Tennessee (merged threads)

[noirwestern]

Is it legal if the players do not play hard and want to lose the game?

I'm an old union guy and this looks and feels for all the world like a work slowdown or perhaps stoppage. Perhaps the young women know nothing will change if they keep limping along and have decided to just blow the whole damn thing up?

 

[noirwestern]

Take over a federal building.

I was thinking more along the lines of a Hostess plant. At least there would be snacks.

 

[toadfoot]

Been looking at the SEC tiebreaker rules for tournament seeding. If Arkansas beats Mississippi (likely) and Tennessee loses to Georgia, Tennessee could officially finish in 10th place in the SEC regular season standings depending upon the order of teams 2-5.

 

[Bayareahusky]

That is ludicrous. Looking at their sched. TENN has had ONE quality win IMO (Oregon St #7). Other than that it's been a disaster. The Strength of schedule argument is a joke. Again are they going to allow 9 SEC teams in the tournament? It seems they would have to, to justify allowing TENN a spot. Hey if they sweep through the SEC Tourney they're in but we all know that's not going to happen.

I thought it was comical when TV tonight included in a list of Tenn's "quality wins" this year..... Syracuse (2 pt win over a 20th ranked team) and Albany..... Oh how the mighty have fallen.... Holly should be like Mark Cuban and manage a Dairy Queen..... no no she would not get that right either......

 

[Plebe]

I thought it was comical when TV tonight included in a list of Tenn's "quality wins" this year..... Syracuse (2 pt win over a 20th ranked team) and Albany..... Oh how the mighty have fallen.... Holly should be like Mark Cuban and manage a Dairy Queen..... no no she would not get that right either.

In fairness, wins over the RPI top 50 and/or over other at-large teams are generally considered quality wins. Tennessee has wins at Oregon State (#7 RPI), over Syracuse (#17, currently projected as a 4-seed), and at Missouri (#29, projected 6-seed). Chattanooga (#50) and Albany (#51) are borderline top-50 wins, but neither would be likely to get an at-large bid (currently projected as 13-seeds). Auburn, though only 60-ish in the RPI, is a bubble team.

That makes one excellent win, two solid quality wins, and three kinda good wins. Of course those are counterbalanced by the four losses to teams outside the RPI top 100.

 

[Bayareahusky]

I guess I am saying I do not agree with the definition of a "quality win"!!!!!!!!

 

[bballnut90]

I really believe the NCAA needs to put greater emphasis on performance leading up to the tournament. Tennessee's win over Oregon State is meaningless at this point in the season. They don't deserve to be a tournament team, and tight wins against them and Syracuse shouldn't get them into the tournament when they lost back to back games against LSU and Alabama. Give the bid to a solid 2nd place mid major school, or a team who is on the upswing rather than a Tennessee team that consistently underperforms and is on an awful downward streak.

 

[jdubct]

At this point, would it be fair to say that at least some of the TN players want to get Holly fired. They should decline an invitation to the WNIT. Whether or not she is replaced after this season, TN should seriously consider not renewing scholarships to certain players who are undermining the program. They could perhaps fill in with JUCO players and proceed, in the longer run, to reestablish itself as a top level program.

 

[Plebe]

I guess I am saying I do not agree with the definition of a "quality win"!!!!!!!!

Well, look at it this way. There are teams in the lower half of the at-large pool that only have one or two top-50 wins and no top-25 wins.

 

[Plebe]

I really believe the NCAA needs to put greater emphasis on performance leading up to the tournament. Tennessee's win over Oregon State is meaningless at this point in the season. They don't deserve to be a tournament team, and tight wins against them and Syracuse shouldn't get them into the tournament when they lost back to back games against LSU and Alabama. Give the bid to a solid 2nd place mid major school, or a team who is on the upswing rather than a Tennessee team that consistently underperforms and is on an awful downward streak.

I understand that impulse, but teams play games in November and December for a reason. That's when almost all nonconference games are played, and the committee has made it clear that it wants teams to challenge themselves in the games they have a say in scheduling. Saying a nonconference win is "meaningless" would fly in the face of that ethos.

 

[Bayareahusky]

At this point, would it be fair to say that at least some of the TN players want to get Holly fired. They should decline an invitation to the WNIT. Whether or not she is replaced after this season, TN should seriously consider not renewing scholarships to certain players who are undermining the program. They could perhaps fill in with JUCO players and proceed, in the longer run, to reestablish itself as a top level program.

Point well taken, but in my opinion, Holly has taken every opportunity to toss these young ladies into the mud to elevate her own status..... she cannot coach.... and although I normally would be pro-coach, Holly has been a blamer all year..... she deserves her fate

 

[UcMiami]

In fairness, wins over the RPI top 50 and/or over other at-large teams are generally considered quality wins. Tennessee has wins at Oregon State (#7 RPI), over Syracuse (#17, currently projected as a 4-seed), and at Missouri (#29, projected 6-seed). Chattanooga (#50) and Albany (#51) are borderline top-50 wins, but neither would be likely to get an at-large bid (currently projected as 13-seeds). Auburn, though only 60-ish in the RPI, is a bubble team.

That makes one excellent win, two solid quality wins, and three kinda good wins. Of course those are counterbalanced by the four losses to teams outside the RPI top 100.

Yup.
And a bunch of their losses are 'good' losses - losses to teams clearly getting into the tournament.
And this is not all being determined in a vacuum either - it all ends up being 'relative' to the other teams at the back end of the at large pool and what their quality wins, quality losses, and bad losses are.

