Ray

[Huskies4ever]

Ray didn't like the offensive strategy. Rondo with string on ball, Pierce isolation, KG spot up jump shooting. Ray was last option on offense and 1st option as trade bait. It says it all, rather play in Miami at way less money. Name another NBA player that has done that.

But this is not true of his role in Miami.

"stand there type shooter"? He has been far more versatile in the first few games than he was in the last year & half with Boston. I won't say money doesn't matter ... but this divorce was about clearing yourself to be able to feel like you have the capacity to play. He's in a better place; the Celtics weren't going to use him all that much.

Both of these posts state exactly how I feel, and what I've been posting since Ray signed with Miami. I think Ray has a lot of pride, and feels he can provide a lot more offense for a team than the C's were allowing him to utilize. He's 37 and coming off ankle surgery. If you're running him off screens, you better get him the ball when he's got a wide open three. He was getting the ball less and less often over the last year and a half.

 

[Waquoit]

We'll see what happens, but I suspect that the Eastern Conference Finals will come down to Miami-Boston. Both teams should be better than last season, which is scary.

How are the C's better without Ray?

 

[Huskies4ever]

Ray averaged nearly 11 shots per game last year. No one on the Celtics averaged more than 15.

He was mad because they didn't run enough plays for him (Ironically, the Heat don't run any plays for him. Or any plays.), despite the fact that he couldn't create any offense for himself. And he didn't like that he was benched for Avery Bradley...even though he was starting until he had bone spurs again.

If he wanted to go play for Miami, fine. That was his choice. But he needs to stop acting like the Celtics mistreated him.

Being benched for Avery Bradley sounds like mistreatment to me. He was being given a lesser role. How is that not mistreatment. He knows he can provide more than the Celtics wanted from him.

 

[UConn990411]

How are the C's better without Ray?

They're not better without Ray - they're better because their bench now consists of Jason Terry, Bradley/Lee, Jeff Green, and Brandon Bass, as opposed to Keyon Dooling, Mickael Pietrus (not signed yet), Marquis Daniels/Sasha Pavlovic (garbage), and Greg Stiemsa/Ryan Hollins (literally one of the worst rebounding bigs ever).

 

[Huskies4ever]

How are the C's better without Ray?

They got Terry, Lee, Green is back, Barbosa, and Sullinger.

 

[UConn990411]

Being benched for Avery Bradley sounds like mistreatment to me. He was being given a lesser role. How is that not mistreatment. He knows he can provide more than the Celtics wanted from him.

Did you not read what I said? Bradley became a starter when Ray was OUT with an ankle injury. Ray was never close to 100% when he came back, so Bradley kept his starting spot.

 

[Huskies4ever]

Did you not read what I said? Bradley became a starter when Ray was OUT with an ankle injury. Ray was never close to 100% when he came back, so Bradley kept his starting spot.

They could've given Ray his starting spot back. He was still getting major minutes and they were playing him the same way before he got injured. All the talk was that this was the C's future, Rondo/Bradley with Ray coming off the bench.

 

[UConn990411]

They could've given Ray his starting spot back. He was still getting major minutes and they were playing him the same way before he got injured. All the talk was that this was the C's future, Rondo/Bradley with Ray coming off the bench.

Because the Celtics were a significantly better team with Bradley starting, and Ray could barely even practice when he came back. It was the right decision by Doc.

 

[RayRay19]

it worked out for both teams...the only downside is he can kiss having his jersey retired in Boston...

 

[Joobie]

Spot on 4ever!!!!..............I'm happy for Ray, especially after the way he's been treated by Garnett, Rivers, Ainge and Heinsohn ..........they're playing real well without him too!!

It's true that Ray was slighted by the Celtics front office, but I don't think you can include Heinsohn. I read that Tommy & Bob Cousy or maybe it was Havlicek that was advocating to have Ray's #20 retired in Boston. I'd say that's pretty special!

Just reread the article. It was Bob Cousy. Pretty cool!

