OT: Things Somehow Get Worse at Alabama

[Leebo]

Didn't say move on from the murder. Oats should be fired and Miller should be kicked off the team. The outrage over the pre-game intro is just distracting from the actual crime.

You say this like people aren't upset about the intro for the way it relates to the other thing. No one who is upset about the intro isn't upset about the murder.

 

[Leebo]

If you're aware that no one forgot about the murder, then how is anyone "distracted".

 

[businesslawyer]

How providing the murder weapon not accessory?

Seriously? If you lend a friend a car because his is in the shop, and he drives it to a 7-11 and robs the cash register, you think that makes you an accessory? Wouldn’t you think that you had to have either knowledge or at least reason to know he was going to take your car and commit a crime to be an accessory?

 

[Rocktheworld]

Yes, I did go to UConn. And I go there now for post-master's work too. What's your point? You know Miller doesn't play for us? What a silly comment.

I think Oats should be fired and Miller should be off the team too. I've said that all along. FOR THE ROLE IN THE MURDER and Oats comments after. Not a stupid pre-game ritual. Suspending him for just that would be moronic.

I can't tell if you genuinely don't understand my point, or if you are this out of touch.

The silliest thing here is you acting like people are less about or are distracted away from the murder by this. No idea where/how you came up with that. Obviously he should be punished for his role in the murder. I’m just talking about this isolated incident; that doesn’t take away from whatever has happened. You’re the one having a tough time following along.

“Move on” is the out of touch response. I’m the one who first called people out on making jokes about the murder in the first thread.

 

[Rocktheworld]

Seriously? If you lend a friend a car because his is in the shop, and he drives it to a 7-11 and robs the cash register, you think that makes you an accessory? Wouldn’t you think that you had to have either knowledge or at least reason to know he was going to take your car and commit a crime to be an accessory?

Didn’t miller them block in the woman so she could more assuredly be killed? What do you think about that aspect of what happened?

And we are talking about bringing a murder device to a murder. Not a car to a robbery.

Good lawyering though lol

 

[ucp990411]

I understood the point completely. If anyone is missing the point, it's you. Of course better judgment should have been used. I dare you to find a single post on here where I said it WASN'T stupid thing to do.

The person I responded to when I said this claimed that a pregame patdown is "insane" under normal circumstances. That was a stupid take.

Did you bother to read what I was responding to? Because what you're saying is equally as stupid.

A little sensitive to criticism are you?

 

[businesslawyer]

Didn’t miller them block in the woman so she could more assuredly be killed? What do you think about that aspect of what happened?

And we are talking about bringing a murder device to a murder. Not a car to a robbery.

Good lawyering though lol

I have not followed the case at all and have no knowledge of what Miller was alleged to do, much less whether he was guilty of a crime. I was simply discussing W’s hypothetical as to whether one was an accessory because your property was used in a crime. Maybe you should look up what a hypothetical is.

 

[Rocktheworld]

I have not followed the case at all and have no knowledge of what Miller was alleged to do, much less whether he was guilty of a crime. I was simply discussing W’s hypothetical as to whether one was an accessory because your property was used in a crime. Maybe you should look up what a hypothetical is.

No need to get pissy, bud

 

[businesslawyer]

No need to get pissy, bud

Excellent point. I should just accept you being pissy, and attacking my post for saying nothing like what you thought I was saying, without thinking it’s appropriate to defend my original post by pointing out you misread it. My bad.

 

[Jay-Bone]

A pre-game patdown under normal circumstances is clever and fun. Get your panties out of a bunch.

Especially if the other week you provided a gun that killed someone. It lets everyone in the crowd know he doesn't have a gun this time.

 

[TerryBoyz]

Alabama's Nate Oats on Brandon Miller's 'pat-down': 'Not appropriate'

Alabama men's basketball coach Nate Oats called freshman forward Brandon Miller's pregame introduction routine of being patted down by a walk-on before heading to midcourt "not appropriate" after his team beat Arkansas 86-83 on Saturday.

www.espn.com

What would we think of these were our players doing this?

Been reading most of these replies and some good points made.

To me I just can’t understand how someone Would still perform this pregame ritual and not think…”hmm, maybe this isn’t such a good idea.” Makes me question how seriously they are taking this.
I have no clue about these pregame rituals but did the Michigan state players do this before or after their incident.
But I’m just an old man man living in the suburbs of ct so I really should pass judegement

 

[Jay-Bone]

The outrage over the pre-game intro is just distracting from the actual crime.

