UConn @ BC -- 9/10/16?
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Dooley
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Just a slight difference - during that same timeframe, BC has played a P5 schedule and has qualified for a bowl game in the past 2 seasons. Yet, BC still has failed to sell out its stadium against the likes of USC (despite a strong showing from USC fans), FSU, and Clemson. In fact, the only games to have been or will be sold out in the past few years were the Pinstripe Bowl (where 85% of the crowd was PSU blue/white) and the upcoming game at Fenway against Notre Dame (80% ND fans where you guys are the road team in your own city!).
If you want to start comparing attendance, the only logical comparison would be the last time we played against a BCS/"Power" schedule with a winning record: the 2010 season. 3 sellouts - Vanderbilt, WVU and Cincinnati. Give UConn fans a P5 schedule and a winning record, there is absolutely no doubt that the Rent will sell out more often than Alumni.
The reason why this whole debate keeps resurfacing is because of lethargic ticket sales at your stadium despite being in a P5 and winning. Despite the arguments to the contrary, a game between the two biggest football programs in New England would excite a good number of people in the region. UConn fans would definitely make the trip up to Boston for this game and likely give you guys your first sellout in years that you will have more than 15-20% of the crowd percentage.
Dooley
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In a winning season with good crowd support from USC too! You put USC on UConn's schedule, in a winning season, and scalpers are making an annual salary's worth of money outside the stadium. We could probably sell our season ticket seat for that one game and pay for the next 4-5 years worth of season tickets. You put USC on UConn's schedule in a losing season (like the year Michigan came here), and we still sell out the Rent.
Hey, I get it. There is limited support for BC in Boston and they will always struggle to sell tickets, regardless of record or opponent. There are a ton of colleges in the city and there is a good contingency of alumni who live away from Boston. Boston is also a pro town where 99 out of 100 fans care more about the Patriots or Red Sox than BC. Much like Wake Forrest, they need help to sell their products even though their athletic programs are, for the most part, lightyears ahead of Wake. I guess that's part of the problem with small private schools playing by P5 rules and why BC voted against some of the measures that will increase their cost to compete.
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We're having issues with attendance. The most widely held theory:
- Lost a lot of season ticket holders with the Spaz disaster for the four years between '09 and '12. The combination of terrible football, increased season ticket prices, increased Donor Based Seating charges for premier seats, increased tailgating costs, increased BCPD presence at tailgates, and even further restrictive tailgating hours. I swear, it was as though DeFilipo and Spaz wrote a script on the best way to destroy a program and then got away with it for 4 years before someone caught on and put a stop to it.
- Some say the decline started earlier with the move out of the Big East. Wake, NCST, Duke, UVa, etc. just weren't attractive to a Northeastern fan base. Even though the move in '05 preceded the attendance dropoff that started in '09, that's skewed by the the fact that almost all ACC teams brought in about an extra 5K tickets to their first games in Boston and the team actually being nationally ranked between '06 and '08. Starting in '09, when we were no longer ranked (good) and the novelty of Boston was no longer a draw for ACC visiting fans, that's when the numbers started showing. This theory holds that BC needs to focus the OOC on traditional northeastern foes to generate interest. This theory would be the one that motivates Bates to sign this series.
- Then some also just point out that '06 was the year that BC started reporting actual bodies through the turnstiles as opposed to tickets sold. This theory suggests that the attendance dropoff isn't as stark as the numbers suggest and if BC can just start winning the numbers will pick up. Adherents to this theory would say that games like USC might've come very close to selling out at the box office, but that only 42K made it into the stadium out of a capacity of 44.5K. Again, tickets sold numbers aren't reported, so we can't be sure on this one. But I'm skeptical.
- Starting in '08 BC's students started skewing away from Northeastern states to a more national student body. Fewer recent alumni staying in Boston.
It's probably a combination of the 4.
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Hard to say that we didn't sell out USC in "a winning season." That game was week three of 2014. In 2013 we went 7-6 just barely, were only a year removed from 2-10 and the media was predicting a step back to 4 or 5 wins. Also, the week before BC got crushed at home by Pitt. So yeah, not exactly fair to say BC was a winning team going into the USC game.
With that said, after winning 7 the last two years and the excitement of the fanbase going into this year, not selling out this year's game against a #9 FSU on a Friday night primetime game was considered by BC fans a more surprising lack of attendance.
