Weak schedule

[HuskyNan]

There always exists a “standalone” opportunity for UConn to make a jump to a P4 conference. But the P4 are all about football, and UConn is the one and only school in the BE that is playing a BCS football schedule, albeit as an independent. Unless a school checks off BCS football as a competitive sport there is no opportunity for them to join a P4 conference.

There is no Big East football. Villanova is in the CAA and Georgetown is in the Patriot League. If any other schools play football, I’m unaware of it

 

[oldude]

There is no Big East football. Villanova is in the CAA and Georgetown is in the Patriot League. If any other schools play football, I’m unaware of it

Butler plays in the Pioneer League. Like Villanova and Georgetown they are a non-BCS team with no ambition to play with the big boys of college football.

 

[oldhusky]

If UConn runs the table heading into the Big Dance at 34-0, which is a distinct possibility, then the only way that the Huskies are not the #1 overall seed is if either SC or UCLA runs the table against tougher schedules, and even then, UConn may still be the overall #1 seed.

Our schedule is relatively weaker this year than most years, but still it is stronger than most national championship contenders before they hit their conference schedule. After teams start their conference schedule our competition is much weaker.

That means there is pressure on us to not have a slip up before everyone hits the conference schedule because we have few opportunities to make up for it with a big win. The Big East seems relatively weaker this year as well, so our seeding upside is pretty well determined before the conference schedule, with the exception of two significant OOC games later in the year.

If we sweep all our OOC games, we are very likely to be the #1 overall seed. If we lose one of them, I think we could still be one of the four top seeds, but we are somewhat at the mercy of how other teams do. Basically we probably need to have fewer losses than the winner of the Power 4 conferences to stay ahead of them.

The good news is a team has to be pretty exceptional to get thru those conference schedules unscathed. I think the odds of one team winning all their conference games in the Power 4 is not very high, whereas it is almost expected for us. Our season is try to hold serve OOC where we will be favored in every game, while rooting for the top teams in the Power 4 to knock each other off every once in a while.

We start in the top position and probably have the best chance in the country to run the table, but if we do lose one, we probably need the other top teams to lose two to stay ahead of them, but that could happen. I suspect if we lost two, our upside would be a number 2 seed, but time will tell.

 

[Ozimoto]

I know seeding does have an impact on your road to the title when it comes tournament time, but the bottom line is you have to win the games when it matters to hold the trophy. If you don't do that, seeding doesn't mean squat.

 

[FanSince17]

Butler plays in the Pioneer League. Like Villanova and Georgetown they are a non-BCS team with no ambition to play with the big boys of college football.

I think this subject is interesting. When I was in college at Washington and Lee University, those schools were D3. I don’t know the ins and outs of it. My best friend’s father coached Davidson football and he advanced the program to a higher level. He eventually destroyed the D3 schedule and Davidson moved toward D1AA and D1.
I don’t think it’s helpful to just shoot down our ideas. (Not you)
I think we all want the best basketball players in the world to be able to compete at the highest level possible.
FYI Minnesota embarrassed Marquette last night, 90-47. Creighton plays Nebraska tonight and Princeton plays Nova tonight.
If it’s a duck, call it a duck.

 

[huskeynut]

The schedule is what it is. Just go out and win games.yracu

What can hurt your seeding for the NCAA's is loosing.

As to the ACC, though UConn would be an excellent fit, BC, Miami, Pitt and Syracuse really don't want us. Asl Bluementhal why.

 

[oldude]

I think this subject is interesting. When I was in college at Washington and Lee University, those schools were D3. I don’t know the ins and outs of it. My best friend’s father coached Davidson football and he advanced the program to a higher level. He eventually destroyed the D3 schedule and Davidson moved toward D1AA and D1.
I don’t think it’s helpful to just shoot down our ideas. (Not you)
I think we all want the best basketball players in the world to be able to compete at the highest level possible.
FYI Minnesota embarrassed Marquette last night, 90-47. Creighton plays Nebraska tonight and Princeton plays Nova tonight.
If it’s a duck, call it a duck.

I am not suggesting for a second that BE WBB is formidable. There is UConn and everyone else. But unless and until UConn can somehow finagle membership into a P4 conference I will continue to say what I have repeated ad nauseum, “It is what it is.”