The outrage is due to the culmination of events and the compounding the pat down did. Its completely rational. Your "apologize and move on" is like "thoughts and prayers" after a school shooting. Your defense of the ritual is ignoring the larger implications.

 

[Jay-Bone]

Look, if I was a fan at the game, I'd be glad someone patted him down. That dude fetches guns for murderers!

 

[Rico444]

Didn’t miller them block in the woman so she could more assuredly be killed? What do you think about that aspect of what happened?

And we are talking about bringing a murder device to a murder. Not a car to a robbery.

Good lawyering though lol

This is a statement from Miller's lawyer. It clearly lays out what, at the very least, their story is. He also claims that Miller was not blocking the victim's car from the road and that he actually parked his car first, and then the victim pulled up on his car. He also says that is clearly shown on surveillance video.

If that last sentence is true, then I understand why Alabama isn't suspending him. Not to defend Miller, because I wouldn't be surprised if he knew more than what his attorney is letting on, but how can you kick him off the team if it's reasonable to believe he didn't know? It's pretty common for kids that grew up in tough neighborhoods to carry around a gun for protection, so even if he knew he was bringing Miles his gun it's reasonable to think it was just for protection.

There's no way of knowing for sure how much he knew that night, so for that reason I get why he's still on the team. That said, if I were an NBA team I would hire a handful of the best PIs I could get to look into his history, because I would be very leery about drafting him.

 

[superjohn]

I wouldn't be surprised if he knew more than what his attorney is letting on, but how can you kick him off the team if it's reasonable to believe he didn't know? It's pretty common for kids that grew up in tough neighborhoods to carry around a gun for protection, so even if he knew he was bringing Miles his gun it's reasonable to think it was just for protection.

There's no way of knowing for sure how much he knew that night, so for that reason I get why he's still on the team. That said, if I were an NBA team I would hire a handful of the best PIs I could get to look into his history, because I would be very leery about drafting him.

If he read the text or was told to bring the loaded gun at 1:30 in the morning it's not at all reasonable to think he didn't know something was going down.

We need to stop making excuses for terrible behavior. He's not a little kid, he's 20 years old.

I have no idea what neighborhood he grew up in but I know if he was from a tough neighborhood he made it out of there because of his basketball gifts. He's not in a tough neighborhood now, he's a college student at a major American state University with all the advantages in the world and 10's of millions of dollars awaiting him.

 

[Mister P]

So the pre game introduction pat down was something they did all year. That’s fine and doesn’t bother me.

But, how in the hell do the coaches, the AD and the university not recognize that this routine needed to cease immediately due to the circumstances of the crime ? They all new this was a game routine and was going to happen.

If they say they weren’t thinking about it then that just tells me how out of tune they are or they just don’t care.

 

[Jay-Bone]

I've got to hand it to Miller though, even if he truly didn't know about the gun, scoring 40 first game after being involved in a murder is some true ice water in one's veins.

 

[superjohn]

So the pre game introduction pat down was something they did all year. That’s fine and doesn’t bother me.

But, how in the hell do the coaches, the AD and the university not recognize that this routine needed to cease immediately due to the circumstances of the crime ? They all new this was a game routine and was going to happen.

If they say they weren’t thinking about it then that just tells me how out of tune they are or they just don’t care.

Yes and how in the hell did Brandon Miller not recognize that doing a pat down in light of him bringing a gun to the scene in which that gun was used to kill a young mother is wildly out of line? Maybe he just doesn't care about any of this and didn't want to change up his pregame routine.

 

[T-Squared]

Didn't say move on from the murder. Oats should be fired and Miller should be kicked off the team. The outrage over the pre-game intro is just distracting from the actual crime.

The fact that the pre-game intro actually occurred after the heinous crime, that Miller was involved in the crime, and that Miller was allowed to play in the team’s next game shows that the University of Alabama has no respect for life or the law. As such, the University should be reprimanded at a high degree.

 

[HuskyHawk]

Yes and how in the hell did Brandon Miller not recognize that doing a pat down in light of him bringing a gun to the scene in which that gun was used to kill a young mother is wildly out of line? Maybe he just doesn't care about any of this and didn't want to change up his pregame routine.