 

[mauconnfan]

It's true that Ray was slighted by the Celtics front office, but I don't think you can include Heinsohn. I read that Tommy & Bob Cousy or maybe it was Havlicek that was advocating to have Ray's #20 retired in Boston. I'd say that's pretty special!

Just reread the article. It was Bob Cousy. Pretty cool!

Maybe but Tommy Points has been backhanding Ray every chance he can get from exhibition games until now.........No matter having Cousy and Hondo's support is very special!!

 

[Huskies4ever]

Because the Celtics were a significantly better team with Bradley starting, and Ray could barely even practice when he came back. It was the right decision by Doc.

So.......Ray was still slighted. Maybe they didn't utilize him properly. I like Doc Rivers. He is a great coach. You are a Celtics fan, right? Try putting yourself in Ray Allen's shoes. Even today, he is a better player than Bradley.

 

[Huskies4ever]

Maybe but Tommy Points has been backhanding Ray every chance he can get from exhibition games until now.........No matter having Cousy and Hondo's support is very special!!

I haven't been following, but what has Tommy said? Ray would have earned a big time Tommy Point against Denver when he dove on the floor, ripped a loose ball out of a Denver player's hands, and got it off to one of his teammates in the final minute plus.

 

[UConn990411]

So.......Ray was still slighted. Maybe they didn't utilize him properly. I like Doc Rivers. He is a great coach. You are a Celtics fan, right? Try putting yourself in Ray Allen's shoes. Even today, he is a better player than Bradley.

He was not a better player the second half of last season. He couldn't keep anyone in front of him because of the ankle.

 

[Huskies4ever]

He was not a better player the second half of last season. He couldn't keep anyone in front of him because of the ankle.

Who cares about last season?!!!! It was not going to change this season!!! Henceforth, Ray left. They would have started Bradley over Ray. That was their plan for the future.
I still don't see how they were better with Bradley, than Ray. Are you saying that the C's would have beat the Heat if they benched Ray in favor of Bradley?

 

[UConn990411]

What is confusing about this? Bradley was a much better player at the end of last season, largely because Ray was only 50%. There's no question Bradley should've started when Ray came back.

The irony is Ray would have started if he came back to Boston this year. And probably would have kept his spot when Bradley is healthy in December/January.

 

[UChusky916]

They weren't that interested in him so they offered him twice as much as Miami did? Makes perfect sense. Ray wasn't "mistreated" by anybody, certainly not Doc Rivers. ***** this is getting ridiculous.

He was never mistreated? He dealt with trade rumors for the past 2-3 seasons, was always considered an aging player that retained some value, a good piece to be moved.

Celts went out and acquired Jason Terry whose role is basically the same as Allen's. This obviously implied he'd be seeing less of the court.

The Celts were never really interesting in resigning Allen. Only when the Heat got serious with him did the Celts throw that money at him, just so that they could say "SEE, WE WANT YOU BACK!"

Ray is a wise man and knew that having money thrown at him is not a sign of respect.

This, coupled with the fact that that Rondo didn't know how to get Allen the ball after working hard off screens, was enough for him. And I dont blame him.

Hope he on the celtics on his way to getting a few more rings.

 

[Dogdeacon]

I love Ray Allen as a player, my favorite Husky ever to watch in the NBA. However all I said was that he was MORE of a spot-up type shooter and people go crazy objecting. He can drive, he can come off screens, etc.. I know he can, but the man is 37 years old and he is UNQUESTIONABLY THE BEST SPOT-UP SHOOTER IN THE NBA. So he chose to got to a team where he'd have more open catch and shoot opportunities as perfectly illustrated by his 4-point play the other night. Same situation in Boston and the play is designed for Pierce (as in Miami it was for LeBron) but Pierce doesn't draw a double and Ray doesn't get the ball UNLESS they diagrammed a play for Ray. The Celtics were doing less of this (but not none) partially because Rondo is the emerging player and he is not a drive and dish to 3 type - more likely to pass to cutters. Avery Bradley was clicking with Rondo last year because of his slashing ability and Avery Bradley is a very good defender. He gives you different things than Ray Allen and assuming he is healthy its at minimum an understandable business decision to choose Bradley (TWENTY ONE years old) over 37yr old Ray Allen.

