Tennessee 2025, part 2

[Scoe]

7 losses in last 9 games how is Tenessse ranked you cannot tell me there’s no SEC bias in these polls. Nova should be ranked as well as their men’s team.

 

[LwrcasefaN]

7 losses in last 9 games how is Tenessse ranked you cannot tell me there’s no SEC bias in these polls. Nova should be ranked as well as their men’s team.

There’s not even an 8 loss team in the top 25 and TN is the sole 9 loss team. TN did have a 10 loss team that won a natty. I think.

 

[Scoe]

There’s not even an 8 loss team in the top 25 and TN is the sole 9 loss team. TN did have a 10 loss team that won a natty. I think.

But but but they played UConn and SC lol. If a ranked BE team was in the top 25 and lost 7 of 9 do they even sniff the receiving votes category.

 

[Iluvacc2]

View attachment 117250

Wow, there’s a good chance they finish the regular season on a 6 game losing streak.

 

[WBBTakeover]

Ouch. NGL, three teams in four years, and now this, is concerning.

They (Tennessee coaches) knew about Janiah (her reputation precedes her) but decided that recruiting stats and landing big names were more important.

 

[BRS24]

They (Tennessee coaches) knew about Janiah (her reputation precedes her) but decided that recruiting stats and landing big names were more important.

In various mock drafts, she's listed at 12, 15, however, there's a lot of noise right now.

 

[WBBTakeover]

In various mock drafts, she's listed at 12, 15, however, there's a lot of noise right now.

Talent was never her issue. She's volatile and a HOFer in her own mind.

 

[Iluvacc2]

Talent was never her issue. She's volatile and a HOFer in her own mind.

To me, she’s a prime example of the portal needing restrictions. One time is fine, but anything after should be a required one year sit out.

 

[WBBTakeover]

To me, she’s a prime example of the portal needing restrictions. One time is fine, but anything after should be a required one year sit out.

I agree 100%

 

[JeannoCT]

When you’re on your third school in 4 years, there’s a problem. And the problem is you.

 

[packwrap]

Wow, there’s a good chance they finish the regular season on a 6 game losing streak.

7 losses in last 9 games how is Tenessse ranked you cannot tell me there’s no SEC bias in these polls. Nova should be ranked as well as their men’s team.

You will be happy there is a new Poll tomorrow. 😁

Vols will only be in the bottom section, Dropped from Poll.

 

[TheGOAT23]

Hey @stwainfan - what's your guess on last three games of OK, LSU, VU ? 1, 2, or 3 wins?

You will probably not get a response. I was told that they only post or respond when Tennessee wins.

 

[Baller29]

How is TN feeling about the LSU game on road Thursday?

I wonder if Janiah will play. She has been very vocal about not liking LSU at all going back to her days at A&M

 

[msf22b]

I’ve watched the last three games (with a jaundiced eye) in an attempt
to decipher the workings of UTenn’s offensive sets (other than the line changes)
and have come to the conclusion that (essentially) there aren’t any.

There is absolutely no mid-range game; zero, zip.

-it’s either: force your way in for a layup and/or if you get the rebound, repeat the
former instruction…or
-If that doesn’t work, chuck a 3 (from the corner, preferably).

That’s it; 95 % of their shots

Who needs coaches? I could tell them that.

 

[USMC(ret)]

The obvious solution is for Tennessee to money-whip Kara Lawson into returning to her alma mater. That begs the question: would she leave Duke, a program she built, a great brand, to come “ home” and fix the dumpster fire that the Volunteers currently are?
My guess? No. She has Duke on a great trajectory, and the path to the top of the conference in the SEC is much steeper than the ACC. Any coach at Tennessee will forever be in Pat’s shadow. Kara doesn’t have that problem at Duke.

 

[Geew1992]

The obvious solution is for Tennessee to money-whip Kara Lawson into returning to her alma mater. That begs the question: would she leave Duke, a program she built, a great brand, to come “ home” and fix the dumpster fire that the Volunteers currently are?
My guess? No. She has Duke on a great trajectory, and the path to the top of the conference in the SEC is much steeper than the ACC. Any coach at Tennessee will forever be in Pat’s shadow. Kara doesn’t have that problem at Duke.

I would say no but..

Per volnation… something happened between her and the board that has ruined the relationship.

Volnation also believes they can get any coach including mulkey or dawn. So maybe they throw money at them

 

[USMC(ret)]

I would say no but..

Per volnation… something happened between her and the board that has ruined the relationship.

Volnation also believes they can get any coach including mulkey or dawn. So maybe they throw money at them

Mulkey or Staley? That’s delusional. Mulkey is a Louisiana native. She’s home. Staley became a legend at South Carolina. She’s adored in Columbia. They built a statue of her… you don’t leave a place like that.

