Wilson over Tuck???

[chrissaran]

Morgan is the most underrated player in women's college basketball without question, but she is not under appreciated by Geno, his staff and her teammates.

 

[asuwish]

You've seen Wilson shoot 3's? Really? And yesterday I saw chupacabra. This entire year Wilson attempted three 3-pointers. THREE. And she made a grand total of one. ONE. That's one more than none. Wilson knows her skill limitations, and any shot more than 8 feet from the basket is her Kryptonite. [I suspect those 3 attempts were likely shot-clock violation heaves.]

*I can understand you supporting your player, but please don't mention shooting three's in the same sentence as A'ja Wilson. It's silly.

A'ja is not my player. Tuck is my player. I think Morgan is probably one of the top 1o players in the country. I do think A'ja has skills and is a good player, but she's a freshman and not close to Tuck as of now. My point was to ask if a player has ever been an AA and not started for their team.

 

[baggerbob]

I misworded that question and you're missing the point. What a player produces per minute is what they did produce, divided by the number of minutes that they play. They are actual bottom-line numbers, and they're more reflective of performance than per game stats. Find me an advanced basketball metric that isn't in the box score that doesn't involve minutes played or pace and we can talk. If your friend is chucking up several shots (3? 4?) and making one, a 25% shooting percentage clearly doesn't warrant more playing time than he was getting.

I think that you're alluding to some biases that per minute stats can have, which are that a player who plays 2 minutes a game is generally playing against weaker opposition, and that players who play more minutes are generally better, and should get recognized for that. While it's true that you shouldn't compare the per minute statistics of a player who is playing 2 minutes to a player who is playing 35, that kind of reality check should come along with any statistical analysis.

A good example is Moriah Jefferson. She's playing 28 minutes per game, not because she's not crucial to the offense, but because UConn has blown out so many of the teams that they've played. When comparing her stats to Jewell Loyd (who's up at 32 minutes because her team has needed her to play for longer), do you think her production should get docked because she's playing fewer minutes? If that's the case, what's the value of per game stats at all, why not just look at totals on the season?

The only problem with that is it doesn't really equate that way. People who play less minutes at a time, are less tired then someone who plays the majority of the game. Also someone coming off the bench, has an advantage many times of playing against players less talented.

 

[RSHERMVIKES]

Averaged 12.9 points, 6.5 rebounds, shot 53.1%, had 61 blocks and 31 steals in only 19.7 minutes per game. That's 26.19 points per 40 minutes and 13.2 rebounds per 40 minutes. You have to admit those are pretty good numbers.

cockhrnleghrn- - - But what did she do against the team SoCar HAD to beat and still HAS to beat? UCONN, NOTHING! SHE WAS NON- EXISTENT! A NO-SHOW! Wilson couldn't carry Morgan Tuck's uniform! One is, even not voted, an AA! Morgan Tuck! The other is a want-to-be! With potential that may or may not be realized! If they meet in the Finals, UCONN will beat SoCar worse than the Feb. 9th game!

 

[RSHERMVIKES]

The AA selection committee is like Little League Baseball & Softball where EVERYONE gets a trophy because we don't want children feeling bad! Then they find out in the real world that hard work & success is rewarded! Not just showing up! There should have been Stewart, MoJeff, Tuck, KML and Loyd on the 1st team to be legit! It wasn't so it is a joke! The Coaches and players across the nation know who the real AA's are!

 

[RSHERMVIKES]

Speaking of five rings for Morgan:

I for one don't think it's going to happen.
Not because the team won't win five championships

But because Morgan will consider her balky knees and decide if she's to have a substantial pro career
She had better get on with it and leave with the class she entered with….Stewie and Moriah.

It will be a difficult but rational decision to forego her extra season of eligibility.
But after careful consideration, it is one she will make.

msf22b- - - Morgan Tuck is not thinking of anything right now but playing out her UCONN career including a red-shirt year! She is finally healthy and is having the best time of her life and would not desert her UCONN team mates for a $40,000.00 contract in the WNBA and a $50,000.00 contract in Europe or Asia! She has become one of the most respected leaders on the team and holds that responsibility highly and will be back competing at her usual high level till she's out of her college eligibility! And you can bet the ranch on that!