Well if what his lawyer says is accurate, he never touched the gun, didn’t know about and may not have even made the connection. Oats needed to stop it, but I get why the kids may not have thought it through.

 

[Jay-Bone]

Yes and how in the hell did Brandon Miller not recognize that doing a pat down in light of him bringing a gun to the scene in which that gun was used to kill a young mother is wildly out of line? Maybe he just doesn't care about any of this and didn't want to change up his pregame routine.

The only thing I can rationalize is that they thought breaking routine would be admission of guilt? Perhaps a terrible PR decision. I just can't even comprehend it being an oversight. Even the walk-on shoulda been like, "Wait a second....." Its almost comical (if not terribly tragic).

 

[superjohn]

Well if what his lawyer says is accurate, he never touched the gun, didn’t know about and may not have even made the connection. Oats needed to stop it, but I get why the kids may not have thought it through.

This is making an excuse for a 20 year old, he's not a 6 year old kid.

 

[CTFAN4LIFE]

So much insensitivity by so many people on this (including some posters on this board). I wonder how many of these people would say these sorts of things when looking into the eyes of the deceased woman's next of kin???

 

[HuskyHawk]

This is making an excuse for a 20 year old, he's not a 6 year old kid.

I don’t believe he asked for or instigated the pat down, his teammates did. Seems the lack of awareness was pretty extensive.

 

[Rico444]

If he read the text or was told to bring the loaded gun at 1:30 in the morning it's not at all reasonable to think he didn't know something was going down.

We need to stop making excuses for terrible behavior. He's not a little kid, he's 20 years old.

I have no idea what neighborhood he grew up in but I know if he was from a tough neighborhood he made it out of there because of his basketball gifts. He's not in a tough neighborhood now, he's a college student at a major American state University with all the advantages in the world and 10's of millions of dollars awaiting him.

I'm not making excuses, I didn't argue that what he did was smart.

 

[Edward Sargent]

This is a statement from Miller's lawyer. It clearly lays out what, at the very least, their story is. He also claims that Miller was not blocking the victim's car from the road and that he actually parked his car first, and then the victim pulled up on his car. He also says that is clearly shown on surveillance video.

If that last sentence is true, then I understand why Alabama isn't suspending him. Not to defend Miller, because I wouldn't be surprised if he knew more than what his attorney is letting on, but how can you kick him off the team if it's reasonable to believe he didn't know? It's pretty common for kids that grew up in tough neighborhoods to carry around a gun for protection, so even if he knew he was bringing Miles his gun it's reasonable to think it was just for protection.

There's no way of knowing for sure how much he knew that night, so for that reason I get why he's still on the team. That said, if I were an NBA team I would hire a handful of the best PIs I could get to look into his history, because I would be very leery about drafting him.

All very nicely packaged by his attorney but eventually a jury will decide

 

[Edward Sargent]

All very nicely packaged by his attorney but eventually a jury will decide

As one of the attorneys!!! One of those dopes better get in that young man’s ear and tell him to show some just a little remorse and the little pat down isn’t that

 

[uconngb]

This is a statement from Miller's lawyer. It clearly lays out what, at the very least, their story is. He also claims that Miller was not blocking the victim's car from the road and that he actually parked his car first, and then the victim pulled up on his car. He also says that is clearly shown on surveillance video.

If that last sentence is true, then I understand why Alabama isn't suspending him. Not to defend Miller, because I wouldn't be surprised if he knew more than what his attorney is letting on, but how can you kick him off the team if it's reasonable to believe he didn't know? It's pretty common for kids that grew up in tough neighborhoods to carry around a gun for protection, so even if he knew he was bringing Miles his gun it's reasonable to think it was just for protection.

There's no way of knowing for sure how much he knew that night, so for that reason I get why he's still on the team. That said, if I were an NBA team I would hire a handful of the best PIs I could get to look into his history, because I would be very leery about drafting him.

I don’t know about anyone else but I read that statement from his lawyer and my conclusion is he 100% knew something was gonna go down. That sounds way too much like “thou doth protest too much” for me.

 

[Husky68]

Starting on January 1, 2023, Alabama will no longer require a permit to carry a concealed handgun on one's person or in a vehicle, which will make the state a permitless or constitutional carry state. Individuals who are not prohibited from possessing a handgun can open or conceal carry without a permit in unrestricted public areas.

 

[Waquoit]

I don't want Oats to get fired. Syracuse would hire him in a second.