Teams/programs with something to prove this season

[doggydaddy]

A lot of talk about Burdick here...I saw her play a lot last season.

Towards the end of the season, she really found a groove n the court. I could tell she was much more comfortable in her role. She is a very skilled passer and can play very well in the high low game.

She will still be behind Spani at the three. She could start at the four, perhaps with freshman graves at the five.

Burdick could average double digit scoring, but she will have to improve defensively. Holly is going to want to play a fast run and gun style. If Burdick can keep up with that style, she will log substantial minutes and will score some points.

Tennessee is televised quite a bit, and I would disagree about Burdick and her finding a groove towards the end for the year. And certainly her stats in her last 12 games don't prove that out.

10 mins, 2 points, 5 rebounds
26 mins, 10 points, 7 rebounds
18 mins,10 points, 6 rebounds
22 mins, 4 points, 3 rebounds
12 mins,6 points,3 rebounds
15 mins, 4 points, 2 rebounds
7 mins,5 points,2 rebounds
9 mins,4 points,1 rebounds
15 mins,0 points,2 rebounds
8 mins,2 points,4 rebounds
5 mins,0 points,2 rebounds
3 mins,0 points,1 rebounds

She had 2 "groove" games in her last 12 with double digit scoring and over those 12 games she averaged 12.5 minutes, 3.9 points, and 3.1 rebounds.

Maybe extended minutes will allow her to find a groove and play to her potential.

 

[doggydaddy]

You have the patience of Job. Nothing wrong with being optimistic about your team.

I agree, but overly optimistic statements like Stainfan about UT on a UConn board are usually challenged.

Heck, we challenge overly optimistic statements about UConn...lol.

 

[doggydaddy]

Stwain - I like you attitude and agree that all fans of great programs expect a FF and a NC every year.

So, did you really expect a FF and NC when Bird, Jones, Williams and Cash graduated?

 

[stwainfan]

I still think it is going to be a huge shift for the program - Pat was so dominant nationally, but also specific to UT and the UT athletic department. Holly will not have that clout/support. And yes I know Pat is still connected, but at sort of an arm's length. It is not going to be easy for Holly this year and I do hope that the fans stay positive even if things do not go as smoothly as they hope.

It's not easy to take over for a legend. Pat was there for workouts just like she has always been. I listened to some interviews and one thing stood out to me. It was about Simmons the word Mature.

 

[HuskyMJ]

It's crazy to read some of this at times. What's defined as good enough? Duke has been very good, won several ACC titles and featured multiple pro players on seemingly every team. They've been one step short of a final four. The Blue Devils have replenished their roster with top level talent. Maryland has been to the Elite 8 four of the last seven seasons, won 2 ACC Tournaments and an ACC regular season title. They too turned over their roster and have managed to again be a Top 5-10 team. Notre Dame would've won it all last year if there wasn't a 6-8, genetic freak playing for Baylor. Not to mention Baylor committed hundreds of recruiting violations (apparently all worthy it) and are dancing in the street with the crown jewels despite being caught cheating.

Programs that probably thought they'd do better than they have in recent seasons- Rutgers, North Carolina, Virginia come to mind. Louisville actually has what was considered elite talent in Schimmel and Smith in the backcourt (both were Top 10). Asia Taylor was Top 20 on the All Star Girls Report. Sharrone Vails was considered a top 30 from what I remember. Sara Hammond was highly regarded (as we know).

Overall, the pool of truly elite players is so shallow that when they all repeatedly go to the same few schools, it doesn't leave a lot for other programs. Many of the coaches have done terrific jobs with what they have to coach.

I agree with everything you just said. The OP listed teams and I only somewhat agreed with one-LSU. None of the others have something to prove they were very successful and could be next year but even if they aren't so what? If you make sweet 16, elite 8 final 4 any of those you had a fantastic season. Teams with something to prove are those that just did not do well or coach who could be gone soon. LSU lost in 2nd round but they have a new coach and still need time to build a program. My list:

Alabama- last place in SEC I don't know if they are on hot seat but it could be possible
Most of the PAC 10 not many teams got bids to the tournament and the talent level is not as high as years past.
I guess any team going to a new conference because that will shake things up
Pitt, Seton Hall, Marquette all struggled last year and have something to prove.
NC State, their coach was rumored to move up for some big name jobs but she has not won a lot yet at State.