 

[Stagnant]

I think this is the weakest out of conference schedule we have had in ages. My guess is that Geno called and a lot of people said no. And we may have struggled to put this schedule together.

And our weak schedule really rears its head when we look at the conference schedule. The big east is way down this year. There is no semi strong Creighton team anymore. Marquette was just selected to finish second in the conference. And they lost to Minnesota by 40.

We can only control what we can control as far as the schedule is concerned. But I think it is harder this year to give LSU a hard time about their schedule.

 

[uconnfan68]

Am sorry but what does the Big East have to offer? Quick answer is nothing. The league was so much better when C Viv; Muffet; Harry and Doug were here. Even though USF never beat us Jose always had good teams.

We didn't join for wbb. It was for mbb.

 

[uconnfan68]

Our schedule is relatively weaker this year than most years, but still it is stronger than most national championship contenders before they hit their conference schedule. After teams start their conference schedule our competition is much weaker.

That means there is pressure on us to not have a slip up before everyone hits the conference schedule because we have few opportunities to make up for it with a big win. The Big East seems relatively weaker this year as well, so our seeding upside is pretty well determined before the conference schedule, with the exception of two significant OOC games later in the year.

If we sweep all our OOC games, we are very likely to be the #1 overall seed. If we lose one of them, I think we could still be one of the four top seeds, but we are somewhat at the mercy of how other teams do. Basically we probably need to have fewer losses than the winner of the Power 4 conferences to stay ahead of them.

The good news is a team has to be pretty exceptional to get thru those conference schedules unscathed. I think the odds of one team winning all their conference games in the Power 4 is not very high, whereas it is almost expected for us. Our season is try to hold serve OOC where we will be favored in every game, while rooting for the top teams in the Power 4 to knock each other off every once in a while.

We start in the top position and probably have the best chance in the country to run the table, but if we do lose one, we probably need the other top teams to lose two to stay ahead of them, but that could happen. I suspect if we lost two, our upside would be a number 2 seed, but time will tell.

It wouldn't matter if we were a #16 seed. No one wants to face us. We just get penalized with no home games.

 

[uconnever]

I said this is an unusually weak schedule when it came out and that there is a good chance we go undefeated. But that wouldn't necessarily mean we are the best team, we need to play at least one of the other teams that are going to compete for a title like UCLA, South Carolina or Texas. Tennessee will be a tough test for us, but that's about it. This makes me nervous for the tournament because the other conferences are stronger top to bottom so those other teams will be battle tested a little more than us. I trust the coaches though.

 

[iri10]

The thing that irritates me most about this year's schedule is not the quality of OOC, or even how mediocre the conference is this year. It's the number of conference games. No conference should have more than 18 games, IMO, even if it's very strong. And we've got 20.

The college game is hurt - in terms of being able to compare teams around the country, in terms of "narratives," etc. - because conferences have limited space for good OOC games. They're all busy with their conferences in the later part of the season, and many are uninterested in testing their team early in the season.

I've had an opinion for a long time, where I wish that there was a mandatory conference break lasting 2-3 weeks in February, in which teams were obliged to schedule OOC. They can make up for it by starting their conference play earlier than they typically do today. Combine that with a stricter limit in total conference games allowed (maybe 16), and the sport as a whole should end up with some juicy OOC during that time period.

 

[HuskyNan]

Guys - (sigh, it’s only November but we need to do this again)

1. AP and Coaches Poll rankings have zero to do with seeding. Nada, zip. Not UConn’s ranking or its opponents
2. The NET ranking is important. A team doesn’t need to be top tier, only in the top 25 of the NET when UConn plays at home and top 50 when playing on the road. That makes it a Quad 1 win - which is important - and several Big East teams fall into that category as do other UConn opponents. Playing a team with a winning record is also valuable to the Huskies
3. Geno likes to play a variety of teams with different styles of play so he can prepare the team for the postseason. While he hates to lose and tries to avoid it as much as possible his ultimate goal is to prepare for March and April. I think that’s one reason for his success- he’s trying to build a postseason team while other teams are focused on winning the regular season

I’m typing on my phone and really need to get back to work but that’s pretty much what I was trying to say

 

[Topdawg]

Current SOS's via Massey:

UConn: 11

Texas: 185

LSU: 262

South Carolina: 155

Notre Dame: 363

The forward looking SOS on Massey for UConn is 22. Not horrible!

