UConn-Villanova thread re: Fouls

[boontonbomber]

The game is getting harder and harder to call, much quicker and certainly more physical. Complain all you want about UConn always getting the short end if it makes you feel better.

 

[ABCDFE]

My issue is that posters think Villanova, or any opponent, gets the benefit of ALL uncalled fouls. How many times was Maddy held or knocked down without a foul? A lot, but the people complaining don’t mention that. The refs were horrendous, no doubt about it. Inconsistent and incompetent for long stretches. ‘Nova wasn’t the sole beneficiary of the bad calls, though, but fans here are totally ignoring that to play the victim card.

Physical games are the way the sport is evolving. A lot of people here don’t read Twitter but if they did, they’d see the bruises on Cameron Brink, Aliyah Boston, Caitlin Clark, and other star players. If people don’t like that style of play, they should check out D2 or another sport because it’s here to stay.

Knowing that, just the thought that there will be complaints about Our Girls and the mean opponents that beat them up for the years to come is depressing.

Your point is well taken. However, when watching the games that our girls play, it is evident that the refs are not calling even the egregious fouls and in some instances lack of awareness and knowledge of the game like in the out of bounds play in the SC game. That is unacceptable and as we've seen can cause injuries to players. If this is also happening with other teams than I would advocate that the officiating stinks for those teams as well. As for a Uconn fan watching Uconn games, I feel there is a clear tactic the other teams are using on the defensive side of the ball. Just like the 2001 patriots who held and pass interfered on almost every pass play in the superbowl, Patriots knew they wouldn't get call for everything and that was the only way to win. We as a team have to fight through this, but it doesn't make it right. In all sports, we just want things to be called the right way as often as possible.

The fans I think have a right to call out the officiating here.

 

[housekeys]

My issue is that posters think Villanova, or any opponent, gets the benefit of ALL uncalled fouls.

The team that benefits most from uncalled fouls is likely the more physical team, keeping in mind that both teams are likely physical. In general, physicality is the talent equalizer. UConn is arguably more talented than most teams they play against. It is not surprising that teams must be physical against UConn. It is not surprising UConn fans will complain. UConn will also be the more physical team when it goes up against a more talented team (on a any given day - UConn may not be the most talented).

Knowing you are a moderator, I can understand your consternation, however.

 

[LwrcasefaN]

All I ask for is consistency at least in the same game. That seems to be a challenge across the league. If you're calling the touch fouls, then just call it both ways. If you're allowing slight hand-checking on the perimeter, then so be it. Look, there's incidental contact in basketball so I'm not a fan of blowing the whistle because someone falls down, screams 'and 1' or jerks their head back. Number one on my wish list is resolving the 'plane of verticality'. Why can the offensive player break that plane (jumping into the defense), but it's a foul on the defense?

 

[HuskyNan]

Your point is well taken. However, when watching the games that our girls play, it is evident that the refs are not calling even the egregious fouls and in some instances lack of awareness and knowledge of the game like in the out of bounds play in the SC game. That is unacceptable and as we've seen can cause injuries to players. If this is also happening with other teams than I would advocate that the officiating stinks for those teams as well.

I wholeheartedly agree that the refs were awful. The women’s game is getting more physical and it seems the refs don’t know how to handle it. The game is evolving; the rules/refs, not so much

As for a Uconn fan watching Uconn games, I feel there is a clear tactic the other teams are using on the defensive side of the ball. Just like the 2001 patriots who held and pass interfered on almost every pass play in the superbowl, Patriots knew they wouldn't get call for everything and that was the only way to win. We as a team have to fight through this, but it doesn't make it right. In all sports, we just want things to be called the right way as often as possible.

The fans I think have a right to call out the officiating here.

UConn fans are ignoring how physical the Huskies are with opponents. It’s unbelievable to me that fans still think UConn plays a finesse game.

I agree the refs are bad. What I hate is that fans make it sound like opponents are deliberately trying to hurt or rough up the Huskies and the refs are looking the other way. Every game the board goes on and on about it. That’s what’s driving me crazy

 

[Bills Fan]

UConn was called for 16 fouls, Villanova was called for 23. UConn had 23 free throw attempts, Villanova had 12.

Is there any chance people could stop complaining about foul calls?

View attachment 84226

Why would they when the game was so poorly reffed ??

 

[RedStickHusky]

FWIW, it's not possible to hold a basketball over your head with two hands and turn your body without moving your elbows. A defender should not be allowed to fish for a flagrant by sticking her face in that cylinder. Beyond that, physical play and bad officiating are environmental factors you have to live with. If we had the 40 point margins we all take for granted, or the bodies to better absorb it all, we'd be doing a lot less complaining.

