True Detective Season 2 | Page 3 | The Boneyard

True Detective Season 2

nelsonmuntz said:
I am fine with most of the dialogue, including Vaughn's. If you wrote down some of McConaghy's lines from last season and just looked at them rather than hear him say them, you would ask yourself "WTF was he talking about?"

I am less fine with the stares. That doesn't work in Twilight, and it certainly doesn't work in a show designed for adults.

Kitsch is entering the category of "cool character ruined by awful acting" (see Paula Malcomson on Ray Donovan for another example). He is playing the gay angle in such a self-loathing way as to be borderline offensive to gays. The scene with the mom should have been much more powerful. He started off OK, but he has spiraled.

My biggest fear is that the previews make it seem like the show is about to jump the shark in a major way with this party.

Farrell is doing very good work, and deserves an Emmy nomination for this.
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It worked for McConaughey's character, I actually know an oddball guy that talks just like that and he has the same vibe as McConaughey. Vaughan's dialogue and stares are just ridiculous, he isn't pulling it off at all and I was excited about this role for him. Kitsch has a good screen presence but he has one expression and just seems like a weak actor. I agree with you on Farrell's acting, he's the only good thing about the show. I was giving it a chance and thought the critics were overly harsh early on but I can't defend it anymore. I absolutely loved the first season but feel like this season is killing off any chance of future seasons being produced.
 
Kitsch is killing me! He always looks like he just ate bad cabbage or he is holding in a major bout of gas. That one facial expression....WTF?!?! And why the hell is he usually whispering?

I still think the show is fine, but only if you don't compare it to last season. As someone said above, Season 1 was a masterpiece. This season is like a high-quality portrait reprint. I think McAdams needs more screen time and Ferrell is holding his own, but I don't see anything Emmy worthy. He is just better than he usually is and those around him. But he wouldn't measure up to Woody or McConaughey.
 
I think a big difference between the seasons is the interplay between major characters. In season 1, we had constant personal drama between the two leads that made it feel "deeper". Most other shows (at least try to ) do this to some degree.

This season is missing that, and although each character is shown going through their own drama, this is as pure a "mystery" season as possible and maybe it seems one-dimensional in that sense compared to the first season. The characters were just kind of thrown together by happenstance.

I'm gonna re-watch season 1 and look for what this season is missing. It's more than acting.
 
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I actually think Farrell's and Kitsch's characters are really interesting, which is why I think it may just be an acting problem with Kitsch. McAdams' character is a bit of a female TV show cop stereotype. I like Vaughn's character too, I am just not crazy about Vaughn playing it.
 
nelsonmuntz said:
I actually think Farrell's and Kitsch's characters are really interesting, which is why I think it may just be an acting problem with Kitsch. McAdams' character is a bit of a female TV show cop stereotype. I like Vaughn's character too, I am just not crazy about Vaughn playing it.
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There have been too many cop shows. It's pretty much impossible for every character to not be a stereotype. Even on The Wire. Ferrel's the biggest of the bunch: alcoholic losing his family
 
Can't compare it to last season. Different characters with different internal problems. The fact that they are both cop shoes with the same title isn't relevant to the story. Think of it like the Twilight Zone or the Amazing Stories series.

The most fascinating parts for me are the interactions between Vaughn and his wife and Vaughn and Farrell. I think both relationships are presented very well. I don't need to see Kitsch anymore and McAdams needs a better storyline. The child of a hippy with self loathing aggression issues isn't working for me, but I like her performance.
 
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This show is all over the place. It's only 8 episodes and it has more mislaid plot lines than than Stephen King's recycling bin.

Remember that big shoutout? Remember Ray getting a second chance and becoming healthy? Who the heck was the dead character that Frank had to go talk to his son?

Is there anyone on the show who hasn't been raped? Is there a woman on the show who hasn't been raped or has been a prostititute?

I think Pizzolato caught lightning in a bottle last season. But this season is a mess.
 
