Why didn't UConn have a bench tonight?

[BroadwayVa]

This--and Charlieball's earlier posts in this thread--seem to me exactly right. To me, the key issue isn't whether or not anyone beyond Azura could have helped off the bench in this game, and I can certainly understand why Geno chose to go with six players only in a game on the road and as tight as this one. To me, it's why that was the case, and I agree that Geno's reluctance to provide regular minutes (other than at the end of games) to his freshman (at least some of them) and Irwin throughout the games preceding this one is surely one of the most important reasons--if not the most important one--for this shortfall. Yes, they will screw up, be inconsistent, and may never get to the point where they belong in a close and important game. But they might, and they would at least provide some rest for the starters, and maybe save some fouls as well. I realize that's not Geno's way, and I get that anyone could simply respond by saying that it's silly to question the methods of a coach who has had such unprecedented success. But it's Geno, himself, who has identified a short bench as a serious problem, and in my view the only answer is playing with regularity--and from the very beginning of the season--the players who have the potential to solve it.

Geno didn't "identify" the short bench--it was words to the Bench to get your A-- in gear and produce.
To his standards. Charlie is right to some extent. I firmly believe practices teach--but you don't really learn until you are immersed in the waters of the game.
Only a novice in December would not see the requirement for more effective players stepping up---but the need for height is serious and with Uconn since April--and Batouly is the only bench that meets that criteria and she is hobbled. Old basketball adage --you can't (or cane\t) teach height.

 

[HuskyBandDad]

so we see things differently. I saw real fatigue(Samuelson,Williams,Collier). I saw Walker play effectively against MD(12&7),UCLA(13&3) and ND(6 rebounds). She could have provided important minutes giving breathers for the 6. Players commit dumb fouls (Collier) when they're tired. Walker can play. To say that putting her in means losing the game is ridiculous. Tired players are more likely to lose games. no big deal-that's just how I see it.

I agree with Walker. But I follow the 30 year hall of fame coach. We fans have no idea what happens in game prep.

 

[BroadwayVa]

of course UConn had a bench. Geno just didn't use it.

is Megan not good enough to play a couple of minutes? she hasn't seemed as effective since she had the flu, but has she really had the chance since? how about Kyla? she's playing very well lately.

Certainly not for the first time, Geno CHOSE to play his best 6 the entire 200 minutes. If (say) Z had also fouled out, Geno would have gone to Megan or Kyla, and one of them would have scored 6 points, got 4 rebounds, and we'd say she played great and that UConn had a terrific bench. But Z didn't foul out and so no one else played.

Everything else is just speculation and buzz.

Geno has 5 bench plus Touly----exclude Touly--Bench ? You can't teach height!!

 

[Rixxx]

IMHO, I believe an opportunity exists when the opposition substitutes their underclassmen. Isn't that the prime time for Geno to do likewise?

 

[HopJim]

This--and Charlieball's earlier posts in this thread--seem to me exactly right. To me, the key issue isn't whether or not anyone beyond Azura could have helped off the bench in this game, and I can certainly understand why Geno chose to go with six players only in a game on the road and as tight as this one. To me, it's why that was the case, and I agree that Geno's reluctance to provide regular minutes (other than at the end of games) to his freshman (at least some of them) and Irwin throughout the games preceding this one is surely one of the most important reasons--if not the most important one--for this shortfall. Yes, they will screw up, be inconsistent, and may never get to the point where they belong in a close and important game. But they might, and they would at least provide some rest for the starters, and maybe save some fouls as well. I realize that's not Geno's way, and I get that anyone could simply respond by saying that it's silly to question the methods of a coach who has had such unprecedented success. But it's Geno, himself, who has identified a short bench as a serious problem, and in my view the only answer is playing with regularity--and from the very beginning of the season--the players who have the potential to solve it.

A different view. "Help" can mean resting starters so they can play at higher level. The affect of the running, pounding, etc. is not related to just one game but to the entire season. We have a team where many have ankle and foot issues. Overwork is the #1 issue so if one goes down as Kia did last year and KLS the year before, this will become a different discussion.

