UCF Postgame Thread

[Jingo]

Some thoughts on the UCF game:

• Senior Day is always bittersweet. It was great to see all 5 seniors start. What was even better was to see that group of seniors come out and battle a tough UCF team, holding them scoreless before the cavalry arrived. I got a little emotional when Touly took that charging foul and then shouted in exhilaration.
• The cavalry was a little sluggish on offense, which I sort of expected. But UConn’s defense continued to be stifling, holding an opponent to single digits for the 4th straight qtr with only 4 pts.
• Against an active zone defense like UCF’s, the Huskies really need Liv on the floor. She makes attacking the zone much easier with her presence in the paint. While she didn’t score much in the 3rd qtr, the court opened up for UConn to knock down a bunch of 3’s.
• Megan really stepped up today with a solid all-around effort, and Anna really picked it up in the 2nd half with a number of big baskets.
• I’m all for the refs letting the teams “play,” but these games against UCF are just flat-out ugly. The Knights bang you with their bodies, slap you with their hands and throw an occasional elbow to your face, as Liv discovered, with a possible broken nose. UCF is increasingly pushing the envelope from playing physical to dangerous play. The AAC refs need to take control of these games. An ejection or two might send an appropriate message to UCF’s players as well as Coach Abe.

I admire teams that play tuff defense but when does it verge on poor sportsmanship?

 

[BBallF]

Future AA?!! On what basis? Virtually every two guard she has played against this year has played better. No one in the history of college basketball has become an All-American with the kind of FG, 3-point and FT percentages she has so far. Right now, she will be lucky to start on next year’s team; Westbrook didn’t transfer here to sit on the bench.

CW is 44% from the field, 31% from 3pt range and 68% from the "charity stripe" for the season. She needs a big Megan- type off season.

 

[ABCDFE]

Grind it out type of game. UCF plays good defense but the mugging inside all game was tough to watch. I thought Liv played aggressive and is really playing with confidence. AM came through in second half and did hit some huge shots for us. Meg was solid and had a quiet double double. CD was good but still a little off on her shots. The worry now is CW. We are very close to March and she does not look like someone who can be counted on to score consistently when open. This is worrisome because that takes away so much momentum when you find the open CW and she can’t hit the open shot. My hope is that something will click but I’m quite worried. She has at the moment gone from the 2nd best scorer at the beginning of the season to now probably the 4th best or 5th best player in the lineup. AM is starting to overtake her because she is able to hit open shots. CW NEEDS To drive and pull up mid range and more strong takes to the basket. Her outside shot is off right now.

 

[BostonBay]

CW is 44% from the field, 31% from 3pt range and 68% from the "charity stripe" for the season. She needs a big Megan- type off season.

Those are not good numbers considering how bad our competition is. The numbers are even worse against the 3 elite teams we played. Her shooting form is way off from the perimeter, and she has no "feel" on how to drive or take the mid-range jumper. Her 1st step seems slower this year and she's having trouble beating her defender. Everything seems "off-balance" for her. Worst, she doesnt bring consistent energy on the floor, like she showed bursts of last year.

Geno has few options though - I dont think starting Aubrey and bring CW off the bench will do the team any good at this point.

 

[vtcwbuff]

I just watched the game. After reading much (not all) of this thread I expected a real thugfest - games with Rutgers and Syracuse come to mind - but what I saw was a physical game and the only really chippy play that I saw was the foul against Dangerfield in the 4th. To me ONO's shot to the nose was just a matter of her having her nose in the wrong place at the wrong time.

 

[hoophuskee]

I'm distinguishing the positions on the basis of the traditional location of the players. CW is rarely at the top of the key or even on the foul line extended. She is almost always set up against the zone in between the foul line extended and the corner. I don't think Anna's effectiveness has taken away from CW at all. Anna didn't score until the second half and only took two more shots than CW but had 14 more points. She also had 5 boards a block and a steal. CW had none of each. Geno wants Anna handling the ball and initiating because she is a great passer even though she has been very turnover prone her first year. She is also 6'1" and can see over the top of the zone. She also rebounds and starts the break well off the dribble. She is closer to a 2 than CW because of these factors. The 2 is also usually the first player to receive the initiating pass from the PG and that is rare for CW. Perhaps these traditional classifications do not fit as well as they used to, but I think you and I are talking about something a lot bigger, such as why we have had such problems against the bigger teams, why we start so slowly offensively and why the #1 high school player in the country two years ago has become almost a non factor in our games. CW herself has said that she is seeing a lot of double teams this year. The players doing that are the ones near her and guarding her and invariably bigger because of her location on the court.

gotcha. I understand. It's not important but you said the below in bold. I took that for "AM" affecting CW because as you indicated CW is playing out of position. If CW is playing out of position in favor of AM, I took that for that it must mean AM is affecting CW. negatively. But your bigger point issue is correct. Not important about the bold comments and my point about who is affecting positions etc. . Thanks!!