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Dooley
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Fair enough. To be fair, the USC game was the springboard for BC that year. I think I was more surprised at USC's contigency for that game that anything else. West coast represented pretty well. They also repped well at MetLife against Syracuse a few years ago so I don't know why I was so surprised.
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To that point UConn sold out Michigan in week 3 coming off of a 5-7 campaign. So...
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ya but in case you haven't heard, it was 16,000 Michigan fans and only 24,000 UConn fans.
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Incredible they can pull the numbers on that. Also, must have been a shortage of Maize and Blue because I don't remember the breakdown at Rentschler looking like that.
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BC has been enormously short-sited. UCONN was a partial solution to making college football a bigger draw in New England and the Northeast in general. So instead of embracing that, the administration viewed it completely as a threat, and did everything in its power to get away from competing with UCONN on a level playing field and, in fact, hoping to diminish UCONN's presence in major college athletics. It is classic a myopic and insular mentality. There is no doubt in my mind that were UCONN in the ACC, BC would be in a much better place with attendance across all sports.
That this was largely overseen by someone as limited as GDF is just further proof of how weak the leadership at BC has been on this issue.
That this was largely overseen by someone as limited as GDF is just further proof of how weak the leadership at BC has been on this issue.
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me either, but that's what BC fans say, so it must be true.
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I agree that its likely a lot of things and the fact that BC's demographics may not be helping either - national, affluent, highly mobile, etc. Just two points. UConn fans can relate to #1. At the worst moment possible we had an AD who had no interest in taking any action with respect to enhancing UConn's profile at the worst possible time in Hathaway. He, in turn, made things worse by hiring a football coach based on the input of a bunch of supposedly influence football coaches from the CT High School scene and that football coach appeared to be more interested in padding his pension than coaching. And this happened right in the middle of the last round of conference realignment. It may not have made a difference in the end due to ACC politics; but, it sure as heck did not help. As for #4, 2008/9 was also right when the economy tanked and lot of jobs in Boston were lost, including mine. While I am not a BC alumni nor fan, I am sure many local BC alumni and fans were in the same boat as me and ended-up moving out of he the area in search of jobs. Then, when the economy recovered, Boston's real estate prices skyrocketed, which kept a lot of new college grads out of the city.
Waquoit
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That's exactly right, because there weren't anywhere near 16K Michigan fans. Also, there were much more than 24K UConn fans, we added seats. Just BCU math.
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Why shouldn't UConn football, have larger home football attendance than BC football does is the question ( BC has had larger football home attendance the last 2 seasons ). UConn is a much bigger school enrollment wise... has far more UConn alums that live near the home stadium of Uconn than the number of BC alums that live near BC's stadium. Unlike BC, UConn has no nearby sports team competition. No Patriots, No Celtics, no Red Sox, no Bruins. In the state of Connecticut, UConn football is much the only game in town in the fall, with little competition for the sports enthusiast dollar Yet it still can't outsell BC at its home football games. Why do UConn Alums.... and there are tens of thousands of them that live in Connecticut still after graduation.... not support UConn football the way it should ? Neither BC nor UConn need not be pointing fingers at one another regarding football attendance (or Bowl Game attendance ) when NEITHER school has football attendance it can brag about, if we are honest with ourselves here.
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Really? A school located in Boston has more alums in Boston than a school not located in Boston?
Also, totally didn't know BU doesn't have a football team. Wondered why we hadn't scheduled them as an FCS game in a while.
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There were not 42,000 butts in seats at the USC game.
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UConn has far, FAR more alums that live within easy driving distance of UConn's Stadium than BC has Alums that are within easy driving distance of BC's stadium. You must know this. Are you saying that its because of UConn's football schedule compared to BC is the primary reason why UConn's far larger numbers of UConn grads do not support its football program at higher percentage levels than do BC alums do ? Why do UConn grads that live in Connecticut support their football team at levels that are far less than BC alums ? Is is economics ?. Is it the quality of the play ? Is it the schedule ? Why did UConn bring so few fans to the Fiesta Bowl BCS game ? I don't have an answer for this. But if you are a UConn grad, and you go to the home games and went to the Fiesta Bowl game, perhaps you could tell us why ? Frankly, I think both UConn and BC both should be doing much better with their football, Bowl Game attendance, and neither school should be pointing fingers at the other re. football attendance.
