UK vs IU

[champs99and04]

I actually think Calipari is a good coach. Not a great coach, but a very good one. He gets a lot of talent, but so does Rick Barnes. More often than not with Calipari his players will play to their potential. People like to say he rolls the ball out and lets them play, but it's not nearly that easy.

When is the last time a Kentucky player has just been a flat out bust?

 

[Walker11]

Verdell Jones III did keep UK in the game but more of the blame must be laid on Crean. As little as I like Dickie V, he was spot-on about Zeller needing to get touches. He literally did not touch the ball for the first 4-5 minutes of game time after Davis re-entered with 4 fouls.

Calipari does get a ton out of his players, hate him or not. His teams are excellent defensively every year and you do not excel on defense without maximum effort. Calipari may not be getting the most out of Jones but this is the anomaly. Brandon Knight improved exponentially last year. That is why he went from a projected lottery pick pre-season, to a late first rounder after his shaky start to a lottery pick in the end.

I'm surprised that a few of you have gotten banned at Rupp Rafters so easily. I have trolled Rupp Rafters a couple of times after a late night of drinking and have basically begged to be banned (calling the fan base imbred hillbillies) but am always allowed back on.

 

[superjohn]

I'm so sick of hearing about what a great coach Calipari is, he gets by far the most talent every year and hasn't won crap. They aren't winning it this year either, he's a crap in game coach.

 

[champs99and04]

I'm so sick of hearing about what a great coach Calipari is, he gets by far the most talent every year and hasn't won crap. They aren't winning it this year either, he's a crap in game coach.

By far the most talent every year? That is arguable. The one year he certainly had the most talent was in 2009-2010, and that roster was made up mostly of freshman. UNC and UConn have just as much talent this year, IMO. Last season UK wasn't even that talented. OSU and UNC both had more talent but UK was able to pull out victories.

In 07-08 Memphis and Kansas were basically equal talent wise and the game came down to the last possesion as expected.

As I said, you could do a lot worse than Calipari. You could have a guy like Rick Barnes.

 

[upstater]

By far the most talent every year? That is arguable. The one year he certainly had the most talent was in 2009-2010, and that roster was made up mostly of freshman. UNC and UConn have just as much talent this year, IMO. Last season UK wasn't even that talented. OSU and UNC both had more talent but UK was able to pull out victories.

In 07-08 Memphis and Kansas were basically equal talent wise and the game came down to the last possesion as expected.

As I said, you could do a lot worse than Calipari. You could have a guy like Rick Barnes.

How is this even an argument? Guy gets more talent than anyone.

 

[Walker11]

I am not going to stick my neck out and say that Cal is a great coach but anyone who watches UK play and can't clearly see that this club gets after it on D needs a check-up.

 

[Brochacho]

Figures that UK lost, they dunked the ball way too many times over the course of the game.

 

[champs99and04]

How is this even an argument? Guy gets more talent than anyone.

On a yearly basis he does, but guys just don't stick around for long, meaning he has to start fresh every year. How many times has Roy Williams gotten star upper classmen to stick around for another run?

If UK doesn't at least make the final four this year I can see how you would be critical, but I think they will.

 

[caw]

In my mind there are 4 parts to being a great coach in college:
1) Recruiting
2) Teaching
3) Pre-game planning/style of coaching
4) In game

Recruiting: Cal may be the best in the game (and yes I know many say he has help from WWW or whoever), he gets away with it though. He has had the last 3, #1 recruiting classes, that is unreal (and likely why most believe he is cheating).

Teaching: Cal is a pretty good teacher of the game. Hate him or not, he does a decent job of building players and allowing them to play to their strength. Heck he got Harrellson drafted. It does help that he has the best athletes money can buy almost every year. His big flaw here is that he doesn't seem to care or know how to teach free-throw shooting.

Pre-game planning/style of coaching: I think Cal's DDO is actually pretty good for the players he has (why not let the kids just out athlete the other team) and usually he gets his guys to play hard on defense.

In game: This is a major area where Cal is pretty weak. He isn't great with TO's, fouls, or rotations. When up against another top coach with equal talent he doesn't know what to do. In this aspect he plays checkers when everyone else is playing chess.

There are a bevy of coaches worse than Cal though, like the ones that can't coach and don't recruit as well as him (Pastner, Barnes, etc.)

If you were making a top ten of current coaches, Cal is probably in it.
Calhoun, Izzo, K, Roy, Jimmy B, Donovan, Pitino and Self would all probably be ahead of him, then you have I would have to think Cal or Matta comes next and those are your top 10 coaches in college bball.

 

[61cygni]

50% of Div. 1 college coaches could coach this year's UK team into a Final Four.

Higher or lower?

 

[Huskymaniac]

I don't have the same hatred of Calipari from his UMass days because I didn't follow the whole Camby thing.

I don't dislike him for being slime. I dislike him because he's a lousy coach and faker.

You had to be there in the dark days to understand the UConn-UMass rivalry. Calipari is a punk who basically made his mark by antagonizing Calhoun. He was like a village idiot poking a bee's nest with a stick. Predictably, Calhoun fought back. The umass dopes thought Calhoun was attacking umass but it was all about the squid. Now the umess fans are like the rednecks down south who are still fighting the civil war. They are still fighting the war against Calhoun and UConn. That's why we have b!tches like Dan Wetzel sniffing the crotches of our recruits to dig up dirt on the program. And ALL OF THIS was caused by the squid. He has always been a decent coach and a major . Without his miraculous success on the recruiting trails he wouldn't win nearly as many games as he does. His teams would still be solid but the reality is that the only reason he knocks on the door of the final four is because he has been able to get championship talent before he every became a champion.