I think the problem with her is that she is a two guard playing in the three position this year and it just doesn't fit her skill set well.

 

[Boreifs]

Besides being a focus of the defense, I think the problem with her is that she is a two guard playing in the three position this year and it just doesn't fit her skill set well. Meg is a natural three but had to play the four this year but is both stronger and 3 inches taller than CW so that transition has not been as difficult such as in rebounding which she really worked on. Yes, CW is in a shooting funk but even if she gets hot this season, she still has to contribute all the other things her position requires.

Playing the three?! Who do you think is the two guard?

 

[oldude]

I just watched the game. After reading much (not all) of this thread I expected a real thugfest - games with Rutgers and Syracuse come to mind - but what I saw was a physical game and the only really chippy play that I saw was the foul against Dangerfield in the 4th. To me ONO's shot to the nose was just a matter of her having her nose in the wrong place at the wrong time.

Yes! Clearly it was Liv’s fault when the UCF player flung her elbow above her shoulder into Liv’s nose, and then the refs compounded Liv’s mistake by calling a flagrant foul on the UCF kid.......

For the record: Rule: A flagrant foul is assessed for excessive elbows, swinging above the shoulders.

 

[Boreifs]

I just watched the game. After reading much (not all) of this thread I expected a real thugfest - games with Rutgers and Syracuse come to mind - but what I saw was a physical game and the only really chippy play that I saw was the foul against Dangerfield in the 4th. To me ONO's shot to the nose was just a matter of her having her nose in the wrong place at the wrong time.

I was courtside. IMO, your impression is totally inaccurate. On TV, you don’t “hear” the banging off the ball or see the elbows thrown to the head region.

 

[psconn]

Did you notice Kim Better (ch'ip#1) and Tierney Lawlor (ch'ip#11) behind the bench? Bookends ~20 years apart. Always good to see the alums in attendance.

 

[Littlemin]

Positions aside, Williams play really all year has not passed the eye test but we are fans and have incomplete “data” if you will. The coaches assessment may, and would appear to be, much different based on her court time. It is not like Auriemma has not shown through the years he will offer the bench to any player with whom he is dissatisfied.

 

[VaConnFan11]

I looked at the box scores of prior UCF games and they had fewer fouls in almost all of them. UConn 16 - UCF 13; USF 28 - UCF 16; Cinci 23- UCF 12; UCF 18 - Houston 17; TLSA 24 - UCF 20; SMU 19 - UCF 16; Tem 13 - UCF 11. Got tired of checking. With the way UCF plays, how do these numbers make sense?

More than likely the Refs don't see UCF's initial foul. They only see the other teams retaliatory foul.

 

[HopJim]

Williams played 38 minutes today, made 1-6 shots, had 2 assists, and no rebounds. Pretty much seemed satisfied to play D, which she did, and give the ball up almost as soon as she touched it. Kinda strange but the coaches must be satisfied as she seldom comes out of any game.

With all due respect to one of my favorite players, who else would Geno put in?

 

[HopJim]

You never seen games like that? You ever play in games like that? It's been part of basketball for years! Where you been?

While I rarely respond to "In my day, we did it.." comments, have to compliment the UConn team for holding onto their composure throughout the game. ONO and Walker in particular hit or held on every play. In my day, we typically retaliated in a variety of ways. Leading teams play through ugly games like this as did the Huskies.

 

[cbraarj]

While I rarely respond to "In my day, we did it.." comments, have to compliment the UConn team for holding onto their composure throughout the game. ONO and Walker in particular hit or held on every play. In my day, we typically retaliated in a variety of ways. Leading teams play through ugly games like this as did the Huskies.

It wasn't an in my day answer! Still involved with the game. My reason for the question is. If you haven't played basketball How do you know what really happens in a physical game and yes the girl that did that to Olivia would have ended up on her butt legally with just a hard foul! In the past if that happened a teammate would have gotten in that girls face! I remember Rene going into the Rutgers huddle because of a foul on Maya and confronting her friend on their team! ( I see the player but the name I don't) This Huskie team does not have this. Batouly might have filled that role but the injuries she has had.