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I agree that UConn should have stronger fan support without question and the University should be doing more. Some of the older alumni though do not have a 'connection' to UConn football though as we were D1AA from the early 1900's through 1999, unlike BC, which has been D1A since inception back in the early 1900's. That said, UConn has already proven that with a good on the field product and a decent schedule, UConn will sell-out games on a regular basis. What is BC's excuse?
Also, just in case Geography was also not included in your education in the Heights.
Connecticut does not have a professional sports team of their own; but, the state is surrounded by them. For example, its just 75 miles from Storrs to Gillette Stadium and its 50 miles between Lowell and Gillette. Its an easy drive, I went to Pat games and various concerts at the old Foxborough stadium myself when I was at UConn. Fairfield County (using Westport as central spot) , where a lot of UConn alumni live, is a direct, 1 hour train ride to MSG in NYC (Knicks and Rangers) and Yankee Stadium (Yankees, NYC FC). How many people can make it to Fenway or TD Garden in under an hour from the Boston burbs? Fairfield County is also 55 miles by car from Citi Field (Mets) and MetLife Stadium (Giants, Jets). Its 65 miles from Fairfield County to Rentschler Field and, unlike Alumni Stadium at BC, UConn's stadium does not have direct mass transit access (The T's Green B, C, D lines). So again, what is BC's excuse?
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SubbaBub
Your stupidity is ruining my country.
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How much time do you spend on the UMass board?
Playing BC non conference is better than playing Army or Villanova. If I had a choice, I rather play better programs. If they were in the same conference, that would be a different story.
If it happens, I'll go to Boston to watch. If not, I'll live.
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First of all, truncating my post certainly doesn't provide the context to show that your response was deflective.
That issue aside, this was about a vision for the future and what was in the best overall interest for college athletics in the region (and therefore BC and UCONN). You make the same tired arguments over and over again. It is emblematic of the overall BC myopia - the status quo of partially filled stadiums and overall marginal performance. Argue all you want about BC's student body, but BC is dependent on regional interest. There is no national following of BC.
Post away Yawk.......I've got too much to do........
Dooley
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Oh good, the Fiesta Bowl conversation again. By far, one of the greatest misreported myths in UConn lore (along with UConn being a poor academic school because of a silly APR metric).
Fact: UConn had at least 15K at the Fiesta. You (and others around the country) think that UConn only had 3K because that is what was reported as being sold through the school. While true, OU for example only sold around 6K of their allotment through the school. The B12 bails out its conference members for any losses due to unsold bowl tickets. The Big East did not do the same. So, the story became national news because UConn sold so few through the school and ate a large chunk of money...money that OU did not have to eat.
If you are also saying that OU only had 6K fans and had "so few fans to the Fiesta Bowl BCS game", then at least you would be fair. Still wrong, but fair. But nobody has yet to mention anything about OU's attendance at that particular Fiesta Bowl. Why? Because they assume OU fans bought their tickets through a secondary ticket market called StubHub (where they could find tickets for $5 because it was sold as a combo deal to the National Championship game that year), and rightfully so.
You would think and hope that the folks at StubHub wouldn't limit access to their site to people living in Oklahoma...but apparently they do. UConn fans couldn't possibly have purchased tickets through StubHub (or other secondary sites) , could they? Hmmmm....
I am going to post two pictures after this post. The first is the OU side of UofPhoenix Stadium. The second is of the UConn side of UofPhoenix Stadium. Looks to be about the same amount of red and blue/white to be filtering its way into the 2nd and 3rd decks. If you want to still drum up this tired, debunked myth in the future, then that is on you and your lack of intelligence.
OU side:
Fact: UConn had at least 15K at the Fiesta. You (and others around the country) think that UConn only had 3K because that is what was reported as being sold through the school. While true, OU for example only sold around 6K of their allotment through the school. The B12 bails out its conference members for any losses due to unsold bowl tickets. The Big East did not do the same. So, the story became national news because UConn sold so few through the school and ate a large chunk of money...money that OU did not have to eat.
If you are also saying that OU only had 6K fans and had "so few fans to the Fiesta Bowl BCS game", then at least you would be fair. Still wrong, but fair. But nobody has yet to mention anything about OU's attendance at that particular Fiesta Bowl. Why? Because they assume OU fans bought their tickets through a secondary ticket market called StubHub (where they could find tickets for $5 because it was sold as a combo deal to the National Championship game that year), and rightfully so.