 

[Vowelguy]

If there is absolutely nothing UConn can do about it, what exactly is the point of bitching about their conference affiliation?

So I guess this board will have no more bitching about injuries, referees, what people in the media say.
Gonna be mighty quiet.

 

[FanSince17]

It's about competition for players, coaches, schools, and fans. Ideally in a season there are competitive opportunities with other teams twice a week. When I went to the Univ of MD in the early 80's, we waited in line for the ticket office to open so we could get our tickets. Every game in the ACC was tough. We had Albert King, NC had Jordan, Perkins, etc. Back in those days, conference championships were a battle royale. 1974 Maryland- 4th ranked, lost to NC St to get knocked out of the NCAA tournament. Every game was important. We didn't talk about seeding in November. What is that?
30 for 30: Requiem for the Big East- ascension of the Big East basketball league in the 80's.
Reminder of what league competition night after night can look like. OMG to be a player then!
I know, "it is what it is", and UConn does everything humanly possible to enhance the players' experience playing at a high level in college, but.....
I don't know what, but I believe something can be done...

 

[cordarone]

So I guess this board will have no more bitching about injuries, referees, what people in the media say.
Gonna be mighty quiet.

It took only until page 2 for the strawmen (or mobile goalposts, if you prefer) to come out.

 

[QtrCrtPress]

We have the players to win it all so if we get penalized for a “weaker schedule” then so be it. USC is #8 and moving up and their next big test will be against UCLA. We have to play them at their house with jasmine D the #1 freshmen . This game against USC will be a good barometer for us.

USC plays South Carolina before UCLA.

 

[cwh20]

More conference games hurts UConn two ways. They already beat up on the conference so adding two more mainly non-competitive wins when they’d rather face tougher OOC opponents doesn’t help the Huskies. and the bigger (related) reason is the teams in p4 conferences also have two more in-conference games. tougher games. That leaves the p4 schools with less incentive and room to schedule UConn. They may be worried about that extra (probable) loss to UConn. And it could help them if UConn is not as battle tested in OOC games as in previous years heading into the NCAA tourney. Hopefully UConn will overcome the weaker schedule.

Conference realignment. It’s mainly about $$$. Football is by far the biggest consideration. Would expansion get a conference into an additional lucrative market is the main draw. So football is king while mbb is a very small factor and the other sports matter not at all. UConn did fill the Rent with Randy Edsall in the Big East conf.

Also, UConn beat NC (not NCST) in the bowl game last year and the move to the AAC was absolutely football driven. Basketball was not a consideration.

 

[EricSD]

^^^ This.

The sad fact is that Playing Xavier, Providence, Butler, and whoever else is at the bottom of the BE...Playing them twice each does NOTHING for UConn. I'm guessing they tried, but it would have been nice to see UConn use it's status and stature to say "no" to 20 games, and in fact, drop it down to 16 or something.

I know it's been discussed ad nauseum, and some (many) are tired of it as it's true - there is zero we can do about our conference. But increasing the # of BE games took 2 OOC off the table for this year, and gave UConn 2 more cupcakes to beat up on, which is not needed.

Side note - what about the strong mid-majors? Usually they want to play anyone any time - but P4 teams tend to avoid them. Green Bay, Gonzaga, South Dakota, South Dakota State, Columbia, Princeton, Harvard, Fairfield, Ball State, James Madison, etc. Would love to see a couple of those on the schedule.

 

[NycUcWbbFan]

More conference games hurts UConn two ways. They already beat up on the conference so adding two more mainly non-competitive wins when they’d rather face tougher OOC opponents doesn’t help the Huskies. and the bigger (related) reason is the teams in p4 conferences also have two more in-conference games. tougher games. That leaves the p4 schools with less incentive and room to schedule UConn. They may be worried about that extra (probable) loss to UConn. And it could help them if UConn is not as battle tested in OOC games as in previous years heading into the NCAA tourney. Hopefully UConn will overcome the weaker schedule.