 

[eebmg]

While I rarely respond to "In my day, we did it.." comments, have to compliment the UConn team for holding onto their composure throughout the game. ONO and Walker in particular hit or held on every play. In my day, we typically retaliated in a variety of ways. Leading teams play through ugly games like this as did the Huskies.

The kind of game Batouly would have loved if she was healthy. UCF would have some bandages of their own.

 

[DEpup]

After Liv got the hit, I think he should have done a little BatCam and Adebayo and see what would have happened.... I think BatCam could have inflicted some pain of her own....

 

[BlueDolphin]

To me ONO's shot to the nose was just a matter of her having her nose in the wrong place at the wrong time.

Reminds me of the time they called a foul on Ben Gordon for hitting the defender in the elbow with his nose. He was in a mask for the next month or so.

 

[Martin]

With all due respect to one of my favorite players, who else would Geno put in?

Anna Aubrey Kyla Meg CW can all play a few possessions for each other just to get someone off the court for a break, to be coached up or receive a foot on rear...whatever is necessary.

 

[Longtime fan]

I was hoping Geno would leave the 5 seniors in the game until UCONN fell behind. But it was a classy gesture nonetheless.

We are joining the Big East next season, right? One of the "rationales" is that the AAC just doesn't have competitive teams for UCONN. Has anyone looked at the members of the Big East in women's Basketball?

The best team is DePaul, whom we usually beat by 20-40 points. There is Seton Hall, Creighton, and ( sorry, I know this is disrespectful) a bunch of other no name teams.

Seriously, can someone please make the argument that we are moving to a conference where "in season" games will be more exciting and competitive?

I don't see a single university which represents more than another game against Memphis or Tulane.

Help me feel better. Please!

It just seems that we keep ordering the exact same breakfast.

 

[Centerstream]

We are joining the Big East next season, right? One of the "rationales" is that the AAC just doesn't have competitive teams for UCONN. Has anyone looked at the members of the Big East in women's Basketball?

The best team is DePaul, whom we usually beat by 20-40 points. There is Seton Hall, Creighton, and ( sorry, I know this is disrespectful) a bunch of other no name teams.

Seriously, can someone please make the argument that we are moving to a conference where "in season" games will be more exciting and competitive?

I don't see a single university which represents more than another game against Memphis or Tulane.

Help me feel better. Please!

It just seems that we keep ordering the exact same breakfast.

Just wondering, how is this related to the UCF Post Game thread? And is posted 2 days after the game.
Probably would get more attention.
And before I am asked, the reason I was looking at this thread is because I just watched the replay and had a comment.

 

[Plebe]

We are joining the Big East next season, right? One of the "rationales" is that the AAC just doesn't have competitive teams for UCONN. Has anyone looked at the members of the Big East in women's Basketball?

The best team is DePaul, whom we usually beat by 20-40 points. There is Seton Hall, Creighton, and ( sorry, I know this is disrespectful) a bunch of other no name teams.

Seriously, can someone please make the argument that we are moving to a conference where "in season" games will be more exciting and competitive?

I don't see a single university which represents more than another game against Memphis or Tulane.

Help me feel better. Please!

It just seems that we keep ordering the exact same breakfast.

Here's one factoid, which I mentioned in another thread earlier. If UConn were in the Big East this year, the Big East would be #5 in the conference RPI ranking -- ahead of the ACC.

The AAC -- with UConn -- is #9 in the RPI this year. Subtract UConn, and the AAC falls to roughly #13.

The "new" Big East has been a bona fide multi-bid conference even without UConn. At least two Big East teams have made the NCAAT every year since realignment (and 3 have made it every year since 2016). The AAC, sans UConn, would've been a one-bid conference more often than not.

 

[Longtime fan]

Here's one factoid, which I mentioned in another thread earlier. If UConn were in the Big East this year, the Big East would be #5 in the conference RPI ranking -- ahead of the ACC.

The AAC -- with UConn -- is #9 in the RPI this year. Subtract UConn, and the AAC falls to roughly #13.

The "new" Big East has been a bona fide multi-bid conference even without UConn. At least two Big East teams have made the NCAAT every year since realignment (and 3 have made it every year since 2016). The AAC, sans UConn, would've been a one-bid conference more often than not.