I think Lawson will some day take her place among the WBB coaching greats. She can recruit. She has charisma. She’s a very good fit at an institution like Duke.

 

[Geew1992]

I’ve watched the last three games (with a jaundiced eye) in an attempt
to decipher the workings of UTenn’s offensive sets (other than the line changes)
and have come to the conclusion that (essentially) there aren’t any.

There is absolutely no mid-range game; zero, zip.

-it’s either: force your way in for a layup and/or if you get the rebound, repeat the
former instruction…or
-If that doesn’t work, chuck a 3 (from the corner, preferably).

That’s it; 95 % of their shots

Who needs coaches? I could tell them that.

Well…. Some on Volnation believe Edward’s will come in and turn the program around. “Shes better than most post players in college right now”.

 

[WBBTakeover]

The obvious solution is for Tennessee to money-whip Kara Lawson into returning to her alma mater. That begs the question: would she leave Duke, a program she built, a great brand, to come “ home” and fix the dumpster fire that the Volunteers currently are?
My guess? No. She has Duke on a great trajectory, and the path to the top of the conference in the SEC is much steeper than the ACC. Any coach at Tennessee will forever be in Pat’s shadow. Kara doesn’t have that problem at Duke.

There's a tinge of "the expectations at Duke aren't the same as they are for Tennessee", which I don't believe is accurate. In fact, I know that it's not accurate.

Kara has done a fantastic job of building Duke back to national prominence*, but what people seem to forget is that Duke had a reputation for her to restore. With that reputation comes expectations. Gail Goestenkors, hands down the best coach in the history of the program, took Duke to two national championship games (1999 vs Purdue and 2006 vs Maryland) and lost them both. That second loss, in particular, accelerated her departure from the program (much of that wasn't her fault, but that's a story for a different day). The expectation was clear--national championship or bust. When Gail couldn't deliver, she was effectively let go (by a clown of an AD). Her successor (the repugnant Joanne McCallie) was good enough to continue to grab elite talent and get Duke to multiple Elite 8s but failed to deliver on a Final 4. Then, her scumbag actions led to the program cratering to the state that it was before Kara arrived.

I say all that to say that the expectations for Kara at Duke are the same as they would be for her if she goes to Tennessee. There are two questions that she'd have to answer in order to choose between Duke and Tennessee. First, what's the best path year in and year out to a #1 seed--the ACC way (where you may have to win at least a share of the ACC regular season AND the conference tournament every season) or the SEC way (where you could get one without having to win either)? Second, what are the resources that I need to get the players that I need to compete with the top of the SEC, top of the B1G, and UConn? Do I need to be in the SEC to get them or can I get them as the head coach of Duke? You yourself said that the path to the top of the ACC isn't as steep as it is in the SEC, so what happens if/when some of those young coaches at Clemson (which has a nice supply of NIL money), Virginia Tech (which is building back football--a move that will help the entire athletic department), UVA (Mr. Reddit, among others, has infused the program with cash so that they can buy players), etc. start putting it together and catch up to Kara's Duke teams? Keep in mind that Jeff Walz isn't going anywhere.

If Tennessee comes calling, Kara better think long and hard about accepting. And if she does, Duke will be fine as long as we can lure back Lindsey Harding.

*I would argue that while Duke is only back in the sense that the team is highly ranked again, Duke, as a dominant force in WCBB, is still not back. We don't have consensus All-Americans and strong NPOY candidates. We haven't made the Final 4 since 2006 (meanwhile, Notre Dame and Louisville have been several times, NC State and Virginia Tech and even Syracuse have been to one). We haven't had a first round WNBA draft pick in forever (no, Azura Stevens doesn't count for us, unfortunately). To truly bring Duke back, Kara's going to have to deliver on all of that. Given how tough the SEC is and how many resources available to the teams at the top of that conference, I'm not so sure that she can.

 

[USMC(ret)]

There's a tinge of "the expectations at Duke aren't the same as they are for Tennessee", which I don't believe is accurate. In fact, I know that it's not accurate.

Kara has done a fantastic job of building Duke back to national prominence*, but what people seem to forget is that Duke had a reputation for her to restore. With that reputation comes expectations. Gail Goestenkors, hands down the best coach in the history of the program, took Duke to two national championship games (1999 vs Purdue and 2006 vs Maryland) and lost them both. That second loss, in particular, accelerated her departure from the program (much of that wasn't her fault, but that's a story for a different day). The expectation was clear--national championship or bust. When Gail couldn't deliver, she was effectively let go (by a clown of an AD). Her successor (the repugnant Joanne McCallie) was good enough to continue to grab elite talent and get Duke to multiple Elite 8s but failed to deliver on a Final 4. Then, her scumbag actions led to the program cratering to the state that it was before Kara arrived.