 

[cockhrnleghrn]

cockhrnleghrn- - - But what did she do against the team SoCar HAD to beat and still HAS to beat? UCONN, NOTHING! SHE WAS NON- EXISTENT! A NO-SHOW! Wilson couldn't carry Morgan Tuck's uniform! One is, even not voted, an AA! Morgan Tuck! The other is a want-to-be! With potential that may or may not be realized! If they meet in the Finals, UCONN will beat SoCar worse than the Feb. 9th game!

Why did we HAVE to beat UCONN? Our conference games are the most important to me, followed by Clemson. UCONN and Duke were after that, in my opinion. Certainly, if we play on Tuesday it will be the most important game. NCAAT games are always the most important, but during the regular season, my opinion is as above.

 

[Striper69]

Why did we HAVE to beat UCONN? Our conference games are the most important to me, followed by Clemson. UCONN and Duke were after that, in my opinion. Certainly, if we play on Tuesday it will be the most important game. NCAAT games are always the most important, but during the regular season, my opinion is as above.

Yeah, I don't think SC had to beat UCONN. I think Dawn just was happy to gauge where her team was against the elite (or maybe the illuminatti would be a better description).

 

[OneTrickPony]

Short answer...no!

But, should SC get past the leprechauns, I suspect Morgan will be anxious to weigh in on the subject where it counts...

 

[ndmb]

The only problem with that is it doesn't really equate that way. People who play less minutes at a time, are less tired then someone who plays the majority of the game. Also someone coming off the bench, has an advantage many times of playing against players less talented.

You get that I addressed that point in the post that you quoted, right? I already posted this in this thread, but there have been some interesting attempts to address this issue empirically, most of which have debunked the idea that efficiency is dramatically affected by playing time. Obviously the effects aren't linear, we're not talking about comparing Briana Pulido's per minute stats to Breanna Stewart's, more like a player who plays 20 min to a player who plays 30 min. Link 1 Link 2

 

[cockhrnleghrn]

Short answer...no!

But, should SC get past the leprechauns, I suspect Morgan will be anxious to weigh in on the subject where it counts...

Frosted Lucky Charms, they're magically delicious!

I would think in a game like that, everyone will be sky high, so I don't think that extra motivation is needed.

 

[OneTrickPony]

Frosted Lucky Charms, they're magically delicious!

I would think in a game like that, everyone will be sky high, so I don't think that extra motivation is needed.

Nor do I...

 

[Sluconn Husky]

cockhrnleghrn- - - But what did she do against the team SoCar HAD to beat and still HAS to beat? UCONN, NOTHING! SHE WAS NON- EXISTENT! A NO-SHOW!

I believe Tuck deserves to be on any list ahead of Wilson, but you are asking a lot of a freshmen to come into Gampel and put on a show against a great UConn team.

 

[Woof 101]

I believe Tuck deserves to be on any list ahead of Wilson, but you are asking a lot of a freshmen to come into Gampel and put on a show against a great UConn team.

It may be asking a lot but one should expect a lot from a player on a AA list ahead of others more deserving. This was a perfect opportunity to show everyone there would be no need for this thread.
Is she going to be great? Most likely but she is not at the level of the award handed out at this point.

 

[Sluconn Husky]

It may be asking a lot but one should expect a lot from a player on a AA list ahead of others more deserving.

Eh, I don't put much into one game, especially against great competition. Stewart had a rough game in South Bend this year, doesn't mean anything in the big picture.

 

[ndmb]

Eh, I don't put much into one game, especially against great competition. Stewart had a rough game in South Bend this year, doesn't mean anything in the big picture.

#smallsamplesize

 

[Woof 101]

Eh, I don't put much into one game, especially against great competition. Stewart had a rough game in South Bend this year, doesn't mean anything in the big picture.