 

[Gurleyman]

I still don't get this obsession with using a foul to give. Calipari wanted his team to give one, and Treague took himself totally out of the play going for a foul 70 feet from the basket which would have accomplished nothing. Now once IU got over midcourt, Darius Miller should have given one since the team is playing 5-on-4 with Teague jogging back for some reason. But if you play straight up D, there is no reason whatsoever to give a foul on purpose, stop the clock, and allow the other team to advance the ball with a pass without time running off the clock. And if Miller had fouled, IU would have had the chance to run a sidelines out of bounds play, which people work on in practice all the time (although with Teague jogging back, that would have been a preferable choice)..

 

[champs99and04]

50% of Div. 1 college coaches could coach this year's UK team into a Final Four.

Higher or lower?

That's a good question. I would say the same thing for UNC. Jones, Davis, Miller, Lamb, and MKG are all studs. Teague is pretty damn talented in his own right.

 

[61cygni]

I think fouling in that situation is fine. If I remember correctly, I think they didn't guard the inbounder? Gotta put someone on him, especially with the length UK has. They probably make a short pass, take a second to get near the timeline and you foul shaving a bit of time off. Force them to have a big guy inbound the ball, or if they use a guard to inbound, slap Davis on him. Guys practice inbounds plays, but they also practice defending them. I want the pressure on the other team to get the ball in before they can even think of finding a decent shot.

 

[superjohn]

I said Calipari gets the best talent every year, how can you dispute this statement? He had had the #1 recruiting class for at least 3 years in a row and he always gets the #1 point guard recruit.

 

[Walker11]

Cal > Ole Roy

 

[superjohn]

Ole Roy is the most overrated coach in the game. I might get flamed for this but I've always considered Dean Smith highly overrated as well, only winning 2 titles with the amount of talent he had is underachieving.

 

[caw]

That's a good question. I would say the same thing for UNC. Jones, Davis, Miller, Lamb, and MKG are all studs. Teague is pretty damn talented in his own right.

How many could get that team to come to their school?

 

[61cygni]

Agree, considering the amount of , not a lot of NCs to show for it. Tarheels seem to think he's the #1 or #2 coach of all-time.

 

[Gurleyman]

I know others disagree, but I just think if you foul in the backcourt, you give the other team the chance to advance the ball 40-50 feet on the inbounds pass without the clock moving. Or if you foul in the frontcourt - you give the inbounds passer five seconds to stand still and weigh his passing options without the clock moving. These are advantages that you do not have going end to end with the clock moving. There are times it makes sense (if you feel like you're beaten off the dribble, or if the other team has a Tyus Edney type with a head of steam going crossing midcourt, or as free reign to gamble on going for a steal or a held ball). It's just become a rote thing - people just think it's standard strategy that you're supposed to give one if you have one, but many times there's nothing strategically gained from it. I just think coaches now do it because everyone else does, and they don't want to be second-guessed. The foul Teague tried to commit maybe was worth it, since Indiana had just taken a timeout to design something and diidnt have any more to design something else, but in hindsight if he had simply guarded his man, there wouldn't have been a guy open, since Miller had to leave his guy to help.

 

[61cygni]

Maybe I misunderstood your first post. Isn't conventional wisdom fouling in this situation after they cross halfcourt, not before? There shouldn't be an issue of advancing the ball to the other-side. I believe the play is to make the inbound tough, try to get a steal if possible, then foul once they cross the timeline before they can get into a shooting motion.

There is probably some truth behind coaches doing it because it's the norm, similar to how few football coaches used to go for it on fourth and short.

 

[mauconnfan]

LOL, critcize his in-game coaching if you want, but Calipari does a terrific job getting the most out of his players.

I know he's considered to be worse than the devil around here, but all things considered the guy is a pretty good basketball coach.

He is a pretty good basketball coach but he was a very good basketball coach prior to Kentucky and Memphis..............his UMass days with Kellogg, Padilla, Travieso and those guys his teams played their butts off. Defensively they were rats and drove teams crazy. But his marriage to WWW and the dark side of the world brings in kids who already know what they want out of life and he's just a bed and breakfast on their way and he accepts that. With most of these kis comes an uncoachable attitude and it's been obvious to many from Memphis to Wall to now. Although they seem to be buying into defense a little more with this years team (and the refs have bought in to it also as they swallowed the whistle at the end for poor IU.......awful display of reffing) there is still that star attitude of the one and dones which is glaring. As I said with many other players of his recent past, these guys could go to UHart and still be the same player in the draft next year. Makes me laugh to hear a kid say "look what he did with John Wall and Derrick Rose.........." - they actually believe he made them better.....shows who kids are listening to. If kids were smart it would be "...look what he did with Jeremy Lamb and Shabazz Napier I never even played an AAU game against him and never heard of him............."

It's Coach Cal, sleeze will never leave him (Don't think he's friendly with JC or Louie Carnesseca) and losing will only make most of us very happy!!

 

[UconnDon]

But the good guys do eventually win with or without referees and the Ky fans. Hmmnn, interesting that the abbreviation of that state is KY. I wonder???

 

[Scot-e]

Great game. Very happy for the IU fans- they always are good people to interact with when we have had the chance.

 

[mauconnfan]

Great game. Very happy for the IU fans- they always are good people to interact with when we have had the chance.

Agree I was very happy for the team and their fans as well as Crean. They have come a long way from the forgotten program after what Sampson did. Good for them!