These are teams that really need to prove something. Saying Notre Dame has something to prove is just not accurate. they want to win like every other good program but so what if they don't?

 

[HuskyMJ]

I forgot to add UNC they did not make the tournament and had a lot of talent. Virginia did not make the tournament and had some really nice pieces. Florida was on the bubble made the tournament but if they want to make the next step you could add them.

 

[doggydaddy]

It's not easy to take over for a legend. Pat was there for workouts just like she has always been. I listened to some interviews and one thing stood out to me. It was about Simmons the word Mature.

Until she gets the ball in her hand.

 

[UcMiami]

Until she gets the ball in her hand.

You are a bad doggy! Bad, Bad!

 

[alexrgct]

I agree with everything you just said. The OP listed teams and I only somewhat agreed with one-LSU. None of the others have something to prove they were very successful and could be next year but even if they aren't so what? If you make sweet 16, elite 8 final 4 any of those you had a fantastic season. Teams with something to prove are those that just did not do well or coach who could be gone soon. LSU lost in 2nd round but they have a new coach and still need time to build a program. My list:

Alabama- last place in SEC I don't know if they are on hot seat but it could be possible
Most of the PAC 10 not many teams got bids to the tournament and the talent level is not as high as years past.
I guess any team going to a new conference because that will shake things up
Pitt, Seton Hall, Marquette all struggled last year and have something to prove.
NC State, their coach was rumored to move up for some big name jobs but she has not won a lot yet at State.

These are teams that really need to prove something. Saying Notre Dame has something to prove is just not accurate. they want to win like every other good program but so what if they don't?

Again, "something to prove" is relative. Nikki Caldwell has something to prove because she makes 900K a year and is a hot name without a ton of tangible production. Tennessee is in a transition year with a million questions, with, empirically, expectations among the fanbase that they won't miss a beat. They could have a season that 98% of the programs in WCBB would be happy with, and it would raise questions because they are Tennessee. Kentucky is having a run of success- can they prove they are comfortable being the hunted. Notre Dame just finished a great two year run- are they ready to take the next step and be a perennial power as opposed to a sporadic one? Is Maryland a one-hit wonder or a team capable of contending on a regular basis? I bet Brenda sells recruits on the notion they can win championships at UMD. And Duke- can they prove they are legit contenders under Coach P? They took half a step back from Gail's heyday. Two of our regular Duke fan contributors "liked" my OP, so I guess they didn't take particular umbrage with that position.

Relativity- it's critical here. If UConn made the Sweet 16, or even the Final Four with the roster the Huskies have this year, hell no it's not a great season. If Duke or Maryland make the F4, they will have proved something. If Kentucky or Louisville make the Final Four, that would be a tremendous result. I tried to document what specifically each team I listed had to prove, and they were very different. And if they don't prove it, so what? So, they're open to criticism.

 

[HuskyMJ]

Again, "something to prove" is relative. Nikki Caldwell has something to prove because she makes 900K a year and is a hot name without a ton of tangible production. Tennessee is in a transition year with a million questions, with, empirically, expectations among the fanbase that they won't miss a beat. They could have a season that 98% of the programs in WCBB would be happy with, and it would raise questions because they are Tennessee. Kentucky is having a run of success- can they prove they are comfortable being the hunted. Notre Dame just finished a great two year run- are they ready to take the next step and be a perennial power as opposed to a sporadic one? Is Maryland a one-hit wonder or a team capable of contending on a regular basis? I bet Brenda sells recruits on the notion they can win championships at UMD. And Duke- can they prove they are legit contenders under Coach P? They took half a step back from Gail's heyday. Two of our regular Duke fan contributors "liked" my OP, so I guess they didn't take particular umbrage with that position.