ZooCougar said:
This show is all over the place. It's only 8 episodes and it has more mislaid plot lines than than Stephen King's recycling bin.

Remember that big shoutout? Remember Ray getting a second chance and becoming healthy? Who the heck was the dead character that Frank had to go talk to his son?

Is there anyone on the show who hasn't been raped? Is there a woman on the show who hasn't been raped or has been a prostititute?

I think Pizzolato caught lightning in a bottle last season. But this season is a mess.
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I give GoT a pass on rape plotlines because it is a period piece and the middle ages were really funked up. I think writers should tread very carefully with them in most cases though, and True Detective II is very reckless.

There is no show in TV history that had more unfinished plot lines than the Sopranos, so I am OK so far with that in TD.

I actually think the show is improving as it moves along, although it is very confusing and I still do not really understand what happened to Vaughn other than the dead guy stole $5MM from him. I definitely do not understand why the hooker party matters to Vaughn's scam.
 
Rocktheworld said:
I'm gonna re-watch season 1 and look for what this season is missing. It's more than acting.
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It's a whole sh!tload of things. Most overlooked is the setting and cinematography. The Bayou is a flat out creepy place, and the cinematography did it all the justice in the world. It was gorgeously shot. You could literally feel the place. Vinci is a dump and you can't give two about anything going on outside the characters.

As has been mentioned, the writing kind of sucks, from plot to dialogue to character development. It's just not strong.

The second season has been hollywood-ized. Feels cheap in comparison to the first season (rich).

Contrary to what others have said, I don't think the fact that the characters are tropes is a big let down in Season 2. They just didn't execute. If you look at it, the characters in Season 1 were tropes as well. They just pulled it off.
 
nelsonmuntz said:
I give GoT a pass on rape plotlines because it is a period piece and the middle ages were really funked up. I think writers should tread very carefully with them in most cases though, and True Detective II is very reckless.

There is no show in TV history that had more unfinished plot lines than the Sopranos, so I am OK so far with that in TD.
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Yeah, but there were 6 seasons in the Sopranos. I'm sure they didn't know how many seasons they'd film when they first started.

True Detective is a (short) one season deal. It has to be tight. There is no excuse for it not to be.
 
I definitely agree that the location is a negative. This is a huge country, so we don't need more things set in LA or New York, and I am good with Miami and DC too. As I said before, the location was a main character last season. They could have been a little more creative this season.
 
nelsonmuntz said:
I give GoT a pass on rape plotlines because it is a period piece and the middle ages were really funked up. I think writers should tread very carefully with them in most cases though, and True Detective II is very reckless.

There is no show in TV history that had more unfinished plot lines than the Sopranos, so I am OK so far with that in TD.

I actually think the show is improving as it moves along, although it is very confusing and I still do not really understand what happened to Vaughn other than the dead guy stole $5MM from him. I definitely do not understand why the hooker party matters to Vaughn's scam.
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***Spoilers (not really) in case you aren't caught up***
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Vaughn (Frank) bought in to the development deal that is going hit big when transit rail is built through previously worthless land. The dead guy was a corrupt politician Frank had paid $5M to as part of his buy in to the LLC developing the land. Problem is the dead guy never put Frank on the contract and who knows who has the $5M. So, Frank is broke and getting more desperate as his old way of life isn't the same game anymore. So he is looking for something that will allow him to buy back into the corridor.

The hooker party is the conduit by which the developers gain investors and influence over powerful people. Some people use golf, these guys highly modified eastern European prostitutes.

Both Frank and the cops are separately looking to find the ties to this crowd that will make their respective cases. The dead guy had some leverage material that would help either side.
 
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It's not fair to compare the seasons as they are totally different.

That said, what I really enjoyed about season one was it's pace. It was very slow, the kind of pace not possible on network. The emptiness of the town working as an analogy to the emptiness between the main characters. That pace helped the oddness work, In fact, it exaggerated the awkwardness between Woody and Matt that served as the basis of the story. Then they hit you with that shootout and it hits like what-the-freak-was-that!!! Then, the pace picks up but the strangeness of these characters never goes away. It was a great use of the time and space available in a mini-series.

