored conference champs "every year".......probably not, but they will be consistently competitive.

IF they decide to leave, I wish them the best.
 
brasssbonanzaa said:
not so fast....everyone's favorite mouthpiece chip brown is reporting that part of a&m's acceptance to the sec is contingent on every big 12 school signing a waiver saying they will never sue the sec for this move.
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Now why on Earth would they ever sign that?
 
WVU would fit in fine with the SEC, but if you were them, would you rather be an average SEC team or the more often than not BE champion? in the SEC they would do fine, but over the long run they'll trail schools like Florida and Alabama, and overall they'll likely be around the 5-8 out of 14 or 16 or whatever size they settle at.

from the SEC's perspective i don't think WVU adds a whole lot in terms of TV viewership so i doubt they'd invite them. from an athletic and competitive perspective it'd be a great fit, but unfortunately those two things don't seem to drive these decisions anymore
 
Latest news: aTm has an official SEC offer, provided the individual BXII left-behinds don't sue.

So far, Baylor isn't budging and has brought things to a grinding halt for now. Frankly, I can't blame them...
 
"Compared to the other BE programs, the atmosphere at WVU games is really BIG TIME. Most of the time the stadium is packed before games and the fans are cheering sideline to sideline."

So your saying the Rent isn't?!
 
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The "WVU to the SEC" rumor is getting zero traction in SEC country. There is no desire for the SEC to bring in the Wheeling/Morgantown/Charleston TV market and the truth be told, WVU doesn't bring any type of natural rival or eyeballs to the TV screen. The SEC may be backed into the corner by the remaining B-12 teams by having to agree not to take another B-12 team to secure the A&M move. That would eliminate Missouri. There are several ACC teams that would be naturally preferable from a TV market standpoint (Maryland w/ the DC market, NC State to escape the Duke UNC shadow and bring the Raleigh/Durham market, FSU because the Florida market is big enough to split between UF and FSU). I am not even including Clemson as they do not have a huge TV market, but would be a bigger fish than WVU.

As for the Baylor situation.......Baylor is one of the few teams on an island in this whole scenario. OK, OK St., Texas and TTech are negotiating w/ the PAC. Kansas, KSU. Missouri could fall back on the BE. Baylor seems screwed and would fall to the level of SMU and Houston, so I can totally understand their reluctance to sign anything.
 
UConnSportsGuy said:
It is not just the competition. It is culture, beliefs, and priorities. The SEC's are different that everyone else's. I don't believe that WVU will succeed in that culture and situation in the long term. Again, I think WVU would actually compete at the top of the SEC in the short term...so it isn't about talent/competition.
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I agree with this. With all due respect to WVU, they do not have the priorities, fanbase, the wealth, the recruiting territory or the history to compete over the long term with the Floridas, Georgias, Alabamas and LSUs. That doesn't mean they won't ever beat them. And goodnessl knows, they are closer to being able to do so in many ways than we are so I am not knocking them. But they would have serious and material long term structural disadvantages.
 
If this is all about the $$, and I've heard it is, then WVU is not an attractive option. Real small market, small draw, not even medium. And now, Baylor won't sign the liability release!
 
From the article on ESPN.com:
"We were notified yesterday afternoon that at least one Big 12 institution had withdrawn its previous consent and was considering legal action," University of Florida president and SEC chairman Dr. Bernie Machen said in a statement released Wednesday. "The SEC has stated that to consider an institution for membership, there must be no contractual hindrances to its departure. "

So, think any BE schools (or TCU) would block a potential WVU to SEC move if it came to this?
 
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