 

[Tontobruto]

The discussion here is thoughtful and constructive. Thank you

 

[BroadwayVa]

I agree with Walker. But I follow the 30 year hall of fame coach. We fans have no idea what happens in game prep.

Most of us who played BB and those of us who have followed Uconn for 20 or 33 years have seen videos of practices--so most of us have very good idea of what happens in those practices. What we don't know is specific's on certain players--even the #2 coach in WBB inject frosh into big time games--Mabrey comes to mind--others for ND played as frosh. Dawn, (#3?) plays frosh regularly, Mss st plays frosh regularly, Louisville, etc---
The question is--does Geno recruit so poorly his kids are not worthy of playing as frosh? Facetious!

 

[HuskyBandDad]

Most of us who played BB and those of us who have followed Uconn for 20 or 33 years have seen videos of practices--so most of us have very good idea of what happens in those practices. What we don't know is specific's on certain players--even the #2 coach in WBB inject frosh into big time games--Mabrey comes to mind--others for ND played as frosh. Dawn, (#3?) plays frosh regularly, Mss st plays frosh regularly, Louisville, etc---
The question is--does Geno recruit so poorly his kids are not worthy of playing as frosh? Facetious!

Just because we see 30 second clips of practice on the Geno Show does not mean any of us knows what goes on during a 2-3 hour practice and film study and weight room.
And how many NC's does ND, Miss ST, SC and LVille have with all these frosh?

 

[boontonbomber]

Geno didn't "identify" the short bench--it was words to the Bench to get your A-- in gear and produce.
To his standards. Charlie is right to some extent. I firmly believe practices teach--but you don't really learn until you are immersed in the waters of the game.
Only a novice in December would not see the requirement for more effective players stepping up---but the need for height is serious and with Uconn since April--and Batouly is the only bench that meets that criteria and she is hobbled. Old basketball adage --you can't (or cane\t) teach height.

Walker has shown herself to be a very good rebounder. Quick to the ball, blocks out well, plays beyond her height.

 

[BroadwayVa]

While I agree with everyone who express concern over UConn’s effectively short bench in big games, that wasn’t why the game was close last night. For the past 2 seasons, UConn has been masking the fact that they don’t have a real post player.

Gabby and Pheesa have done a wonderful job, and UConn has employed some creative defensive schemes to defend teams with size like Baylor & SC last season, but like MS St last year, and TX last night, some teams will be able to expose UConn’s lack of a traditional post player.

Right now Z is getting a crash course on playing the post, and she’s been very good at times, but she’s got a ways to go. It should be noted that at Duke, Z was a wing. I had held out hope that Batouly would be able to at least play some “Natalie Butler” minutes, but whether it’s due to bad knees or lack of trust, that hasn’t happened so far.

During the incredible stretch of 4 straight championship teams, UConn always had some combination of Steph, Kiah, Tuck & Stewie to play against teams with one or more Bigs in the post, and so it was a strength for the Huskies, not a weakness they were trying to hide.

I agree, nice analysis. Last year Geno masked the lack of a Big until Mss St unmasked it. This year we had hopes Azura would be a Post---she wasn't and isn't--she's a wing, a great wing. She is learning
but she won't be fully effective this year--
Geno as all great coaches plays all year for March/April. The progression of his team is on a path to PEAK in late april---when do you want to play your best--January or April??

 

[BroadwayVa]

Walker has shown herself to be a very good rebounder. Quick to the ball, blocks out well, plays beyond her height.

'
I am a member of YOUR choir.

 

[boontonbomber]

I agree with Walker. But I follow the 30 year hall of fame coach. We fans have no idea what happens in game prep.

no, we don't know what's happening in game prep. but,as you agree, we have seen Walker perform against good teams. the only thing I can figure is that Geno must be peeved with her for some lack of practice intensity. I hope his not playing her doesn't hurt the team at some point.

 

[JoePgh]

Geno DID play Megan in the UCLA and Notre Dame games, and she did well. I have to assume that she practiced well in advance of those games, but that she hasn't been practicing as well recently.