No offense but what you put into one game has nothing to do with what a committee handing out these awards should be reviewing.
As for Stewart having a rough game in South Bend you are correct. You may have missed she has it rough and takes beat downs in every game. She gets beat up and doubled quite often and in that one as with others they pick their poison. Two others stepped up to carry the scoring. Stewie came away with a paltry 15 points 9 rebounds and 2 assists.
We can agree to disagree on this one.

 

[Sluconn Husky]

No offense but what you put into one game has nothing to do with what a committee handing out these awards should be reviewing.

That was my point. I don't believe Wilson's performance against UConn should be any deciding factor in any official postseason plaudits.

 

[RSHERMVIKES]

Why did we HAVE to beat UCONN? Our conference games are the most important to me, followed by Clemson. UCONN and Duke were after that, in my opinion. Certainly, if we play on Tuesday it will be the most important game. NCAAT games are always the most important, but during the regular season, my opinion is as above.

cockhrnleghrn- - - -Any time a team (SoCar) aspires to be the top dog at their level, Division I WCBB, then every chance they get they want to out-shine that rival (UCONN)! So YES SoCar HAD TO WIN vs UCONN on Feb.9th or April 7th or whenever they would meet! IF SoCar had won on Feb. 9th you would have stripped naked running around screaming WE'RE #1, WE'RE #1! So don't give me the BS that the game didn't mean anything! If it meant NOTHING why were you bragging on this board how SoCar was going to kick UCONN's ASS Feb. 9th? If it meant NOTHING you would have kept your big mouth on COCKY TALK then coming to THE BONEYARD but IT MEANT EVERYTHING TO YOU so you wanted to put us UCONN fans in their place! HAHa you had your ass handed to you on a plate!
If both our teams get to April 7th for the NCAA Finals we'll kick your ass again and do it worse than Feb. 9th and there's nothing SoCar can do about it!

 

[cockhrnleghrn]

cockhrnleghrn- - - -Any time a team (SoCar) aspires to be the top dog at their level, Division I WCBB, then every chance they get they want to out-shine that rival (UCONN)! So YES SoCar HAD TO WIN vs UCONN on Feb.9th or April 7th or whenever they would meet! IF SoCar had won on Feb. 9th you would have stripped naked running around screaming WE'RE #1, WE'RE #1! So don't give me the BS that the game didn't mean anything! If it meant NOTHING why were you bragging on this board how SoCar was going to kick UCONN's ASS Feb. 9th? If it meant NOTHING you would have kept your big mouth on COCKY TALK then coming to THE BONEYARD but IT MEANT EVERYTHING TO YOU so you wanted to put us UCONN fans in their place! HAHa you had your ass handed to you on a plate!
If both our teams get to April 7th for the NCAA Finals we'll kick your ass again and do it worse than Feb. 9th and there's nothing SoCar can do about it!

1) There's no need to shout, I am perfectly capable of hearing in a normal voice;
2) I never said anything of the sort about how we were "going to kick UCONN's ass". I did say I was confident that we would win. I was also confident that our men's team would beat Kentucky this season. I don't believe in defeatist attitudes. I also believe we will win 2 games in Tampa;
3) I've been posting on the Boneyard since long before we played this season, probably close to a year and a half;
4) If you'll re-read my post I said we didn't "have" to beat UCONN. We've played 3 times in all of our WBB history - 3 games does not a rivalry make. Our biggest rivals in WBB are Clemson, Tennessee, Kentucky, Georgia and probably North Carolina. If we continue to play UCONN every year then it will likely move up the list of rivalries.

 

[Buzzyboy]

cockhrnleghrn- - - -Any time a team (SoCar) aspires to be the top dog at their level, Division I WCBB, then every chance they get they want to out-shine that rival (UCONN)! So YES SoCar HAD TO WIN vs UCONN on Feb.9th or April 7th or whenever they would meet! IF SoCar had won on Feb. 9th you would have stripped naked running around screaming WE'RE #1, WE'RE #1! So don't give me the BS that the game didn't mean anything! If it meant NOTHING why were you bragging on this board how SoCar was going to kick UCONN's ASS Feb. 9th? If it meant NOTHING you would have kept your big mouth on COCKY TALK then coming to THE BONEYARD but IT MEANT EVERYTHING TO YOU so you wanted to put us UCONN fans in their place! HAHa you had your ass handed to you on a plate!
If both our teams get to April 7th for the NCAA Finals we'll kick your ass again and do it worse than Feb. 9th and there's nothing SoCar can do about it!