Conference realignment. It’s mainly about $$$. Football is by far the biggest consideration. Would expansion get a conference into an additional lucrative market is the main draw. So football is king while mbb is a very small factor and the other sports matter not at all. UConn did fill the Rent with Randy Edsall in the Big East conf.

Also, UConn beat NC (not NCST) in the bowl game last year and the move to the AAC was absolutely football driven. Basketball was not a consideration.

How many national championships does the SEC have? 12

• Details here.
• TN (8), South Carolina (3), LSU (1)

How many national championships does the UConn have? 12

• All in the Big East and AAC

There are advantages to having a “weak conference schedule” prior to the NCAAT.

• There are disadvantages to having a “strong conference schedule” prior to the NCAAT.
• Details here and here. And this thread.

These advantages/ disadvantages probably disappear or reverse at the extremes ((almost) all “weak”/ “strong” regular season games).

But the addition of two conference games? In a backdrop of a revised NCAAT selection criteria that makes it potentially harder for UConn to get a #1 seed with early season losses (which happened last year but did not hurt as Geno and CD’s farm system curriculum has always been to be best prepared team, seedings falling where it does).

40 inimitable years of coaching excellence by Geno and CD is not nothing.

 

[oldude]

How many national championships does the SEC have? 12

• Details here.
• TN (8), South Carolina (3), LSU (1)

How many national championships does the UConn have? 12

• All in the Big East and AAC

There are advantages to having a “weak conference schedule” prior to the NCAAT.

• There are disadvantages to having a “strong conference schedule” prior to the NCAAT.
• Details here and here. And this thread.

These advantages/ disadvantages probably disappear or reverse at the extremes ((almost) all “weak”/ “strong” regular season games).

But the addition of two conference games? In a backdrop of a revised NCAAT selection criteria that makes it potentially harder for UConn to get a #1 seed with early season losses (which happened last year but did not hurt as Geno and CD’s farm system curriculum has always been to be best prepared team, seedings falling where it does).

40 inimitable years of coaching excellence by Geno and CD is not nothing.

While your argument is interesting. There is one factor that overrides the conference argument, and that is the HC. Pat had 8, Kim has 4 (Baylor & LSU), Dawn has 3 and the G.O.A.T. has 12.

 

[NycUcWbbFan]

While your argument is interesting. There is one factor that overrides the conference argument, and that is the HC. Pat had 8, Kim has 4 (Baylor & LSU), Dawn has 3 and the G.O.A.T. has 12.

It is always about the program, the coaches and the sustainable ecosystem (recruits, farm system development, culture, standards of excellence, etc.).

The unexamined assumption that some people have is that UConn would be more successful than it already is if it were in a stronger conference.

• None of the SEC’s best teams have achieved what UConn has.
• Thought experiments — and that’s all we can do because “it is what it is” and we cannot do a “what if” — suggests moving to a stronger conference is not a better magic pill than some people think it is.

 

[oldude]

It is always about the program, the coaches and the sustainable ecosystem (recruits, farm system development, culture, standards of excellence, etc.).

The unexamined assumption that some people have is that UConn would be more successful than it already is if it were in a stronger conference.

• None of the SEC’s best teams have achieved what UConn has.
• Thought experiments — and that’s all we can do because “it is what it is” and we cannot do a “what if” — suggests moving to a stronger conference is not a better magic pill than some people think it is.

The complaints about UConn’s weak schedule would be better directed at various teams from the P4 conferences who have all the financial resources in the world, great schools to recruit to and tough competition in conference (reminiscent of the OBE). Hence, the real question should be, “What’s wrong with TX, UCLA, ND, TN, USC etc. that don’t appear capable of winning another championship despite all of their inherent advantages?

 

[HuskyNan]

Side note - what about the strong mid-majors? Usually they want to play anyone any time - but P4 teams tend to avoid them. Green Bay, Gonzaga, South Dakota, South Dakota State, Columbia, Princeton, Harvard, Fairfield, Ball State, James Madison, etc. Would love to see a couple of those on the schedule.

Who would you replace on the schedule?