Season two is much more conventional. It follows some of the bread crumbs of season one. Odd relationships between the main characters. An unexpected huge shootout. But for me the more complicated plot and bigger array of characters add up to less. I also agree with the previous comment that Los Angeles stopped being interesting a long time ago.
 
Palatine said:
I also agree with the previous comment that Los Angeles stopped being interesting a long time ago.
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I didn't mind it at first, and wouldn't mind it if it was significant to the plot/conflict.

I thought the California super-highway system would be the crux of the story. The series is flooded with all the shots of highways in both the opening credits and scene transitions. I thought that the building of the rail system would jeopardize use of the highway system, and this would cause conflict politically that would suck in Frank and his underground dealings. I thought it would be a cool, fresh, unconventional, complex use of LA. But to be honest I had no idea how the cops would be brought in to the plot.

Anyway, that highway system that I imagined would have been like, as Nelson said, almost like a character in itself as Bumf-ck, Louisiana was in season 1, is clearly not very significant now that we're 75% done with the series. So that means the series really could have been anywhere and Frank could have made a $5 million deal over anything. And you could have had him stooping to dealing with any large organized crime group other than Mexican cartels.

I think it would be cool if they did a season in Europe.
 
SubbaBub said:
***Spoilers (not really) in case you aren't caught up***
.
.
.
.
.
.
.



Vaughn (Frank) bought in to the development deal that is going hit big when transit rail is built through previously worthless land. The dead guy was a corrupt politician Frank had paid $5M to as part of his buy in to the LLC developing the land. Problem is the dead guy never put Frank on the contract and who knows who has the $5M. So, Frank is broke and getting more desperate as his old way of life isn't the same game anymore. So he is looking for something that will allow him to buy back into the corridor.

The hooker party is the conduit by which the developers gain investors and influence over powerful people. Some people use golf, these guys highly modified eastern European prostitutes.

Both Frank and the cops are separately looking to find the ties to this crowd that will make their respective cases. The dead guy had some leverage material that would help either side.
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I may have missed like half an episode somewhere, because i did not know about the LLC. I got that the hooker parties were for blackmail, but I don't understand what they were blackmailing the participants for. Maybe we don't know that yet.

I do think the hooker party was gratuitous and completely unnecessary. Having all these guys at the same party banging women in front of everyone else kind of takes away the expectation of anonymity up front. At least Kubrick had the sense to make everyone wear masks in Eyes Wide Shut. If the attendees at the hooker party were so powerful, you would have thought that some of them would recognize that this was a bad idea rather than banging hookers in front of their friends.
 
nelsonmuntz said:
I may have missed like half an episode somewhere, because i did not know about the LLC. I got that the hooker parties were for blackmail, but I don't understand what they were blackmailing the participants for. Maybe we don't know that yet.

I do think the hooker party was gratuitous and completely unnecessary. Having all these guys at the same party banging women in front of everyone else kind of takes away the expectation of anonymity up front. At least Kubrick had the sense to make everyone wear masks in Eyes Wide Shut. If the attendees at the hooker party were so powerful, you would have thought that some of them would recognize that this was a bad idea rather than banging hookers in front of their friends.
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Ms. Bub calls it, "proving you are watching HBO"

There were two short scenes of exposition about Frank looking to get his piece of the deal back (IIRC, he can for $7M, maybe $10M). The point was there was no way for Frank to raise that much. So, he is looking for blackmail leverage while trying to retain/restart his crime empire, which wasn't a whole lot to begin with.

The premise is that all the guys at the party are in various shady businesses together. The politicians and investors are also there and perks of being in business with these guys. Gratuitous, sure but you do need a way of connecting the various business, criminal, and political players. The location of Vinci, a corrupt small town outside LA with it's entire municipal service infrastructure on the take is essential to the plot.
 