Relativity- it's critical here. If UConn made the Sweet 16, or even the Final Four with the roster the Huskies have this year, hell no it's not a great season. If Duke or Maryland make the F4, they will have proved something. If Kentucky or Louisville make the Final Four, that would be a tremendous result. I tried to document what specifically each team I listed had to prove, and they were very different. And if they don't prove it, so what? So, they're open to criticism.

No problem and you should have replied to the posted I quoted since I basically agreed with that poster but then rambled on. He or she did a better job summing up their opinion which I just said Ia gree with them "Outside Shot" was the poster.

 

[tennfanatic00]

Tennessee is televised quite a bit, and I would disagree about Burdick and her finding a groove towards the end for the year. And certainly her stats in her last 12 games don't prove that out.

10 mins, 2 points, 5 rebounds
26 mins, 10 points, 7 rebounds
18 mins,10 points, 6 rebounds
22 mins, 4 points, 3 rebounds
12 mins,6 points,3 rebounds
15 mins, 4 points, 2 rebounds
7 mins,5 points,2 rebounds
9 mins,4 points,1 rebounds
15 mins,0 points,2 rebounds
8 mins,2 points,4 rebounds
5 mins,0 points,2 rebounds
3 mins,0 points,1 rebounds

She had 2 "groove" games in her last 12 with double digit scoring and over those 12 games she averaged 12.5 minutes, 3.9 points, and 3.1 rebounds.

Maybe extended minutes will allow her to find a groove and play to her potential.

I came away very impressed with her when watching her at the SEC tournament. I don't have those stats offhand, but she was much more comfortable on the court.

She's a distributer and a heady player with a consistent mid range jumper. I don't ever think she'll be First Team AA or anything, but she's a very valuable asset to the team.

 

[doggydaddy]

I came away very impressed with her when watching her at the SEC tournament. I don't have those stats offhand, but she was much more comfortable on the court.

She's a distributer and a heady player with a consistent mid range jumper. I don't ever think she'll be First Team AA or anything, but she's a very valuable asset to the team.

Stats don't say everything, but these were the 3 SEC tourney games.

15 mins, 4 points, 2 rebounds, 2-2 from the field, 0 assists, 2 TO's.
7 mins,5 points,2 rebounds, 1-2 from the field, 0 assists, 1 TO's.
9 mins,4 points,1 rebounds, 2-3 from the field, 0 assists, 0 TO's.

Good shooting. That's about it. Very impressed? You are easily impressed. Distributer? No assists?

 

[tennfanatic00]

Stats don't say everything, but these were the 3 SEC tourney games.

15 mins, 4 points, 2 rebounds, 2-2 from the field, 0 assists, 2 TO's.
7 mins,5 points,2 rebounds, 1-2 from the field, 0 assists, 1 TO's.
9 mins,4 points,1 rebounds, 2-3 from the field, 0 assists, 0 TO's.

Good shooting. That's about it. Very impressed? You are easily impressed. Distributer? No assists?

You're correct, stats do not say everything.

Rather than keep this going back and forth, let's just agree to disagree here.
I've seen a lot of her and think she's a player, you're not convinced and have seen not much of her. We'll fix that this year.

Obviously her playing time will go up significantly this year, so it's put up or shut up time.

 

[Coler]

I don't agree with the Louisville overachieved argument. I think they had/have a roster as "talented" or more so than most. Last year's team had:
G Schimmel- Top 10 recruit by ESPN
G Smith- Top 5 recruit by ESPN
G/F Hammond- Top 15 recruit by ESPN
F Vails- Top 20 recruit by All Star Girls Report
F Taylor- Top 20 recruit by All Star Girls Report

How many other schools, not named UConn, Tenn or Duke could claim 5 recruits of that status? I just don't buy that Louisville overachieved. Did they lose players to injury? Yes. However, their roster was stacked!

Rutgers can.

G Canty- Top 10 recruit by ESPN
G/F Laney- Top 20 recruit by ESPN
G Richardson- Top 20 recruit by ESPN
F/C Oliver- Top 10 recruit by ESPN
C Hollivay- Top 10 recruit by ESPN
G/F Copper- Top 20 recruit by ESPN

 

[VAMike23]

Rutgers can.