You would think and hope that the folks at StubHub wouldn't limit access to their site to people living in Oklahoma...but apparently they do. UConn fans couldn't possibly have purchased tickets through StubHub (or other secondary sites) , could they? Hmmmm....
I am going to post two pictures after this post. The first is the OU side of UofPhoenix Stadium. The second is of the UConn side of UofPhoenix Stadium. Looks to be about the same amount of red and blue/white to be filtering its way into the 2nd and 3rd decks. If you want to still drum up this tired, debunked myth in the future, then that is on you and your lack of intelligence.
OU side:
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Dooley
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If the answer to this question is 'none', I'm about to become a UMass fan.
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The " excuse " would be " much smaller school enrollment than UConn ", ..." far, FAR fewer BC Alums living near their stadium than UConn Alums living near their stadium ".... Connecticut being totally devoid of any Pro teams in the State"..... etc.... these would be just a few explanations ( or " excuses " , if you prefer )
UConn should have WAY more football fans in its state than does BC does in its state. Many BC Alums live out of state and can't get to its home games. So they watch their school on TV. UConn should have larger home game attendance over BC every year.. irrespective of won- loss record, schedule. Most Public Flag Ship Universities have much higher home football attendance than the Privates do... especially the Privates in Pro Sports oriented towns. Georgia Tech will never outsell Georgia. and with the Falcons in Atlanta thst makes it tough. And the State of Georgia is BIG on football ( hockey interest is slim to none in the state ). Miami Hurricanes never sold out their stadium, even when they were winning national titles. Miami is a Private University too.... its in football rich Florida too... but the Dolphins, even when they are lousy, outsell the amateur sport of College football. This should be no revelation here then that UConn should ALWAYS outdraw BC in football home attendance and in fan interest in its area. The fact that it doesn't at present is more the issue it would seem to me.
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It's like talking to a brick wall.
Dooley
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As for overall home game fan support, UConn has struggled in recent seasons. No question about that. A number of probable factors - 4 consecutive losing seasons; a horrific G5 level schedule with very few/any "big name" games; a horrendous coaching hire that sucked all energy out of the program...all probably at the top of the list for many. UConn just drew 33K to the last home game against Navy which is, all things considered, halfway decent considering the large amount of season ticket accounts lost over the years. Still not good, but getting better. The program has a pulse again which, I think, has a few more casual fan types excited. But still a long way to go.
Give UConn fans a winning record with a P5 schedule and you will see season ticket accounts skyrocket and sellouts more often than not.
Give UConn fans a winning record with a P5 schedule and you will see season ticket accounts skyrocket and sellouts more often than not.
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Look, Yawkey and Tusky have made some cogent points on why BC attendance is down, just as we can. The issue isn't a peeing contest over who has more empty seats, its how can we help fill them up. I want Northeast football to be considered something other than a joke by the football media. BC and UConn AD's in the past have been horrendous. The politics of the Big East de-construction left a lot of folks disgusted with huge lapses in behavior especially among the supposedly most ethical among us. But we can't recreate the past. What we have now is a chance to move on and prosper together. I say let's get this game scheduled and then let's have a blast yapping about it till kickoff.
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The Fiesta Bowl question is an issue that has been beaten to death. A lot of UConn fans did make it to the game; but, because they went on their own and did not use the travel/game package that the Fiesta Bowl organizers forced upon UConn they were not counted. I wish I kept the package offer by the Fiesta Bowl; but, if memory serves, it would have cost me $6,000 for 2 people. That’s a half-a-year’s tuition for in-state students. I remember looking at going on my own and the tickets were about $200 face, airfare was about $1,000, and hotels in nearby Scottsdale, which I have friends, was about $120 a night. That works out to be $2,800 for two people and the reason why no one bought that package. I didn’t go myself as I had just changed jobs in November of 2010 and had not PTO time plus I was living in corporate housing in Jersey at the time while my family was still in Boston, so I spent any time off going home.
Oh, and by the way, this came out right after UConn’s bowl game. At least we learned where all of that money was going to.
http://www.businessinsider.com/fiesta-bowl-john-junker-purchases-2011-3
Of course, BC fans can’t compare because even after decades as a D1A football team, the Eagles never made it to a BCS bowl.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Boston_College_Eagles_bowl_games
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