Still feeling badly about the losses to Baylor and ND? Well at least...

[CL82]

...we're not Rutgers. Here's a link to a column by Steve Politi at the Newark Star Ledger after lat night's loss to St. Johns.

The quest for 900 has become a metaphor for her program. A few years ago, when Stringer was challenging Connecticut and Geno Auriemma for conference supremacy, she would regularly wipe the court with St. John’s, winning 17 straight in the series.

Now, it is a six-game winning streak for the Red Storm, with two of those coming under first-year coach Joe Tartamella. St. John’s has caught and passed Stringer’s program, and it isn’t the only team that can stake that claim.

So the problem isn’t failing to keep up with Geno and Co. – everyone struggles to do that. The problem allowing so many other rivals to catch and climb over her in the standings. Being second or third best in the Big East is fine, but eighth or ninth?

Politi's columnist role is equivalent to Jacobs locally, although he ussually is an uabashed supporter of RU sports.

 

[easttexastrash]

Almost ensures that she won't land undecided 2013 recruit Ieshia Small.

 

[HuskyNan]

Almost ensures that she won't land undecided 2013 recruit Ieshia Small.

Not really. CViv is a very good recruiter who's landed a number of fabulous players, no matter how up and down Rutger's season has been. She just has a knack.

 

[easttexastrash]

Not really. CViv is a very good recruiter who's landed a number of fabulous players, no matter how up and down Rutger's season has been. She just has a knack.

Nan, other than her offensive challenges, how would you truly rate her coaching abilities? I trend to think of her as just a defensive coach.

 

[HuskyNan]

Nan, other than her offensive challenges, how would you truly rate her coaching abilities? I trend to think of her as just a defensive coach.

CViv is a very good coach, a Hall of Famer. IMO, she has 2 issues that have prevented her from achieving great results like she has in the past.

1. The insistence of emphasizing defense over offense. It used to be that the 5-5 press was feared and dreaded by all opponents, including the Huskies. However, it doesn't matter if the opponent only scores in the 50's if the Scarlet Knights are going to score in the 40's. When Rutgers had Essence Carson, Cappie Pondexter, Matee Ajavon, and Epiphanny Prince, RU won a lot because those players could go one on one with any team and score enough points by themselves to lift the Scarlet Knights to victory.

It's not that RU has no talent now, it has abundant talent, it's that CViv is still emphasizing defense over different offensive schemes. If you watch RU, you'll see one possession where it looks like a world-beater but on the next offensive possession, it looks like it's the first day of practice. I think the kids sometimes get perplexed when an opponent changes up D or takes away the top scorer's offensive opportunities. CViv needs to adjust her offensive coaching to the personnel she has now and to teach them Plan B when they can't do what they initially wanted. IMO, they need to take advantage of their players' skills, which brings me to...

2. CViv is going to stick with what worked 20 years ago no matter what personnel she has on the roster. I used to worry that she was going to open up the playbook and let all those fabulous athletes, highly ranked-high scoring kids in high school, run run run in a free flowing offense. But, RU continued to slog in half-court games, running Villanova-type offenses (which is like watching paint dry), running down the shot clock before attempting a shot. The Scarlet Knights do get out on the fast break sometimes, and look great doing so, but I don't think it's part of the offensive plan. If they can be slowed down, fuhgedaboudit.

 

[Adesmar123]

Nan,

How can you have those two huge problems as a coach and still be considered a great coach today?

 

[HuskyNan]

Nan,

How can you have those two huge problems as a coach and still be considered a great coach today?

Let me add this - CViv has the ability to recruit and coach, but she's too stubborn to change what has worked in the past to what she needs to do now. I say she's a great coach because she can achieve great things and has achieved great things that will take more than just a couple year's bad results to erase.

 

[Adesmar123]

Thanks Nan. I think she was a great coach. I think the game has passed her by. She might be above average now. With her recent recruiting classes, there is always tomorrow. Great coaches find a way to have great seasons with above average players. CVS seems to be a great coach with great players who finds a way to have above average seasons.

 

[Adesmar123]

PS...Nan, I really have no idea of their actual record over the past 5 years. Do you have it available ?

thanks

 

[HuskyNan]

PS...Nan, I really have no idea of their actual record over the past 5 years. Do you have it available ?

2011-12 Went 22-10(10-6), lost 1st round of NCAAs
2010-11 Went 20-13 (11-5 Big East, 4th) lost to eventual NCAA champion in 2nd round
2009-10 Went 19-15, (9-7, 5th), lost 1st round of NCAAs
2008-09 Went 21-13 (9-7, 7th), lost 3rd round of NCAAs
2007-08 Went 27-9 (14-2, 2nd), lost to UConn in Regional Championship. This is the last year for Carson & Ajavon
2006-07 Went 27-9 (12-4, 2nd), lost to Tennesseee in National Championship game

 

[EricLA]

Thanks Nan. I think she was a great coach. I think the game has passed her by. She might be above average now. With her recent recruiting classes, there is always tomorrow. Great coaches find a way to have great seasons with above average players. CVS seems to be a great coach with great players who finds a way to have above average seasons.

FWIW I agree. She was a fabulous coach in the past when, as Nan said, she had enough talent that players could go 1 on 1 and score just enough and the pressing, stifling defense was enough to win games.