There are 31 at large bids and of those probably the first 25 are pretty obvious - the runners up in a few mid majors (say 3) plus the runners up in the BE and AAC, plus the top 3-4 teams in the P5 conferences that don't win their respective tournaments (say 20 teams)

So that leaves maybe 6 remaining spots that are really debatable among maybe ten teams and none of those ten teams has an unassailable resume - they don't have many if any quality wins against teams already selected for the tournament let alone against ranked teams, and they mostly all have some pretty bad losses. Within that universe even if they lose their last two games TN stands out as having played a lot of 'quality' teams that are already in the tournament and having a few quality wins. Even at 16-14 stacked up against teams with much better records, the quality of those records doesn't bear close scrutiny.

I think a 16-14 TN team would get in, but it would be borderline, a 17-13 team or a 18-13 team which are quite possible is probably assured of getting in. They are a bad team playing terrible basketball with no change in sight, but the evaluation process strongly favors them. I would much rather see a good mid-major get a shot than to see TN stumble into the tournament - but the committee has almost never done that so i don't expect it to this year.

 

[TroyHouse66]

noirwestern
<<...Perhaps the young women ... have decided to just blow the whole damn thing up?>>
*************************************************

"old union guy"
We need to guide them ... they need to organize as a class, seize the machinery of production, and carry on when the employer class (UT, SEC, & NCAA) shall have been overthrown.
"One Big Union guy"
(www.iww.org)

 

[DaddyChoc]

I went looking for the boxscore on ESPN.com... I had to change my "dropdown" menu from Top 25 to "NCAA Division 1" to find it, thats funny!

 

[HardHatGuy#2]

I take no joy in this. It was fun for a bit, but now it is bully-on-the-playground time. I will not join the Cartmans of the world, dancing and singing Kumbaya around the tire fire.

I take joy in memories of Rizzotti pounding a dribble to fake out the defender on her way to a back-breaking layup, Shoeblocker completely dominating the lane, getting 9 (really 10) blocks, Taurasi hop-skipping through the core of the defense to score, or raining another three down to tear the hearts out of the defense, all while on the Biggest Stage Ever. Those were things to be celebrated.

This is Schadenfreude, which is something that I try to avoid. As they say, Karma is a B!+©h.

 

[Plebe]

I take no joy in this. It was fun for a bit, but now it is bully-on-the-playground time. I will not join the Cartmans of the world, dancing and singing Kumbaya around the tire fire.

This is Schadenfreude, which is something that I try to avoid. As they say, Karma is a B!+©h.

I agree. I must admit I enjoyed seeing the late-game collapses in close games against the likes of Mississippi State and Texas A&M. But those were road games against teams that are actually pretty good. To see them give the game away in mind-boggling fashion in Baton Rouge, followed by a game against Alabama in which they trailed virtually the entire game — against two teams far removed from the RPI top 100 — it's just too much. Holly's postgame presser after the LSU loss was excruciating.

 

[Wbbfan1]

I'm actually Stunned the Lady Vols lost to Bama last night. Both the LSU and Bama loss are to teams with inferior talent and neither team has a player that went off for 30+ points to explain/understand the losses. This is a superior talented team losing to teams that the players themselves should have found a way to win both of them. Their inner pride/motivation should have kicked in, especially the Bama game and said we're not losing again to a team with much lessor talent. Instead of the Lady Vols Coaches and players instead of digging themselves out of the hole, they're going deeper.

Sunday is Senior Day for the Lady Vols. Final Game of the Regular Season and probably 10k+ in attendance. The players should be able for one game pull themselves together to win one for Basahara Graves and Nia Moore. Shouldn't be looking for the bench for motivation, it should be within themselves. Now Georgia is a better team then both Bama and LSU and they might still lose, but they shouldn't.

 

[HuskyNan]

Charlie's on drugs. Won't happen.

It's not that Tennessee deserves to be in the tournament; it's that there aren't enough teams that are better than Tennessee. Beyond a handful of good teams and another few well-coached but low talent teams, most of women's college basketball is dreadful.

 

[divots]

http://www.utsports.com/video/?yBOh0p0Ae6w

Your heart has to go out to see Andraya Carter and Bashaara Graves respond to the media after yet another painful loss especially after watching their coach in her presser talk about players' missed shots and missed opportunities the reason that Tennessee lost.......sad...........

http://www.utsports.com/video/?n0NXNbDYM4A

 

[Vowelguy]

Teams with records of 19-11, 19-12, 18-12, 17-13, 17-13 all received at-large bids to last year's tournament.

 

[Plebe]

http://www.utsports.com/video/?yBOh0p0Ae6w

Your heart has to go out to see Andraya Carter and Bashaara Graves respond to the media after yet another painful loss especially after watching their coach in her presser talk about players' missed shots and missed opportunities the reason that Tennessee lost..sad......

http://www.utsports.com/video/?n0NXNbDYM4A

Mine sure does. Graves was extremely promising as a freshman, already then a rebounding phenomenon. Like many other LV players of recent years, though, she seemed to plateau by her sophomore year. It's gotta kill her to be having this kind of a senior year. Carter was actually more articulate and expressive than Holly about how the team has underachieved and how they need to respond. These are good kids in a bad situation.

 

[cabbie191]

13 turnovers vs. 8 assists! 26% FG%!

That's actually an improvement on the turnovers - they have averaged a bit over 19 for the season IIRC.

 

[meyers7]

This is Alabama..... Even a blind squirrel should find a nut..... sad state of affairs..... and I do feel badly for the players.

No way, they chose TN. They made their bed. Let 'em lie in it.

 

[meyers7]

Dumpster fire for this is a compliment!

 

[PacoSwede]

.. Carter was actually more articulate and expressive than Holly about how the team has underachieved and how they need to respond. ...

Yeah, I was extremely impressed with Carter's demeanor and thoughtfulness. I think she should be signed up by ESPN, or at least get a tryout, if she has any interest.