G Canty- Top 10 recruit by ESPN
G/F Laney- Top 20 recruit by ESPN
G Richardson- Top 20 recruit by ESPN
F/C Oliver- Top 10 recruit by ESPN
C Hollivay- Top 10 recruit by ESPN
G/F Copper- Top 20 recruit by ESPN

I thought that Laney was Top 10, or close to it?

 

[DobbsRover2]

Again, "something to prove" is relative. Nikki Caldwell has something to prove because she makes 900K a year and is a hot name without a ton of tangible production. Tennessee is in a transition year with a million questions, with, empirically, expectations among the fanbase that they won't miss a beat. They could have a season that 98% of the programs in WCBB would be happy with, and it would raise questions because they are Tennessee. Kentucky is having a run of success- can they prove they are comfortable being the hunted. Notre Dame just finished a great two year run- are they ready to take the next step and be a perennial power as opposed to a sporadic one? Is Maryland a one-hit wonder or a team capable of contending on a regular basis? I bet Brenda sells recruits on the notion they can win championships at UMD. And Duke- can they prove they are legit contenders under Coach P? They took half a step back from Gail's heyday. Two of our regular Duke fan contributors "liked" my OP, so I guess they didn't take particular umbrage with that position.

Relativity- it's critical here. If UConn made the Sweet 16, or even the Final Four with the roster the Huskies have this year, hell no it's not a great season. If Duke or Maryland make the F4, they will have proved something. If Kentucky or Louisville make the Final Four, that would be a tremendous result. I tried to document what specifically each team I listed had to prove, and they were very different. And if they don't prove it, so what? So, they're open to criticism.

Relativity is indeed the essence of all, and for those who seem to actually find some divine order from the flights of birds, spots on sheep livers, and preseason rankings, here is the standings for the flops and upward flips based on last year's preseason rankings. We tend to forget about what was expected back in October of every year, but there is a record that nasty people like me can refer to as far as the "official" line about how teams are going to do. But for me a team has to miss its expected season's destiny by 2 places to be a genuine flop. And I'll also admit that all is relative in rankings, so the difference between Purdue which was ranked #16 in the AP poll and KY at #17 is big, making the Boilermakers a minor disappointment (but not a flop) and the Wildcats a raging success because of the NCAAs boundary line. But again, for those who take the 2012-13 preseason ranking seriously, this is the post-mortem on last year's duds and dynamos.

• Duds (teams that were 2 slots or worse in NCAA performance than predicted): Miami(FL), Rutgers, UNC, FSU, UCLA, USC, Texas Tech
• Dynamos (teams that were 2 slots or better in NCAA performance than predicted): St. Bonaventure (a NY team), Kansas, South Carolina (all three at +2+ since none were in top 50 preseason but made the Sweet 16), and KY, which was not a dynamo in ESPN\USA (which expected more) but was by AP.

So yeah, CViv and Hatchell and a host of others need to start packing the satchel, but if you're a St. Bonny coach, your red carpet awaits. And let me also put in a plug for another NY team that always overachieves, but last year by only +1: "Here are the Foxes" (aka Marist)

 

[Coler]

I thought that Laney was Top 10, or close to it?

She was 11th, so she could classify as top 15.

 

[UCONNfan1]

She was 11th, so she could classify as top 15.

I liked her game a lot last year. UCONN recruited her and i would have liked to have seen her at UCONN but in the absence of that, I'm glad RU landed her. IIRC, she needs to work on her outside and deep shooting a bit? she's more a slasher type? Anyway, she's gonna be a good one for RU. Help you beat Tennessee lol.

 

[Coler]

I liked her game a lot last year. UCONN recruited her and i would have liked to have seen her at UCONN but in the absence of that, I'm glad RU landed her. IIRC, she needs to work on her outside and deep shooting a bit? she's more a slasher type? Anyway, she's gonna be a good one for RU. Help you beat Tennessee lol.

Yeah, she showed that she could hit some threes, she had one huge three that sent our game against Miami into overtime. All she needs to do is keep working on it, and it will really help her game so defenders can't guard the drive on her as much.

I agree she's going to be really good for us. But I knew in my gut that we would land her in the end.

