Sue Bird Interview with some Paige tidbits

meyers7

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That’s exactly my point.
Didn't sound like it. The way you put it, it sounded like you didn't think Jefferson was the best PG that ever played at UCONN.
 

oldude

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Didn't sound like it. The way you put it, it sounded like you didn't think Jefferson was the best PG that ever played at UCONN.
I think when all is said and done, it’ll be Paige. But if you exclude DT from the pg conversation as a “combo” guard, I actually rank Mo as #1 and Sue as #2.
 
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I think Paige has already gotten past the "just another top recruit" category.
so you're lowering the bar for her from championships to stats? the point Uconn you're measured by Championships which is why people place Stewie over Maya and D even tho both were better players than Stewie hopefully Paige can win some Championships to further complicated the debate as to who's the best but if she doesn't win anything she's just another top recruit with amazing stats
 
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When we disagree about how we rank players, we are often disagreeing about our respective criteria for ranking players. If we rank UConn players by championships, Stewie, Tuck and Mo are tops. For points scored it’s Maya. For career wins it’s Saniya Chong & Tierney Lawlor (yes that’s correct).

My #1 criteria is something of an intangible. I think the greatest players are the ones who make everyone around them better. That’s why my MBB GOAT is Magic and not MJ.

As far as UConn WBB, I thought I would never see another player like DT whose ability to lead her team, get everyone involved and deliver in the clutch was unparalleled. This past season Paige changed my opinion on that criteria.

Hopefully, Paige will be part of multiple championships at UConn. If that happens, the BY will be arguing about the GOAT for years to come.
I agree with the theme of this posting. Intangibles are huge to team success. That is why I don’t understand why Napheesa is not generally mentioned in the same breath as other players when discussing top 5 or 10 UConn players. Stats + intangibles. 1 NC and 3 other final fours. Maybe if y’all replaced NC’s with final fours as the key criteria , you could more effectively evaluate the greatness of past Huskies.
 
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My interpretation of Sue’s comments is adding to the National Championship Tradition.
Does not mean needing to win 3 or 4 straight, or even multiple (which would be a major plus) but to add to the history of UCONN excellence by leading the program to at least one championship title to even be considered.
IMHO- if Paige wins POY for four consecutive years (won’t happen) and fails to be a member of at least one National Championship winner, I would argue that the POY award is conveyed under false criteria.
 
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so you're lowering the bar for her from championships to stats? the point Uconn you're measured by Championships which is why people place Stewie over Maya and D even tho both were better players than Stewie hopefully Paige can win some Championships to further complicated the debate as to who's the best but if she doesn't win anything she's just another top recruit with amazing stats
I'm not lowering anything. The plain fact is, Paige is not "just another top recruit".
 
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Sue specifically said: "But, when you go to Connecticut, the only thing you’re judged on is championships."
Is anyone seriously debating this statement?
Shocked No Way GIF by Entertainment Tonight
A lot of people like Bird who have a public platform like to think they speak for a lot of people. They should realize that in fact, it’s just their opinion.
 
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Let’s compare apples to apples. In DT’s freshman season in the national semifinals vs ND, she had possibly the worst game of her college career during a 90-75 loss to the Irish. DT was 1-15 from the floor.
Absolutely true but ironically it may have been the best thing to happen to her. She often referred to that game as a prime motivator. The next year in the Finals, Geno called a time out and cleared the left side of the court for her as a sophomore. She backed down her defender, spun, double pumped and Stacey Dales, who had come over to double, fouled her and fouled out. D made the bucket and foul shot. Game, set, match. My point wasn't that D was better than Paige as a freshman, it was that on the National Semi stage Paige was outplayed. Perhaps that loss to Arizona will have the same motivating effect on her and hopefully the whole team.
 

oldude

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Absolutely true but ironically it may have been the best thing to happen to her. She often referred to that game as a prime motivator. The next year in the Finals, Geno called a time out and cleared the left side of the court for her as a sophomore. She backed down her defender, spun, double pumped and Stacey Dales, who had come over to double, fouled her and fouled out. D made the bucket and foul shot. Game, set, match. My point wasn't that D was better than Paige as a freshman, it was that on the National Semi stage Paige was outplayed. Perhaps that loss to Arizona will have the same motivating effect on her and hopefully the whole team.
I expect the entire team to be motivated by the AZ loss. The picture that E posted when she announced her intention to return next season, of Liv, Christyn and herself walking off the court with looks of both dissatisfaction and determination, with the caption, “Unfinished Business” pretty much confirms the team’s motivation for the upcoming season.
 