SubbaBub said:
Ms. Bub calls it, "proving you are watching HBO"

There were two short scenes of exposition about Frank looking to get his piece of the deal back (IIRC, he can for $7M, maybe $10M). The point was there was no way for Frank to raise that much. So, he is looking for blackmail leverage while trying to retain/restart his crime empire, which wasn't a whole lot to begin with.

The premise is that all the guys at the party are in various shady businesses together. The politicians and investors are also there and perks of being in business with these guys. Gratuitous, sure but you do need a way of connecting the various business, criminal, and political players. The location of Vinci, a corrupt small town outside LA with it's entire municipal service infrastructure on the take is essential to the plot.
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Is Frank running the parties? I thought someone else was running them, although Frank's guy is involved without Frank's knowledge. I had expected Ray to kill that guy in the escape. Didn't Frank ask Ray to kill that guy?
 
nelsonmuntz said:
Is Frank running the parties? I thought someone else was running them, although Frank's guy is involved without Frank's knowledge. I had expected Ray to kill that guy in the escape. Didn't Frank ask Ray to kill that guy?
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Frank asked Ray to follow that guy to see what he's up to, there is nothing to lead you to believe Frank is running the parties.
 
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nelsonmuntz said:
Is Frank running the parties? I thought someone else was running them, although Frank's guy is involved without Frank's knowledge. I had expected Ray to kill that guy in the escape. Didn't Frank ask Ray to kill that guy?
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No, but one of Frank's underlings runs the girls off the books and is involved as a side business. If Frank were running it, he'd have what he needs by now.

I'm guessing Frank is a notch or two below these guys on the criminal top 10 list.
 
bottom line why the hell isn't cary fukunaga directing every episode??
 
I finished the series and still don't really know what happened or I think I know what happened and none of it was all that compelling. I think the acting was actually good, it's the writing that led to all the awkwardness. Frank could have been a great character but the stupid storyline and silly dialogue made it so that he really didn't come into his own until the last few episodes. Glad it's over.
 
Best part of the episode tonigh was during the scene where Vaughn is convincing his wife to leave without him and he'll meet here in Venezuela, she says "you're a sh1tty actor" (or something to that effect)... My wife looks at me and says "even his TV wife thinks he sucks in this series".
 
God, what an inane s--- show that was.

There was nothing redeeming about that eight hours of television.

If there's any justice, the show has a 1/2 hour epilogue next week where Vince Vaughn, Rachel McAdams and Colin Farrell beat the crap out of the writers.
 
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Just not very good at all. Nothing like the 1st season and not close for that matter in any regard.

Disappointing as I at least hoped the last hour and a half brought some sense back to the story but it never happened. Stop at 2 if you can't get back to some semblance of 1.
 
It was a different story conceptually from the first season. More just a standard cop drama than a mystery. There was no real central, mysterious, evil villain that has to be caught. Like a cop drama, the goal posts keep moving as the crime network they stumble upon goes deeper and deeper. The Wire had 50 episodes to make it what it was. Eight here.

And the story was just bland as hell. You knew by the camera/shot and musical style that you were watching True Detective, but it had no real edge.
 
Rocktheworld said:
It was a different story conceptually from the first season. More just a standard cop drama than a mystery. There was no real central, mysterious, evil villain that has to be caught. Like a cop drama, the goal posts keep moving as the crime network they stumble upon goes deeper and deeper. The Wire had 50 episodes to make it what it was. Eight here.

And the story was just bland as hell. You knew by the camera/shot and musical style that you were watching True Detective, but it had no real edge.
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I basically agree with you, but i would put the first 8 episodes of The Wire against this season any day. I would put any 8 episode sequence of the Wire against this season.

I didn’t think it was bad, just not in the same league as Season 1. I think you nailed it..this was just your typical cop drama.
 
Welp...that whole season was just a huge waste of time.
 
I watched the first episode and didn't like it enough to watch any other episodes. The reviews on the season are now so bad that I'll never watch it.

Anyone care to give me a wrap up of what it was about in 100 words or less?
 
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