Yeah, we should be able to beat Tennessee this year. Hopefully.

 

[DobbsRover2]

You have the patience of Job. Nothing wrong with being optimistic about your team.

Yep, everybody tries to be optimistic about their team for the upcoming season, or you can't really be a true fan. But as in all realms of realism and relativity, you need to have at least a hint of a clue. Otherwise, you're the Alabama fan saying your team is going to win the WCBB title instead of the football crown.

 

[easttexastrash]

I think Baylor has a lot to prove. They want to be considered as one of the greatest teams ever and pribably the only way to prove it is to go undefeated again.

 

[easttexastrash]

Why exactly is Jeff Walz immensely likeable?

I've asked the same about Taylor Swift

I agree that Walz is likeable, although I can't say exactly why. Maybe it is his story with his stuttering. He seems like a nice guy who has beat the odds.

 

[easttexastrash]

I've always thought Walz was one of the good guys and had a good relationship with other coaches including Geno. And I thought recruits generally liked him. Mitchell is another one who I thought came across really well with recruits.

If Walz were at UT I think Russell would have alreally verballed to him. I get the impression that she really connects with him. I would be shocked if she ends up wearing orange. Could Harper, Davis and Russell end up at Louisville.

 

[doggydaddy]

You're correct, stats do not say everything.

Rather than keep this going back and forth, let's just agree to disagree here.
I've seen a lot of her and think she's a player, you're not convinced and have seen not much of her. We'll fix that this year.

Obviously her playing time will go up significantly this year, so it's put up or shut up time.

I've seen lots of her in college. I watched maybe 15-20 Tennessee games. If you are talking HS, no I didn't see her, but college is a different ball game.

 

[triaddukefan]

Duke has the most to prove in my opinion.

 

[DobbsRover2]

I think Baylor has a lot to prove. They want to be considered as one of the greatest teams ever and pribably the only way to prove it is to go undefeated again.

That's okay, I'm convinced Baylor is a really great team. Once is enough, they don't have to go undefeated again. Two in a row would be piggy. Maybe they can win 38 or so and go to the dogs (the kind that pull sleds) in the last game.

 

[easttexastrash]

Duke has the most to prove in my opinion.

Duke does have a lot to prove if they want to crash the perceived Baylor/UCONN party.

 

[DobbsRover2]

Duke has the most to prove in my opinion.

That's odd, a Savannah St. fan said the same thing about her team. I still think the Huskies need to get the 8th ring to show they're not just throwing punches at something orange.

 

[mudcat]

[quote="DobbsRover2, post: 315220, member: 807"]Relativity is indeed the essence of all, and for those who seem to actually find some divine order from the flights of birds, spots on sheep livers, and preseason rankings, here is the standings for the flops and upward flips based on last year's preseason rankings. We tend to forget about what was expected back in October of every year, but there is a record that nasty people like me can refer to as far as the "official" line about how teams are going to do. But for me a team has to miss its expected season's destiny by 2 places to be a genuine flop. And I'll also admit that all is relative in rankings, so the difference between Purdue which was ranked #16 in the AP poll and KY at #17 is big, making the Boilermakers a minor disappointment (but not a flop) and the Wildcats a raging success because of the NCAAs boundary line. But again, for those who take the 2012-13 preseason ranking seriously, this is the post-mortem on last year's duds and dynamos.

Relatively speaking, my big picks for achievement over expectations are UCLA and Nebraska. I think UCLA has a good chance to upset CAL and finish 2nd in the PAC12, not so sure they can upend Standford. I think Neb has a good chance of finishing first in the Big 10 over PSU. Having always liked C Viv, I hope she can produce a little more dynamic offense and finish behind UCONN in the BE. Isn't Tex A&M now in the SEC - they have a good chance of winning that just because I don't expect much from the conference outside of Kentucky.

 

[Man-Man]

I think Baylor has a lot to prove. They want to be considered as one of the greatest teams ever and pribably the only way to prove it is to go undefeated again.

If Baylor goes 40-0 again or even 39-0, I'd bet they'd have a dozen cupcakes to start off the 2013-14 season.