Superhero movies

[ZooCougar]

I thought WW sucked. Man of Steel was better.

Dawn of Justice came along too early. Superman is big enough to not need all the extra super heroes.

 

[Scalito]

I thought WW sucked. Man of Steel was better.

Dawn of Justice came along too early. Superman is big enough to not need all the extra super heroes.

Superman has not done well on his own. He is not "complicated" enough in a world where superhero movies are being made for adults instead of kids. A shame, really. The Christopher Reeves movies were great because the makers embraced the character. Nowadays everyone has to be an angsty Dark Knight or Wolverine.

That's the problem with Wonder Woman too. If you cannot bring a little girl to watch Wonder Woman, the movie failed.

 

[CL82]

Superman has not done well on his own. He is not "complicated" enough in a world where superhero movies are being made for adults instead of kids. A shame, really. The Christopher Reeves movies were great because the makers embraced the character. Nowadays everyone has to be an angsty Dark Knight or Wolverine.

Great observation. Superman doesn't lend himself to a dark brooding portrayal. If you are going to make a Superman movie, it needs to be a fight of good versus evil. That is what made the first Christopher Reeves so successful in my opinion.

A bit OT, but I think you see some of the same thing in the Hobbit trilogy. They tried to make it Lord of the Rings. It wasn't in scope or tone. You could have, IMO have made one, or maybe two movies true to the original books and it would have far better.

 

[Scalito]

Great observation. Superman doesn't lend himself to a dark brooding portrayal. If you are going to make a Superman movie, it needs to be a fight of good versus evil. That is what made the first Christopher Reeves so successful in my opinion.

A bit OT, but I think you see some of the same thing in the Hobbit trilogy. They tried to make it Lord of the Rings. It wasn't in scope or tone. You could have, IMO have made one, or maybe two movies true to the original books and it would have far better.

I agree on The Hobbit. Hollywood isn't that creative. They fix on a formula that works and then try and stuff everything into that box. Superman is simply the antithesis of the current formula with his wholesome Americana profile (Truth, Justice and the American Way) that is likely both a little embarrassing to the filmmakers and detrimental to the international box office returns.

 

[huskyrob1]

Superman has not done well on his own. He is not "complicated" enough in a world where superhero movies are being made for adults instead of kids. A shame, really. The Christopher Reeves movies were great because the makers embraced the character. Nowadays everyone has to be an angsty Dark Knight or Wolverine.

That's the problem with Wonder Woman too. If you cannot bring a little girl to watch Wonder Woman, the movie failed.

Superman never succeeded IMO because the original tv series and George Reeves was so hard to live up to. Superheroes can never appear stupid and bumbling, like Christopher Reeves did when playing Clark Kent.

 

[ZooCougar]

Superman has not done well on his own. He is not "complicated" enough in a world where superhero movies are being made for adults instead of kids. A shame, really. The Christopher Reeves movies were great because the makers embraced the character. Nowadays everyone has to be an angsty Dark Knight or Wolverine.

That's the problem with Wonder Woman too. If you cannot bring a little girl to watch Wonder Woman, the movie failed.

Man of Steel did well enough. I think part of the reason Dawn of Justice failed was that Superman's treatment in the film was so utterly stupid.

I think there is opportunity for a non Anti-Hero character out there. Spider Man isn't the antihero type for example. Same goes for Captain America

The Dark Knight movies were awesome because a Super Hero finally got "grown up" series of movies. Batman is full of angst and is an imperfect hero. It would have been great to have a Superman series with the same quality. Instead we get a version of Lex Luthor that is like the Joker meets Mark Zuckerberg.

 

[ZooCougar]

Superman never succeeded IMO because the original tv series and George Reeves was so hard to live up to. Superheroes can never appear stupid and bumbling, like Christopher Reeves did when playing Clark Kent.

I thought the first two were pretty successful. The first one was pretty epic IMO.

 

[ZooCougar]

I agree on The Hobbit. Hollywood isn't that creative. They fix on a formula that works and then try and stuff everything into that box. Superman is simply the antithesis of the current formula with his wholesome Americana profile (Truth, Justice and the American Way) that is likely both a little embarrassing to the filmmakers and detrimental to the international box office returns.

You mean like Captain America?

 

[Scalito]

You mean like Captain America?

Kinda, yeah. They have a done a very good job threading that needle by surrounding him with angstier characters and making his wholesome Americana the but of jokes and something he is slightly embarrassed about.

 

[ZooCougar]

They have a done a very good job threading that needle by surrounding him with angstier characters and making his wholesome Americana the but of jokes and something he is slightly embarrassed about.

Except for the first CA, I thought those were best Marvel movies aside from Guardians of the Galaxy. I think his embarrassment has more to do with being a child of the 20's and 30's.

 

[Scalito]

Except for the first CA, I thought those were best Marvel movies aside from Guardians of the Galaxy. I think his embarrassment has more to do with being a child of the 20's and 30's.

That is some of it, but not all. Have you seen Thor II when Loki takes on his image and sarcastically talks about how righteous he feels? They are mocking the character a bit. Just like they do with the he-cannot-swear shtick because he is being aged for a maturer crowd looking for more "gray."

P.s. If you cannot tell, I have seen these a million times. Until WW, they have been a go to compromise on the TV with my kid.

 

[ZooCougar]

That is some of it, but not all. Have you seen Thor II when Loki takes on his image and sarcastically talks about how righteous he feels? They are mocking the character a bit. Just like they do with the he-cannot-swear shtick because he is being aged for a maturer crowd looking for more "gray."