 

[Husky pride]

UConn was called for 16 fouls, Villanova was called for 23. UConn had 23 free throw attempts, Villanova had 12.

Is there any chance people could stop complaining about foul calls?

View attachment 84226

Not when the complaints are legitimate and the flagrant fouls could cause injury to an already depleted lineup.

 

[baggerbob]

This is what Lou has to deal with every game with no calls going her way.

There were at least 2 fouls that should have been called in that sequence.

 

[HuskyNan]

Not when the complaints are legitimate and the flagrant fouls could cause injury to an already depleted lineup.

So, what will endless threads on the Boneyard accomplish to stop the behavior?

 

[boontonbomber]

So, what will endless threads on the Boneyard accomplish to stop the behavior?

Never has accomplished anything, never willl, but maybe good therapy for some people.

 

[Ct Dog]

It’s a message board that’s what’s suppose to happen

 

[AgStatesman]

Playing physical against UConn is just pragmatic. 99.9% of teams over the years haven't been able to match up talent wise to the Husky's. If you are a competitive team that knows UConn is better, but you still want to find a way to win the game, turn it into a slugfest. Katie Abrahamson-Henderson's teams at UCF did that for years as did Maryland. It's amusing to me. Physicality is one area where the women's game is way behind the men's. The women's game is allowed to be much more physical at this point. What to do about it? Be mentally tough enough to take it, which the Husky's seem to be.

 

[Husky pride]

So, what will endless threads on the Boneyard accomplish to stop the behavior?

In all do respect, many threads can fall into the category of not positively stopping a given behavior… but, nonetheless, warrant being said.

 

[CTrefugee]

Similar to the NFL. In the last 2 minutes of a game, coaches could request the review of a call.
If they are wrong, they lose a timeout (which are usually valuable near the end). There were a number of bad call both ways in the Villanova game ( and all the other games).

In the last two minutes (crunch time) there were two terrible calls that hurt UCONN.
At about 1:47 Nika was pushed into Maddie by another Villanova player and called for a foul.
At about 0:48 A held ball was called when it was just a foul by Villanova. Villanova was never close to a joint possesion.

This rule would also benefit the refs who would no longer be "blamed" for crucial late game errors.

 

[SVCBeercats]

 

[Pharos]

UConn was called for 16 fouls, Villanova was called for 23. UConn had 23 free throw attempts, Villanova had 12.

Is there any chance people could stop complaining about foul calls?

View attachment 84226

We need a new stat: "Bodies Unable to Manage Passing Safely" or "B.U.M.P.S." This will be more than "Fouls Called." It won't even be every collision between two (or more?) players. It'll just be the number of times that collision produces player pain of some kind. The trick will be to keep the "diving" under control, you know the James Harden head snap sort of thing. Comparing BUMPS to actual fouls called will give some basis for assessing ref reliability.

 

[Rowdy831]

Agree about turnovers, but really now, there aren’t many better teams that UConn hasn’t played.

Speaking of competing for the NC, not necessarily their conference teams.

 

[Kat]

It’s a message board that’s what’s suppose to happen

Exactly. It’s very easy to ignore comments that you don’t approve of and it’s not necessary to lecture people about it, either.

 

[Zinethar]

UConn used to be a finesse team. Teams with good coaching can alter tactics when it is called for. Now, from my observation, UConn has become a very aggressive and physical team very much like most of the other good teams they have played. There is likely a foul on almost every possession for both teams. What needs to happen is the Officials need to also adjust (and likely the rules also). Dangerous contact needs to be always called. Body bumps that do not affect a shot should not be called. An arm getting hit while making a shot should always be called as it affects the game. Sensible calls that are consistent throughout the game. UConn did adjust in that game in that they had early fouls that they learned from and didn't do them later. Nika was called for a foul at one point that was questionable and shortly after got hit with another which was EARNED. The opponent did not bother her like that again.

There are rules that need revision to clarify them or eliminate some things. The block/charge call unless in the arc is vague and no one knows what is the right call.Verticality would seem to be good but is still called when a player jumps into a defender. I'm just glad that I'm only a swimming and track official. A basketball official has all eyes on them at all times and is mostly an impossible job as the rules are now written. Before the end of the first quarter is all fouls as written were called it would be a 4 on 4 game. (For football fans think ruffing the passer!)

 

[CONN78SEJ]

UConn was called for 16 fouls, Villanova was called for 23. UConn had 23 free throw attempts, Villanova had 12.

