So everyone who still thinks basketball matters... | Page 3 | The Boneyard

So everyone who still thinks basketball matters...

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ConnHuskBask said:
How about taking a look at the numbers then.

National Championships 3 - 1

Final Fours 4 - 4
Elite 8s 10 - 7 (only 2 since 1990!)
Sweet 16s 16 - 19
Big East Regular Season Titles 10 - 8
Big East Championship Titles 7 - 5

If you can't look at and say which is the better program you're just either a Syracuse fan or a moron (not mutually exclusive).
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Sorry you can't deal with a fact like head to head records. However, I did not insult anyone did I? It's funny what someone will say hiding behind a PC.
 
Druken Friar said:
Sorry you can't deal with a fact like head to head records. However, I did not insult anyone did I? It's funny what someone will say hiding behind a PC.
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It is a pointless argument. They are both immediately recognizable as elite programs today. Anything else is just subjective opinion.
 
Druken Friar said:
Sorry you can't deal with a fact like head to head records. However, I did not insult anyone did I? It's funny what someone will say hiding behind a PC.
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I really can't tell if you are you just trolling UConn?

Syracuse has 2 Elite 8s since 1990!!!

2 Elite 8s in the last 20 years. Let that sink in.

Syracuse is definitely an elite program, there's no question about it.

But come crunch time in the tourney...the cream always, rises to the top.
 
Go to the Syracuse board. They still think Georgetown, Villanova and St Johns are their rivals. A good portion of their fanbase appears to think we're Uconn circa 1984, and just a flash in the pan. The disdain for us is comical. It must be tough to see a team go from cellar dweller to completely surpassing you over a 25 year period.

The sad part is the joy they seem to be taking in the destruction of the Big East, and the teams left behind.
 
ConnHuskBask said:
How about taking a look at the numbers then.

National Championships 3 - 1

Final Fours 4 - 4
Elite 8s 10 - 7 (only 2 since 1990!)
Sweet 16s 16 - 19
Big East Regular Season Titles 10 - 8
Big East Championship Titles 7 - 5

If you can't look at and say which is the better program you're just either a Syracuse fan or a moron (not mutually exclusive).
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When you guys play Bowling Green for the MAC title....will it be on SNY?
 
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nelsonmuntz said:
Interestingly I would have thought that BCU would consider Syracuse more competitive since both schools are populated by mediocre, pretentious, douches whose parents are willing to spend 2.5x what they could get for essentially the same education at any of the 25 best public universities. The primary difference between the two schools is that Syracuse women are better looking and sluttier.
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LOL. this is a classic!!!!!!!
 
freescooter said:
College basketball at the highest levels isn't about regular season. If you are playing at a national level not a living soul on this earth cares if you win 25 games in a season. NO-BOD-EE! Haven't since the NCAA tourney went to 64 teams. If that is what you want to brag about, watch the MAAC or the NEC. Twenty-five wins is a big deal there. What matters is what you do come March. Pitt has done squat. West Virginia has had as many final four runs in the modern era as, oh, George Mason. There next one will make them equal to Oklahoma State. Syracuse at least has a title to its name. As I said, they rode Carmelo as far as they can ride him. Boeheim rode him all the way to the Hall of Fame. Final Fours in 1996 and especially 1987 are about as relevent as West Virginia's 1959 Final Four. And with the exception of the 3 Final Fours in 35 years, the Orange have never been past the Sweet 16. I guess we have a different definition of "elite."
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That part is definitely an exaggeration. If they didn't win it, he would essentially be Eddie Sutton, who yes, is also in the Hall of Fame.
 
Mots010 said:
Go to the Syracuse board. They still think Georgetown, Villanova and St Johns are their rivals. A good portion of their fanbase appears to think we're Uconn circa 1984, and just a flash in the pan. The disdain for us is comical. It must be tough to see a team go from cellar dweller to completely surpassing you over a 25 year period.

The sad part is the joy they seem to be taking in the destruction of the Big East, and the teams left behind.
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UConn surpassed them both in basketball AND football. Lacrosse is next.
 
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Mots010 said:
Go to the Syracuse board. They still think Georgetown, Villanova and St Johns are their rivals. A good portion of their fanbase appears to think we're Uconn circa 1984, and just a flash in the pan. The disdain for us is comical. It must be tough to see a team go from cellar dweller to completely surpassing you over a 25 year period.

The sad part is the joy they seem to be taking in the destruction of the Big East, and the teams left behind.
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Just ask BC.
 
Vuce said:
And the point of this post is what? That Uconn, a HUGE basketball school, should drop the sport or the fans should not watch or care? Not going to happen.
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I'm old enough to have been around for Uconn's first years in th BE (went to the first BE tourney in Providence). There was talk of Uconn dropping out of the BE because they couldn't compete with the likes of Providence and others. Things can change: 30 years latter we have 3 national championships.
We built a stadium and practice facility. Uconn is Div 1 in football for the long haul.
 
ConnHuskBask said:
I really can't tell if you are you just trolling UConn?

Syracuse has 2 Elite 8s since 1990!!!

2 Elite 8s in the last 20 years. Let that sink in.

Syracuse is definitely an elite program, there's no question about it.

But come crunch time in the tourney...the cream always, rises to the top.
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I was originally responding to a post that stated Syracuse was not an elite program. I disagree. I also disagree that teams from the 70's and 80's are somehow irrelevant. If that is true than what is the cut off? It's a stupid agrument. I saw Georgetown play UConn in the mid 80's. I watched UCLA during the Walton years. Those teams would still be tough to beat even with today's athletes.