I thought that your response was a little overly aggressive. I have as much passion about UConn as the next guy but I don't think cockhrnleghrn ever was that forceful in his pregame expressions of how the game would turn out. I agree that South Carolina wanted and expected to win OR at LEAST be very competitive and the game surely didn't end up that way. I'm inclined to think that what WE LEARNED is that South Carolina would have to have UConn play a pretty bad game for them to have any chance to beat the Huskies. We are clearly a better team than they are. The only team I fear is Notre Dame and by fear, I'm just saying that I'm inclined to think their team is easily the most competitive with us. We'd better play quite well against them or it could be scary.

 

[Buzzyboy]

1) There's no need to shout, I am perfectly capable of hearing in a normal voice;
2) I never said anything of the sort about how we were "going to kick UCONN's ass". I did say I was confident that we would win. I was also confident that our men's team would beat Kentucky this season. I don't believe in defeatist attitudes. I also believe we will win 2 games in Tampa;
3) I've been posting on the Boneyard since long before we played this season, probably close to a year and a half;
4) If you'll re-read my post I said we didn't "have" to beat UCONN. We've played 3 times in all of our WBB history - 3 games does not a rivalry make. Our biggest rivals in WBB are Clemson, Tennessee, Kentucky, Georgia and probably North Carolina. If we continue to play UCONN every year then it will likely move up the list of rivalries.

I am not sure that South Carolina can sustain the level of recruiting that they've had. I think Dawn Staley has gotten some pretty talented recruits but that may possibly dry up if she doesn't have major success. What may happen is that some of the type girls who chose SC may eventually choose the Kentucky's or Louisville's or Tennessee's or maybe in FSU's if Dawn Staley can't get the job done. I'm not sold on her abilities as of yet though she's had some success. There have been other programs including Georgia's who have fallen in the past years and not been nearly as competitive year in and year out as they had previously. I wouldn't assume anything!

 

[ndmb]

1) There's no need to shout, I am perfectly capable of hearing in a normal voice;
2) I never said anything of the sort about how we were "going to kick UCONN's ass". I did say I was confident that we would win. I was also confident that our men's team would beat Kentucky this season. I don't believe in defeatist attitudes. I also believe we will win 2 games in Tampa;
3) I've been posting on the Boneyard since long before we played this season, probably close to a year and a half;
4) If you'll re-read my post I said we didn't "have" to beat UCONN. We've played 3 times in all of our WBB history - 3 games does not a rivalry make. Our biggest rivals in WBB are Clemson, Tennessee, Kentucky, Georgia and probably North Carolina. If we continue to play UCONN every year then it will likely move up the list of rivalries.

RSHERMVIKES is being pretty over the top and I think that's clear to pretty much everyone but them. I have always appreciated your posts; I think you post thoughtful comments and in good faith. Thanks from this Husky fan to your contributions to this board.

 

[Bgillon]

RSHERMVIKES is being pretty over the top and I think that's clear to pretty much everyone but them. I have always appreciated your posts; I think you post thoughtful comments and in good faith. Thanks from this Husky fan to your contributions to this board.

I agree wholeheartedly with this comment. You add a great perspective to this blog. And I want you to boast about your team. If we meet in the NC, I expect a closer game than the one in Feb.

 

[HuskyNan]

Do you think that she (or any players on teams that win the national title) care about being named to all american teams like this? Do you envision players sulking over not getting named to one of these lists?

I don't think Morgan experienced more than a moment's disappointment as she's focused on other things right now. But you can be sure Chris Dailey printed out the All-American list and posted it on the inside of Morgan's locker. I'd bet money on it.