None of these things make the Celtics or Rondo bad players or disrespectful towards Ray Allen. He simply wasn't AS good of a FIT for the Celtics as he is for the Miami Heat and that is MOSTLY why he is on the Miami Heat. I think the Celtics even knew that losing Ray would make them worse initially and quite possibly for all of 2012-13. Undeniably it lowers their title chances because even if the four-headed Terry/Lee/Barbosa/Bradley monster is better than Ray Allen, the Celtics #1 competitor got better. Ray Allen made a very smart basketball decision based on style of play, his skillset over the next 3yrs and his #1 goal which is to win.

 

[UConn990411]

Spot on, Dog.

As a Celtics fan, I understand Ray's decision, even if it is still painful to accept. I just think it's absurd when people say he was mistreated in any way by the Celtics (which, SHOCKINGLY, only people on this board make that claim).

 

[BigErnMcCracken]

Are you saying that the C's would have beat the Heat if they benched Ray in favor of Bradley?

Had Bradley been healthy they would have beaten Miami. He would have started over Ray because he was better than Ray, who was playing on one leg.

It's always amusing when people who play the "it's just business" card about a player that didn't go to UConn instead go on and on about how mean the Celtics were to Ray. It's a joke. He couldn't stay healthy and Bradley gave them a better chance to win. Ray clearly wanted to be in Miami and now he's there. End of story. All this trash about disrespect is a product - frankly - of Ray airing out his hurt feelings well after the fact.

 

[Joobie]

Sorry to disagree with you BigErn, but you are sooooooooooooooo wrong about this. Ray WAS slighted by the Celtics front office. They tried to trade him 3 years in a row & he was told to back his bags at the end of last season. He was 5th (!!!) in line as far as the Celtics priorities went for signing free agents. Jason Terry was before Ray, which I thought was a pretty hard slap in the face, all things considered. The night before the Knicks played in Boston last season, Ray was in the hospital with a stomach bug, but there he was, all suited up & ready to play. He hit the shot that sent the game into OT (I was there, it was thrilling). Why wouldn't you do everything & anything you could to keep a consummate professional like that on your team? The answer is not enough & THAT'S why Ray is playing in Miami...

 

[Huskies4ever]

Well said, Joobie.

 

[BigErnMcCracken]

Sorry to disagree with you BigErn, but you are sooooooooooooooo wrong about this. Ray WAS slighted by the Celtics front office. They tried to trade him 3 years in a row & he was told to back his bags at the end of last season. He was 5th (!!!) in line as far as the Celtics priorities went for signing free agents. Jason Terry was before Ray, which I thought was a pretty hard slap in the face, all things considered. The night before the Knicks played in Boston last season, Ray was in the hospital with a stomach bug, but there he was, all suited up & ready to play. He hit the shot that sent the game into OT (I was there, it was thrilling). Why wouldn't you do everything & anything you could to keep a consummate professional like that on your team? The answer is not enough & THAT'S why Ray is playing in Miami...

Oh yeah? Well you're wrong! How about that.

Look, he turned down a no-trade clause because he felt disrespected being told he'd come off the bench. So he went somewhere else to come off the bench. He didn't like that the Celtics are committed to Bradley long term. He doesn't get along with Rondo. He complained about being a decoy, despite the fact that he was still getting plenty of shots. He wanted to be treated like a superstar when those days are behind him. He was a broken down guy on the down slope of his career for an awful lot of last year and he - and I dont relish saying this - seemed to have a hard time putting the interests of the team ahead of his own.

So you can go on and on about how poorly he was treated but it sounds silly. And ponder for a second why he's left every NBA team he's played for on bad terms.