CL82

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What Sue is reported to have said is, “The only thing you’re judged on is championships.” As I commented earlier, while that statement has a nice ring to it, it’s a bit of hyperbole.
Sort of. Here is the full quote from the OP:
Yeah, listen, the kid is incredibly talented. You can see it not just in her play, but in her personality, in her attitude, she definitely has star qualities. But, when you go to Connecticut, the only thing you’re judged on is championships. So, that obviously — and that’s not to challenge her, she already knows that, (laughs) I’m not trying to talk by any means, I hope she wins the next three years, of course — but usually when it’s all said and done, that’s how you settle this argument. And it’s really because there’s been so many great players.

Would you take Maya (Moore) or D (Diana Taurasi), I don’t know? Would you take Stewie or D or Maya or Rebecca (Lobo) or Tina (Charles) or? It’s like, gosh, how do you pick? So at the end of the day, you just gotta settle it with the ring. We’ll see how she does.
Yes she did say the words “the only thing you’re judged on is championships” but you have to interpret those word within context laid out in the complete quote. She is using that particular criteria as a tie breaker among several talented athletes.
 
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CocoHusky

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A lot of people like Bird who have a public platform like to think they speak for a lot of people. They should realize that in fact, it’s just their opinion.
Depends on the subject matter though. This particular subject matter for which Sue was asked an opinion is regarding UCONN all time greats. In that regard there aren't more than a handful of people on this planet more qualified to express an opinion than Sue Bird. That's why I'm frankly surprised by the push back. I understand @Bigboote point/pushback that Championships is not the "only" criteria but I haven't heard any suggestions of a better criteria.
 

CocoHusky

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so you're lowering the bar for her from championships to stats? the point Uconn you're measured by Championships which is why people place Stewie over Maya and D even tho both were better players than Stewie hopefully Paige can win some Championships to further complicated the debate as to who's the best but if she doesn't win anything she's just another top recruit with amazing stats
Don't think the bar is being lowered, just using a different criteria stats vs. championships. It is only "some" people that elevate Stewie above DT based on championships alone. Many other validly point out that DT had lesser capable teammates and had to carry a larger burden specifically in DT Junior and Senior championship campaigns.
 

HuskyNan

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The title argument is a good one but Bird went there because she knows that's all she has left in defense of her status. Not that Bird isn't a legend but Bueckers was NPOY as a freshman, when Bird didn't even play.
She didn’t play because she tore her ACL early in the season. After she was hurt and Kiersten Walters couldn’t play because of her knees, the remaining guards available to play the point were Amy Duran, Courtney Gaine, Marci Glenney, and Tihana Abrlic. Of course they didn’t win a championship.
 

Bald Huskie

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Absolutely true but ironically it may have been the best thing to happen to her. She often referred to that game as a prime motivator. The next year in the Finals, Geno called a time out and cleared the left side of the court for her as a sophomore. She backed down her defender, spun, double pumped and Stacey Dales, who had come over to double, fouled her and fouled out. D made the bucket and foul shot. Game, set, match. My point wasn't that D was better than Paige as a freshman, it was that on the National Semi stage Paige was outplayed. Perhaps that loss to Arizona will have the same motivating effect on her and hopefully the whole team.
I think D is the GOAT, and yes that play was unbelievable. But just remember, Paige was the primary player in the game, the POTY, everyone was keying on her. D was surrounded by four great players that had more experience and capability as seen by Oklahoma. These other four players were guarded just as close as D, but Geno recognized how special she was and was able to make the play. Lets not forget that these other players were four of the first six picks in the next WNBA draft. Just saying that Paige was figuratively naked out there while D had plenty of shelter. By the way, D was a sophomore when she made that play, so lets see what happens next April before we pass judgement.
 

oldude

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Sort of. Here is the full quote from the OP:

Yes she did say the words “the only thing you’re judged on is championships” but you have to interpret those word within context laid out in the complete quote. She is using that criteria particular criteria as tie breaker among several talented athletes.
OK, I'll accept that interpretation. But for the sake of argument, let's say Paige is named a 1st team AA (likely) and NPOY (possible) in each of the next 3 seasons, but Stanford, SC or some other team take down the Huskies short of a national championship in each of those seasons (possible). Does the tiebreaker mean that Paige is not as good as Sue, DT, Maya, Stewie, Mo......?