#21 Louisville
FSU
#25 Ohio State
#14 Michigan (Edited to correct typo)
Utah
South Florida
#10 USC
#23 Iowa
#17 Notre Dame
#12 Tennessee

All but Loyola are P4 teams and if UConn wants to get into a conference, playing nice with the P4 is a good idea

 

[ucmiami2]

Schedules are not created during the summer - they are created over a few years - 2 year home and home agreements, and a few that are longer than 2 year. With the transfer portal, team strength of scheduled opponents can change during a small window at the end of the previous season, so what looked like a strong team can become weak, and what looked weak might become strong. And of course freshmen can shine immediately or take a year or more to thrive. And actual play strength of any team can change drastically from 'preseason' and early season 'polls.' Add in injuries to key personnel and surprises happen.

And really, does it matter if your team is a 1 or 2 seed come the NCAAs - you need to win 6 games, 3 of which are going to be extremely competitive, and a 4th that might be tougher than expected.

If Uconn doesn't go undefeated in their OOC then they may well not be a #1 seed in the NCAA, and probably don't deserve a #1 seed - that will depend on the results other teams achieve. Undefeated seasons are rare in WCBB and undefeated seasons heading into the NCAA tournament are also very rare. Our coaches are better at achieving them than all the other coaches combined in Div 1 WCBB history.

I'm not going stressed about strength of schedule. I will get stressed once the tournament begins.

 

[Gael]

The unexamined assumption that some people have is that UConn would be more successful than it already is if it were in a stronger conference.

I can't read peoples' minds, so I don't necessarily know what assumptions they have—examined or unexamined.

But to speculate: The concerns of some fans may not necessarily be about whether UConn in a stronger conference and with a stronger OOC schedule "would be more successful than it already is"—which is looking at past results and the short term present.

Rather, their concerns may be ones that look toward the not-so-distant future when Geno retires. If, when Geno and company retire in a few years, UConn remains in a weak Big East and for some reason cannot conterbalance that with a strong OOC schedule, some fans may be concerned that that situation will make it difficult to recruit not only top players but also an elite replacement coach.

How many NCs have been won this century by non-P5 teams, other than UConn, or by non-elite coaches?

 

[Stagnant]

I just want to say. Pointing out that the schedule is weak is different than hating on it or criticizing it. A reasonable person understands that we are handcuffed to some extent because of our conference affiliation.

 

[NycUcWbbFan]

I can't read peoples' minds, so I don't necessarily know what assumptions they have—examined or unexamined.

But to speculate: The concerns of some fans may not necessarily be about whether UConn in a stronger conference and with a stronger OOC schedule "would be more successful than it already is"—which is looking at past results and the short term present.

Rather, their concerns may be ones that look toward the not-so-distant future when Geno retires. If, when Geno and company retire in a few years, UConn remains in a weak Big East and for some reason cannot conterbalance that with a strong OOC schedule, some fans may be concerned that that situation will make it difficult to recruit not only top players but also an elite replacement coach.

How many NCs have been won this century by non-P5 teams, other than UConn, or by non-elite coaches?

I joined the Board last year but I’ve been a lurker forever and have been reading about complaints about the “Big Least” and the AAC for years.

It got most shrill during the long championship drought, and like the proverbial moon, it was something that some people obsessed about as the big culprit. Same as not being able to recruit post players, athletic players, missing out on the last minute on prized recruits, etc.

There are perfectly deducible reasons (biblical injury plague, fatigue due to biblical injury plague, Achilles heels, prior paradigm obstacles to recruiting most-desired bigs, better opposing coach strategy from weaknesses in the roster, some uncharacteristic poor game) and fans have been spoiled by Geno and CD’s repeat successes. UConn has more repeat records than any other program — in fact, repeat records (eg undefeated seasons, repeat championships, etc.) are rare in other programs — a testament to how much of a unicorn Geno and CD are.

So, I don’t necessarily see that people’s angst about Geno’s retirement is the proximate cause for the complaints about the Big East and AAC as it has been going on ad nauseam for a long time.

 

[The CDR-Ret]

The answer: join the ACC.
Come on UConn football.
Would Danny be ok with that switch? BE mens can be really really good.

I would enjoy it, as it would allow a possible matchup every year (and some twice in the ACC tourney) against uNd, Louisville, Stanford, UNC, NC State, Duke, and many who used to be in the OLD Big East.

Then the Out Of Conference games would not be as necessary for strength of schedule.

Go Huskies!!!