I like Ray. But the public bitching he's done since he left Boston doesn't become him.

 

[mauconnfan]

Oh yeah? Well you're wrong! How about that.

Look, he turned down a no-trade clause because he felt disrespected being told he'd come off the bench. So he went somewhere else to come off the bench. He didn't like that the Celtics are committed to Bradley long term. He doesn't get along with Rondo. He complained about being a decoy, despite the fact that he was still getting plenty of shots. He wanted to be treated like a superstar when those days are behind him. He was a broken down guy on the down slope of his career for an awful lot of last year and he - and I dont relish saying this - seemed to have a hard time putting the interests of the team ahead of his own.

So you can go on and on about how poorly he was treated but it sounds silly. And ponder for a second why he's left every NBA team he's played for on bad terms.

I like Ray. But the public bitching he's done since he left Boston doesn't become him.

He's Ray Allen.......he was with the Celtics, they asked questions prior to the Heat playing the C's.......call it bitching if you wish but I call it answering questions asked by the media honestly......

And the reason you may think he left eveyrwhere on "bad terms" is because he's a future HOFer and you hear about things that occurred when he left.......and it wasn't all bad you just elect to see it that way!
Some of it's on Ray, his pride and ego no doubt but to give the C's a pass on this is a joke!

 

[aceboon]

What bad terms did Ray leave Seattle on? I know there was some sniping with George Karl after he was traded from Milwaukee but what player hasn't Karl pissed off during his career?

Oh yeah? Well you're wrong! How about that.

Look, he turned down a no-trade clause because he felt disrespected being told he'd come off the bench. So he went somewhere else to come off the bench. He didn't like that the Celtics are committed to Bradley long term. He doesn't get along with Rondo. He complained about being a decoy, despite the fact that he was still getting plenty of shots. He wanted to be treated like a superstar when those days are behind him. He was a broken down guy on the down slope of his career for an awful lot of last year and he - and I dont relish saying this - seemed to have a hard time putting the interests of the team ahead of his own.

So you can go on and on about how poorly he was treated but it sounds silly. And ponder for a second why he's left every NBA team he's played for on bad terms.

I like Ray. But the public bitching he's done since he left Boston doesn't become him.

 

[UConn990411]

He was never mistreated? He dealt with trade rumors for the past 2-3 seasons, was always considered an aging player that retained some value, a good piece to be moved.

Last thing I'll say on this, because it's going nowhere.

Ray did have to deal with his name being in trade talks more than any player not named Rondo, which is why I COMPLETELY understood his decision to leave for Miami. Not only would he be increasing his chance for a ring, but he would be finishing his career on his terms as well.

However, to say the Celtics mistreated him by including him in trade talks is absurd. It had nothing to do with Boston disliking him, but rather that he had the most affordable contract of the Big 3 and a skillset that every team can use. It's just business.

Look at last year, for instance: Ainge had trades in place to send Ray to Memphis and Paul Pierce to New Jersey. Ray wasn't being dealt because the Celtics thought he was useless; Ainge was in the process of blowing the whole thing up and starting over.

(Pierce, by the way, has been a Celtic all 14 years of his career and is one of the top 5-6 players in franchise history...and Ainge was on the verge of trading him to one of the worst teams in the league. If anyone was disrespected, it was him. And yet he said before this season it was nothing personal.)

 

[Joobie]

990411...I am not convinced that Ainge was serious about trading Pierce. Pierce has been the face of the franchise for a really long time. I think that Danny Anige has just enough of the blarney in him to make me question the validity of a Pierce trade.

There was a LOT more going on behind with Ray & the C's than we will ever know. As far as Ray's "bitching" in concerned, he was given a golden opportunity to throw KG under a bus & instead took the high road, saying only "that's just how he is".

BigErn, if you are still convinced that I am so totally off base on all of this, I suggest you talk to someone who knows a lot more about Ray's relationship with the Celtics than any of us. I was so bothered by Ray going to Miami, that's what I did. I dunno that Donny Marshall was happy to talk to me, but he DID & I came away with a completely different perspective. Maybe you should do the same...