Apparently no one takes seriously his "moral hazard" argument -- that if you allow a freshman to get minutes despite bad practices, then she has a tendency to tune out your coaching for the rest of her time at UConn. That makes sense to me, and I have to believe that Geno knows that from bitter past experience.

 

[BroadwayVa]

Just because we see 30 second clips of practice on the Geno Show does not mean any of us knows what goes on during a 2-3 hour practice and film study and weight room.
And how many NC's does ND, Miss ST, SC and LVille have with all these frosh?

You haven't seen the 1/2 long shows on Geno practices??
I bow to the master and kiss his ring. When a discussion can't go beyond--it goes to that. Geno is human--ALL humans are imperfect and with faults/flaws. !
Still one of those top coaches won that NC last year when Geno didn't---
Played Frosh against the same team that defeated Geno.

With the NC discussion ended. GENO has played Frosh and started frosh . If you go to those year prior to Stewie, maybe prior to Maya. He had teams with out fire power or decent guards beyond the frosh. He then HAD to used them--and he did. He even played Charde whom he though less than energetic and practiced less than stellar--because she could score. Never say Never.

 

[hart2hart]

I’d like too see Geno play MW and KI with 3 of the starters.... rest 2.
I bet they really improve! Just saying.........

 

[HuskyBandDad]

You haven't seen the 1/2 long shows on Geno practices??

I watch every Geno show. Some of the same clips are used in multiple shows. The clips are 30-60 seconds long.
You hear Geno making comments at certain players. How do you draw conclusions based on those short tid bits.
Have they ever shown them in the film room? I have never seen it.
Everyone can have their opinion but as Geno has said before "no one knows" but him and his coaches.

 

[BroadwayVa]

I watch every Geno show. Some of the same clips are used in multiple shows. The clips are 30-60 seconds long.
You hear Geno making comments at certain players. How do you draw conclusions based on those short tid bits.
Have they ever shown them in the film room? I have never seen it.
Everyone can have their opinion but as Geno has said before "no one knows" but him and his coaches.[/QUOTE

I would suggest it were he and his coaches.

 

[bizarro aj]

Geno has said hundreds of times, if i look at you and see fear or doubt in your eyes you will not play! Im pretty sure he knows how to run his team with his 33yrs of experience.

 

[HuskyBandDad]

He, him all the same. Lol

 

[BroadwayVa]

Geno DID play Megan in the UCLA and Notre Dame games, and she did well. I have to assume that she practiced well in advance of those games, but that she hasn't been practicing as well recently.he w

Apparently no one takes seriously his "moral hazard" argument -- that if you allow a freshman to get minutes despite bad practices, then she has a tendency to tune out your coaching for the rest of her time at UConn. That makes sense to me, and I have to believe that Geno knows that from bitter past experience.

You are right about the moral argument. And once you state your moral position--it's difficult to retract that.
But --when the need was there and the options were few--Geno used Frosh in nearly all positions as the need was seen. Charde--is my example --of one who today would not see the floor--her practices were not great, Geno by all reports thought her less than energetic. But she could score and he had few who could--she was excellent on the point of his press--he needed her.
Right now at this point ---he needs a Frosh/Soph or two to fill holes --give him a few minutes here and there. Walker, has shown she can play in big games. Coomb? Not Molly, not Touly, who else??

 

[DICKG]

of course UConn had a bench. Geno just didn't use it.

is Megan not good enough to play a couple of minutes? she hasn't seemed as effective since she had the flu, but has she really had the chance since? how about Kyla? she's playing very well lately.

Certainly not for the first time, Geno CHOSE to play his best 6 the entire 200 minutes. If (say) Z had also fouled out, Geno would have gone to Megan or Kyla, and one of them would have scored 6 points, got 4 rebounds, and we'd say she played great and that UConn had a terrific bench. But Z didn't foul out and so no one else played.

Everything else is just speculation and buzz.