Thanks, but that is not the overwhelming argument I was hoping for. In the last few years, USF and or UCF has qualified for the tournament, I think.

In any case, we are grasping at straws. The Big East may be "better" by some arcane mathematical formula, but what game are youooking forward to next season?

Saint Johns? Villanova? Marquette? Butler? Providence? Georgetown?

In women's basketball, how do they do against Memphis, USF, Cincinnati, Tulane? There isn't a decent team in the AAC or the Big East in the women's game.

We are just eating another tomato sandwich.

 

[oldude]

We are joining the Big East next season, right? One of the "rationales" is that the AAC just doesn't have competitive teams for UCONN. Has anyone looked at the members of the Big East in women's Basketball?

The best team is DePaul, whom we usually beat by 20-40 points. There is Seton Hall, Creighton, and ( sorry, I know this is disrespectful) a bunch of other no name teams.

Seriously, can someone please make the argument that we are moving to a conference where "in season" games will be more exciting and competitive?

I don't see a single university which represents more than another game against Memphis or Tulane.

Help me feel better. Please!

It just seems that we keep ordering the exact same breakfast.

Thanks, but that is not the overwhelming argument I was hoping for. In the last few years, USF and or UCF has qualified for the tournament, I think.

In any case, we are grasping at straws. The Big East may be "better" by some arcane mathematical formula, but what game are youooking forward to next season?

Saint Johns? Villanova? Marquette? Butler? Providence? Georgetown?

In women's basketball, how do they do against Memphis, USF, Cincinnati, Tulane? There isn't a decent team in the AAC or the Big East in the women's game.

We are just eating another tomato sandwich.

OK, here are all the other arguments for the NBE over the AAC:

1. Restores natural rivalries with teams like Georgetown, Nova, St Johns, Seton Hall (think both MBB & WBB)
2. Significantly lowers travel costs
3. Puts UConn in most major eastern media markets: NY, Phil, DC, Chicago to name a few.
4. Allows UConn to get out from under the money losing albatross of AAC football. The University now is in position to evaluate multiple options for the future of UConn FB.

 

[hoophuskee]

Thanks, but that is not the overwhelming argument I was hoping for. In the last few years, USF and or UCF has qualified for the tournament, I think.

In any case, we are grasping at straws. The Big East may be "better" by some arcane mathematical formula, but what game are youooking forward to next season?

Saint Johns? Villanova? Marquette? Butler? Providence? Georgetown?

In women's basketball, how do they do against Memphis, USF, Cincinnati, Tulane? There isn't a decent team in the AAC or the Big East in the women's game.

We are just eating another tomato sandwich.

I'm not sure what you were expecting but the Big East is better. You're mocking Marquette while building up UCF?

The AAC is worse than the Big East. Regarding success-
three times USF made it to the 2nd rd.
And one time Tulane, Temple, and UCF made it to the NCAA's only to lose.
So-- AAC had 4 teams in NCAA (excluding UCONN) overall with only 1 going past rd 1 but never beyond that.
-----------
The Big East is better:
DePaul has gone to S16 twice of which USF never did. Has gone 3 other times beyond rd 1. USF got 3 more times to NCAA same number as DePaul but lost while DePaul won.
And from 2013 to now 3 different teams advanced once to rd 2 and Marquette did it twice.
No other team other than USF even did it once.
Further Seton Hall got to NCAA twice but lost but the point is
more teams make the NCAA Tourney from the Big East and more teams advance (excluding UCONN).
So-- B.E. had 6 teams in NCAA overall with only 1 going pass rd 2, while 4-5 teams went past rd 1 and only 1 never got past rd 1.
------------
UCONN lost in two games by last second shots.
Possibly just a little better conference has them in the finals with one or two more titles.
Potentially this conference can help prepare them for some of those one point games.
Let;s see if they can rather than complain so early.

 

[Longtime fan]

I'm not sure what you were expecting but the Big East is better. You're mocking Marquette while building up UCF?