 

[Huskies4ever]

Oh yeah? Well you're wrong! How about that.

Look, he turned down a no-trade clause because he felt disrespected being told he'd come off the bench. So he went somewhere else to come off the bench. He didn't like that the Celtics are committed to Bradley long term. He doesn't get along with Rondo. He complained about being a decoy, despite the fact that he was still getting plenty of shots. He wanted to be treated like a superstar when those days are behind him. He was a broken down guy on the down slope of his career for an awful lot of last year and he - and I dont relish saying this - seemed to have a hard time putting the interests of the team ahead of his own.

So you can go on and on about how poorly he was treated but it sounds silly. And ponder for a second why he's left every NBA team he's played for on bad terms.

I like Ray. But the public bitching he's done since he left Boston doesn't become him.

What am I missing here? How ignorant or misinformed are you? How did Ray leave the Bucks and Sonics on bad terms? How has he been bitching and moaning, when he's been answering reporter's questions honestly, and with class? He could have told the world how much of a jerk KG is, and instead, he took the higher road (as always).
Ray was being pushed down the ladder from "big three" to "big six". How is that not being mistreated? he is now showing the Celtic's how wrong they were. They didn't believe in him as much as he believed in himself. He will prove them wrong for underestimating them.

 

[Gurleyman]

I'm with Dogdeacon on this one. Whatever little personal feelings/slights were out there would have been easily put aside by all parties if the basketball end of things made sense any more. But Ray couldn't get open in the playoffs - some of it was his ankle costing him a little explosiveness coming off screens, but some of it was the fact that Pierce and KG don't draw doubles any more, and some of it was that teams defended him coming off screens with two guys - leave the screener (Bass, Stiemsma, KG) open if you have to, but make sure Ray can't catch and shoot on the three. You could see it was frustrating him - and it wasn't anyone's fault. The screener was trying, Rondo was looking, but the play wasn't there most of the time. Too easy to defend. Ray does need to be able to play off a dominant player at this stage of his career (Rondo is elite, but doesn't command help defense). Hence, the Miami fit made a lot of sense (or the Clippers, before that fell through).

The Terry signing was perhaps the final nail (although we don't know - perhaps the decision was already made by then). Terry can create his own shot better and they didn't sign him to sit on the bench in the fourth quarter. Ray might have been looking at possible 9th or 10th man status in Boston if he stayed (with crunch time minutes on a good night).

While it is true that Bradley was playing better than an injured Ray during the regular season, in a lot of ways it was fool's gold. Once you got in a long playoff series and the intensity was higher, Bradley's inexperience and erratic jump shot killed the C's floor spacing before he was hurt. Although certainly he would have helped defending Wade once they made it that far - that was where he was really missed.

Sent from my BlackBerry 9930 using Tapatalk

 

[BigErnMcCracken]

He's Ray Allen.......he was with the Celtics, they asked questions prior to the Heat playing the C's.......call it bitching if you wish but I call it answering questions asked by the media honestly......

And the reason you may think he left eveyrwhere on "bad terms" is because he's a future HOFer and you hear about things that occurred when he left.......and it wasn't all bad you just elect to see it that way!
Some of it's on Ray, his pride and ego no doubt but to give the C's a pass on this is a joke!

First of all mau, I'm not talking about the run-up to the Miami game. I'm talking about the talking he did on the way out the door, and over the summer, when he was the only one making his departure an issue.

Second, I don't know how it's a joke. If we have no problem with kids getting recruited over, why do we wring our hands when the same thing happens to a 30-something zillionaire? They made him an offer based on what they envisioned his role being. He didn't take it. So goes life. This whole "disrespected" thing is a little over the top. By the definition thrown around here, Paul Pierce has endured an awful lot more disrespect in his 15 years in Boston than Ray ever did.