By the way, only at UConn could we even have this discussion. UConn fans are truly blessed........
 

CocoHusky

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I think D is the GOAT, and yes that play was unbelievable. But just remember, Paige was the primary player in the game, the POTY, everyone was keying on her. D was surrounded by four great players that had more experience and capability as seen by Oklahoma. These other four players were guarded just as close as D, but Geno recognized how special she was and was able to make the play. Lets not forget that these other players were four of the first six picks in the next WNBA draft. Just saying that Paige was figuratively naked out there while D had plenty of shelter. By the way, D was a sophomore when she made that play, so lets see what happens next April before we pass judgement.
DT best statistical year was indeed her sophomore year-yet that same year it was Sue Bird that was named AP National POY. 4 different players (Ruth Riley, Sue Bird, Alana Beard & Diana Taurasi) would win the AP POY award while DT was in a UCONN uniform. The first fact is a clear indication that you cannot always rely on just stats. The second statement might be an indication that the college landscape in DT's college days was far more competitive than it is today which might account for a freshman (Paige) sweeping the POY for the first time EVER in the history of WCBB.
 
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I expect the entire team to be motivated by the AZ loss. The picture that E posted when she announced her intention to return next season, of Liv, Christyn and herself walking off the court with looks of both dissatisfaction and determination, with the caption, “Unfinished Business” pretty much confirms the team’s motivation for the upcoming season.
I realize that it's a big thing now to use social media to express intentions etc. like motivation, revenge, or whatever. But I'm rarely impressed with anything expressed on SM. Because I subscribe to the "don't listen to what they say, watch what they do" way of thinking, I'll wait to see what these 3 and the whole team do this offseason to make themselves better players to actually be able to utilize this massive dose of motivation. They'll need to be a much more focused and physically tougher team to play against to make this stuff anything more than just tough talk. And most of them have a ways to go to accomplish that.
 

CocoHusky

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The title argument is a good one but Bird went there because she knows that's all she has left in defense of her status. Not that Bird isn't a legend but Bueckers was NPOY as a freshman, when Bird didn't even play. And Taurasi told us what to expect for the next 3 years. Just for argument sake let's say that Bueckers wins zero titles but wins NPOY 4 times (with the stats to back it up). Would she be precluded from consideration as the best pg in UConn history? I say no. Titles are won by TEAMS not players. The best player is so whether or not he/she played on a winning team. In the 60's the Celtics were the best team but the best player was Wilt.

Frankly it's nice to see former players chide Bueckers about her lack of a title. After observing her for 4 years I think she responds better to a challenge than to constant praise. It's her best attribute.
:eek: Sue Bird needs no defense of her status her legend is very SECURE. Sue will go down as the best PG to ever play the women's game and she will be a 1st ballot HOF based on her UCONN, WNBA, International and Olympic championships.
Your Question: Just for argument sake let's say that Bueckers wins zero titles but wins NPOY 4 times (with the stats to back it up). Would she be precluded from consideration as the best pg in UConn history?
My Answer: Of course not. I would also bet you that even if Paige were to win the next 3 NCAA championships & three years from now we are having a debate of the best UCONN PG ever Sue Bird and Moriah Jefferson will be included in that conversation. It will be a remarkable conversation to have and I hope I'm around for it because it will have been nearly 25 years since Sue played at UCONN.
 
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I think D is the GOAT, and yes that play was unbelievable. But just remember, Paige was the primary player in the game, the POTY, everyone was keying on her. D was surrounded by four great players that had more experience and capability as seen by Oklahoma. These other four players were guarded just as close as D, but Geno recognized how special she was and was able to make the play. Lets not forget that these other players were four of the first six picks in the next WNBA draft. Just saying that Paige was figuratively naked out there while D had plenty of shelter. By the way, D was a sophomore when she made that play, so lets see what happens next April before we pass judgement.
Everything you said is true. The point of talking about that play was the fact that it came a year after the horrible game against ND in the semis which motivated her. I have no judgment to pass at this time except that Paige was outplayed against Arizona but so was the team. DT was keyed on on defense her entire junior and senior seasons but she not only succeeded, she made everyone else around her better. Very few players have been able to do that.
 