Every year, the goal of this program is to get to the championship game. The Texas game was really an insignificant game in the whole scheme of things. I would rather a few on the bench players get some quality minutes in a game like this rather than win the game. Geno's comment after the game about his goal now is to get the bench more minutes is funny. He constantly berates his bench in the press. He jokes about Stevens' defense in the press. That is not how you instill confidence in a person. His feelings about his bench players should be kept for the locker room; after all he is the one who recruited all of them. Some of them were high school all americans and it is a reflection on him if none of them can give him "quality minutes", whatever that is.

 

[CocoHusky]

Rellah Boothe of Texas (who was going to avg 40 pts or something like that to show people she is the best recruit from last year) did not get in the game either, so don't feel bad for Megan.

None of the three highly touted Texas Freshmen 9 Boothe #3, Patterson #4, Littleton # 33 played in the game, pretty much the same as UCONN Walker #1, Coombs #13, Gordon #29.

 

[drweo]

That's who Geno is. Bench players making contributions against the dregs we play in the AAC doesn't impress him. He clearly has no level of trust with any of them past the sixth position.

He did almost pay a price for it tonight, though. Katie Lou played her heart out, but she was dead tired at the end. That's why she missed the FTs that would have made the final stretch much less nerve racking.

And the blackened, swollen eye may have contributed to the missed shots as well.

 

[Charliebball]

While 99% of my focus is on enjoying the great win, I do think about UConn in 2 years with no true post player. Geno usually figures out a way to overcome but with all the giants at Texas, Baylor, etc. curious what his plan is.

the loss of Charli Collier can't be underestimated but ONO is 6'4" and quite a fine shot blocker so they will have some additional height starting next year

 

[Charliebball]

Geno DID play Megan in the UCLA and Notre Dame games, and she did well. I have to assume that she practiced well in advance of those games, but that she hasn't been practicing as well recently.

Apparently no one takes seriously his "moral hazard" argument -- that if you allow a freshman to get minutes despite bad practices, then she has a tendency to tune out your coaching for the rest of her time at UConn. That makes sense to me, and I have to believe that Geno knows that from bitter past experience.

I believe it but I think there's a compromise position where the best of the lot get some useful minutes even if they have been somewhat less then stellar in practice..........obviously anybody that dogs it gets nada................in the end if you don't play your bench you hurt the starters and negate the development of your younger players

 

[CocoHusky]

The bench players have not demonstrated in practice that they are ready to play up to UConn’s standards yet . Once they do they will play. I for one am glad that Geno and UConn don’t cave and make the players earn their playing time.

Hasn't Megan Walker earned any level of trust from her play in the UCLA and ND games? Hard to imagine she could have played better.

 

[Goodgood]

None of the three highly touted Texas Freshmen 9 Boothe #3, Patterson #4, Littleton # 33 played in the game, pretty much the same as UCONN Walker #1, Coombs #13, Gordon #29.

Yes, that is correct but 9 Texas players were in the game vs 6 for UConn. We just need to give the starters more rest so we don't lose like we almost always do in overtime.

 

[CocoHusky]

While 99% of my focus is on enjoying the great win, I do think about UConn in 2 years with no true post player. Geno usually figures out a way to overcome but with all the giants at Texas, Baylor, etc. curious what his plan is.

the loss of Charli Collier can't be underestimated but ONO is 6'4" and quite a fine shot blocker so they will have some additional height starting next year

How about an entirely foreign Rx for the UCONN post.
An Australian in 2018-Ezi
A gal from U.S. Virgin Islands in 2019- Aliyah
A Brazilian in 2020- Kamilla.

 

[HuskyBandDad]

Every year, the goal of this program is to get to the championship game. The Texas game was really an insignificant game in the whole scheme of things. I would rather a few on the bench players get some quality minutes in a game like this rather than win the game. Geno's comment after the game about his goal now is to get the bench more minutes is funny. He constantly berates his bench in the press. He jokes about Stevens' defense in the press. That is not how you instill confidence in a person. His feelings about his bench players should be kept for the locker room; after all he is the one who recruited all of them. Some of them were high school all americans and it is a reflection on him if none of them can give him "quality minutes", whatever that is.

You don't follow the program much?

 

[HuskyBandDad]

102 ? straight regular season wins. 169-1? I think it sounds crazy to be complaining about anything.