I say all that to say that the expectations for Kara at Duke are the same as they would be for her if she goes to Tennessee. There are two questions that she'd have to answer in order to choose between Duke and Tennessee. First, what's the best path year in and year out to a #1 seed--the ACC way (where you may have to win at least a share of the ACC regular season AND the conference tournament every season) or the SEC way (where you could get one without having to win either)? Second, what are the resources that I need to get the players that I need to compete with the top of the SEC, top of the B1G, and UConn? Do I need to be in the SEC to get them or can I get them as the head coach of Duke? You yourself said that the path to the top of the ACC isn't as steep as it is in the SEC, so what happens if/when some of those young coaches at Clemson (which has a nice supply of NIL money), Virginia Tech (which is building back football--a move that will help the entire athletic department), UVA (Mr. Reddit, among others, has infused the program with cash so that they can buy players), etc. start putting it together and catch up to Kara's Duke teams? Keep in mind that Jeff Walz isn't going anywhere.

If Tennessee comes calling, Kara better think long and hard about accepting. And if she does, Duke will be fine as long as we can lure back Lindsey Harding.

*I would argue that while Duke is only back in the sense that the team is highly ranked again, Duke, as a dominant force in WCBB, is still not back. We don't have consensus All-Americans and strong NPOY candidates. We haven't made the Final 4 since 2006 (meanwhile, Notre Dame and Louisville have been several times, NC State and Virginia Tech and even Syracuse have been to one). We haven't had a first round WNBA draft pick in forever (no, Azura Stevens doesn't count for us, unfortunately). To truly bring Duke back, Kara's going to have to deliver on all of that. Given how tough the SEC is and how many resources available to the teams at the top of that conference, I'm not so sure that she can.

A couple of things: I remember Gail G and her success at Duke, but I thought that Texas lured her away from Durham for more money and resources (things didn’t pan out for her there, and she withdrew from the public eye after that).
Second, Kara will attracted a certain type of player in the same way that Geno and Dawn recruit. They want players willing to be coached, who will play within a system, and who will commit to going to class (Dawn tells prospective parents that their daughter WILL graduate). Geno and Dawn guarantee nothing but opportunity. And some players can see the value in that… and some can’t and go elsewhere… several times.
Gotta admit, I’m a Kara fan. Love her “Handle hard better” speech… speaks to her own philosophy of life and coaching. Duke’s an incredible brand, and she appreciates being part of that brand.

 

[JeannoCT]

Well…. Some on Volnation believe Edward’s will come in and turn the program around. “Shes better than most post players in college right now”.

she can't turn it around by herself! Every recruit/portal player that comes to TN is close to the greatest ever. So even tho a player is ranked 50+, that's wrong and they should be top 20. They are proven wrong almost every time.

 

[Vowelguy]

Lawson lobbied for the TN job after Warlick, and was turned down hard. I think
It was ugly.

GG went to Texas yea for money but in part because she had a bad relationship with the new Duke AD. I think she would’ve been forced out had she not left. He wanted someone to take them to a NC. @CamrnCrz1974 can give the fuller stiry

 

[WBBTakeover]

A couple of things: I remember Gail G and her success at Duke, but I thought that Texas lured her away from Durham for more money and resources (things didn’t pan out for her there, and she withdrew from the public eye after that).

That's the bare bones of it, but there's a whole lot more to the story than that (it's not appropriate for this forum, so I'll stop here).

Second, Kara will attracted a certain type of player in the same way that Geno and Dawn recruit. They want players willing to be coached, who will play within a system, and who will commit to going to class (Dawn tells prospective parents that their daughter WILL graduate). Geno and Dawn guarantee nothing but opportunity. And some players can see the value in that… and some can’t and go elsewhere… several times.

That's all fine and dandy, but I want results--banners and rings. Geno has them. Dawn has them. Kara isn't going to get her full due (at least from me) until she gets them. And if she never does, then I, as someone who has followed Duke WBB for a long time, cannot give Kara her full due. I know where the program has been and where it needs to go before I can put her up there with Gail. She may have all the right intentions, but results matter in the end. I don't know if she can get it done at Duke because it'll be harder to win here when you have the SEC positioned to dominate the sport for years to come.

And it's not just women's basketball. I say the same things about Marissa Young (except that all of Duke's softball history is attributed to her).

Gotta admit, I’m a Kara fan. Love her “Handle hard better” speech… speaks to her own philosophy of life and coaching. Duke’s an incredible brand, and she appreciates being part of that brand.

