Rebounding a Major Concern

[Waquoit]

Napier hawks down rebounds , could simply be padding his stats.

Tell me this is a joke. If only Daniels was interested in padding his stats in a similar fashion.

 

[Scot-e]

Question. Is it just me or does it seem like we have had a lot of balls (on the offensive end) coming off the basket and doing "funky" things? Maybe it's all the longer range jump shots but it just looks like we are not so badly out of position vs we have not had the ball come our way as much as it has in the past. I am not saying this is everything or a fix- but it could be 6+- rebounds a game that just have not gone our way up to this point.

My hope is that this is the case and our rebounding issue is slightly more fixable then we believe it to be.

 

[UConn990411]

Miller was a little defensive about the rebounding on the post game show, maybe bring Clyde V back. Miller did say once you box out you still need to then go for the ball. I saw Bazz grab a rebound sandwiched between 2 of our bigs. Part is we don't have a strong guy and it is not part of most players on our teams natural mindset... Unrelenting pursuit for the ball.

You should be thrown in jail for the number of horses you've beaten to death.

We get that you want Clyde back, but it's not happening. Move on.

 

[James]

People are complaining about rebounding like it's something that's cost us games. nitpicking statistics in blowouts is useless. Save your panic for an actual competitive game.

 

[Chief00]

I figured that would catch your attention. Much like taking a date to MacDonald's =$10

 

[ctchamps]

People are complaining about rebounding like it's something that's cost us games. nitpicking statistics in blowouts is useless. Save your panic for an actual competitive game.

There are definitely flaws with the way the bigs go after rebounds. And it isn't just boxing out. They don't know when to release and go for the ball similar to Bazz and Boatright. They don't anticipate how the ball will bounce which Bazz and Boatright are able to do to get themselves under the ball.

AB is a natural shot blocker. It's instinctual for him. He has the timing down very well. Some people rebound instinctually. Others have to learn it and develop it. Unfortunately none of the bigs on UConn have an instinct for rebounding. Hopefully one or more will click and go from conscious thinking about rebounding to just automatically getting the ball.

Of course most teams don't have the strengths UConn has. And those strengths can compensate for the weaknesses. However, if UConn can improve the rebounding weakness they will be a more dangerous team than they already are

I felt that this team would go through growing pains with the 5's because PN was UConn's best shot and he just was understanding things at the end of last season. It meant that he would still be up and down for a good part of this season. I felt Wolf's departure was significant because he was more experienced than PN even if he was a sub par rebounder. Nothing has changed regarding rebounding even with AB. Shot blocking obviously is a different story.

 

[Waquoit]

There are definitely flaws with the way the bigs go after rebounds. And it isn't just boxing out. They don't know when to release and go for the ball similar to Bazz ...

Isn't funny the way our two best rebounders since Emeka left have been Bazz and Kemba. My hope is that Daniels gets the mindset to be a rebounder but like you say, he just doesn't seem to have the knack.

 

[caw]

I'm not even going to suggest our bigs have been great at rebounding, but rebounding in total has been slightly better than last year.

Last year UConn was out rebounded in 22 games: -172 or -8 a game
UConn out rebounded 7 opponents:
- UNH +1
-DePaul + 20
- ND +8
-SH + 4
-SU +1
-DePaul + 12
-Gtown + 8

So that is +54 in 7 games, or +8 per game.

Total of -118, or -4 per game.

Cincy was a net neutral game.

So far this year, UConn has out rebounded two teams, split once and been out rebounded once. +6 so far this year.

Now Napier is obviously making up a ton of the rebounding so far this year, he has gone from 4.4 to 9.5 rebounds., so the bigs really aren't any better or worse. It's still early an one can hope the bigs pick it up so Napier can focus elsewhere.

 

[arnie3]

Rebounding in itself is not the concern. the concern is offensive rebounding where UConn is losing the battle (37/66). That means that opponents are getting more shot attempts (250/220). BU shot only 33% in the first half, UConn shot 50%, yet BU was down only 5 points. UConn has got to do a better job on the boards or they will consistently have to have 15 to 20 point leads to overcome the fact that they are allowing opponents to get two and three shots each time down. Of course, having such big leads isn't feasible and Ollie knows this. It seems that whenever a team goes into a zone, UConn loses poise- whether it's throwing the ball away (Kromah), or putting up hasty/ill-advised shots (Calhoun/Napier). So far what I've seen in the first half is UConn starting out poised and letting the game come to them- hitting the open or hot hand which builds leads, and then losing poise, perception and court awareness, which makes the team blow leads and have to claw their way back.
It's early in the season and they will have to work on these areas. However, they must limit opponents to one shot which will allow their transition game to get rolling and not allow opponents to get back to a zone defense.