Is there any chance people could stop complaining about foul calls?

View attachment 84226

Come on Nan, when the game was on and still to be decided early 2nd half. UConn got the shaft on almost every call or no call. A lot of those 23 Villanova fouls came in the last two minutes, trying to stop the clock. I seem to recall UConn’s best shooter getting two quick fouls to start the game.

 

[psconn]

UConn was called for 16 fouls, Villanova was called for 23. UConn had 23 free throw attempts, Villanova had 12.

Is there any chance people could stop complaining about foul calls?

View attachment 84226

Not here to complain about the refs, potential bias, or their effect on the outcome. That's been thoroughly covered.

Just want to point out the logical fallacy in equating box score foul totals with the "fairness" of the reffing... Team A could get whistled for 15 fouls, but but a careful review shows only 10 were legit... Team B got whistled for 15 fouls also but a careful review shows that they actually committed 20. The box score shows that the reffing was fair and equal but was it?.

Therein lies the subjective element that keeps team forums and sports talk radio humming....

 

[CB360]

Gee..I don't know. How about Nika gettting a solid elbow to the eye and no foul called and AE getting a hand jab under the chin, but thats not a foul and a whack on the face of Caroline..Nope no foul there, but a villanova player pile drives Nika and it knocks siegrist down and of course that was a foul on Nika. I have been pretty fair to the refs, but this was a blatant missmatch in fouls. No two ways about it.

I truly believe the officiating in the Big East is not very good this year! Not just against UConn but every team is dealing with it. When some of these calls are made, like Nika being plowed over into MS and it's obvious what happened, it hurts the game

 

[Littlemin]

Similar to the NFL. In the last 2 minutes of a game, coaches could request the review of a call.
If they are wrong, they lose a timeout (which are usually valuable near the end). There were a number of bad call both ways in the Villanova game ( and all the other games).

In the last two minutes (crunch time) there were two terrible calls that hurt UCONN.
At about 1:47 Nika was pushed into Maddie by another Villanova player and called for a foul.
At about 0:48 A held ball was called when it was just a foul by Villanova. Villanova was never close to a joint possesion.

This rule would also benefit the refs who would no longer be "blamed" for crucial late game errors.

Yeah, let’s slow the end of the game down even more; taking 10 minutes to decide who a ball was off of or how much time should be on the clock isn’t enough?
If you can’t tell, I HATE the incorporation of replay into sports, it serves absolutely no purpose other than to break the rhythm of games because it hasn’t even begun to take bad calls out of sports.

 

[delawarehusky]

I was at the game and was surprised to see that Maggie S. is one of the best floppers I've seen; whenever she went up for a shot and was closely guarded she flopped and got the call where w/o the flop it was a probate no call.

 

[Nolefan]

I was at the game and was surprised to see that Maggie S. is one of the best floppers I've seen; whenever she went up for a shot and was closely guarded she flopped and got the call where w/o the flop it was a probate no call.

That flop she did when NM was pushed into her deserved an academy award .. and both Villanova players were laughing about it afterwards

 

[hoopsnloops32]

Let’s not forget this terrible call where Lou was called for an offensive foul because two Nova players ran into each other.

 

[maple]

That flop she did when NM was pushed into her deserved an academy award .. and both Villanova players were laughing about it afterwards

That call had me seriously fuming. Even if she didn't flop, how you can possibly call a foul when someone is pushed into another player?? Should have at least been a "play on, no whistle" situation.

 

[stamfordhusky]

Would it be appropriate for UConn women’s video department to put a collection of these physical assaults together to share with the Big East officials’ overseers? Is there any reason they wouldn’t do that?

I’m sure they have. And many of their opponents have probably put together videos of UConn fouls.

 

[npignatjr]

Playing physical against UConn is just pragmatic. 99.9% of teams over the years haven't been able to match up talent wise to the Husky's. If you are a competitive team that knows UConn is better, but you still want to find a way to win the game, turn it into a slugfest. Katie Abrahamson-Henderson's teams at UCF did that for years as did Maryland. It's amusing to me. Physicality is one area where the women's game is way behind the men's. The women's game is allowed to be much more physical at this point. What to do about it? Be mentally tough enough to take it, which the Husky's seem to be.

That tactic goes way back, UCF had nothing over OBE teams, Rutgers, Syracuse, Georgetown for example. DT was beat up for her whole UCONN career, got hit so hard in the back, I think against Rutgers, while working to get open she was hurt, Geno made a post game statement about that then 20 years ago.