P.s. If you cannot tell, I have seen these a million times. Until WW, they have been a go to compromise on the TV with my kid.

Looking forward to the next Thor movie. Thor is so much better when he isn't in his own movie. But Thor Ragnarok looks like it actually might not suck.

Thor's righteousness and naïveté are what makes him so endearing. Hemsworth plays it perfectly.

BTW, I think the Anti-Hero archetype is a big part of the American Psyche. We had to be dragged into WWI and WWII... etc.. We also love stories of redemption. Even Han Solo, arguably the most popular Star Wars character is a great anti-hero. A greedy smuggler who reluctantly abandons his outlaw life to serve a cause greater than himself.

 

[Scalito]

Looking forward to the next Thor movie. Thor is so much better when he isn't in his own movie. But Thor Ragnarok looks like it actually might not suck.

Thor's righteousness and naïveté are what makes him so endearing. Hemsworth plays it perfectly.

BTW, I think the Anti-Hero archetype is a big part of the American Psyche. We had to be dragged into WWI and WWII... etc.. We also love stories of redemption. Even Han Solo, arguably the most popular Star Wars character is a great anti-hero. A greedy smuggler who reluctantly abandons his outlaw life to serve a cause greater than himself.

Just to be clear---I am not arguing against the dark or anti-heros. I am arguing that Hollywood is trying to stuff the classic pure Americana heros like superman into that role instead of embracing the character. I love the Dark Knight trilogy. Dark heros are great. But Superman is not a dark hero and he doesn't work as one.

 

[ZooCougar]

Just to be clear---I am not arguing against the dark or anti-heros. I am arguing that Hollywood is trying to stuff the classic pure Americana heros like superman into that role instead of embracing the character. I love the Dark Knight trilogy. Dark heros are great. But Superman is not a dark hero and he doesn't work as one.

I don't think he needs to be in order to be successful in the box office. If they try that play, then it will fail.

His god like powers trump whatever vulnerability his righteousness can create. Plus, it is believable because he he gets his values from two uncompromising fathers. Warner Bros really screwed Superman up.

 

[Scalito]

Still haven't seen Guardians II. It is hard to catch superhero flicks without my daughter as an excuse, and even I am not dumb enough to put that on with her.

 

[ZooCougar]

Still haven't seen Guardians II. It is hard to catch superhero flicks without my daughter as an excuse, and even I am not dumb enough to put that on with her.

Good, but not as good as the first.

 

[huskyrob1]

I thought the first two were pretty successful. The first one was pretty epic IMO.

I just think Christopher Reeve way overplayed the Clark Kent side of things. Came off looking like a bumbling dufus while George Reeves set the bar, and a very serious bar, even in the early episodes living with his parents on the farm. I mean if you're going to be a Superhero, act like one.

 

[ZooCougar]

I just think Christopher Reeve way overplayed the Clark Kent side of things. Came off looking like a bumbling dufus while George Reeves set the bar, and a very serious bar, even in the early episodes living with his parents on the farm. I mean if you're going to be a Superhero, act like one.

That show is too old to be relatable IMO.

 

[huskyrob1]

That show is too old to be relatable IMO.

Not trying to knock Christopher Reeve, he's made some great flicks, just thought he wasn't right for Superman. His role as Richard Collier in "Somewhere in Time" is memorable.

 

[Scalito]

Not trying to knock Christopher Reeve, he's made some great flicks, just thought he wasn't right for Superman. His role as Richard Collier in "Somewhere in Time" is memorable.

He was great in Somewhere in Time. But he is Superman. No one will ever play it as well. I don't think they should even try. It's like trying to be Roger Moore instead of James Bond. There are multiple ways to do it.

 

[zyron]

Still haven't seen Guardians II. It is hard to catch superhero flicks without my daughter as an excuse, and even I am not dumb enough to put that on with her.

Got it from Redbox last night and really enjoyed it. It had me laughing more than the first but was a bit less overall. Highly recommend it though.

 

[Mano]

I just recently saw Logan... now that is how to properly service a character! All those X-Men movie moments where they only hint at Wolverine's darker, edgier true nature were finally let loose to great results. A great sendoff to one of the absolute best comic book characters IMO.

I think the real problem with the Superman movies to date have been the choice of director. Zack Snyder is a super talented guy but I think he was the wrong choice for Superman from the beginning. I do love what he did with Watchmen though.

 

[Kolumbo]

Are the Guardians movies that good? I was flipping around one night and started watching Guardians of the Galaxy but when I saw a fox and a tree talking, I thought it was a goofy kids movie and turned it off. I'll check it out if it's worth it. I like the Avengers movies although some of the jokes are getting a little too cutesy, but the characters are all very like-able.

 

[nwhoopfan]

It's a talking genetically engineered raccoon, not a fox. GOTG is a bunch of obscure characters from an obscure comic that only hard core comic fans were even aware of previously (I'm not one of those). That Marvel Studios turned a movie based off of that into a runaway hit just shows how much of a Midas touch they have.

Anyway the movie is entertaining. I didn't think it was quite as good as the hype suggested, but it's worth watching.

 

[ZooCougar]

Are the Guardians movies that good? I was flipping around one night and started watching Guardians of the Galaxy but when I saw a fox and a tree talking, I thought it was a goofy kids movie and turned it off. I'll check it out if it's worth it. I like the Avengers movies although some of the jokes are getting a little too cutesy, but the characters are all very like-able.

It's a story about a bunch of misfits saving the Galaxy.