 

[sparky]

When a guard is your top rebounder, it means disaster.

 

[ctchamps]

Isn't funny the way our two best rebounders since Emeka left have been Bazz and Kemba. My hope is that Daniels gets the mindset to be a rebounder but like you say, he just doesn't seem to have the knack.

Last season DD averaged 5.5 rebounds/game which is what UConn got out of RS in the 2010-11 season. On the other hand AO had 8.7 rebounds/game in 2010-11 and there is no five on this team that is remotely close at this stage. Isolating one stat has its drawbacks. AO was very good at getting rebounds but he was poor to average in keeping his player from dribbling past him, average at help side defense, average at preventing his player from shooting over him and down right dismal with any play that he had to go out on the perimeter to help a guard, such as the pick and roll.

DD is so focused or doesn't have great peripheral vision that he often doesn't see who is around him. I would say his reflexes and anticipation skills are also average or he's thinking too much and not letting the game just come to him. He's a great player, but he appears mechanical at times. My gut is the kid just over thinks things. I'm thrilled the coaching staff and the guards focused the offense in the BU game around him. KO and the team know what is the best way to get him going.

It's too early to make an evaluation regarding PN and AB. My gut tells me that by mid season both players will be 4-6 rebound guys which would take away most of the rebounding disadvantages and be on par with the combo of CO and AO in the 2010-2011 season.

 

[caw]

Rebounding in itself is not the concern. the concern is offensive rebounding where UConn is losing the battle (37/66). That means that opponents are getting more shot attempts (250/220). BU shot only 33% in the first half, UConn shot 50%, yet BU was down only 5 points. UConn has got to do a better job on the boards or they will consistently have to have 15 to 20 point leads to overcome the fact that they are allowing opponents to get two and three shots each time down. Of course, having such big leads isn't feasible and Ollie knows this. It seems that whenever a team goes into a zone, UConn loses poise- whether it's throwing the ball away (Kromah), or putting up hasty/ill-advised shots (Calhoun/Napier). So far what I've seen in the first half is UConn starting out poised and letting the game come to them- hitting the open or hot hand which builds leads, and then losing poise, perception and court awareness, which makes the team blow leads and have to claw their way back.
It's early in the season and they will have to work on these areas. However, they must limit opponents to one shot which will allow their transition game to get rolling and not allow opponents to get back to a zone defense.

UConn has missed this year?

Seriously though:

UConn has collected 37 of 117 OR opportunities. 32%

Opponents have collected 66 of 179 OR opportunities. 37%

So if UConn had collected 6 more or opponents 10 less, or some combination in between it would be nearly identical. Again, it's not good to lose this battle but it's not that bad.

In fact the Yale game aside, UConn has rebounded at a very similar rate offensively in each game to the opponent.

EDIT: my point was that really it's UConns defensive rebounding that needs work. UConn has actually offensively rebounded fairly well.

 

[David 76]

Are you offering?

No.
Just wondering if Clyde's taste had been more upscale if it would helped his career ;^)

 

[Onions]

Isn't funny the way our two best rebounders since Emeka left have been Bazz and Kemba. My hope is that Daniels gets the mindset to be a rebounder but like you say, he just doesn't seem to have the knack.

I believe you've forgotten about Jeff Adrian and Thabeet, both of whom we're pulling down 10 rebounds a game.

 

[Gurleyman]

UConn has missed this year?

Seriously though:

UConn has collected 37 of 117 OR opportunities. 32%

Opponents have collected 66 of 179 OR opportunities. 37%

So if UConn had collected 6 more or opponents 10 less, or some combination in between it would be nearly identical. Again, it's not good to lose this battle but it's not that bad.

In fact the Yale game aside, UConn has rebounded at a very similar rate offensively in each game to the opponent.

EDIT: my point was that really it's UConns defensive rebounding that needs work. UConn has actually offensively rebounded fairly well.

That number is also skewed a little bit by our blocks. You block a shot out of bounds, the other team gets a team rebound. Or obviously if you block it back to them, they get one. I skimmed the play by plays quickly and it looks like opponents have 15 offensive rebounds off of blocks this year and we have two (we have a 28-8 edge in blocks - and typically blocked shots are around 50-50, as opposed to the regular average in college basketball which is 70-30 in favor of the defense). Take the blocks out and our opponents are 51 of 151 - or 33 percent.

