Step back jump shots are illegal?

[the Q]

..and let's not talk about steps to the basket.

That number also is about 7...

 

[MD#12Fan]

Agree with JordyG here very much. The problem now is to reverse the trend would take the years it has gotten to get to this point. Yes young dogs can learn new tricks but years of ingrained moves are hard to break. My guess is someone with the skill and determination of Paige she would work on it and succeed but it would take time.
I think I just have to live with the fact of how much the game has changed as I knew it. OK already got a little off topic here so I won't even go into moving picks running rampant.

I respectfully believe setting up rules and enforcing them should be easy. I am a classroom teacher and the easiest thing I can do is institute a rule, such as "no gum chewing". How simple is that? Where is the gray with that? (personally, I never asked for that, because I felt that I "had bigger fish to fry") Now, what happens when you have the rule, but you don't enforce it. Newsflash: they chew gum. I'd argue that's what happens with these rules like palming and maybe traveling.
All they have to do is enforce the rules on the books. From my coaching and playing experience, what happens is that officials have "points of emphasis" from time to time in order to get things back on track. Like the wishy-washy teacher saying, "guys, no more gum chewing".
Last point: if a rule is too hard to explain and enforce, then it needs to change. Rewrite the doggone rule.
So, as a teacher, rather than arguing with adolescents when I needed to be teaching them, I decided not to have a gum chewing rule. Palming???
I also think one has to ask, why do we have the rule to begin with. I think in hoops it's about maintaining no unfair advantages between players. For example: verticality, hand-checking, pushing, grabbing, traveling.
With teaching IMO it's about the children's safety and whether the classroom is a place in which learning can occur. Gum? Who cares?

 

[Zinethar]

"Carrying, also colloquially referred to as palming, is a violation in the game of basketball. It occurs when the dribbling player continues to dribble after allowing the ball to come to rest in one or both hands. Carrying is similar to a double dribble because the player momentarily stops dribbling and then resumes dribbling. If the player is in motion while carrying the ball, then it is similar to traveling (3+ steps). Players can avoid a carrying violation by keeping their palms facing the floor while dribbling.

Most basketball players slide their hand to one side of the ball when dribbling to better control the ball, directing it from left to right and vice versa. So long as the ball does not come to rest, not only is this legal, but it also allows more control and easier ball-handling. The problem arises when the ball-handler slides their hand too far down the side of the ball and has their hand below it. A carrying violation is called once the player’s hand is below the ball’s plane of 90° and the required up and down motion of the ball significantly stops." From Wikipedia.

Paige in general does not palm the ball. Putting the hand on the side of the ball is legal (where the side stops and bottom starts males this rule almost impossible to enforce. But the key is also causing the ball to pause. It actually would be possible to palm the ball while having the hand on top of the ball if your hands were large enough to actually hold it in place. That would most likely result in a traveling call.

 

[jabstep]

I for one like the innovative things that are done by offensive players especially smaller players to avoid getting their shot blocked by larger players. A totally defensive game is kinda boring. Stepbacks have been around for 50 years. In some form or another. I know I learned it from Ernie D playing him one vs one every day.

 

[JoePgh]

To which "step and a half" rule are you referring? Where is the "gather step" in the NCAA rules? I don't see it in the NCAA Women's Basketball rules. See NCAA Publications - 2019-20 and 2020-21 NCAA Women's Basketball Rules and Interpretations (electronic versions updated Sept. 1, 2020)
See download options check "Download PDF Free."
Click on DOWNLOAD NOW.
Go to page 80 for traveling rules.
Which rules refers to "step and a half" and "gather step" or are these rules Homeric fan rules.

I can't claim to be a basketball rules lawyer, but I did read the traveling rules on Page 80 of the PDF that you referenced. I agree with you that they do not appear to allow a full step prior to releasing a shot.

HOWEVER, in basketball at all levels (not just the NBA) for as long as I can remember, a player driving to the basket for a layup has been allowed to pick up his/her dribble and then take a full step before releasing the shot. Moriah did that all the time on some of her most memorable drives. Stewie did it in the first half of the Mississippi State blowout game, when her "step and a half" covered nearly the entire distance between the free throw line and the hoop. I have to believe that this is provided for somewhere in the rules.

If that is correct, and a step prior to a shot is allowed, then in the step-back jump shot case, moving one foot back is OK because it is not the pivot foot, and moving the second (pivot) foot back is OK because of the allowed single step. In that case, moving both feet back before shooting (even if the feet are not moved simultaneously) should be legal. And if that is not correct, then I don't see how the problem is cured by moving both feet back simultaneously, as the Big 12 supervisor of officials indicated.

Note that the newspaper article from the Kansas City Mercury that was previously cited in this thread refers to "one legal step". I realize they aren't the rule book, but I doubt if they fabricated the concept from whole cloth.

 

[SVCBeercats]

Note that the newspaper article from the Kansas City Mercury that was previously cited in this thread refers to "one legal step". I realize they aren't the rule book, but I doubt if they fabricated the concept from whole cloth.

No they did not fabricate the concept because it is the reality of the way today's game is called. Almost 60 years ago high school basketball was called by the book strictly at least in westcentral PA. Which goes to my point in another post, in today's game rules are ignored or the referees are lax. I have a friend who is 40+ years younger and referees basketball and football at the high school level. I mentioned my concerns about steps and other infractions gone uncalled. He agreed with me, they are ignored or the players are given tremendous latitude. He said initially he called the game by the rule book but was instructed to relax he strict interpretation of the rules. One aspect of refereeing has not changed, they still call fouls they anticipate but not actually see. My ref friend claims he does not do this. Of course he says so with a smile.

 

[chrissaran]

What about Olivia's fadeaway? Has anyone paid attention to her footwork when she pulls back?
Off-topic, but I would prefer if she developed a skyhook in preference to her current fade.

Only Kareem could shot the skyhook effectively, which is why you don't see other players shooting it.

 

[MD#12Fan]

Only Kareem could shot the skyhook effectively, which is why you don't see other players shooting it.

Darn, you must be a young buck. I’m 63. We all learned hook shots from early age. I agree, the sky hook was unique. Like a jump shot, a hook shot released at the top of his jump, high over his head. Liv won’t master that but she sure as heck can have a hook shot with either hand IMO.
In my day, guards had quick jump hooks inside. To me effective as heck. Big guards that can rebound can flip up the ball to the hoop a jump hook inside before the bigs have time to react. Old school!

 

[DefenseBB]

I agree with everything you are saying, Jay Bilas is not an idiot though. As far as him having an agenda that part is true. His agenda has always been for the benefit of the Student Athlete ( Men and Women ), against the NCAA and for the promotion of his main employer (ESPN) I'm not sure why a discussion about step back jumper would trigger you to attack Jay so viciously-unless you are against his agenda.

So you are not agreeing with everything he is saying...?