And that's fine. She's eloquent in her speech and her words resonate with plenty of people. Unlike McCallie, I'm not embarrassed for her to be a representative of the university. But she's going to have to prove that she can take a team to multiple Final 4s (and pull off a NC win) to be considered one of the best in the business. Whether that happens at Duke or with another program (Tennessee) remains to be seen. I'd love for it to happen at Duke, but I'm not sure that the resources are there for that to happen. If she was at Tennessee and had the resources that Danny White (who is, interestingly enough, the son of one of our former ADs) gives their current coach, she'd be set.

Edit: Is there a problem, @YKCornelius?

 

[JeannoCT]

Lawson lobbied for the TN job after Warlick, and was turned down hard. I think
It was ugly.

GG went to Texas yea for money but in part because she had a bad relationship with the new Duke AD. I think she would’ve been forced out had she not left. He wanted someone to take them to a NC. @CamrnCrz1974 can give the fuller stiry

I believe she resigned from the UT Board of Trustees due to lack of diversity in the Athletic Department Leadership.

 

[bballnut90]

There's a tinge of "the expectations at Duke aren't the same as they are for Tennessee", which I don't believe is accurate. In fact, I know that it's not accurate.

Kara has done a fantastic job of building Duke back to national prominence*, but what people seem to forget is that Duke had a reputation for her to restore. With that reputation comes expectations. Gail Goestenkors, hands down the best coach in the history of the program, took Duke to two national championship games (1999 vs Purdue and 2006 vs Maryland) and lost them both. That second loss, in particular, accelerated her departure from the program (much of that wasn't her fault, but that's a story for a different day). The expectation was clear--national championship or bust. When Gail couldn't deliver, she was effectively let go (by a clown of an AD). Her successor (the repugnant Joanne McCallie) was good enough to continue to grab elite talent and get Duke to multiple Elite 8s but failed to deliver on a Final 4. Then, her scumbag actions led to the program cratering to the state that it was before Kara arrived.

I say all that to say that the expectations for Kara at Duke are the same as they would be for her if she goes to Tennessee. There are two questions that she'd have to answer in order to choose between Duke and Tennessee. First, what's the best path year in and year out to a #1 seed--the ACC way (where you may have to win at least a share of the ACC regular season AND the conference tournament every season) or the SEC way (where you could get one without having to win either)? Second, what are the resources that I need to get the players that I need to compete with the top of the SEC, top of the B1G, and UConn? Do I need to be in the SEC to get them or can I get them as the head coach of Duke? You yourself said that the path to the top of the ACC isn't as steep as it is in the SEC, so what happens if/when some of those young coaches at Clemson (which has a nice supply of NIL money), Virginia Tech (which is building back football--a move that will help the entire athletic department), UVA (Mr. Reddit, among others, has infused the program with cash so that they can buy players), etc. start putting it together and catch up to Kara's Duke teams? Keep in mind that Jeff Walz isn't going anywhere.

If Tennessee comes calling, Kara better think long and hard about accepting. And if she does, Duke will be fine as long as we can lure back Lindsey Harding.

*I would argue that while Duke is only back in the sense that the team is highly ranked again, Duke, as a dominant force in WCBB, is still not back. We don't have consensus All-Americans and strong NPOY candidates. We haven't made the Final 4 since 2006 (meanwhile, Notre Dame and Louisville have been several times, NC State and Virginia Tech and even Syracuse have been to one). We haven't had a first round WNBA draft pick in forever (no, Azura Stevens doesn't count for us, unfortunately). To truly bring Duke back, Kara's going to have to deliver on all of that. Given how tough the SEC is and how many resources available to the teams at the top of that conference, I'm not so sure that she can.

Title or bust is a steep expectation for a program that hasn’t ever won a title, let alone made a Final Four in 20 years. The level of history and expectations is far different at a program like Tennessee compared to Duke, I don’t think it’s fair to equate the two. Tennessee has one of the strongest and most demanding fan bases in the country and the pressure is on quickly if you can’t get results from the get go. The level of expectation just isn’t the same in Durham and it makes the job a heck of a lot more desirable IMO.

Kara’s done a tremendous job at Duke and I’d be shocked if she left. Didn’t have a great experience applying for the Tennessee gig and I’m sure she sees firsthand how difficult the job is.

She’s turned Duke around and is recruiting extremely well. Lots of parallels between her and what Shea is doing at Vanderbilt. Duke won the ACC Tournament last year and came a bucket away from a Final Four. This year they’ve had a remarkable turnaround and will likely win the ACC regular season. Going forward they are positioned to be a top 5-10 team for years to come with lots of young talent in the pipeline, even without SEC level funding.