Doesn't mean rebounding isn't a problem area - since we will face better front lines than we've seen so far (especially if we get to where we want to go). And right now we rank 266 out of 350 in D1 in defensive rebounding percentage, despite playing three mid majors in our first four.

 

[Waquoit]

I believe you've forgotten about Jeff Adrian and Thabeet, both of whom we're pulling down 10 rebounds a game.

It's funny how I forget that entire year even though I actually went to Detroit.

 

[Husky25]

That number is also skewed a little bit by our blocks. You block a shot out of bounds, the other team gets a team rebound. Or obviously if you block it back to them, they get one. I skimmed the play by plays quickly and it looks like opponents have 15 offensive rebounds off of blocks this year and we have two (we have a 28-8 edge in blocks - and typically blocked shots are around 50-50, as opposed to the regular average in college basketball which is 70-30 in favor of the defense). Take the blocks out and our opponents are 51 of 151 - or 33 percent.

Doesn't mean rebounding isn't a problem area - since we will face better front lines than we've seen so far (especially if we get to where we want to go). And right now we rank 266 out of 350 in D1 in defensive rebounding percentage, despite playing three mid majors in our first four.

I know if you block the ball back to the opposition, it counts as a rebound (stupid stat), but are you sure that if the ball goes out of bounds it is also a rebound? They didn't physically control the ball after a shot. If the ball bounces OB off the offensive player as a result of a block, I think it only counts as a turnover. It doesn't seem very equitable.

Be that as it may, Brimah needs to keep the ball inbounds, a la Bill Russell and Emeka Okafor. Alas, he is a raw freshman and there's plenty of time to learn a fast break opportunity is much more valuable than the highlight reel block into the 5th row.

 

[Gurleyman]

It's funny how I forget that entire year even though I actually went to Detroit.

You forgot 2006 too - we led the nation in rebounding that year. But at times we would all like to forget that year. And Oriakhi/Drummond.

 

[Gurleyman]

I know if you block the ball back to the opposition, it counts as a rebound (stupid stat), but are you sure that if the ball goes out of bounds it is also a rebound? They didn't physically control the ball after a shot. If the ball bounces OB off the offensive player as a result of a block, I think it only counts as a turnover. It doesn't seem very equitable.

Be that as it may, Brimah needs to keep the ball inbounds, a la Bill Russell and Emeka Okafor. Alas, he is a raw freshman and there's plenty of time to learn a fast break opportunity is much more valuable than the highlight reel block into the 5th row.

Yes - it is a team rebound. Look at the bottom of our stats and there's a line for team rebounds factored in to our totals. Every missed shot in basketball has to have a rebound that goes with It. Theres a different category if you miss the first of two foul shots when the ball isn't in play - that's a deadball rebound, which isn't factored in to the stats.

http://www.uconnhuskies.com/sports/m-baskbl/stats/2013-2014/teamcume.html

 

[Waquoit]

You forgot 2006 too - we led the nation in rebounding that year. But at times we would all like to forget that year. And Oriakhi/Drummond.

I didn't forget about O and D. I think Bazz is a better rebounder than those guys were that year.

 

[Gurleyman]

I didn't forget about O and D. I think Bazz is a better rebounder than those guys were that year.

Through four games, maybe. He averaged 4.5 last year, so he'll likely climb the bell curve back to the mean by the time we hit January. I'd guess maybe 5 or 5.5 by season's end. If he stays over 6, it would be pretty remarkable.

AO, for his faults, was a pretty good rebounder in our NC year (had some days with 20) and regressed as a junior. Drummond underachieved here rebounding-wise compared to what he was capable of, but he's the third or fourth leading rebounder in the NBA right now behind Love and Howard and maybe one more. Only looking at college - yeah, I can see not including him on the list of our better ones.

 

[Husky25]

Yes - it is a team rebound. Look at the bottom of our stats and there's a line for team rebounds factored in to our totals. Every missed shot in basketball has to have a rebound that goes with It. Theres a different category if you miss the first of two foul shots when the ball isn't in play - that's a deadball rebound, which isn't factored in to the stats.

http://www.uconnhuskies.com/sports/m-baskbl/stats/2013-2014/teamcume.html

Interesting. In my 30 years of following basketball, I didn't know that. I want to go back to Freshman basketball. I'm sure I had a few rebounds that I didn't get credit for. My numbers could have fooled the JV coach...up to the point he saw my height and saw me play...

 

[Waquoit]

Through four games, maybe...

Bigger guys will get more rebounds. But I was talking more about the skill of rebounding, the timing, the anticipation, the technique. Bazz is pretty damn good. Kemba was awesome.