I root for Big East Basketball in general, UConn when I can see them. For the record, I never said Syracuse was better, more like equal to. In my opinion, programs are coach driven, both UConn and Syracuse have been fortunate to have the same guy for a long time, both are excellent.

I've been watching basketball for a long time, pre Big East. I used to go to a tournament called the ECAC. I went to PC games in the 70's and UConn games in the 80's. Despite what guys like Jay Bilas says, Big East basketball eclipsed the ACC years ago. It's sad to see the conference breaking apart because of football.
 
I see Syracuse as a nice program, but more along the line of a Maryland than one of the really elite programs. Sure they win a lot of games in the regular season, but they rarely perform well in the NCAAs. A couple of nice runs over 35 years and no other Elite 8s is fine but hardly an elite performance. they are Marquette without the handicap of playing most of those years in CUSA.

As far as what runs matter and what runs don't, I agree that its a tough call, but at some point, pointing to a Final Four run in 1987 loses at least some of its relevency. It is similar to when Villanova trys to say its an elite program based on one championship more than 25 years ago...and 1 Final Four since. Heck City College once won both the NIT and the NCAA in the same season. They must be the best ever.
 
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Excalibur said:
In his defense, "head to head" could mean "when we play them" as opposed to a general comparison of programs, though the context clearly indicates otherwise.
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Even that would be a stretch, there's only been a very select few instances in recent years where SU has had a "sizable edge" over us in a specific BB game. And for every one of those instances, there's one from another year where we've had a sizable edge. So if that's the point, it still makes no sense. Most years, we're both at or about the same level.
 
Druken Friar said:
I'm not trying to tweak anyone, I just acknowledge they have been good for a long time. Last I checked, head to head, it was 50-36 in favor of the Orangemen. Whoever has been at the top, Georgetown, Villanova, Pitt, UConn, Louisville, etc.. Syracuse is always in the mix.

This what I said.
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docsu said:
Who incidentally is a BCS program...which soon will be more than I can say for Connecticut.
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True. But at least in basketball we will only make the transition from....

Big East and National Champions to MAC and National champions. We'll live with it. In the meantime.. SU can hang the ACC Coastal Region Quaterfinals Champion Banner next to the 6OT win against UCONN Banner.
 
Boy this thread has gotten way off track, I'll say that. The basic point of it all was that having great baksetball doesn't protect you in the least. It didn't protect Kansas last year when the B-12 almost crashed and it didn't protect UCONN this year as the Big East is heading for the trashheap. It was because they had recognizable football programs that Pitt, Syracuse, BC, Miami, and yes Waylon, Utah and Colorado, and probably West Virginia, all ended up in secure places.
 
Druken Friar said:
I was clearly refering to head to head meetings.
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I imagine that logic could catch on. Championships, players who went on to outstanding pro careers, all take a backseat to head to head results. I will use your position to launch a campaign demonstrating UConn's superiority to Notre Dame as a football program. After all, head to head results are what is important.
 
freescooter said:
I see Syracuse as a nice program, but more along the line of a Maryland than one of the really elite programs. Sure they win a lot of games in the regular season, but they rarely perform well in the NCAAs. A couple of nice runs over 35 years and no other Elite 8s is fine but hardly an elite performance. they are Marquette without the handicap of playing most of those years in CUSA.

As far as what runs matter and what runs don't, I agree that its a tough call, but at some point, pointing to a Final Four run in 1987 loses at least some of its relevency. It is similar to when Villanova trys to say its an elite program based on one championship more than 25 years ago...and 1 Final Four since. Heck City College once won both the NIT and the NCAA in the same season. They must be the best ever.
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in fairness, we did have the #1 ranked team at the end of the regular season two years ago, only to be derailed by injury in the postseason, that team was a lock for SU's 4th final four since 1987, with a great shot at championship #2 since 2003.

to clear up the head-to-head discussion, since 1980 syracuse and uconn are essentially .500 against each other (it might be one game either way right now), with neither program winning more than 4 in row versus the other, which has happened only twice, once for each side. i understand the argument that it is probably a better rivalry than georgetown, the stats back it up. for whatever reason though, georgetown is public enemy #1, there is just something different about it. for instance, as a kid i loved ray allen, still do, i rooted for you guys big time in 1999. i have never pulled for gtown for one second in any game in my life.

to your larger point, while it supports your argument to judge a program based only on ncaa tourney performance, it is not the only criteria by which to judge programs. the blue bloods are duke, unc, kentucky, and kansas, and syracuse and uconn are in the next tier. it's just the way it is.
 
TheRogers said:
True. But at least in basketball we will only make the transition from....

Big East and National Champions to MAC and National champions. We'll live with it. In the meantime.. SU can hang the ACC Coastal Region Quaterfinals Champion Banner next to the 6OT win against UCONN Banner.
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You're right. National Champions come from non-BCS programs all the time. I'm sure top-50 recruits will be down with playing basketball games in Bowling Green and Athens, Ohio.
 
docsu said:
You're right. National Champions come from non-BCS programs all the time. I'm sure top-50 recruits will be down with playing basketball games in Bowling Green and Athens, Ohio.
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If UCONN ends up a non-BCS school, we'll be a non-BCS school with a winning tradition....and when I say this, it's backed up with hardware. It's a tradition that gets players ready for the pros...and again, that can be backed-up with UCONN's stable of pros on current rosters. Granted it's not ideal but getting that training and winning in April will get our share of top recruits.

But that's a big IF on not being a BCS school.
 
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