The AAC is worse than the Big East. Regarding success-
three times USF made it to the 2nd rd.
And one time Tulane, Temple, and UCF made it to the NCAA's only to lose.
So-- AAC had 4 teams in NCAA (excluding UCONN) overall with only 1 going past rd 1 but never beyond that.
-----------
The Big East is better:
DePaul has gone to S16 twice of which USF never did. Has gone 3 other times beyond rd 1. USF got 3 more times to NCAA same number as DePaul but lost while DePaul won.
And from 2013 to now 3 different teams advanced once to rd 2 and Marquette did it twice.
No other team other than USF even did it once.
Further Seton Hall got to NCAA twice but lost but the point is
more teams make the NCAA Tourney from the Big East and more teams advance (excluding UCONN).
So-- B.E. had 6 teams in NCAA overall with only 1 going pass rd 2, while 4-5 teams went past rd 1 and only 1 never got past rd 1.
------------
UCONN lost in two games by last second shots.
Possibly just a little better conference has them in the finals with one or two more titles.
Potentially this conference can help prepare them for some of those one point games.
Let;s see if they can rather than complain so early.

Okay. I give up. It is a great move. Creighton will be a sell-out.

 

[Longtime fan]

OK, here are all the other arguments for the NBE over the AAC:

1. Restores natural rivalries with teams like Georgetown, Nova, St Johns, Seton Hall (think both MBB & WBB)
2. Significantly lowers travel costs
3. Puts UConn in most major eastern media markets: NY, Phil, DC, Chicago to name a few.
4. Allows UConn to get out from under the money losing albatross of AAC football. The University now is in position to evaluate multiple options for the future of UConn FB.

Dude;

1. Those old rivalries are really, really old. It is a great league ( and many rivalries) for men's BB; far less so the women.

2. I get the economic argument. Sadly, that was not my goal.

3. Not sure what number 3 signifies. So many of our best players come from California.

4. UCONN football would lose in the IVY league.

I will stop complaining. There is no point. There never is.

 

[dogged1]

Dude;

1. Those old rivalries are really, really old. It is a great league ( and many rivalries) for men's BB; far less so the women.

2. I get the economic argument. Sadly, that was not my goal.

3. Not sure what number 3 signifies. So many of our best players come from California.

4. UCONN football would lose in the IVY league.

I will stop complaining. There is no point. There never is.

Unnnh, it wasn't done to improve our Women's basketball program. It was done for the Men's basketball program.

 

[Plebe]

Thanks, but that is not the overwhelming argument I was hoping for. In the last few years, USF and or UCF has qualified for the tournament, I think.

In any case, we are grasping at straws. The Big East may be "better" by some arcane mathematical formula, but what game are youooking forward to next season?

Saint Johns? Villanova? Marquette? Butler? Providence? Georgetown?

In women's basketball, how do they do against Memphis, USF, Cincinnati, Tulane? There isn't a decent team in the AAC or the Big East in the women's game.

We are just eating another tomato sandwich.

And USF or UCF would've probably been the only AAC team in the tournament in most of those years, with no UConn in the picture. Two minus one equals one. That's the way one-bid leagues work.

With all due respect, your issues in this thread seem more emotional or psychological than about facts or data. So, I'll do my best to avoid confusing the matter with facts.

Far be it from me to tell you what to get excited about. Millions of people get excited about golf and yoga, but I find both of them excruciatingly boring. Perception is everything.

If it's about quality of play, then clearly the Big East is a better conference than the AAC. Is it the Pac-12? Obviously not. But there is in fact a major qualitative difference between teams in the 20-60 range and teams in the 100-200 range. I'll refrain from citing facts or data because you don't like those, but just because it's not what you want doesn't mean it's not a step up.

Other conferences aren't all they're cracked up to be either. You think Baylor fans get thrilled about playing Kansas and Kansas State twice every year?

 

[Longtime fan]

And USF or UCF would've probably been the only AAC team in the tournament in most of those years, with no UConn in the picture. Two minus one equals one. That's the way one-bid leagues work.

With all due respect, your issues in this thread seem more emotional or psychological than about facts or data. So, I'll do my best to avoid confusing the matter with facts.

Far be it from me to tell you what to get excited about. Millions of people get excited about golf and yoga, but I find both of them excruciatingly boring. Perception is everything.

If it's about quality of play, then clearly the Big East is a better conference than the AAC. Is it the Pac-12? Obviously not. But there is in fact a major qualitative difference between teams in the 20-60 range and teams in the 100-200 range. I'll refrain from citing facts or data because you don't like those, but just because it's not what you want doesn't mean it's not a step up.

Other conferences aren't all they're cracked up to be either. You think Baylor fans get thrilled about playing Kansas and Kansas State twice every year?

Thanks, Plebe.