Rarely would UCONN score over 60 in games vs. RU, and often it was in the low 50's, even in victories. I think in a way Summitt suffered from the same problem over the final 5+ years before she retired. For them, it was always good enough to have fantastic athletes, stress defense, and crash the O-boards for missed shots and clean up around the hoop. It's one of the reasons (IMHO) 4's and 5's weren't developed to the best of their potential at Tenn - offense was never run thru them and they weren't an active part of a free flowing offensive scheme.

Nan already posted the record the past 5 years...

Most coaches would be pretty happy with those results. I'm not sure how many NCAA's she made during the past 5 years - i'd think all but maybe the 19-15 season. Still, she's not done much lately in spite of still landing top talent. She's got a bunch of AA's and top 10 HS kids on her roster and still can't coach a style that brings her teams into the 21st century... Imagine what a coach like Shea could do with a roster like that!!

 

[HuskyNan]

Most coaches would be pretty happy with those results. I'm not sure how many NCAA's she made during the past 5 years - i'd think all but maybe the 19-15 season. Still, she's not done much lately in spite of still landing top talent. She's got a bunch of AA's and top 10 HS kids on her roster and still can't coach a style that brings her teams into the 21st century... Imagine what a coach like Shea could do with a roster like that!!

RU has been to the NCAAs for 10 consecutive years, I believe, including 2010.

 

[Adesmar123]

Nan, I think those overall records support your two statements on CVS.

Do you think those 5 years reflect the work of a HOF coach with a good recruiting record? By the way, I am not questioning her HOF credentials. Those are pretty good. I am only commenting on her last 5 years. This year will probably be a worse year than those 5.

Its your body of work that makes or breaks a HOF'er. All of your work does not have to be HOF material. I think,in the end, time will judge CVS on her last years.

 

[ThisJustIn]

...we're not Rutgers. Here's a link to a column by Steve Politi at the Newark Star Ledger after lat night's loss to St. Johns.



Politi's columnist role is equivalent to Jacobs locally, although he ussually is an uabashed supporter of RU sports.

Similar piece in the Times. I almost thought is was the same piece, until I compared...

 

[Icebear]

This is now her 5th year in a row with double digit losses.

I agree that she was a good coach and, also, that she no longer is. The game has changed and she has not kept up. I expect that her recruiting will soon begin to flag.

 

[Vowelguy]

This will mark the fifth straight year outside the BE top 3, and almose surely the 2nd time in 5 yrs with fewer than 20 wins. And perhaps no NCAAs.

 

[speedoo]

This will mark the fifth straight year outside the BE top 3, and almose surely the 2nd time in 5 yrs with fewer than 20 wins. And perhaps no NCAAs.

They need a miracle to make the NCAA's.. Not going to happen.

 

[HuskyNan]

Nan, I think those overall records support your two statements on CVS.

Do you think those 5 years reflect the work of a HOF coach with a good recruiting record? By the way, I am not questioning her HOF credentials. Those are pretty good. I am only commenting on her last 5 years. This year will probably be a worse year than those 5.

Its your body of work that makes or breaks a HOF'er. All of your work does not have to be HOF material. I think,in the end, time will judge CVS on her last years.

If Yo Yo Ma woke up tomorrow with crippling arthritis and can now only play poorly, he'd still be a great cellist. It's just MHO but I think you either are something or you're not.

I wonder if she's just losing passion after so many years? Maybe she responds better to pressure. I don't know how much RU the university cares about its women's hoops program -or its perennially bad men's program, either. If the AD did care, there'd be pressure on CViv to put a better product on the court. We'll see what happens when her contract comes up for renewal.

 

[Icebear]

I believe the there is a difference between is and was. It would apply to YoYo Ma as much as to CViv.

 

[Vowelguy]

I wonder if she's just losing passion after so many years? Maybe she responds better to pressure. I don't know how much RU the university cares about its women's hoops program -or its perennially bad men's program, either. If the AD did care, there'd be pressure on CViv to put a better product on the court. We'll see what happens when her contract comes up for renewal.

Given her salary -- isn't she the highest paid state employee? -- you'd think the AD would care more. She makes more than 1M. They could save bout 500k and get better results.

 

[Vowelguy]

Undoubtedly she's HOF.
900 wins
3 separate teams to final 4
4 final4s overall

 

[UcMiami]

Nan - I agree with your posts and I think she is still a 'great' coach. I think she has always been a defensive coach and her offense has never been pretty since she came to RU (can't speak about the earlier years.) I think her biggest problem over the last number of years has been a lack of continuity. When Prince surprised everyone by leaving early it created a vacuum of leadership I thought. I believe that was the fab five recruiting class year when three (?) players ended up leaving in the first year. With a defensive minded/offensively challenged coach not having your star senior leading the buy-in to the defensive focus caused a problem. The defense really suffered and has been nowhere near as good in the following years - and with that all the easy buckets off of steals and traps have disappeared as well further cutting into the offensive output.
She has recruited a lot of talent in the last few years but the chemistry and intensity just seem off.
And I think she maybe has lost some of her fire as well. I wouldn't be surprised if she played out the current contract and retired.