eebmg

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Laundry List of what puts Paige on my Mt Rushmore (assuming she still plays at her individual level and gets at least 1 Naty) By personal level, she maintains her unanimous first team AA status , elite play in playoffs etc. She may even not get another NPOY since her stats may become less pronounced as she lets other shine more

1) No one has had as much pressure put on her as Paige especially with the level of hype before she came here. The pressure to win at UConn continues to grow as the program has ascended to the most rarified air and at the same time, the NC has eluded UConn for the last 5 years. Far more than the Sue/Diana Years. I would maybe put Stewie on the same level with her guarantee of 4 NC's etc

2) She is playing without any AA's and has had to mold a team with far more underclassman than upper classman. I assume that will change in the upcoming years but nothing is completely sure until it happens

3) She has shown a unique ability to make the biggest shots when the team has desperately needed it under pressure of real losses. (TN, SC and even AZ) Stewie has never had to do that although I imagine she would if put in the same positions.

4) Perhaps unique to my mindset but she exceeds her athleticism and is completely unselfish She is not the absurdly gifted athlete like Maya or Stewie and has to use her Basketball IQ far more to get the job done.

5) I say 1 NC is enough simply because the competition level of other teams has gotten so much better. Gone are the days when UConn is the favorite over the field.
 
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:eek: Sue Bird needs no defense of her status her legend is very SECURE. Sue will go down as the best PG to ever play the women's game and she will be a 1st ballot HOF based on her UCONN, WNBA, International and Olympic championships.
Your Question: Just for argument sake let's say that Bueckers wins zero titles but wins NPOY 4 times (with the stats to back it up). Would she be precluded from consideration as the best pg in UConn history?
My Answer: Of course not. I would also bet you that even if Paige were to win the next 3 NCAA championships & three years from now we are having a debate of the best UCONN PG ever Sue Bird and Moriah Jefferson will be included in that conversation. It will be a remarkable conversation to have and I hope I'm around for it because it will have been nearly 25 years since Sue played at UCONN.
I would agree that Sue will go down as the greatest point guard ever in women's basketball when she retires and when she is inducted into the HOF. Paige can unseat her from that throne later though. We just have a long way to go for that with NCs, Olympic Golds, WNBA, etc.
 
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Depends on the subject matter though. This particular subject matter for which Sue was asked an opinion is regarding UCONN all time greats. In that regard there aren't more than a handful of people on this planet more qualified to express an opinion than Sue Bird. That's why I'm frankly surprised by the push back. I understand @Bigboote point/pushback that Championships is not the "only" criteria but I haven't heard any suggestions of a better criteria.
No real pushback. Just pointing out that there's no requirement to be qualified to express an opinion. Based on the definition, "a view or judgement formed about something, not necessarily based on fact or knowledge", you and I are just as qualified as Bird. Of course people are free to value what she says above others if they want, but in the end it's still just her opinion.
 
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OK, I'll accept that interpretation. But for the sake of argument, let's say Paige is named a 1st team AA (likely) and NPOY (possible) in each of the next 3 seasons, but Stanford, SC or some other team take down the Huskies short of a national championship in each of those seasons (possible). Does the tiebreaker mean that Paige is not as good as Sue, DT, Maya, Stewie, Mo......?

By the way, only at UConn could we even have this discussion. UConn fans are truly blessed........
Exactly. Unless Auriemma has put out a blanket statement that this is the view of the program, Bird is only speaking for herself and those who agree with her.
 
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Are we in that much need of a savior?
Sue is 100% correct. She didn’t make the “rules” stop denying it people. I would bet my dollars to your donuts that Geno would agree. It maybe unfortunate but you’re judged by Nattys at UConn. Don’t just argue for argument sake. Lol
 
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DT best statistical year was indeed her sophomore year-yet that same year it was Sue Bird that was named AP National POY. 4 different players (Ruth Riley, Sue Bird, Alana Beard & Diana Taurasi) would win the AP POY award while DT was in a UCONN uniform. The first fact is a clear indication that you cannot always rely on just stats. The second statement might be an indication that the college landscape in DT's college days was far more competitive than it is today which might account for a freshman (Paige) sweeping the POY for the first time EVER in the history of WCBB.
I definitely agree with this. In comparison to that era, today's WCBB is a put it through your legs, look the other way, fall down when you're touched, finesse game. The front lines UConn and Tenn. put on the floor back then would be making today's players and coaches cry now. Those kids got after it and pounded each other. And yes, I think the officials are softer now too.
 

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